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The {{Citations missing|date=February 2007}} tag at the top of the history section is interfereing with system map, I will try and find some references to remove it but if I cant then maybe someone could rejigg it. Gingerblokey 18:10, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Glasgow_Subway.png
It's true that the subway in Glasgow has picked up the nickname 'Clockwork Orange', but only people outside the city ever use that nickname. Nobody in Glasgow ever actually calls it that.
Well, I would say that it sometimes gets called the Clockwork Orange as a "joke", personally I call it the Underground, but Strathclyde PTE have changed it's name to the Subway, they say that most people called it that anyway.
The Orange Colour was officially known as Strathclyde red, this is now being changed to carmine and cream.
"It is because of Glasgow's geology that the subway was cut with great difficulty through solid rock; this accounts for both the small size of the tunnels and the failure to expand the system"
-In light of the many miles of mainline railway tunnels, active and disused, bore and cut and cover, that criss-cross Glasgow, this sounds highly unlikely and should probably be removed unless it can be verified.
"However, in the nearer future SPT will be looking at replacing the rolling stock to bring their fleet of trains up to date."
-I've removed this section as its point has already been made in the preceeding paragraph.
--Finton Stack
Does anyone have a good photograph of the new livery mentioned in the article? David Arthur 21:28, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
Certainly not true now.
Recently a centre car has been re-painted into Radio Clyde's corporate colours. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.4.212.210 ( talk) 16:12, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
"It remains one of only two tube-type underground railways in the UK outside London, the other being the Tyne and Wear Metro."
What about Merseyrail? ProhibitOnions 16:06, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
"The Glasgow Subway is a metro system in Glasgow, Scotland; and one of the 3 largest underground (subway) systems in the United Kingdom."
The latter section of this sentence is redundant: there are only 2-3 underground systems in the UK. I've replaced it with 'one of only two underground (subway) systems in the United Kingdom. If anyone wants this changed in light of Newcastle, I won't object, but bear in mind that only around 20% of the Newcastle system is underground, and would be more properly described as a light rail system. FrFintonStack 01:16, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
It is arguable that the Merseyrail system is a metro, it is probably more properly described as a suburban rail system. However, the system has marginally more underground mileage than the Glasgow Subway and five underground stations and is very similar to the London tube in many respects, so to ignore it completely in this article is, I believe, misleading. I'm not going to make any edits though.
The addition of the Mersey Railway is confusing. The earliest underground services in Glasgow were between High Street and Stobcross on what is now the North Clyde line, but we don't consider those to be metro services. The modern Merseyrail page compares the current Merseyrail system to other S-Bahn systems, which is totally what the North Clyde and the Argyle lines also are: urban lines with heavy suburban reach.
I was wondering what would be correct terminology to use - moving walkway or travelator (have i spelt this correctly?) Simply south 22:32, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
It is referred to on the Subway as a travelator. 86.4.212.210 ( talk) 16:08, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
The reference to the subcrawl seems very dismissive and brief. Suggest a fuller entry, based around info from the website at subcrawl.co.uk? The subcrawl is a well-established pub crawl route: at one stage it had its own wikipedia page, that has now been deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.131.237.212 ( talk) 02:29, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
I have created two stations on the Glasgow Subway as a start but they need vast improvement. Also, the rest of the stations need to be created.
The stations i have created are:
Is subway the correct word to use?
Please feel free to create the rest of the stations.
Also can someone create a railbox showuing the Glasgow Subway stations, similar to the National Rail and London Underground ones?
Simply south 19:02, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
Correction. I've created most articles on the underground stations. I have used subway as that is what they are called by SPT. I have moved Kelvinhall to its correct page. And also moved Partick as it is an interchange. I have also found a railbox (from the Partick station). However the station articles on most still need to be expanded significantly. I hope they end up similar to LU.
back to Buchanan Street
Simply south 12:28, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Wondering if anyone understands what is meant by the section I've put into italics below:
Trains used to be hoisted on to and off of the tracks prior to the installing of electric systems and consequently points between Govan and Ibrox where trains can exit the underground tunnel system to terminate for engineering, cleaning or storing.
Is there a bit missing at the end of the sentence, to go with the use of "consequently"? Or is it trying to say that the points between Govan and Ibrox came after the electrification (i.e. perhaps "consequently" was used where "subsequently" was intended)? In any case, it's totally unclear. – Kieran T ( talk | contribs) 00:46, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
I think what ought to be said in the italic section is:
"...and consequently points were installed between Govan and Ibrox after the 1977 modernisation that allowed trains to exit the system to gain access to Broomloan Depot for engineering, maintenance and cleaning requirements."
86.4.212.210 ( talk) 16:10, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
Does anyone have annual ridership figures for the subway? 86.0.203.120 02:00, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
I live in glasgow and I'm not aware of this term being 'frowned upon', although people do tend to call it the 'subway'. NPOv problem? raining girl 19:59, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
In Feburary 2005 a group of students [1] created the "Subway Challenge". Participants had to leave the train at Buchanan Street station and attempt to re-board the same train at St Enoch station. Challengers were free to travel between stations by any means necessary, however due to the fact that Buchanan Street is pedestrianised, motorised travel was not used.
Initially this was intended as a harmless prank and a bit of fun between friends, however an online video [1] of the stunt has become cult viewing resulting in the challenge making the newspapers [2] [3] and the stunt being re-recorded for Channel 4. citation needed
Ottb19 23:53, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
There is another "Subway Challenge" probably created by students too. It involves getting off at every station and going to the nearest pub to have one drink. This goes on until you start back at the original pub at the first stop. Maybe let's leave that out too... :) Panthro 18:16, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
That's called a Subcrawl and has been around for years, it's not really a variant on a Subway Challenge sort of thing. It's actually really good fun. I think it should be included because it's well known amongst the students in the Glasgow area. Renquist ( talk) 23:41, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
References
Does anyone know why the Subway's ridership figures seem to be declining? (see articles for stations). This seems bizarre since the areas it serves are becoming more built-up and residential and the number of people living, working and socialising in Glasgow is now growing. FrFintonStack 03:08, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
Ridership has been declining due to the increasing age and decreasing reliability of the Subway services. The system has had minimal renovation work since its last major overhaul in the 1970s. This coupled with improving rail and bus services is rendering the Subway increasingly uncompetitive. The SPT released a plan statement to modernise and possibly expand the system in the next decade to combat the falling ridership. GullibleKit 20:36, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
The map is great but according to the Railway line legend the symbol denotes "Interchange station (with suburban or light rail network)". As far as I know the Subway, this would only apply to Buchanan St and Partick. All the others should use the image shoudln't they? I think it's a bit misleading to suggest they all interchange with ScotRail, which clearly they don't!
BTW I love the way Wikipedia maps standardise to the German S-Bahn symbol! :-) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cnbrb ( talk • contribs) 18:53, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Ah, nice work. Makes much more sense now! -- Cnbrb 00:00, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
I just found a subway ticket in good condition from 1996 with the old Strathclyde Regional Council logo. I could scan it for inclusion in the article if anyone thinks this would be neat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.105.228.120 ( talk) 21:31, 24 April 2008 (UTC)
yes please-- cloudo ( talk) 14:33, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
This claim may not be true. See Istanbul's Tünel opened in 1875. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.69.129.79 ( talk) 00:06, 6 May 2008 (UTC)
I think I have to agree with the you on this point, now my calculus may not be up to scratch, but if Glasgow City and District Railway opened in March 1863 (which runs 5.3Km underground (i.e. like the subway)) and London's underground was opened on and Services began on 10 January 1863 on the Metropolitan Railway and Services, Doesn’t this make Glasgow City and District Railway the second oldest subway in the world opening in 1863? Also FYI to the questions before, the Subway has always been called the Subway to Glesga folk, trying to anglicising it to ‘underground’ never caught on, My father born in 1916 knew it as the Subway and I have always called it the same, as for the ‘Clockwork Orange’ it was sometimes ‘affectionately’ know by this, as for the colour, when I was in school and GGPTE was changing the livery on the buses we were told the colour of the buses and subway livery was ‘German Red’ and not ‘Strathclyde Red’ as previously mentioned, this followed the livery on the Subway after renovation in 1977. Kewlscot ( talk) 16:47, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
The antique (Victorian?) Glasgow Subway has a shape like a Switchback Railway, with stations at high points and low points between them. Very peculiar. Its history may be worth discussing somewhere. -- Una Smith ( talk) 05:10, 5 August 2008 (UTC)
This is quite common in building underground railways - there is a rising gradient on the approach to the station and a falling gradient on departing - intended to assist the braking and acceleration of the train by the use of gravity. Shrdlu junction ( talk) 04:48, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
The link to www.futureglasgow.co.uk/Rail.htm has been removed owing to the major error 404. The page no longer exist anymore. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.40.106.21 ( talk)
Does anyone know the by-laws regarding this? I heard that until recently drinking was legal on the London underground. Is it legal on the Glasgow subway? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mnealon ( talk • contribs) 12:00, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
If it was illegal the polis would have a hard time enforcing it. The footy fans drink themsleves stupid on the subway. -- 86.138.172.161 ( talk) 14:48, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
I heard that, on the pre-modernisation Subway, because one side of the carriages was never seen by passengers, that side wasn't painted, to save money. Does anybody know if that was true? Shrdlu junction ( talk) 04:51, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
The article is incorrect. I corrected it adding Merseyrail, as it it the largest metro system outside of London, running underground in central Liverpool and central Birkenhead. Then someone takes it away saying it is not a metro, because of an ownership issue. What nonsense!! Either Merseyrail is or it is not a metro. IT IS A METRO!! From wiki: "A Metro is a rapid transit rail system, also known as a subway or underground". Merseyrail is a predominantly electric urban rapid transit rail system that is partially underground. The electric part is self contained with the system run by Seco/Nedrail. It is the largest metro system in the UK outside of London, with about 6 or 7 miles of tunnel under Liverpool and Birkenhead awaiting reuse complete with the odd underground station. A new line is being considered for re-use for LFC's new stadium. I put the article right again. DO NOT CHANGE, as the article is false as it stands. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.66.58.123 ( talk) 20:54, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
79.66.48.37 ( talk) 13:40, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
Oct 24 2008 by Ben Schofield, Liverpool Daily Post. Trains network is creaking, says transport chief. MERSEYRAIL trains are running so close to capacity the network is “creaking”, the region’s transport chief said. 79.65.119.190 ( talk) 13:21, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
I am a Liverpudlian and therefore reasonably familiar with the Merseyrail system and I have done several edits to the Merseyrail thread and have always deleted the word 'metro' when I have come across it. I am not really bothered whether our rail system is called a metro or not and I am certainly not going to make any edits to this article one way or the other - having only ever ridden on the Glasgow Subway once.
However, the word 'metro' is not precisely defined and so it is rather pedantic to state that the Glasgow subway is definitely a metro, the Tyne and Wear Metro may be and the Merseyrail system definitely isn't. The word 'metro' is understood to come from the Paris Metropolitain and so could just be interpreted as 'the railway of a metropolitan area'. In fact, you could argue that as Merseyrail covers a large part of the Merseyside metropolitan area whereas the Glasgow Subway only covers the city centre, Merseyrail has more right to call itself a metro.
But, if you use the more conventional definitions, then I would agree that in the case of, say, the branch from Ellesmere Port to Hooton, which has two trains an hour at present, is totally above ground and runs through a semi-rural area it would be hard to argue that this was a metro. On the other hand, the line from Liverpool Lime Street to Birkenhead Hamilton Square, which is used by thousands of people every day, ticks all the boxes of the metro definition, being fully underground having a frequent service (fourteen trains per hour each way) and using electric traction.
The main point is surely that a large proportion of the people reading the Glasgow Subway article will not be versed in the finer points of what is and what isn't a metro and, if your article states or implies that only London, Newcastle and Glasgow have underground systems and they know that Liverpool also has one, that is going to reflect badly on the accuracy of the article and the knowledge of the people writing it.
All this is confusion about what a metro is - shortened from Metropolitan Railway. Like calling a vacuum cleaner a Hoover. There are better descriptions. Urban transit, mass transit. By reading the above it is clear London Underground is not a metro by some of the misguided comments. London Underground is a larger version of Merseyrail. The focus is urban transit which has an underground station element and the who was the 1st, 2nd, etc in the world to have such a system. 1st was London, then Liverpool, then Glasgow, then Budapest and then Glasgow again. 152.37.85.43 ( talk) 16:02, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
Both this and the Budapest Metro article claim to be the 3rd oldest underground metro system in the world. Which is correct? Lugnuts ( talk) 11:11, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
Can someone give a proper explanation of outer and inner circle as the article doesn't seem to cover it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.73.48.124 ( talk) 08:16, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
Anyone willing to start a rail vehicle page or at least create a decent section on this page for the rolling stock? I would myself like ive done for most of the UK light rail vehicles but have no knowledge or experience of the Glasgow stock and find that theirs far less written about them online with which to found an article. WatcherZero ( talk) 01:58, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
When the Subway was refurbished in 1977, the Automatic Fare Collection system was provided by Revenue Control Systems (RCS) of Watford, who designed, built and installed all the equipment except the ticket machines which were provided by Westinghouse of Chipenham, based on LU style Westomat machines. The system went operational in 1979 and the tickets used were yellow paper single mag stripe Edmondson size tickets.
The gates used the first microprocessors (Intel 4004).
The RCS systwm was replaced by Cubic equipment in the late 80's
M C Newton 217.128.70.25 ( talk) 16:30, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
I have decided that the misleading omission of Merseyrail from the introduction to this article needs to be addressed. There are four cities with underground rapid transit systems in Britain - they are London, Newcastle, Glasgow and Liverpool. The Merseyrail system is the oldest of the three systems outside of the capital and predates the City and South London in having deep level stations with lift access. Though there are fewer stations compared to the Glasgow Subway, the route length (6.5 miles) is slightly larger and the passenger volume through the five underground stations on the route is greater than all fifteen on the Glasgow system.
Much is made of the fact that Merseyrail is not a metro, which I accept, but what is the essential difference between Merseyrail and the Tyne and Wear Metro apart from the fact that the latter calls itself a metro? The systems are very similar in terms of system length, underground system length, train frequency, areas served etc. Certainly the two systems have far more in common with each other than either does with the Glasgow Subway.
Don't forget that this is not a technical forum but an encyclopedia with a general readership. In that light, the omission of the Merseyrail system is incomprehensible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mann Island ( talk • contribs) 19:59, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
The latest revision of the introduction (25.02) is fine with me. I am not bothered that Merseyrail is not mentioned, just that if we are going to list underground systems outside of London, then it is very misleading not to include it. Mann Island — Preceding
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Mann Island (
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contribs)
20:00, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
Hi just wondered if anyone knew the reason why pushchairs(prams) have to be folded before going through the gates at glasgow tube station. the reason I asked is we have twins and my wife was unable to take them on the tube on her own as it was impossible for her to carry two kids and a folded chair as well as a baby bag through the gates. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.150.148.94 ( talk) 19:36, 5 March 2011 (UTC)
It is not 100% clear what the operating voltage is now. Is it still 600 volts? Could this be made clearer? Thanks. PeterEastern ( talk) 04:27, 6 December 2011 (UTC)
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Why do we define Glasgow Subway as "heavy rail" in the lead - and as the "only heavy rail underground metro"? I can't find any citations and it seems like a very odd claim, since Wikipedia defines heavy rail as "conventional railways forming part of the national network, including commuter, intercity, high-speed rail, rural and freight services, as distinct from metro, light rail and tram lines, people movers and similar." Glasgow Subway is narrow gauge, has no connection to the mainline network, and is not part of Network Rail or National Rail. Both Tyne and Wear Metro and Merseyrail have a stronger claim to being heavy rail. Smurrayinchester 09:15, 25 April 2017 (UTC)
This seems to be part of the North American definition of heavy rail. Under the UK definition, the Subway fits more with a metro definition. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.17.101.35 ( talk) 16:31, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
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I remember the pre-refurbishment service as being called "the Shuggle" - by virtue of the vigorous rocking motion that passengers were subjected to. Am I alone in this recollection and, more importantly, do any published accounts record this? ThoughtIdRetired ( talk) 20:41, 4 November 2017 (UTC)
The reference given says that Tait was *an* assistant engineer on the project, not *the* assistant engineer. Do we have any more references? Absolutelypuremilk ( talk) 21:59, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
"The Glasgow Subway [...] is the third-oldest underground metro system in the world after the London Underground and the Budapest Metro."
"The Budapest Metro [...] is [...] the third-oldest electrically operated underground railway in the world."
People usually vie for first place, subways apparently vie for third.
There might be ways to make it logically consistent, but it's horrible writing at best. 91.10.3.7 ( talk) 02:57, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
The oldest urban rail networks with sections of underground tunnel and stations are in order of 1st opening:
That is historical fact. When the word "Liverpool" comes up, those filled with jealousy and hate towards the city and its people develop selective amnesia. Look at the talk sections on Liverpool and Merseyrail. Unbelievable. You couldn't make it up. 2A01:4B00:881D:3700:48E5:50F2:DD72:285 ( talk) 14:11, 18 January 2019 (UTC)
What is the oldest "underground" station in Glasgow? I believe way before the Subway. Glasgow maybe underselling its own history. 2A01:4B00:881D:3700:B992:FE0:E14B:41B6 ( talk) 16:06, 18 January 2019 (UTC)
Why on earth has the Mersey Railway been flagged as the third oldest subway in the world? It's not a subway.
Apparently, the recently adopted official subway map in Scottish Gaelic says "Fo-rèile Ghlaschu" for "Glasgow Subway". It should be changed in the table.-- 2001:16B8:31B0:B400:D1DF:956A:E183:B2DE ( talk) 15:13, 23 September 2021 (UTC)
Romeksz has edited the page this morning and referenced an old SPT page which suggests that the GS is the 3rd oldest underground railway, after the London Underground and a line in Budapest. However, it makes no mention of the Mersey Railway, which opened 10 years before the Glasgow Subway. Is this likely to be an oversight? Comments welcome. Mattdaviesfsic ( talk) 06:46, 27 October 2022 (UTC)
Mersey Railway is railway with tunnel or full underground subway? That's the question in my opinion. Metro (meaning as rapid transport) don't need to be a underground subway as London, Budapest and Glasgow subways. romeksz ( talk) 13:08, 14 December 2022 (UTC)
The existing future developments section primarily touches on former proposals for expansion. The section has collected things that weren't in the last round of modernisation.
In general, the expansion plans discussed have not been serious plans with funding and rigour (which is partly why we have a link to glasgowlive). The reference in the introductory remarks to expansion plans from 2007 is probably also not necessary; they add nothing to the context of what the subway system is today or will be in the future.
Any dormant proposals, including crossrail, are probably not relevant in light of the publication of the final recommendations of the STPR2, which retains the subway in the Clyde Metro proposals.
Can we either reduce the existing "Future development" section to something more like "Former expansion proposals"? 2600:4041:5BE9:5404:D0B6:5A70:B9EB:645 ( talk) 15:45, 15 January 2023 (UTC)
This is the
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Glasgow Subway article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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The {{Citations missing|date=February 2007}} tag at the top of the history section is interfereing with system map, I will try and find some references to remove it but if I cant then maybe someone could rejigg it. Gingerblokey 18:10, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Glasgow_Subway.png
It's true that the subway in Glasgow has picked up the nickname 'Clockwork Orange', but only people outside the city ever use that nickname. Nobody in Glasgow ever actually calls it that.
Well, I would say that it sometimes gets called the Clockwork Orange as a "joke", personally I call it the Underground, but Strathclyde PTE have changed it's name to the Subway, they say that most people called it that anyway.
The Orange Colour was officially known as Strathclyde red, this is now being changed to carmine and cream.
"It is because of Glasgow's geology that the subway was cut with great difficulty through solid rock; this accounts for both the small size of the tunnels and the failure to expand the system"
-In light of the many miles of mainline railway tunnels, active and disused, bore and cut and cover, that criss-cross Glasgow, this sounds highly unlikely and should probably be removed unless it can be verified.
"However, in the nearer future SPT will be looking at replacing the rolling stock to bring their fleet of trains up to date."
-I've removed this section as its point has already been made in the preceeding paragraph.
--Finton Stack
Does anyone have a good photograph of the new livery mentioned in the article? David Arthur 21:28, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
Certainly not true now.
Recently a centre car has been re-painted into Radio Clyde's corporate colours. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.4.212.210 ( talk) 16:12, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
"It remains one of only two tube-type underground railways in the UK outside London, the other being the Tyne and Wear Metro."
What about Merseyrail? ProhibitOnions 16:06, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
"The Glasgow Subway is a metro system in Glasgow, Scotland; and one of the 3 largest underground (subway) systems in the United Kingdom."
The latter section of this sentence is redundant: there are only 2-3 underground systems in the UK. I've replaced it with 'one of only two underground (subway) systems in the United Kingdom. If anyone wants this changed in light of Newcastle, I won't object, but bear in mind that only around 20% of the Newcastle system is underground, and would be more properly described as a light rail system. FrFintonStack 01:16, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
It is arguable that the Merseyrail system is a metro, it is probably more properly described as a suburban rail system. However, the system has marginally more underground mileage than the Glasgow Subway and five underground stations and is very similar to the London tube in many respects, so to ignore it completely in this article is, I believe, misleading. I'm not going to make any edits though.
The addition of the Mersey Railway is confusing. The earliest underground services in Glasgow were between High Street and Stobcross on what is now the North Clyde line, but we don't consider those to be metro services. The modern Merseyrail page compares the current Merseyrail system to other S-Bahn systems, which is totally what the North Clyde and the Argyle lines also are: urban lines with heavy suburban reach.
I was wondering what would be correct terminology to use - moving walkway or travelator (have i spelt this correctly?) Simply south 22:32, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
It is referred to on the Subway as a travelator. 86.4.212.210 ( talk) 16:08, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
The reference to the subcrawl seems very dismissive and brief. Suggest a fuller entry, based around info from the website at subcrawl.co.uk? The subcrawl is a well-established pub crawl route: at one stage it had its own wikipedia page, that has now been deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.131.237.212 ( talk) 02:29, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
I have created two stations on the Glasgow Subway as a start but they need vast improvement. Also, the rest of the stations need to be created.
The stations i have created are:
Is subway the correct word to use?
Please feel free to create the rest of the stations.
Also can someone create a railbox showuing the Glasgow Subway stations, similar to the National Rail and London Underground ones?
Simply south 19:02, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
Correction. I've created most articles on the underground stations. I have used subway as that is what they are called by SPT. I have moved Kelvinhall to its correct page. And also moved Partick as it is an interchange. I have also found a railbox (from the Partick station). However the station articles on most still need to be expanded significantly. I hope they end up similar to LU.
back to Buchanan Street
Simply south 12:28, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Wondering if anyone understands what is meant by the section I've put into italics below:
Trains used to be hoisted on to and off of the tracks prior to the installing of electric systems and consequently points between Govan and Ibrox where trains can exit the underground tunnel system to terminate for engineering, cleaning or storing.
Is there a bit missing at the end of the sentence, to go with the use of "consequently"? Or is it trying to say that the points between Govan and Ibrox came after the electrification (i.e. perhaps "consequently" was used where "subsequently" was intended)? In any case, it's totally unclear. – Kieran T ( talk | contribs) 00:46, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
I think what ought to be said in the italic section is:
"...and consequently points were installed between Govan and Ibrox after the 1977 modernisation that allowed trains to exit the system to gain access to Broomloan Depot for engineering, maintenance and cleaning requirements."
86.4.212.210 ( talk) 16:10, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
Does anyone have annual ridership figures for the subway? 86.0.203.120 02:00, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
I live in glasgow and I'm not aware of this term being 'frowned upon', although people do tend to call it the 'subway'. NPOv problem? raining girl 19:59, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
In Feburary 2005 a group of students [1] created the "Subway Challenge". Participants had to leave the train at Buchanan Street station and attempt to re-board the same train at St Enoch station. Challengers were free to travel between stations by any means necessary, however due to the fact that Buchanan Street is pedestrianised, motorised travel was not used.
Initially this was intended as a harmless prank and a bit of fun between friends, however an online video [1] of the stunt has become cult viewing resulting in the challenge making the newspapers [2] [3] and the stunt being re-recorded for Channel 4. citation needed
Ottb19 23:53, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
There is another "Subway Challenge" probably created by students too. It involves getting off at every station and going to the nearest pub to have one drink. This goes on until you start back at the original pub at the first stop. Maybe let's leave that out too... :) Panthro 18:16, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
That's called a Subcrawl and has been around for years, it's not really a variant on a Subway Challenge sort of thing. It's actually really good fun. I think it should be included because it's well known amongst the students in the Glasgow area. Renquist ( talk) 23:41, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
References
Does anyone know why the Subway's ridership figures seem to be declining? (see articles for stations). This seems bizarre since the areas it serves are becoming more built-up and residential and the number of people living, working and socialising in Glasgow is now growing. FrFintonStack 03:08, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
Ridership has been declining due to the increasing age and decreasing reliability of the Subway services. The system has had minimal renovation work since its last major overhaul in the 1970s. This coupled with improving rail and bus services is rendering the Subway increasingly uncompetitive. The SPT released a plan statement to modernise and possibly expand the system in the next decade to combat the falling ridership. GullibleKit 20:36, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
The map is great but according to the Railway line legend the symbol denotes "Interchange station (with suburban or light rail network)". As far as I know the Subway, this would only apply to Buchanan St and Partick. All the others should use the image shoudln't they? I think it's a bit misleading to suggest they all interchange with ScotRail, which clearly they don't!
BTW I love the way Wikipedia maps standardise to the German S-Bahn symbol! :-) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cnbrb ( talk • contribs) 18:53, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Ah, nice work. Makes much more sense now! -- Cnbrb 00:00, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
I just found a subway ticket in good condition from 1996 with the old Strathclyde Regional Council logo. I could scan it for inclusion in the article if anyone thinks this would be neat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.105.228.120 ( talk) 21:31, 24 April 2008 (UTC)
yes please-- cloudo ( talk) 14:33, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
This claim may not be true. See Istanbul's Tünel opened in 1875. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.69.129.79 ( talk) 00:06, 6 May 2008 (UTC)
I think I have to agree with the you on this point, now my calculus may not be up to scratch, but if Glasgow City and District Railway opened in March 1863 (which runs 5.3Km underground (i.e. like the subway)) and London's underground was opened on and Services began on 10 January 1863 on the Metropolitan Railway and Services, Doesn’t this make Glasgow City and District Railway the second oldest subway in the world opening in 1863? Also FYI to the questions before, the Subway has always been called the Subway to Glesga folk, trying to anglicising it to ‘underground’ never caught on, My father born in 1916 knew it as the Subway and I have always called it the same, as for the ‘Clockwork Orange’ it was sometimes ‘affectionately’ know by this, as for the colour, when I was in school and GGPTE was changing the livery on the buses we were told the colour of the buses and subway livery was ‘German Red’ and not ‘Strathclyde Red’ as previously mentioned, this followed the livery on the Subway after renovation in 1977. Kewlscot ( talk) 16:47, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
The antique (Victorian?) Glasgow Subway has a shape like a Switchback Railway, with stations at high points and low points between them. Very peculiar. Its history may be worth discussing somewhere. -- Una Smith ( talk) 05:10, 5 August 2008 (UTC)
This is quite common in building underground railways - there is a rising gradient on the approach to the station and a falling gradient on departing - intended to assist the braking and acceleration of the train by the use of gravity. Shrdlu junction ( talk) 04:48, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
The link to www.futureglasgow.co.uk/Rail.htm has been removed owing to the major error 404. The page no longer exist anymore. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.40.106.21 ( talk)
Does anyone know the by-laws regarding this? I heard that until recently drinking was legal on the London underground. Is it legal on the Glasgow subway? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mnealon ( talk • contribs) 12:00, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
If it was illegal the polis would have a hard time enforcing it. The footy fans drink themsleves stupid on the subway. -- 86.138.172.161 ( talk) 14:48, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
I heard that, on the pre-modernisation Subway, because one side of the carriages was never seen by passengers, that side wasn't painted, to save money. Does anybody know if that was true? Shrdlu junction ( talk) 04:51, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
The article is incorrect. I corrected it adding Merseyrail, as it it the largest metro system outside of London, running underground in central Liverpool and central Birkenhead. Then someone takes it away saying it is not a metro, because of an ownership issue. What nonsense!! Either Merseyrail is or it is not a metro. IT IS A METRO!! From wiki: "A Metro is a rapid transit rail system, also known as a subway or underground". Merseyrail is a predominantly electric urban rapid transit rail system that is partially underground. The electric part is self contained with the system run by Seco/Nedrail. It is the largest metro system in the UK outside of London, with about 6 or 7 miles of tunnel under Liverpool and Birkenhead awaiting reuse complete with the odd underground station. A new line is being considered for re-use for LFC's new stadium. I put the article right again. DO NOT CHANGE, as the article is false as it stands. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.66.58.123 ( talk) 20:54, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
79.66.48.37 ( talk) 13:40, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
Oct 24 2008 by Ben Schofield, Liverpool Daily Post. Trains network is creaking, says transport chief. MERSEYRAIL trains are running so close to capacity the network is “creaking”, the region’s transport chief said. 79.65.119.190 ( talk) 13:21, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
I am a Liverpudlian and therefore reasonably familiar with the Merseyrail system and I have done several edits to the Merseyrail thread and have always deleted the word 'metro' when I have come across it. I am not really bothered whether our rail system is called a metro or not and I am certainly not going to make any edits to this article one way or the other - having only ever ridden on the Glasgow Subway once.
However, the word 'metro' is not precisely defined and so it is rather pedantic to state that the Glasgow subway is definitely a metro, the Tyne and Wear Metro may be and the Merseyrail system definitely isn't. The word 'metro' is understood to come from the Paris Metropolitain and so could just be interpreted as 'the railway of a metropolitan area'. In fact, you could argue that as Merseyrail covers a large part of the Merseyside metropolitan area whereas the Glasgow Subway only covers the city centre, Merseyrail has more right to call itself a metro.
But, if you use the more conventional definitions, then I would agree that in the case of, say, the branch from Ellesmere Port to Hooton, which has two trains an hour at present, is totally above ground and runs through a semi-rural area it would be hard to argue that this was a metro. On the other hand, the line from Liverpool Lime Street to Birkenhead Hamilton Square, which is used by thousands of people every day, ticks all the boxes of the metro definition, being fully underground having a frequent service (fourteen trains per hour each way) and using electric traction.
The main point is surely that a large proportion of the people reading the Glasgow Subway article will not be versed in the finer points of what is and what isn't a metro and, if your article states or implies that only London, Newcastle and Glasgow have underground systems and they know that Liverpool also has one, that is going to reflect badly on the accuracy of the article and the knowledge of the people writing it.
All this is confusion about what a metro is - shortened from Metropolitan Railway. Like calling a vacuum cleaner a Hoover. There are better descriptions. Urban transit, mass transit. By reading the above it is clear London Underground is not a metro by some of the misguided comments. London Underground is a larger version of Merseyrail. The focus is urban transit which has an underground station element and the who was the 1st, 2nd, etc in the world to have such a system. 1st was London, then Liverpool, then Glasgow, then Budapest and then Glasgow again. 152.37.85.43 ( talk) 16:02, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
Both this and the Budapest Metro article claim to be the 3rd oldest underground metro system in the world. Which is correct? Lugnuts ( talk) 11:11, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
Can someone give a proper explanation of outer and inner circle as the article doesn't seem to cover it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.73.48.124 ( talk) 08:16, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
Anyone willing to start a rail vehicle page or at least create a decent section on this page for the rolling stock? I would myself like ive done for most of the UK light rail vehicles but have no knowledge or experience of the Glasgow stock and find that theirs far less written about them online with which to found an article. WatcherZero ( talk) 01:58, 24 May 2010 (UTC)
When the Subway was refurbished in 1977, the Automatic Fare Collection system was provided by Revenue Control Systems (RCS) of Watford, who designed, built and installed all the equipment except the ticket machines which were provided by Westinghouse of Chipenham, based on LU style Westomat machines. The system went operational in 1979 and the tickets used were yellow paper single mag stripe Edmondson size tickets.
The gates used the first microprocessors (Intel 4004).
The RCS systwm was replaced by Cubic equipment in the late 80's
M C Newton 217.128.70.25 ( talk) 16:30, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
I have decided that the misleading omission of Merseyrail from the introduction to this article needs to be addressed. There are four cities with underground rapid transit systems in Britain - they are London, Newcastle, Glasgow and Liverpool. The Merseyrail system is the oldest of the three systems outside of the capital and predates the City and South London in having deep level stations with lift access. Though there are fewer stations compared to the Glasgow Subway, the route length (6.5 miles) is slightly larger and the passenger volume through the five underground stations on the route is greater than all fifteen on the Glasgow system.
Much is made of the fact that Merseyrail is not a metro, which I accept, but what is the essential difference between Merseyrail and the Tyne and Wear Metro apart from the fact that the latter calls itself a metro? The systems are very similar in terms of system length, underground system length, train frequency, areas served etc. Certainly the two systems have far more in common with each other than either does with the Glasgow Subway.
Don't forget that this is not a technical forum but an encyclopedia with a general readership. In that light, the omission of the Merseyrail system is incomprehensible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mann Island ( talk • contribs) 19:59, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
The latest revision of the introduction (25.02) is fine with me. I am not bothered that Merseyrail is not mentioned, just that if we are going to list underground systems outside of London, then it is very misleading not to include it. Mann Island — Preceding
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20:00, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
Hi just wondered if anyone knew the reason why pushchairs(prams) have to be folded before going through the gates at glasgow tube station. the reason I asked is we have twins and my wife was unable to take them on the tube on her own as it was impossible for her to carry two kids and a folded chair as well as a baby bag through the gates. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.150.148.94 ( talk) 19:36, 5 March 2011 (UTC)
It is not 100% clear what the operating voltage is now. Is it still 600 volts? Could this be made clearer? Thanks. PeterEastern ( talk) 04:27, 6 December 2011 (UTC)
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Why do we define Glasgow Subway as "heavy rail" in the lead - and as the "only heavy rail underground metro"? I can't find any citations and it seems like a very odd claim, since Wikipedia defines heavy rail as "conventional railways forming part of the national network, including commuter, intercity, high-speed rail, rural and freight services, as distinct from metro, light rail and tram lines, people movers and similar." Glasgow Subway is narrow gauge, has no connection to the mainline network, and is not part of Network Rail or National Rail. Both Tyne and Wear Metro and Merseyrail have a stronger claim to being heavy rail. Smurrayinchester 09:15, 25 April 2017 (UTC)
This seems to be part of the North American definition of heavy rail. Under the UK definition, the Subway fits more with a metro definition. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.17.101.35 ( talk) 16:31, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
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I remember the pre-refurbishment service as being called "the Shuggle" - by virtue of the vigorous rocking motion that passengers were subjected to. Am I alone in this recollection and, more importantly, do any published accounts record this? ThoughtIdRetired ( talk) 20:41, 4 November 2017 (UTC)
The reference given says that Tait was *an* assistant engineer on the project, not *the* assistant engineer. Do we have any more references? Absolutelypuremilk ( talk) 21:59, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
"The Glasgow Subway [...] is the third-oldest underground metro system in the world after the London Underground and the Budapest Metro."
"The Budapest Metro [...] is [...] the third-oldest electrically operated underground railway in the world."
People usually vie for first place, subways apparently vie for third.
There might be ways to make it logically consistent, but it's horrible writing at best. 91.10.3.7 ( talk) 02:57, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
The oldest urban rail networks with sections of underground tunnel and stations are in order of 1st opening:
That is historical fact. When the word "Liverpool" comes up, those filled with jealousy and hate towards the city and its people develop selective amnesia. Look at the talk sections on Liverpool and Merseyrail. Unbelievable. You couldn't make it up. 2A01:4B00:881D:3700:48E5:50F2:DD72:285 ( talk) 14:11, 18 January 2019 (UTC)
What is the oldest "underground" station in Glasgow? I believe way before the Subway. Glasgow maybe underselling its own history. 2A01:4B00:881D:3700:B992:FE0:E14B:41B6 ( talk) 16:06, 18 January 2019 (UTC)
Why on earth has the Mersey Railway been flagged as the third oldest subway in the world? It's not a subway.
Apparently, the recently adopted official subway map in Scottish Gaelic says "Fo-rèile Ghlaschu" for "Glasgow Subway". It should be changed in the table.-- 2001:16B8:31B0:B400:D1DF:956A:E183:B2DE ( talk) 15:13, 23 September 2021 (UTC)
Romeksz has edited the page this morning and referenced an old SPT page which suggests that the GS is the 3rd oldest underground railway, after the London Underground and a line in Budapest. However, it makes no mention of the Mersey Railway, which opened 10 years before the Glasgow Subway. Is this likely to be an oversight? Comments welcome. Mattdaviesfsic ( talk) 06:46, 27 October 2022 (UTC)
Mersey Railway is railway with tunnel or full underground subway? That's the question in my opinion. Metro (meaning as rapid transport) don't need to be a underground subway as London, Budapest and Glasgow subways. romeksz ( talk) 13:08, 14 December 2022 (UTC)
The existing future developments section primarily touches on former proposals for expansion. The section has collected things that weren't in the last round of modernisation.
In general, the expansion plans discussed have not been serious plans with funding and rigour (which is partly why we have a link to glasgowlive). The reference in the introductory remarks to expansion plans from 2007 is probably also not necessary; they add nothing to the context of what the subway system is today or will be in the future.
Any dormant proposals, including crossrail, are probably not relevant in light of the publication of the final recommendations of the STPR2, which retains the subway in the Clyde Metro proposals.
Can we either reduce the existing "Future development" section to something more like "Former expansion proposals"? 2600:4041:5BE9:5404:D0B6:5A70:B9EB:645 ( talk) 15:45, 15 January 2023 (UTC)