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Anna Hazare has been listed as "Atheist Gandhian". I do not think that is true. There isn't any reference to show that either. My understanding is that since he lives in a Hindu temples, his religion should be assumed to be Hindu. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rohitj.iitk ( talk • contribs) 18:58, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
I think the "notable admirers" section should name Einstein as well.
heya,
under the "criticisms" section is the following:
"Gandhi's rigid ahimsa has been translated as pacifism, thus a source of criticism from political conservatives and nationalists. His supposed view that one should not resist even an armed invasion of one's country, and his supposed comments that the British people should have offered no resistance to Nazi Germany and that the people victimized in the holocaust should have committed mass suicide to prevent Nazis from committing the sin of killing them, and to protest the evil they were committing have been viewed as grossly extreme and impractical, and outrightly insulting to the victims of the holocaust and the peoples subjected to the attacks of Nazi forces." (emphasis mine)
Given that the article itself has a quote supporting the former, and that a quote for the latter can be found at Wikiquote, I really don't see any need for "supposedly" to be placed there, save as an attempt to save face on Gandhi's behalf.
While it's improved on past revisions the article still feels more like a "welcome to Gandhism" magazine article than an encyclopaedia entry.
An encyclopaedic article should just state the facts. It should not be a scenario analysis of what Mahatma Gandhi would have said had he been still alive etc. While I may agree with the author's contentions if it were a magazine article, I would not accept it as a part of encyclopaedia. --- Gurubrahma 08:22, 5 September 2005 (UTC)
I understand your desire to keep it entirely factual.
There are so many people everywhere who construe Gandhi's opposition to wars around the world, etc. They happily forget that he died in 1948.
SO WHY DO WE STILL SAY HE INSPIRED DR. KING, LECH WALESA AND NELSON MANDELA, if he died in 1948 and that's that?
Obviously people would like to know how Gandhi would approach new world events, and expound his core beliefs to obtain guidance and a sense of right and wrong.
Wikipedia must make the facts absolutely clear, by using modern literary techniques WITHOUT deviating from the facts. Other encyclopedias have obviously failed to elucidate the reality about Gandhi if he has become a poster-boy for the anti-war, anti-US pacifists. WHY SHOULD WIKIPEDIA MAKE THE SAME MISTAKES?
This is about what people learn from articles here. I hope you understand that it is necessary to EXPOUND to develop the correct attitude.
I want to make the point that Gandhi was never hypocritical in his approach to peace, nor politically biased himself. I offered clear examples of his thinking by building on the way he analyzed events of his lifetime.
To add, the neutrality' of this article is absolute. It conflicts with no differing points of view, and walks a strict factual line.
I do not think it is fair to remove the POV notice, when the discussion is still going on. On the talk-page, 3 people believe it is POV while one doesn't believe so, and he is the original contributor of the article. The original contributor of the article should not remove that notice when the discussion is still on-going, especially since the POV tag would attract people to the discussion page. Also, the edit history should reflect what has been done to the page. let's observe some wikiquette. --- Gurubrahma 09:45, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
Dear All, khhhjjkljh
I apologize for the temp removal of the POV thing. I have a proposition for y'all: why don't y'all pick a passage which contains the info objectionable to you, and re-jig it to meet your viewpoint, and put it up for discussion?
Bear in mind, its important all the same to have some form of direct and explicit reference of Gandhi in relation to world events, such as the Rwanda and Sudan tragedies. We can't remove Gandhi's relevance to such events, as its beyond our power to do so.
My desire is to make an article as explicitly true to Gandhi as possible. I can't tolerate the anti-Gandhi freaks who screw up his words and present false criticism, or those who don't do any real research before putting up stuff based on newspaper op-eds.
I've gone over the article and removed direct references to Rwanda and Sudan w/o compromising the point I was making.
I've also re-organized the article: its purpose is to explain the thinking of Gandhi, how it has been applied around the world, and how what most of us understand to be Gandhi's teachings are actually different from Gandhi's own approach.
Gandhi's autobiography gives an excellent, direct contact with the mind of Mahatma Gandhi.
If there are any other questions/problems, its all open for discussion. But I would like to take down the neutrality sign in 24 hours. Its bad enough a man of peace had to be killed by violence. We don't need to argue over this for eternity.
Dear All,
I would like to apologize for any rudeness or arrogance I've demonstrated in the past couple of days. Being passionate about this subject, I had temporarily forgotten that I don't own this article, the legacy of Gandhiji or Wikipedia.
Thank you.
Nirav Maurya
An anon IP has been removing it without discussing it on the talk page. I think he should discuss it here before repeatedly deleting it. I've also left a message on the anon IP's talk page. Gurubrahma 05:27, 29 September 2005 (UTC)
Hello Gurubrahma,
I'm writing this to say that you were right - it was me giving you a little headache with the Purushottam Das Tandon article. And yes, I didn't have the stomach to get through the edit wars on Mahatma Gandhi, Gandhism. Furthermore, it was me removing your fancruft notice on the Gandhism article.
Its true that I've had my problems with you. I wasn't man enough to admit that your spirited and aggressive participation in Wikipedia was actually scaring me, as if there was something mentally wrong with me and my outlook on the world, and ability to communicate with other people. I think I got into Wikipedia totally for the wrong reasons.
I actually hate bitching, so I want to just say that you've been a good teacher - you've helped me understand my faults, and understand the hidden mistakes in my edits on various articles.
I wish you good luck on Wikipedia and your life.
Har Har Mahadev!
Nirav Maurya.
I've made some new revisions to the article, bringing its size within the preferable limit, eliminating long passages of repetitive material and several biased and judgemental assertions.
I've also made corrections to bring the article closer to NPOV, judgementalism and eliminate fancruft within the passages and conclusions.
Bear in mind, this is Gandhism, and all about Gandhi, so the latter job is quite difficult to judge and complete. - Nirav.
Over the past week, I've done much to erase those statements carrying bias and favoritism of Gandhi. At this point, I can't find any more statements that are judgmental about Gandhi, his views or any other people. Plus, I've added info on the points Gandhi is criticized and blamed about. Criticism is an important element of Gandhism.
I'm thus removing the fancruft notice. If anybody objects to this, I'd like to point out two things - (1) there are no judgmental statements or passages left, (2) there is a long passage containing points of criticism and (3) This is an article about Gandhi, and he was a great man.
However it is all open to discussion by future Wikiusers.
Jai Sri Rama! - Nirav Maurya.
I just added the cleanup-tone template to the article. I do think that the article is quite good, but I think that it does require some additional rewriting to have a formal style suitable for an encyclopedia article, and to remove some statements that are opinions rather than facts. I see from some of the comments here that these issues have been raised here before. Let's continue to improve this good and important article! -- 201.78.233.162 22:18, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
I've just completed a major re-edit of the article to try to make its tone more encyclopedic and less like an essay, and have consequently removed the cleanup template. I'm aware that Gandhism is a topic about which many people feel very strongly, but please remember that you do your position more justice by a fair and neutral assessment of the facts than by launching into one-sided passionate eulogies or, for that matter, furious rants. For what it's worth, I'm sure Gandhi would have agreed... :-)
I've done my best to remove the emotive language and extensive tautologies in this piece, but several sections still need extensive attention from experienced and neutral editors. The sections "Brahmacharya and Ahimsa" and "Religion" are little more than unsourced collections of quotes. These need to be rewritten as proper encyclopedic sections.
The section "Criticism and controversy" makes some important points, but desperately needs sources. Please read Wikipedia's guide to writing great articles: it is much more powerful to let the facts speak for themselves, rather than constantly reiterating how great Gandhi is. Readers will work out their own opinions. In particular, emotive language must be excised, as it often becomes offensive or ridiculous. Referring to Aung San Suu Kyi as "a small young woman", for instance, is deeply demeaning: she is a Nobel Prize winner, an internationally respected political leader, and almost sixty years of age! In any case, her size, age and sex have no bearing on her position as a Gandhian.
The section "Without truth, nothing" seems to be completely out of place and probably needs to have its salient facts redistributed more logically throughout the article, before being deleted.
This article is in need of restructuring. Presently, it is more a collection of miscelleaneous facts than a coherent introduction to the topic - especially in the later sections. There is, however, some very important material here, and it is a highly important subject. -- TinaSparkle 12:44, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
he had philosophical debates with gandhi.. -- ti 15:47, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
I have moved the article from Gandhism to Gandhianism. The term Gandhian is in far greater use than Gandhism. nirvana2013 08:31, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
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Here is nothing mentioned about Gandhi's experiment with sex and his views towards contraceptions. Souniel Yadav ( talk) 15:56, 10 October 2019 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Gandhism article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is written in Indian English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, travelled, centre, analysed, defence) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus. |
This page is not a forum for general discussion about Gandhism. Any such comments may be removed or refactored. Please limit discussion to improvement of this article. You may wish to ask factual questions about Gandhism at the Reference desk. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Anna Hazare has been listed as "Atheist Gandhian". I do not think that is true. There isn't any reference to show that either. My understanding is that since he lives in a Hindu temples, his religion should be assumed to be Hindu. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rohitj.iitk ( talk • contribs) 18:58, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
I think the "notable admirers" section should name Einstein as well.
heya,
under the "criticisms" section is the following:
"Gandhi's rigid ahimsa has been translated as pacifism, thus a source of criticism from political conservatives and nationalists. His supposed view that one should not resist even an armed invasion of one's country, and his supposed comments that the British people should have offered no resistance to Nazi Germany and that the people victimized in the holocaust should have committed mass suicide to prevent Nazis from committing the sin of killing them, and to protest the evil they were committing have been viewed as grossly extreme and impractical, and outrightly insulting to the victims of the holocaust and the peoples subjected to the attacks of Nazi forces." (emphasis mine)
Given that the article itself has a quote supporting the former, and that a quote for the latter can be found at Wikiquote, I really don't see any need for "supposedly" to be placed there, save as an attempt to save face on Gandhi's behalf.
While it's improved on past revisions the article still feels more like a "welcome to Gandhism" magazine article than an encyclopaedia entry.
An encyclopaedic article should just state the facts. It should not be a scenario analysis of what Mahatma Gandhi would have said had he been still alive etc. While I may agree with the author's contentions if it were a magazine article, I would not accept it as a part of encyclopaedia. --- Gurubrahma 08:22, 5 September 2005 (UTC)
I understand your desire to keep it entirely factual.
There are so many people everywhere who construe Gandhi's opposition to wars around the world, etc. They happily forget that he died in 1948.
SO WHY DO WE STILL SAY HE INSPIRED DR. KING, LECH WALESA AND NELSON MANDELA, if he died in 1948 and that's that?
Obviously people would like to know how Gandhi would approach new world events, and expound his core beliefs to obtain guidance and a sense of right and wrong.
Wikipedia must make the facts absolutely clear, by using modern literary techniques WITHOUT deviating from the facts. Other encyclopedias have obviously failed to elucidate the reality about Gandhi if he has become a poster-boy for the anti-war, anti-US pacifists. WHY SHOULD WIKIPEDIA MAKE THE SAME MISTAKES?
This is about what people learn from articles here. I hope you understand that it is necessary to EXPOUND to develop the correct attitude.
I want to make the point that Gandhi was never hypocritical in his approach to peace, nor politically biased himself. I offered clear examples of his thinking by building on the way he analyzed events of his lifetime.
To add, the neutrality' of this article is absolute. It conflicts with no differing points of view, and walks a strict factual line.
I do not think it is fair to remove the POV notice, when the discussion is still going on. On the talk-page, 3 people believe it is POV while one doesn't believe so, and he is the original contributor of the article. The original contributor of the article should not remove that notice when the discussion is still on-going, especially since the POV tag would attract people to the discussion page. Also, the edit history should reflect what has been done to the page. let's observe some wikiquette. --- Gurubrahma 09:45, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
Dear All, khhhjjkljh
I apologize for the temp removal of the POV thing. I have a proposition for y'all: why don't y'all pick a passage which contains the info objectionable to you, and re-jig it to meet your viewpoint, and put it up for discussion?
Bear in mind, its important all the same to have some form of direct and explicit reference of Gandhi in relation to world events, such as the Rwanda and Sudan tragedies. We can't remove Gandhi's relevance to such events, as its beyond our power to do so.
My desire is to make an article as explicitly true to Gandhi as possible. I can't tolerate the anti-Gandhi freaks who screw up his words and present false criticism, or those who don't do any real research before putting up stuff based on newspaper op-eds.
I've gone over the article and removed direct references to Rwanda and Sudan w/o compromising the point I was making.
I've also re-organized the article: its purpose is to explain the thinking of Gandhi, how it has been applied around the world, and how what most of us understand to be Gandhi's teachings are actually different from Gandhi's own approach.
Gandhi's autobiography gives an excellent, direct contact with the mind of Mahatma Gandhi.
If there are any other questions/problems, its all open for discussion. But I would like to take down the neutrality sign in 24 hours. Its bad enough a man of peace had to be killed by violence. We don't need to argue over this for eternity.
Dear All,
I would like to apologize for any rudeness or arrogance I've demonstrated in the past couple of days. Being passionate about this subject, I had temporarily forgotten that I don't own this article, the legacy of Gandhiji or Wikipedia.
Thank you.
Nirav Maurya
An anon IP has been removing it without discussing it on the talk page. I think he should discuss it here before repeatedly deleting it. I've also left a message on the anon IP's talk page. Gurubrahma 05:27, 29 September 2005 (UTC)
Hello Gurubrahma,
I'm writing this to say that you were right - it was me giving you a little headache with the Purushottam Das Tandon article. And yes, I didn't have the stomach to get through the edit wars on Mahatma Gandhi, Gandhism. Furthermore, it was me removing your fancruft notice on the Gandhism article.
Its true that I've had my problems with you. I wasn't man enough to admit that your spirited and aggressive participation in Wikipedia was actually scaring me, as if there was something mentally wrong with me and my outlook on the world, and ability to communicate with other people. I think I got into Wikipedia totally for the wrong reasons.
I actually hate bitching, so I want to just say that you've been a good teacher - you've helped me understand my faults, and understand the hidden mistakes in my edits on various articles.
I wish you good luck on Wikipedia and your life.
Har Har Mahadev!
Nirav Maurya.
I've made some new revisions to the article, bringing its size within the preferable limit, eliminating long passages of repetitive material and several biased and judgemental assertions.
I've also made corrections to bring the article closer to NPOV, judgementalism and eliminate fancruft within the passages and conclusions.
Bear in mind, this is Gandhism, and all about Gandhi, so the latter job is quite difficult to judge and complete. - Nirav.
Over the past week, I've done much to erase those statements carrying bias and favoritism of Gandhi. At this point, I can't find any more statements that are judgmental about Gandhi, his views or any other people. Plus, I've added info on the points Gandhi is criticized and blamed about. Criticism is an important element of Gandhism.
I'm thus removing the fancruft notice. If anybody objects to this, I'd like to point out two things - (1) there are no judgmental statements or passages left, (2) there is a long passage containing points of criticism and (3) This is an article about Gandhi, and he was a great man.
However it is all open to discussion by future Wikiusers.
Jai Sri Rama! - Nirav Maurya.
I just added the cleanup-tone template to the article. I do think that the article is quite good, but I think that it does require some additional rewriting to have a formal style suitable for an encyclopedia article, and to remove some statements that are opinions rather than facts. I see from some of the comments here that these issues have been raised here before. Let's continue to improve this good and important article! -- 201.78.233.162 22:18, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
I've just completed a major re-edit of the article to try to make its tone more encyclopedic and less like an essay, and have consequently removed the cleanup template. I'm aware that Gandhism is a topic about which many people feel very strongly, but please remember that you do your position more justice by a fair and neutral assessment of the facts than by launching into one-sided passionate eulogies or, for that matter, furious rants. For what it's worth, I'm sure Gandhi would have agreed... :-)
I've done my best to remove the emotive language and extensive tautologies in this piece, but several sections still need extensive attention from experienced and neutral editors. The sections "Brahmacharya and Ahimsa" and "Religion" are little more than unsourced collections of quotes. These need to be rewritten as proper encyclopedic sections.
The section "Criticism and controversy" makes some important points, but desperately needs sources. Please read Wikipedia's guide to writing great articles: it is much more powerful to let the facts speak for themselves, rather than constantly reiterating how great Gandhi is. Readers will work out their own opinions. In particular, emotive language must be excised, as it often becomes offensive or ridiculous. Referring to Aung San Suu Kyi as "a small young woman", for instance, is deeply demeaning: she is a Nobel Prize winner, an internationally respected political leader, and almost sixty years of age! In any case, her size, age and sex have no bearing on her position as a Gandhian.
The section "Without truth, nothing" seems to be completely out of place and probably needs to have its salient facts redistributed more logically throughout the article, before being deleted.
This article is in need of restructuring. Presently, it is more a collection of miscelleaneous facts than a coherent introduction to the topic - especially in the later sections. There is, however, some very important material here, and it is a highly important subject. -- TinaSparkle 12:44, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
he had philosophical debates with gandhi.. -- ti 15:47, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
I have moved the article from Gandhism to Gandhianism. The term Gandhian is in far greater use than Gandhism. nirvana2013 08:31, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Gandhism. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 17:39, 10 October 2017 (UTC)
Here is nothing mentioned about Gandhi's experiment with sex and his views towards contraceptions. Souniel Yadav ( talk) 15:56, 10 October 2019 (UTC)