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I added a couple of sentences explaining some important factors about introducing new genes to plants. The important of what type of promoter to use, codon usage and deactivating the genes. Legendarygottyline ( talk) 06:47, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
This article doesn't appreciate or acknowledge the dangers of GM foods, or even accurately portray the ones listed. For one, Arpad Pusztai had many experiments, and even though they could have been wrong, they were repeated by others with similar results.
Also, the methods of gene transfer aren't fully portrayed, thus eluding the truth. They do fire genes from a "gene gun" but that isn't a full representation of what actually happens. They coat the genes on thousands of small shards and fire them at a pack of cells hoping one will penetrate, and not completely destroy the cell. Then they use a method to kill out all the cells without the gene, but this and the fact the cell was ruptured can have serious negative side affects. Also, the genes can replace other genes or make others not function properly. There is real no science in this process, its aiming a gun and hoping you get a really lucky shot.
I have many other gripes about the lax attention to the dangers of GM foods and the means by which they are created. My only reference is "Seeds of Deception" by Jeffrey M. Smith.
So you base your argument on one non-peer reviewed source called "Seeds of Deception." Was "Sowers of Discontent" sold out? How about "Flowers of Doom?" or "Fruits of Agony?"-- 216.227.89.35 ( talk) 19:24, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
Hi, I think there should be some info in the article about terminator seeds. Ie. genetically modified seeds that don't germinate and thus don't create new seeds, which means that new seeds have to be purchased each year from the company that makes these mutant organisms. cheers, Jamie —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.68.137.227 ( talk) 15:11, 17 July 2010 (UTC)
I removed the recent additions to allergies as the sources were not reliable, particularly for what was written. This reference might warrant some further discussion though: Genetically Modified Foods: Are They a Risk to Human/Animal Health? by Arpad Pusztai. Also I could not find the article referring to the butterflies, but it could be alluding to this study. AIRcorn (talk) 03:23, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
Read the article but didn't see it, well here's the source and quote: "Q: Supporters of GMOs say that they’re essential if we are going to be able to feed the planet?
Gillés-Eric Séralini: That’s ridiculous. For some time now, GMOs have been pesticide-producing plants protected by patents that are a mainstay of intensive agriculture. For the last 14 years they have been used to prioritise animal feed for rich countries ahead of food for the children of the poor.
Patented seeds increase famine and raise prices, as we have seen in their use to produce agrofuels.
Guy Riba: GMOs are a solution. But they are not the only one. What we should be fully promoting is selection by genetic markers. We can exploit and track natural diversity better within one species." http://www.combat-monsanto.co.uk/spip.php?article287 (I know the site may seem a bit biased but the one actually giving the information is an expert and his reasoning does seem sound) Also, it should be noted that even if you succeed in giving the plant the intended traits it could also give it unanticipated ones (good or bad). Props888 ( talk) 01:07, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
Notes that reference 109 is now a broken link.
Here are some scholarly reports on the effects of GM foods: Finamore A, Roselli M, Britti S, et al. Intestinal and peripheral immune response to MON 810 maize ingestion in weaning and old mice. J Agric. Food Chem. 2008; 56(23):11533-11539. Kroghsbo S, Madsen C, Poulsen M, et al. Immunotoxicological studies of genetically modified rice expression PHA-E lectin or Bt toxin in Wistar rats. Toxicology. 2008; 245:24-34. Malatesta M, Boraldi F, Annovi G, et al. A long-term study on female mice fed on a genetically modified soybean:effects on liver ageing. Histochem Cell Biol. 2008; 130:967-977. Velimirov A, Binter C, Zentek J. Biological effects of transgenic maize NK603xMON810 fed in long term reproduction studies in mice. Report-Federal Ministry of Health, Family and Youth. 2008. Kilic A, Aday M. A three generational study with genetically modified Bt corn in rats: biochemical and histopathological investigation. Food Chem. Toxicol. 2008; 46(3):1164-1170.-- 99.237.112.21 ( talk) 00:37, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
I wondered why there is no mention of Monsanto's "New Leaf Potato" in the table of genetically modified crop plants. Even though it is not presently being marketed, McDonald's and other fast food chains used these potatoes for making french fries during the late 90's until consumer outrage forced them to stop the practice between late 1999 and early 2000. Rhoadeka ( talk) 03:08, 30 September 2011 (UTC)
I removed the following as there are way too many. I have pasted them here in case some need to be recued. David D. (Talk) 22:04, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
The article is unreadable and is essentially a marketing piece for organic farming. It contains numerous quotes from material published by unscientific groups with obvious agendas to promote organic produce, such as Soil Association, Center for Food Safety and Organic Center. It contains entire sections devoted to health risks, even though no real evidence of any such risks has been ever produced and they remain pure conjecture. The section on the EU "ban" is dishonest: the EU did not have a blanket ban but instead delayed the licensing process without any reason; and it focuses on some irrelevant Wikileaks cable in order to suggest that US has an ulterior motive, or that its government is taking bribes. The section about allergens does not mention that GM food is actually tested for allergens, while non-GM food is not. -- Tweenk ( talk) 07:11, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
The section "Alfalfa" seems to me to be particularly one-sided - i.e. not a Neutral Point Of View. This section reads like propaganda from the anti-GM activists not an entry in an encyclopaedia. 50% of this section contains stuff/quotes from the "organic farming/sales community", " organic farming groups, organic food outlets, and activists", two anti-GM politicians and the " Center for Food Safety." What about some information from the other side of the argument? Where are the detailed reasons why the USDA allowed GM alafalfa to be grown? Where are the quotes from the farmers who grow the 96% of alfalfa that is not organic and who presumably benefit from advantages of GM alfalfa? Where are the quotes from the pro-GM politicians, from Monsanto and from the GM seed distributors?
SylviaStanley (
talk)
09:57, 29 September 2011 (UTC)
The section "Legal issues with Roundup Ready Alfalfa in the US" in the article "Alfalfa" seems to much a much more objective description. I propose we replace what is here with the section from "Alfalfa." SylviaStanley ( talk) 16:58, 31 October 2011 (UTC)
There is some sourced material there [11], which may be relevant, although it uses WP:Parenthetical referencing. ASCIIn2Bme ( talk) 16:51, 7 November 2011 (UTC)
Virtually all of this article concerns crops. No animals have yet been commercialised as GM food. Cotton, one of the major crops main use is as a fibre not a food. Non-food crops like biofuels, Amflora, flowers etc could and should be covered by this article. Many issues regarding GM crops are different than those regarding GM animals. Any GE animal issues would still be covered under Genetically modified organisms. AIRcorn (talk) 05:31, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
This article cites a university report that links GM crops with the reduction in Monarch Butterflies. Probably want to include some of the latest research on the environmental impact.-- 124.182.103.253 ( talk) 22:24, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
The plant breeders' and geneticists' perspective is one of the things missing all the time from news reports and publications like this. For example, on the allergy issue, it is probably impossible for a disease resistance gene to cause allergies when it is transferred to another crop. When your transfer storage proteins (like those in the mentioned Brazil nut) to another seed or nut, yes, you can anticipate the potential for allergic reactions to be transferred to that crop species.
For some crops, we plant breeders and geneticist need to insert GMOs for some of the toughest diseases and insect pests. There aren't any alternatives within the species or related species for some viruses, fungi, and bacteria. And transfer from related species is sometimes extremely difficult if not impossible unless one uses biotechnology. Everyone can debate all they want, but if you want to one day pay $20-30/lb for bananas, or some other fruit and vegetable crops, then we will just quit using GMOs altogether. For poorer countries dependent on some of the staple food crops, it truly makes sense in areas where these diseases or insect pests are and have been rampant for years.
SLN Breeder — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.191.140.162 ( talk) 21:08, 6 December 2011 (UTC)
I like your topic and data you posted. You have really detailed data and facts. In the method I have question about last sentance. Since I haven’t done much research on GMO food, is it true that all transgenic gene should be able to denature by heat before human consumption? How about genetic fruits or vegetables. Majority of them are consumed fresh ? Or is it some specific gene that can’t be consumed by humans and therefore that product need to be coocked? I know that avedin in rice binds to biotin and therefore nned to be coocked to lose its ability to bind biotin. Does it it mean all transgenic genes can cause similar issues? If it does that how public will know what to consumed fresh or cooked? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gshikula1 ( talk • contribs) 16:13, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
I am a GGC student performing this as a student project. I plan to add a History section to this article which includes dates and factual information about Genetically Modified Foods. I also plan to add 2-3 illustrations that proceed along the lines of this article. Jahmal.council ( talk) 18:10, 6 March 2012 (UTC) 168.28.23.1 ( talk) 15:44, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Today I added a small history section but I really need help! I am open for any suggestions if anyone wants to help me. I believe it is historically accurate, but I also believe it need more facts. Please help if you can. Jahmal.council ( talk) 18:12, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
There is a lot of good information in this article, I like what you have added! I really like the section on health risks, maybe you could expand the table into a small narrative for people like me who don't like reading figures. Maybe you could expand on the FlavrSavr tomato, eco friendly pig, golden rice, and maybe say something in the intro about the benefits of GM foods. To give people an idea of what biotechnology is, and why it’s important, you could say it could be an efficient way to feed nutritious food to developing countries, and disaster victims. Also, since Monsanto plays a big role in GMOs, maybe you could make a mini-section on them, so that people would know what they do, and who is in charge of the company. Also, maybe under the “methods” section, you could divide it into sub-sections, titled with the name of that technique, and detail each of the different types of biotech techniques. I didn’t even know what biotechnology was until I took that class with Dr. Timpte, so a lot of people will need more information to get an idea about genes are transferred like through microballistics. Natalietadpole ( talk) 22:20, 21 April 2012 (UTC)
I added some information on the controversy page, it is the last paragraph.I would like to know others take on what i wrote. Mendez1993 ( talk) 08:21, 19 June 2012 (UTC)
I am planning on adding information on the controversy section. There is a website that has much information about the controversies on GMO food Mendez1993 ( talk) 07:01, 19 June 2012 (UTC)
The tag heading this article indicates that this article is too biassed towards the United States of America. It was said on the programme Today on BBC Radio Four on May 2 2012 that there had been a conflict between two rival sides over genetically modified food - this was definitely taking place in Europe, so this could be added to the article to make it a little more global. I shall happily modify the article if I can find the details. ACEOREVIVED ( talk) 23:47, 2 May 2012 (UTC)
OK, I have done a little research and found a little more on the protest reported on the "Today" programme in May 2012. I can add more details if I have anything further. At least this gives us news from somewhere east of the Atlantic. ACEOREVIVED ( talk) 08:30, 3 May 2012 (UTC)
The Genetically modified animals section seems too broad for the page that it is within. The parts that seem to broad are: the list of 6 classes of transgenic animals; the example animals (goats with spider silk and glowing pigs) that are not intended for consumption.
I suggest that it deserves it's own page, or the content could be added to Genetically_modified_organism#Transgenic_animals. I think that the section on this page should be kept to genetically modified animals that are in some way intended to be consumed, as this is a "food" page, not a general GMO page. ThanAngell ( talk) 21:12, 25 June 2012 (UTC)
The correct term for this and the correct title for the article is Genetically Engineered Food. The term Genetically Modified is a political term and calls into question the impartiality of the article. It is also ambiguous. Is there any question that triploid seedless watermelon have been genetically modified? Tyrerj ( talk) 23:02, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
what is not new about genetically modified(GM)food? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.243.16.7 ( talk) 04:07, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
This comment points out something I have been thinking about. Here are the issues:
a) some people have health concerns about food produced in genetically modified plants (what happens to their bodies when they eat it). There are questions here about safety, regulation, labelling, etc. of the food product itself.
b) While many GM crops are ultimately used for food, others, like cotton and corn, are also used for other things like fabric or fuel.
c) some people are worried about what GM crops do to the environment, which can be broadly broken down into effects on targeted organisms (resistance) and effect on non-targeted organisms (butterflies, gene-flow)
d) some people are in general concerned about methods of industrial agriculture in general (monoculture, use of chemicals) and concerns about GM technology may be best fit into the way it perpetuates industrial ag
From the title of the article, I (and apparently others) expect it to deal only with (a). But since there is no article on GM crops per se, (b)-(c) have been dealt with in this article. Also there is nowhere a description of GM agribusiness in general -- what it is, who the players are (companies and farmers), how farmers use GM technology in practice, which would include explaining why farmers have so widely adopted it, and describe how its products are used... but this article, so inaptly named, does a lot of it.
There are two other wiki articles Genetically modified organism and Genetically modified food controversies.
I am not sure how to best deal with this. I think I would like to propose that we rename this article to something like Genetically Modified Crops, (very open to other ideas!) And deal with (a) only briefly here since there is a whole article on that topic. And put this article into sensible harmony with the GMO article.
What do you think? Jytdog ( talk) 13:41, 30 August 2012 (UTC)
The articles this discussion should concern:
The concept of genetically modifying organisms (especially crops/food) is a fairly controversial topic, so I would imagine that the articles get a fair amount of visitors. That said, I want to point out some issues to the articles that could be fixed. I've assigned numbers to each suggestion/issue, so that they can be discussed in separate sections.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Yutsi ( talk • contribs)
hi read this — Preceding unsigned comment added by Purebuzzin ( talk • contribs) 11:56, 8 January 2013 (UTC)
If nothing else could we get an answer to this issue. The paragraphs that this concerns are these ones. AIRcorn (talk) 21:01, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
Hi
IMO, any time we have subarticles, there should be a standard, brief paragraph in the "head" article (ideally taken from the lede of the subarticle and edited for concision if necessary) and a link to "main", and then keep an eye on those standard paragraphs for changes so that they stay short and plain. Ideally, no statistics would be in those standard paragraphs, otherwise when new data emerges we have to go back and update the data in many places which will inevitably lead to missing things and the overall suite falling out of sync within itself and with reality. I feel that we should try hard to avoid having long sections in different articles that cover the same matter. This was the state in which I found articles within this suite several months ago and most of my work has been consolidating overlapping material into clear, NPOV, well sourced discussions. Having a suite of articles covering various aspects of complex matter is indeed common in WIkipedia, but it is also commonly handed badly IMO. For instance in the suite of evolution articles, the main evolution article has a history section that is very long (7 paragraphs that fill my screen)... and there is an entire much longer subarticle on the history (about 10x longer). I glanced over the two texts and they don't tell the same story or even use the same refs.... this is not a happy thing for an encyclopedia and we should avoid doing this. This is for me a very important principle and I hope we can discuss it. Jytdog ( talk) 13:58, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
(starting tabs over) Hi Aircorn... so far nobody has gone to the mat on the the self references. With respect to the objection raised in Issue 1, I wrote above, that if you read Wiki's self-reference policy, it is clear that these texts do not violate that policy. Nobody has responded to that so I assume nobody disagrees. My sense is that you and arc de ciel have objected on more stylistic grounds... but neither of you has gone to the mat on this. Is this indeed important to you?
But let's go back to the subject matter of this section. I have been trying to lay down a principle that sections for which we have big subarticles should just be very brief stubs - 1 paragraph taken from the lede of the subarticle, so that we don't end up with long, weedy descriptions of a given issue in different articles that extensively overlap with each other and with the main subarticle... which leads to inconsistencies and disorganization that you have described as a bane of wikipedia (and I heartily agree!). I thought we had kind of agreed on this... but you just recently expanded one of these stub sections with a bunch of material copied from a subarticle. So what gives? How shall we do this? I have been tempted to go into some of the articles you have created and apply this "stub principle" (for instance you have a section on "regulation of the release of genetically modified organisms" in your "regulation of genetic engineering" article that is my mind is waaaay too long and should be just a stub, as we have a whole article on "regulation of the release of genetically modified organisms") but i have held back from stubifying that section until (and only if) we reach consensus here. Jytdog ( talk) 18:09, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
I'm not really watching the articles right now, but I just wanted to confirm that the objections I raised were indeed answered. It doesn't "feel good" from my own style perspective, but I don't know of any style guideline that rules it out. Also, I think that the general organization Jytdog has put in place is a good one; as he said, my concerns were only about the way they were disambiguated. It seems that people adding the same citations repeatedly is common in this group of articles, and this organization would probably help a lot. Arc de Ciel ( talk) 03:00, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
Let's have a focused discussion on overall structure. This is part of the topic mentioned above but only part. Let's map it out. It would be really great to do this with some kind of software that allowed us to draw things, but I am ignorant of how to do that. So I will take a shot at this using words alone.
Here is my perspective
All this done with the principle of subarticles mentioned above... Jytdog ( talk) 14:00, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
I like the smallification of text!! didn't know one could do that. Funny that you have "animal based" - there is no GM food from animals (yet). but in theory i see what you mean. But i disagree really really strongly that "GM crops" is main for plant-based GM food. GM crops is about agriculture. its not about food. why do you think gm crops is about food? more to say but that stopped me - one thing at a time! Jytdog ( talk) 03:34, 17 October 2012 (UTC)
Séralini GE, Clair E, Mesnage R, Gress S, Defarge N, Malatesta M, Hennequin D, de Vendômois JS.
Long term toxicity of a Roundup herbicide and a Roundup-tolerant genetically modified maize.
Food Chem Toxicol. 2012 Nov;50(11):4221-31. doi: 10.1016/j.fct.2012.08.005. Epub 2012 Sep 19.
Abstract
The health effects of a Roundup-tolerant genetically modified maize (from 11% in the diet), cultivated with or without Roundup, and Roundup alone (from 0.1ppb in water), were studied 2years in rats. In females, all treated groups died 2-3 times more than controls, and more rapidly. This difference was visible in 3 male groups fed GMOs. All results were hormone and sex dependent, and the pathological profiles were comparable. Females developed large mammary tumors almost always more often than and before controls, the pituitary was the second most disabled organ; the sex hormonal balance was modified by GMO and Roundup treatments. In treated males, liver congestions and necrosis were 2.5-5.5 times higher. This pathology was confirmed by optic and transmission electron microscopy. Marked and severe kidney nephropathies were also generally 1.3-2.3 greater. Males presented 4 times more large palpable tumors than controls which occurred up to 600days earlier. Biochemistry data confirmed very significant kidney chronic deficiencies; for all treatments and both sexes, 76% of the altered parameters were kidney related. These results can be explained by the non linear endocrine-disrupting effects of Roundup, but also by the overexpression of the transgene in the GMO and its metabolic consequences.
PMID
22999595
[PubMed - in process]
Full Free Text:
http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.fct.2012.08.005
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0278691512005637
http://research.sustainablefoodtrust.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Final-Paper.pdf
-- Ocdnctx ( talk) 19:15, 18 October 2012 (UTC)
The lede currently has the line "Critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including safety issues,[4] ecological concerns, and economic concerns raised by the fact GM plants (and potentially animals) that are food sources are subject to intellectual property law." This line should be balanced with a proponents line that mentions scientific consensus on safety, increased yields, lower chemical use. Either that or the line should be removed and issue dealt with at Genetically modified food controversies instead. BlackHades ( talk) 11:31, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
General response to topic: nothing can be in the lede, that is not in the body of the article. Currently there is no discussion of the safety of GM food or any of the other stuff that BlackHades suggests, in the body of the article. Which I am kind of happy about as inclusion would mean that this article would start to look exactly like the controversies article... but on the other hand, I could totally see there being a section on Food Safety in this article. SO i oppose expansion of the lede (unless the body is first expanded). I do not think that the line can be deleted as controversy over perceptions of safety is one of the most notable things about GM food. Jytdog ( talk) 23:16, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
I did make an outline. You haven't stated your position on it. Do you agree with my suggestion? If so, we can start working toward it. It doesn't necessarily have to be a new section on safety. It can be a expansion of the current controversy section that includes safety. "A more condensed version of the lede currently in Genetically modified food controversies should be under the controversy body section of this page. That explains the controversy for and against GM food as argued by proponents and opponents. It should highlight key arguments by both sides but in a short precise manner. Probably something half the size of the lede in Genetically modified food controversies. Followed by including a one line proponents and one line critics line in the lede of this page." BlackHades ( talk) 19:22, 25 January 2013 (UTC)
I was afraid of this line being transferred from the other article with the same insufficient sources and actually even topping by an almost satiric use of source (California voters dismissing labelling as source for scientific consensus? Please .....) Let me restate, what I've already posted earlier in the discussion:
-- Kmhkmh ( talk) 13:47, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
The problem is that strictly speaking those sources do not really prove a scientific consensus, but that show merely that many members of the scientific community consider them safe. One of the sources does make an explicitly makes statement regarding a broad consensus, but that's a blog and apparently simply based on personal experience/impression than an actual examination. As far as comparisons are concerned currently this strikes me much more like a "nuclear energy is safe" form of "consensus" (that statement could have been sourced in similar fashion at least few years back) rather than the consensus on global warming. That's least my (layman) impression based on the sources I've looked it.--
Kmhkmh (
talk)
15:21, 25 January 2013 (UTC)
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I have requested full page protection due to edit-warring. I would hope no more reverts take place since one user is over the 3RR limit and the other at 3RR. I also hope no reports will be made to 3RRN. Thank you. Δρ.Κ. λόγος πράξις 03:59, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
An editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page—whether involving the same or different material—within a 24-hour period.According to that, you are at 5RR and counting. You really should stop reverting and engage in talk instead. Thank you. Δρ.Κ. λόγος πράξις 04:09, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
I removed the following from the controversies section:
Controversies has its own separate article. Genetically modified food controversies. The controversies paragraph in this article is meant to be a short general brief overview of that article. It should not be dwelling on such specific incidents without cause. There is no reason that makes it necessary to mention the Starlink corn incident specifically, and be the ONLY incident given weight over all incidents mentioned in Genetically modified food controversies. Is it more noteworthy than the Pusztai affair? Séralini affair? Or any other incidents that exist in Genetically modified food controversies? None of these have any weight in this brief general overview of Genetically modified food controversies in the paragraph of this article and neither should the Starlink corn incident. BlackHades ( talk) 09:54, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
Substantial information missing in the introduction of this issue. The "Edit" link is available for the sub sections, but one is not available for the paragraphs at the top. It says:
"There is broad scientific consensus that food on the market derived from GM crops poses no greater risk to human health than conventional food.[4][5][6][7][8][9] However, critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including safety issues....."
It says "critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds," at this point no evidence is offered. Here are some circa 2013:
We now have overwhelming evidence that GM foods are not substantially equivalent to the non-modified version, and are in fact responsible for significant number of deaths and diseases including but not limited to the cases of Autism, Bipolar, Infertility, Intestinal leakage, malnutrition, obesity, toxicity, allergies, Thyroid Cancer, Kidney Injury, Diabetes, Deaths from Intestinal Infections, Deaths from Alzheimer's, Deaths from Senile Dementia and more. There is broad scientific consensus that food on the market derived from GM crops have caused these aforementioned diseases and deaths. [1] [1] [1].
At Monsanto's request, the EPA arbitrarily raised the toxicity limits of glyphosate from 6 to 20 parts per million in 1987 without testing. [2] Glyphosate (Roundup) continued to exceed the already arbitrary raised 1987 safety levels when Monsanto won an ridiculously unprecedented exemption from any future tracking from the EPA for Roundup Ready Soybeans (1993) [2] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Behtaj ( talk • contribs) 08:02, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
The organization of this article makes no sense whatsoever. Why isn't it organized by plant type or something that actually has some basis in reality? The DNA/protein content of the end product is completely irrelevant, and we don't organize other articles in this way. Titanium Dragon ( talk) 00:58, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
Today in these difs, User:Onerealman123 added the following
( http://naturalrevolution.org/gmo-resources/scientific-research/ Scientific research journals), however, dispute the findings that GMOs are safe. A long-term toxicology study was conducted on pigs fed a combined genetically modified (GM) soy and GM maize (corn) diet, and their conclusions state that GMOs and the chemcials used to grow them are associated with multiple chronic diseases reported by the ( http://www.organic-systems.org/journal/81/8106.pdf Journal of Organic Systems, 2013). There is also concerns from the ( http://aaemonline.org/ American Academy of Environmental Medicine) and their report of ( http://naturalrevolution.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Evidence-of-Probable-Harm-and-Safety-Concerns-of-Transgenic-GMO-Crops-and-Food-Products-American-Academy-of-Environmental-Medicine.pdf Evidence of Probable Harm and Safety Concerns of Transgenic (GMO) Crops and Food Products).
Since GMOs were introduced into the food supply in 1995, the rate of ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20159870 chronic health conditions) among children in the United States increased from 12.8% in 1994 to 26.6% in 2006, particularly for asthma, obesity, and behavior and learning problems.
The ( http://www.aaemonline.org/gmopost.html Academy of Environmental Medicine) has issued a position statement on GMO food stating, “...several animal studies indicate serious health risks associated with GM food consumption including infertility, immune dysregulation, accelerated aging, dysregulation of genes associated with cholesterol synthesis, insulin regulation, cell signaling, and protein formation, and changes in the liver, kidney, spleen and gastrointestinal system. “There is more than a casual association between GM foods and adverse health effects. There is causation as defined by Hill's Criteria in the areas of strength of association, consistency, specificity, biological gradient, and biological plausibility. The strength of association and consistency between GM foods and disease is confirmed in several animal studies.” They further state that “because GM foods have not been properly tested for human consumption, and because there is ample evidence of probable harm,” they call on physicians to educate the public and warn their patients to avoid GM foods.
I reverted that addition. Reasons:
Happy to discuss. Jytdog ( talk) 16:39, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
Today User:Geraldatyrrell made this edit, with edit note "clarifying concerns section, removing emotionally laden terminology"
I have manually reverted all but the replacement of "safety" with "public health".
The change was from "critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including safety issues, [3] ecological concerns, and economic concerns raised by the fact that GM plants (and potentially animals) that are food sources are subject to intellectual property law."
to: "many analysts have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including public health issues, [3] environmental degradation, and economic concerns raised by the fact that GM plants (and potentially animals) that are food sources are subject to intellectual property law and largely owned by multinational corporations."
I italicized the changes. The changes appear to me, to be tendentious and change NPOV language to more POV language - from "critics" to "many analysts" increases the number and plays down that these "analysts" are actually criticizing mainstream science and regulatory procedures. The critics, are indeed "critics". Also, "multinational corporations" is kind of typical activist-y language to describe Big Bad Companies... so I would say that adding it, is an effort to increase the punch, to make it more emotionally laden, not less. (It is also question-begging; patents are ultimately used to make money - why is it shocking that companies would own them? Also, I am not sure that they are "largely" owned by companies - it wouldn't surprise me but I would bet that Gerald has no source for that.) Likewise, "environmental degradation" is much less NPOV that "ecological concerns." It is hard for me to see how these changes make the article more NPOV - they seem to me, to make it less so. I don't see a big difference between "safety" and "public health" and am not sure why the change was made, but it seems to be a neutral word selection issue that is not worth fussing over. Jytdog ( talk) 17:32, 22 October 2013 (UTC)
I removed the redundant text from this section, everything I wrote has been parsed and appears below, thanks Jytdog for that Geraldatyrrell ( talk) 01:40, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
PRSV not PRV.
PRV is a pressure regulating valve not the virus, i would edit it but it seems like i can't... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.1.30.22 ( talk • contribs) 16:07, 30 October 2013 UTC
As a result of a discussion here my attention was called to the statement "There is no evidence to support the idea that the consumption of approved GM food has a detrimental effect on human health" that was introduced by User:semitransgenic in this edit as a change from "No reports of ill effects have been documented in the human population from GM food." I think that language is too broad and have reverted to the older language. Hope you all agree. Jytdog ( talk) 02:43, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
NRC2004
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | → | Archive 10 |
I added a couple of sentences explaining some important factors about introducing new genes to plants. The important of what type of promoter to use, codon usage and deactivating the genes. Legendarygottyline ( talk) 06:47, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
This article doesn't appreciate or acknowledge the dangers of GM foods, or even accurately portray the ones listed. For one, Arpad Pusztai had many experiments, and even though they could have been wrong, they were repeated by others with similar results.
Also, the methods of gene transfer aren't fully portrayed, thus eluding the truth. They do fire genes from a "gene gun" but that isn't a full representation of what actually happens. They coat the genes on thousands of small shards and fire them at a pack of cells hoping one will penetrate, and not completely destroy the cell. Then they use a method to kill out all the cells without the gene, but this and the fact the cell was ruptured can have serious negative side affects. Also, the genes can replace other genes or make others not function properly. There is real no science in this process, its aiming a gun and hoping you get a really lucky shot.
I have many other gripes about the lax attention to the dangers of GM foods and the means by which they are created. My only reference is "Seeds of Deception" by Jeffrey M. Smith.
So you base your argument on one non-peer reviewed source called "Seeds of Deception." Was "Sowers of Discontent" sold out? How about "Flowers of Doom?" or "Fruits of Agony?"-- 216.227.89.35 ( talk) 19:24, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
Hi, I think there should be some info in the article about terminator seeds. Ie. genetically modified seeds that don't germinate and thus don't create new seeds, which means that new seeds have to be purchased each year from the company that makes these mutant organisms. cheers, Jamie —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.68.137.227 ( talk) 15:11, 17 July 2010 (UTC)
I removed the recent additions to allergies as the sources were not reliable, particularly for what was written. This reference might warrant some further discussion though: Genetically Modified Foods: Are They a Risk to Human/Animal Health? by Arpad Pusztai. Also I could not find the article referring to the butterflies, but it could be alluding to this study. AIRcorn (talk) 03:23, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
Read the article but didn't see it, well here's the source and quote: "Q: Supporters of GMOs say that they’re essential if we are going to be able to feed the planet?
Gillés-Eric Séralini: That’s ridiculous. For some time now, GMOs have been pesticide-producing plants protected by patents that are a mainstay of intensive agriculture. For the last 14 years they have been used to prioritise animal feed for rich countries ahead of food for the children of the poor.
Patented seeds increase famine and raise prices, as we have seen in their use to produce agrofuels.
Guy Riba: GMOs are a solution. But they are not the only one. What we should be fully promoting is selection by genetic markers. We can exploit and track natural diversity better within one species." http://www.combat-monsanto.co.uk/spip.php?article287 (I know the site may seem a bit biased but the one actually giving the information is an expert and his reasoning does seem sound) Also, it should be noted that even if you succeed in giving the plant the intended traits it could also give it unanticipated ones (good or bad). Props888 ( talk) 01:07, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
Notes that reference 109 is now a broken link.
Here are some scholarly reports on the effects of GM foods: Finamore A, Roselli M, Britti S, et al. Intestinal and peripheral immune response to MON 810 maize ingestion in weaning and old mice. J Agric. Food Chem. 2008; 56(23):11533-11539. Kroghsbo S, Madsen C, Poulsen M, et al. Immunotoxicological studies of genetically modified rice expression PHA-E lectin or Bt toxin in Wistar rats. Toxicology. 2008; 245:24-34. Malatesta M, Boraldi F, Annovi G, et al. A long-term study on female mice fed on a genetically modified soybean:effects on liver ageing. Histochem Cell Biol. 2008; 130:967-977. Velimirov A, Binter C, Zentek J. Biological effects of transgenic maize NK603xMON810 fed in long term reproduction studies in mice. Report-Federal Ministry of Health, Family and Youth. 2008. Kilic A, Aday M. A three generational study with genetically modified Bt corn in rats: biochemical and histopathological investigation. Food Chem. Toxicol. 2008; 46(3):1164-1170.-- 99.237.112.21 ( talk) 00:37, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
I wondered why there is no mention of Monsanto's "New Leaf Potato" in the table of genetically modified crop plants. Even though it is not presently being marketed, McDonald's and other fast food chains used these potatoes for making french fries during the late 90's until consumer outrage forced them to stop the practice between late 1999 and early 2000. Rhoadeka ( talk) 03:08, 30 September 2011 (UTC)
I removed the following as there are way too many. I have pasted them here in case some need to be recued. David D. (Talk) 22:04, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
The article is unreadable and is essentially a marketing piece for organic farming. It contains numerous quotes from material published by unscientific groups with obvious agendas to promote organic produce, such as Soil Association, Center for Food Safety and Organic Center. It contains entire sections devoted to health risks, even though no real evidence of any such risks has been ever produced and they remain pure conjecture. The section on the EU "ban" is dishonest: the EU did not have a blanket ban but instead delayed the licensing process without any reason; and it focuses on some irrelevant Wikileaks cable in order to suggest that US has an ulterior motive, or that its government is taking bribes. The section about allergens does not mention that GM food is actually tested for allergens, while non-GM food is not. -- Tweenk ( talk) 07:11, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
The section "Alfalfa" seems to me to be particularly one-sided - i.e. not a Neutral Point Of View. This section reads like propaganda from the anti-GM activists not an entry in an encyclopaedia. 50% of this section contains stuff/quotes from the "organic farming/sales community", " organic farming groups, organic food outlets, and activists", two anti-GM politicians and the " Center for Food Safety." What about some information from the other side of the argument? Where are the detailed reasons why the USDA allowed GM alafalfa to be grown? Where are the quotes from the farmers who grow the 96% of alfalfa that is not organic and who presumably benefit from advantages of GM alfalfa? Where are the quotes from the pro-GM politicians, from Monsanto and from the GM seed distributors?
SylviaStanley (
talk)
09:57, 29 September 2011 (UTC)
The section "Legal issues with Roundup Ready Alfalfa in the US" in the article "Alfalfa" seems to much a much more objective description. I propose we replace what is here with the section from "Alfalfa." SylviaStanley ( talk) 16:58, 31 October 2011 (UTC)
There is some sourced material there [11], which may be relevant, although it uses WP:Parenthetical referencing. ASCIIn2Bme ( talk) 16:51, 7 November 2011 (UTC)
Virtually all of this article concerns crops. No animals have yet been commercialised as GM food. Cotton, one of the major crops main use is as a fibre not a food. Non-food crops like biofuels, Amflora, flowers etc could and should be covered by this article. Many issues regarding GM crops are different than those regarding GM animals. Any GE animal issues would still be covered under Genetically modified organisms. AIRcorn (talk) 05:31, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
This article cites a university report that links GM crops with the reduction in Monarch Butterflies. Probably want to include some of the latest research on the environmental impact.-- 124.182.103.253 ( talk) 22:24, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
The plant breeders' and geneticists' perspective is one of the things missing all the time from news reports and publications like this. For example, on the allergy issue, it is probably impossible for a disease resistance gene to cause allergies when it is transferred to another crop. When your transfer storage proteins (like those in the mentioned Brazil nut) to another seed or nut, yes, you can anticipate the potential for allergic reactions to be transferred to that crop species.
For some crops, we plant breeders and geneticist need to insert GMOs for some of the toughest diseases and insect pests. There aren't any alternatives within the species or related species for some viruses, fungi, and bacteria. And transfer from related species is sometimes extremely difficult if not impossible unless one uses biotechnology. Everyone can debate all they want, but if you want to one day pay $20-30/lb for bananas, or some other fruit and vegetable crops, then we will just quit using GMOs altogether. For poorer countries dependent on some of the staple food crops, it truly makes sense in areas where these diseases or insect pests are and have been rampant for years.
SLN Breeder — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.191.140.162 ( talk) 21:08, 6 December 2011 (UTC)
I like your topic and data you posted. You have really detailed data and facts. In the method I have question about last sentance. Since I haven’t done much research on GMO food, is it true that all transgenic gene should be able to denature by heat before human consumption? How about genetic fruits or vegetables. Majority of them are consumed fresh ? Or is it some specific gene that can’t be consumed by humans and therefore that product need to be coocked? I know that avedin in rice binds to biotin and therefore nned to be coocked to lose its ability to bind biotin. Does it it mean all transgenic genes can cause similar issues? If it does that how public will know what to consumed fresh or cooked? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gshikula1 ( talk • contribs) 16:13, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
I am a GGC student performing this as a student project. I plan to add a History section to this article which includes dates and factual information about Genetically Modified Foods. I also plan to add 2-3 illustrations that proceed along the lines of this article. Jahmal.council ( talk) 18:10, 6 March 2012 (UTC) 168.28.23.1 ( talk) 15:44, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Today I added a small history section but I really need help! I am open for any suggestions if anyone wants to help me. I believe it is historically accurate, but I also believe it need more facts. Please help if you can. Jahmal.council ( talk) 18:12, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
There is a lot of good information in this article, I like what you have added! I really like the section on health risks, maybe you could expand the table into a small narrative for people like me who don't like reading figures. Maybe you could expand on the FlavrSavr tomato, eco friendly pig, golden rice, and maybe say something in the intro about the benefits of GM foods. To give people an idea of what biotechnology is, and why it’s important, you could say it could be an efficient way to feed nutritious food to developing countries, and disaster victims. Also, since Monsanto plays a big role in GMOs, maybe you could make a mini-section on them, so that people would know what they do, and who is in charge of the company. Also, maybe under the “methods” section, you could divide it into sub-sections, titled with the name of that technique, and detail each of the different types of biotech techniques. I didn’t even know what biotechnology was until I took that class with Dr. Timpte, so a lot of people will need more information to get an idea about genes are transferred like through microballistics. Natalietadpole ( talk) 22:20, 21 April 2012 (UTC)
I added some information on the controversy page, it is the last paragraph.I would like to know others take on what i wrote. Mendez1993 ( talk) 08:21, 19 June 2012 (UTC)
I am planning on adding information on the controversy section. There is a website that has much information about the controversies on GMO food Mendez1993 ( talk) 07:01, 19 June 2012 (UTC)
The tag heading this article indicates that this article is too biassed towards the United States of America. It was said on the programme Today on BBC Radio Four on May 2 2012 that there had been a conflict between two rival sides over genetically modified food - this was definitely taking place in Europe, so this could be added to the article to make it a little more global. I shall happily modify the article if I can find the details. ACEOREVIVED ( talk) 23:47, 2 May 2012 (UTC)
OK, I have done a little research and found a little more on the protest reported on the "Today" programme in May 2012. I can add more details if I have anything further. At least this gives us news from somewhere east of the Atlantic. ACEOREVIVED ( talk) 08:30, 3 May 2012 (UTC)
The Genetically modified animals section seems too broad for the page that it is within. The parts that seem to broad are: the list of 6 classes of transgenic animals; the example animals (goats with spider silk and glowing pigs) that are not intended for consumption.
I suggest that it deserves it's own page, or the content could be added to Genetically_modified_organism#Transgenic_animals. I think that the section on this page should be kept to genetically modified animals that are in some way intended to be consumed, as this is a "food" page, not a general GMO page. ThanAngell ( talk) 21:12, 25 June 2012 (UTC)
The correct term for this and the correct title for the article is Genetically Engineered Food. The term Genetically Modified is a political term and calls into question the impartiality of the article. It is also ambiguous. Is there any question that triploid seedless watermelon have been genetically modified? Tyrerj ( talk) 23:02, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
what is not new about genetically modified(GM)food? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.243.16.7 ( talk) 04:07, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
This comment points out something I have been thinking about. Here are the issues:
a) some people have health concerns about food produced in genetically modified plants (what happens to their bodies when they eat it). There are questions here about safety, regulation, labelling, etc. of the food product itself.
b) While many GM crops are ultimately used for food, others, like cotton and corn, are also used for other things like fabric or fuel.
c) some people are worried about what GM crops do to the environment, which can be broadly broken down into effects on targeted organisms (resistance) and effect on non-targeted organisms (butterflies, gene-flow)
d) some people are in general concerned about methods of industrial agriculture in general (monoculture, use of chemicals) and concerns about GM technology may be best fit into the way it perpetuates industrial ag
From the title of the article, I (and apparently others) expect it to deal only with (a). But since there is no article on GM crops per se, (b)-(c) have been dealt with in this article. Also there is nowhere a description of GM agribusiness in general -- what it is, who the players are (companies and farmers), how farmers use GM technology in practice, which would include explaining why farmers have so widely adopted it, and describe how its products are used... but this article, so inaptly named, does a lot of it.
There are two other wiki articles Genetically modified organism and Genetically modified food controversies.
I am not sure how to best deal with this. I think I would like to propose that we rename this article to something like Genetically Modified Crops, (very open to other ideas!) And deal with (a) only briefly here since there is a whole article on that topic. And put this article into sensible harmony with the GMO article.
What do you think? Jytdog ( talk) 13:41, 30 August 2012 (UTC)
The articles this discussion should concern:
The concept of genetically modifying organisms (especially crops/food) is a fairly controversial topic, so I would imagine that the articles get a fair amount of visitors. That said, I want to point out some issues to the articles that could be fixed. I've assigned numbers to each suggestion/issue, so that they can be discussed in separate sections.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Yutsi ( talk • contribs)
hi read this — Preceding unsigned comment added by Purebuzzin ( talk • contribs) 11:56, 8 January 2013 (UTC)
If nothing else could we get an answer to this issue. The paragraphs that this concerns are these ones. AIRcorn (talk) 21:01, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
Hi
IMO, any time we have subarticles, there should be a standard, brief paragraph in the "head" article (ideally taken from the lede of the subarticle and edited for concision if necessary) and a link to "main", and then keep an eye on those standard paragraphs for changes so that they stay short and plain. Ideally, no statistics would be in those standard paragraphs, otherwise when new data emerges we have to go back and update the data in many places which will inevitably lead to missing things and the overall suite falling out of sync within itself and with reality. I feel that we should try hard to avoid having long sections in different articles that cover the same matter. This was the state in which I found articles within this suite several months ago and most of my work has been consolidating overlapping material into clear, NPOV, well sourced discussions. Having a suite of articles covering various aspects of complex matter is indeed common in WIkipedia, but it is also commonly handed badly IMO. For instance in the suite of evolution articles, the main evolution article has a history section that is very long (7 paragraphs that fill my screen)... and there is an entire much longer subarticle on the history (about 10x longer). I glanced over the two texts and they don't tell the same story or even use the same refs.... this is not a happy thing for an encyclopedia and we should avoid doing this. This is for me a very important principle and I hope we can discuss it. Jytdog ( talk) 13:58, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
(starting tabs over) Hi Aircorn... so far nobody has gone to the mat on the the self references. With respect to the objection raised in Issue 1, I wrote above, that if you read Wiki's self-reference policy, it is clear that these texts do not violate that policy. Nobody has responded to that so I assume nobody disagrees. My sense is that you and arc de ciel have objected on more stylistic grounds... but neither of you has gone to the mat on this. Is this indeed important to you?
But let's go back to the subject matter of this section. I have been trying to lay down a principle that sections for which we have big subarticles should just be very brief stubs - 1 paragraph taken from the lede of the subarticle, so that we don't end up with long, weedy descriptions of a given issue in different articles that extensively overlap with each other and with the main subarticle... which leads to inconsistencies and disorganization that you have described as a bane of wikipedia (and I heartily agree!). I thought we had kind of agreed on this... but you just recently expanded one of these stub sections with a bunch of material copied from a subarticle. So what gives? How shall we do this? I have been tempted to go into some of the articles you have created and apply this "stub principle" (for instance you have a section on "regulation of the release of genetically modified organisms" in your "regulation of genetic engineering" article that is my mind is waaaay too long and should be just a stub, as we have a whole article on "regulation of the release of genetically modified organisms") but i have held back from stubifying that section until (and only if) we reach consensus here. Jytdog ( talk) 18:09, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
I'm not really watching the articles right now, but I just wanted to confirm that the objections I raised were indeed answered. It doesn't "feel good" from my own style perspective, but I don't know of any style guideline that rules it out. Also, I think that the general organization Jytdog has put in place is a good one; as he said, my concerns were only about the way they were disambiguated. It seems that people adding the same citations repeatedly is common in this group of articles, and this organization would probably help a lot. Arc de Ciel ( talk) 03:00, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
Let's have a focused discussion on overall structure. This is part of the topic mentioned above but only part. Let's map it out. It would be really great to do this with some kind of software that allowed us to draw things, but I am ignorant of how to do that. So I will take a shot at this using words alone.
Here is my perspective
All this done with the principle of subarticles mentioned above... Jytdog ( talk) 14:00, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
I like the smallification of text!! didn't know one could do that. Funny that you have "animal based" - there is no GM food from animals (yet). but in theory i see what you mean. But i disagree really really strongly that "GM crops" is main for plant-based GM food. GM crops is about agriculture. its not about food. why do you think gm crops is about food? more to say but that stopped me - one thing at a time! Jytdog ( talk) 03:34, 17 October 2012 (UTC)
Séralini GE, Clair E, Mesnage R, Gress S, Defarge N, Malatesta M, Hennequin D, de Vendômois JS.
Long term toxicity of a Roundup herbicide and a Roundup-tolerant genetically modified maize.
Food Chem Toxicol. 2012 Nov;50(11):4221-31. doi: 10.1016/j.fct.2012.08.005. Epub 2012 Sep 19.
Abstract
The health effects of a Roundup-tolerant genetically modified maize (from 11% in the diet), cultivated with or without Roundup, and Roundup alone (from 0.1ppb in water), were studied 2years in rats. In females, all treated groups died 2-3 times more than controls, and more rapidly. This difference was visible in 3 male groups fed GMOs. All results were hormone and sex dependent, and the pathological profiles were comparable. Females developed large mammary tumors almost always more often than and before controls, the pituitary was the second most disabled organ; the sex hormonal balance was modified by GMO and Roundup treatments. In treated males, liver congestions and necrosis were 2.5-5.5 times higher. This pathology was confirmed by optic and transmission electron microscopy. Marked and severe kidney nephropathies were also generally 1.3-2.3 greater. Males presented 4 times more large palpable tumors than controls which occurred up to 600days earlier. Biochemistry data confirmed very significant kidney chronic deficiencies; for all treatments and both sexes, 76% of the altered parameters were kidney related. These results can be explained by the non linear endocrine-disrupting effects of Roundup, but also by the overexpression of the transgene in the GMO and its metabolic consequences.
PMID
22999595
[PubMed - in process]
Full Free Text:
http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.fct.2012.08.005
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0278691512005637
http://research.sustainablefoodtrust.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Final-Paper.pdf
-- Ocdnctx ( talk) 19:15, 18 October 2012 (UTC)
The lede currently has the line "Critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including safety issues,[4] ecological concerns, and economic concerns raised by the fact GM plants (and potentially animals) that are food sources are subject to intellectual property law." This line should be balanced with a proponents line that mentions scientific consensus on safety, increased yields, lower chemical use. Either that or the line should be removed and issue dealt with at Genetically modified food controversies instead. BlackHades ( talk) 11:31, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
General response to topic: nothing can be in the lede, that is not in the body of the article. Currently there is no discussion of the safety of GM food or any of the other stuff that BlackHades suggests, in the body of the article. Which I am kind of happy about as inclusion would mean that this article would start to look exactly like the controversies article... but on the other hand, I could totally see there being a section on Food Safety in this article. SO i oppose expansion of the lede (unless the body is first expanded). I do not think that the line can be deleted as controversy over perceptions of safety is one of the most notable things about GM food. Jytdog ( talk) 23:16, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
I did make an outline. You haven't stated your position on it. Do you agree with my suggestion? If so, we can start working toward it. It doesn't necessarily have to be a new section on safety. It can be a expansion of the current controversy section that includes safety. "A more condensed version of the lede currently in Genetically modified food controversies should be under the controversy body section of this page. That explains the controversy for and against GM food as argued by proponents and opponents. It should highlight key arguments by both sides but in a short precise manner. Probably something half the size of the lede in Genetically modified food controversies. Followed by including a one line proponents and one line critics line in the lede of this page." BlackHades ( talk) 19:22, 25 January 2013 (UTC)
I was afraid of this line being transferred from the other article with the same insufficient sources and actually even topping by an almost satiric use of source (California voters dismissing labelling as source for scientific consensus? Please .....) Let me restate, what I've already posted earlier in the discussion:
-- Kmhkmh ( talk) 13:47, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
The problem is that strictly speaking those sources do not really prove a scientific consensus, but that show merely that many members of the scientific community consider them safe. One of the sources does make an explicitly makes statement regarding a broad consensus, but that's a blog and apparently simply based on personal experience/impression than an actual examination. As far as comparisons are concerned currently this strikes me much more like a "nuclear energy is safe" form of "consensus" (that statement could have been sourced in similar fashion at least few years back) rather than the consensus on global warming. That's least my (layman) impression based on the sources I've looked it.--
Kmhkmh (
talk)
15:21, 25 January 2013 (UTC)
|
I have requested full page protection due to edit-warring. I would hope no more reverts take place since one user is over the 3RR limit and the other at 3RR. I also hope no reports will be made to 3RRN. Thank you. Δρ.Κ. λόγος πράξις 03:59, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
An editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page—whether involving the same or different material—within a 24-hour period.According to that, you are at 5RR and counting. You really should stop reverting and engage in talk instead. Thank you. Δρ.Κ. λόγος πράξις 04:09, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
I removed the following from the controversies section:
Controversies has its own separate article. Genetically modified food controversies. The controversies paragraph in this article is meant to be a short general brief overview of that article. It should not be dwelling on such specific incidents without cause. There is no reason that makes it necessary to mention the Starlink corn incident specifically, and be the ONLY incident given weight over all incidents mentioned in Genetically modified food controversies. Is it more noteworthy than the Pusztai affair? Séralini affair? Or any other incidents that exist in Genetically modified food controversies? None of these have any weight in this brief general overview of Genetically modified food controversies in the paragraph of this article and neither should the Starlink corn incident. BlackHades ( talk) 09:54, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
Substantial information missing in the introduction of this issue. The "Edit" link is available for the sub sections, but one is not available for the paragraphs at the top. It says:
"There is broad scientific consensus that food on the market derived from GM crops poses no greater risk to human health than conventional food.[4][5][6][7][8][9] However, critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including safety issues....."
It says "critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds," at this point no evidence is offered. Here are some circa 2013:
We now have overwhelming evidence that GM foods are not substantially equivalent to the non-modified version, and are in fact responsible for significant number of deaths and diseases including but not limited to the cases of Autism, Bipolar, Infertility, Intestinal leakage, malnutrition, obesity, toxicity, allergies, Thyroid Cancer, Kidney Injury, Diabetes, Deaths from Intestinal Infections, Deaths from Alzheimer's, Deaths from Senile Dementia and more. There is broad scientific consensus that food on the market derived from GM crops have caused these aforementioned diseases and deaths. [1] [1] [1].
At Monsanto's request, the EPA arbitrarily raised the toxicity limits of glyphosate from 6 to 20 parts per million in 1987 without testing. [2] Glyphosate (Roundup) continued to exceed the already arbitrary raised 1987 safety levels when Monsanto won an ridiculously unprecedented exemption from any future tracking from the EPA for Roundup Ready Soybeans (1993) [2] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Behtaj ( talk • contribs) 08:02, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
The organization of this article makes no sense whatsoever. Why isn't it organized by plant type or something that actually has some basis in reality? The DNA/protein content of the end product is completely irrelevant, and we don't organize other articles in this way. Titanium Dragon ( talk) 00:58, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
Today in these difs, User:Onerealman123 added the following
( http://naturalrevolution.org/gmo-resources/scientific-research/ Scientific research journals), however, dispute the findings that GMOs are safe. A long-term toxicology study was conducted on pigs fed a combined genetically modified (GM) soy and GM maize (corn) diet, and their conclusions state that GMOs and the chemcials used to grow them are associated with multiple chronic diseases reported by the ( http://www.organic-systems.org/journal/81/8106.pdf Journal of Organic Systems, 2013). There is also concerns from the ( http://aaemonline.org/ American Academy of Environmental Medicine) and their report of ( http://naturalrevolution.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Evidence-of-Probable-Harm-and-Safety-Concerns-of-Transgenic-GMO-Crops-and-Food-Products-American-Academy-of-Environmental-Medicine.pdf Evidence of Probable Harm and Safety Concerns of Transgenic (GMO) Crops and Food Products).
Since GMOs were introduced into the food supply in 1995, the rate of ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20159870 chronic health conditions) among children in the United States increased from 12.8% in 1994 to 26.6% in 2006, particularly for asthma, obesity, and behavior and learning problems.
The ( http://www.aaemonline.org/gmopost.html Academy of Environmental Medicine) has issued a position statement on GMO food stating, “...several animal studies indicate serious health risks associated with GM food consumption including infertility, immune dysregulation, accelerated aging, dysregulation of genes associated with cholesterol synthesis, insulin regulation, cell signaling, and protein formation, and changes in the liver, kidney, spleen and gastrointestinal system. “There is more than a casual association between GM foods and adverse health effects. There is causation as defined by Hill's Criteria in the areas of strength of association, consistency, specificity, biological gradient, and biological plausibility. The strength of association and consistency between GM foods and disease is confirmed in several animal studies.” They further state that “because GM foods have not been properly tested for human consumption, and because there is ample evidence of probable harm,” they call on physicians to educate the public and warn their patients to avoid GM foods.
I reverted that addition. Reasons:
Happy to discuss. Jytdog ( talk) 16:39, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
Today User:Geraldatyrrell made this edit, with edit note "clarifying concerns section, removing emotionally laden terminology"
I have manually reverted all but the replacement of "safety" with "public health".
The change was from "critics have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including safety issues, [3] ecological concerns, and economic concerns raised by the fact that GM plants (and potentially animals) that are food sources are subject to intellectual property law."
to: "many analysts have objected to GM foods on several grounds, including public health issues, [3] environmental degradation, and economic concerns raised by the fact that GM plants (and potentially animals) that are food sources are subject to intellectual property law and largely owned by multinational corporations."
I italicized the changes. The changes appear to me, to be tendentious and change NPOV language to more POV language - from "critics" to "many analysts" increases the number and plays down that these "analysts" are actually criticizing mainstream science and regulatory procedures. The critics, are indeed "critics". Also, "multinational corporations" is kind of typical activist-y language to describe Big Bad Companies... so I would say that adding it, is an effort to increase the punch, to make it more emotionally laden, not less. (It is also question-begging; patents are ultimately used to make money - why is it shocking that companies would own them? Also, I am not sure that they are "largely" owned by companies - it wouldn't surprise me but I would bet that Gerald has no source for that.) Likewise, "environmental degradation" is much less NPOV that "ecological concerns." It is hard for me to see how these changes make the article more NPOV - they seem to me, to make it less so. I don't see a big difference between "safety" and "public health" and am not sure why the change was made, but it seems to be a neutral word selection issue that is not worth fussing over. Jytdog ( talk) 17:32, 22 October 2013 (UTC)
I removed the redundant text from this section, everything I wrote has been parsed and appears below, thanks Jytdog for that Geraldatyrrell ( talk) 01:40, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
PRSV not PRV.
PRV is a pressure regulating valve not the virus, i would edit it but it seems like i can't... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.1.30.22 ( talk • contribs) 16:07, 30 October 2013 UTC
As a result of a discussion here my attention was called to the statement "There is no evidence to support the idea that the consumption of approved GM food has a detrimental effect on human health" that was introduced by User:semitransgenic in this edit as a change from "No reports of ill effects have been documented in the human population from GM food." I think that language is too broad and have reverted to the older language. Hope you all agree. Jytdog ( talk) 02:43, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
NRC2004
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).