This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Giorgi family article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||
|
I removed the sentence "The Giorgi family received patrician status in 930" on the grounds that a source more recent than 1864 would be needed to support such an assertion (which apparently conflicts with the date of first mention given by Treccani), but was reverted by an IP. I've now asked at the reliable sources noticeboard for comment on that source. Justlettersandnumbers ( talk) 09:21, 11 May 2018 (UTC)
An IP has repeatedly added the description "dynasty" to this article, most recently with the edit summary "Justletterandnumbers: stop! If these surnames are in the onfobox they should also be in the article. Also, an historic family who had several rulers is called a dynasty. Don't undo revisions just for the sake of it on subjects you don't know about".
So, which members the family have "ruled" anything? Marin Zorzi was Doge of Venice for ten months; who else? Because if there are other significant rulers it is more than a little surprising that they are mentioned neither in our article nor in the sources used to build it, and quite astonishing that the IP who knows so much about them has not mentioned even one of them by name.
Oh, and since most notable members of this family were in fact called Zorzi, would it not make sense to move the page to that title? Justlettersandnumbers ( talk) 15:45, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Zorzi is the translation in Venetian dialect of Giorgi. The family is the same but the Zorzi branch was not part of the Dubrovnik nobility, the Giorgi (Durdevic, which is the Croatian translation of Giorgi, were. Please don't merge the pages. The Zorzi were incredibly important in Venice, the Giorgi in Dubrovnik. They are part of the same family but developed independent importance in two different countries (the Republic of Venice and the Republic of Ragusa). If you look at the list of Dubrovnik nobility you will find the Durdevic (Giorgi) and not the Zorzi. So we should keep two distinct (yet connected) pages. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.27.229.242 ( talk) 17:06, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Apart from Marino Zorzi, who is already notable you have several Governors and Rectors of the Republic of Ragusa including
Please stop saying things that are not true and don't merge pages about families that have long and complex history. You have to understand the complexity. Things are not white or black. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.27.229.242 ( talk) 17:13, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
The Zorzi are not part of the Duborvnik nobility as the Giorgi are. The Giorgi are a dynasty that ruled for centuries in Dubrovnik (as part of the patriciate of the country in various roles). The Zorzi didn't. They have a common ancestor but they are two separate, yet connected families. Don't mix things up and don't merge the pages. History is complex to understand, don't oversimplify it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.27.229.242 ( talk) 17:38, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
References
Why are the following notable members of the family not added to the article and repeatedly canceled by some users for no good reason?
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Giorgi family article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||
|
I removed the sentence "The Giorgi family received patrician status in 930" on the grounds that a source more recent than 1864 would be needed to support such an assertion (which apparently conflicts with the date of first mention given by Treccani), but was reverted by an IP. I've now asked at the reliable sources noticeboard for comment on that source. Justlettersandnumbers ( talk) 09:21, 11 May 2018 (UTC)
An IP has repeatedly added the description "dynasty" to this article, most recently with the edit summary "Justletterandnumbers: stop! If these surnames are in the onfobox they should also be in the article. Also, an historic family who had several rulers is called a dynasty. Don't undo revisions just for the sake of it on subjects you don't know about".
So, which members the family have "ruled" anything? Marin Zorzi was Doge of Venice for ten months; who else? Because if there are other significant rulers it is more than a little surprising that they are mentioned neither in our article nor in the sources used to build it, and quite astonishing that the IP who knows so much about them has not mentioned even one of them by name.
Oh, and since most notable members of this family were in fact called Zorzi, would it not make sense to move the page to that title? Justlettersandnumbers ( talk) 15:45, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Zorzi is the translation in Venetian dialect of Giorgi. The family is the same but the Zorzi branch was not part of the Dubrovnik nobility, the Giorgi (Durdevic, which is the Croatian translation of Giorgi, were. Please don't merge the pages. The Zorzi were incredibly important in Venice, the Giorgi in Dubrovnik. They are part of the same family but developed independent importance in two different countries (the Republic of Venice and the Republic of Ragusa). If you look at the list of Dubrovnik nobility you will find the Durdevic (Giorgi) and not the Zorzi. So we should keep two distinct (yet connected) pages. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.27.229.242 ( talk) 17:06, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Apart from Marino Zorzi, who is already notable you have several Governors and Rectors of the Republic of Ragusa including
Please stop saying things that are not true and don't merge pages about families that have long and complex history. You have to understand the complexity. Things are not white or black. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.27.229.242 ( talk) 17:13, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
The Zorzi are not part of the Duborvnik nobility as the Giorgi are. The Giorgi are a dynasty that ruled for centuries in Dubrovnik (as part of the patriciate of the country in various roles). The Zorzi didn't. They have a common ancestor but they are two separate, yet connected families. Don't mix things up and don't merge the pages. History is complex to understand, don't oversimplify it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.27.229.242 ( talk) 17:38, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
References
Why are the following notable members of the family not added to the article and repeatedly canceled by some users for no good reason?