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Is there an early life section that one would normally expect in a Wikipedia biography of a person? If so, I don't see it. Mechamind90 ( talk) 03:21, 31 October 2009 (UTC)
This is his current bio on the church's website, which states:
Fred Phelps was born Nov. 13, 1929, in Meridian, Mississippi. Graduated Meridian High at 16 with highest academic honors, American Legion Citizenship Award, track letter, Bausch-Lomb Science Award, Eagle Scout, Principal Appointment to West Point Military Academy. The summer following graduation, he had a profound religious experience, gave up West Point, enrolled instead for Bible/ministerial training at Bob Jones College, Cleveland, Tennessee (later moving with them as they transitioned to Bob Jones University, Greenville, South Carolina)...
Apparently, he claims that he attended West Point and left after a profound religious experience. Is there any evidence to support these claims or are they simply fabrications? I think it would be important to include information that either substantiates or refutes his West Point attendance. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Christoofor ( talk • contribs) 15:04, October 30, 2008
User:KyuubiSeal has exchanged all links for links to 4chan.com imageboard. Not registered, can't revert this vandalism. 74.97.80.79 ( talk) 19:20, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Just so we're all clear, per Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2010 January 18#Category:Homophobia, "no articles for allegedly homophobic people (including fictional people), organizations, or media should exist in this category." Therefore, the article about Fred Phelps - who is allegedly homophobic - should not appear in the Homophobia category... so stop adding it. — HelloAnnyong (say whaaat?!) 16:44, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
Can We get a source on that? It seems debatable but it implies a lot of things.... Weaponbb7 ( talk) 21:13, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
Seems to me that Phelps easily meets the definition of a vexatious litigant, especially when reading through this source. Any thought on the best we to introduce this to the article without being OR? Beach drifter ( talk) 23:36, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Editors, please read this note [1] left on the help desk and incorporate the necessary points. In case there are issues, kindly discuss. ♪ ♫ Wifione ♫ ♪ ―Œ ♣Łeave Ξ мessage♣ 08:01, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
I'd say this might be considered a bit slanted against him... though its pretty hard to paint anything good about him, considering everything... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.228.195.210 ( talk) 06:04, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
Since several persons involved are described as lawyers - who do they file lawsuits on behalf of or against? When I search I find scanty and apparently unreliable sources that I don't think I'll be able to use. For example, there is a document posted in several places on the Web that describes him suing people who attacked him [2]; however, one site I found couldn't confirm that there was any truth to it [3] and even that probably isn't a proper Wikipedia source let alone for a BLP. The Southern Poverty Law Center has a page that is probably citable [4] and describes some lawsuits by the church - but what they describe doesn't sound profitable. This leaves me all very confused, as I'd think that lawyers inevitably make money from their profession, and everything is on the record. Has anyone here tried to dig into this? Wnt ( talk) 05:14, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
A recent interview with one of his sons speaking about many of the various issues and clarifying a few points. http://www.xtra.ca/public/National/Son_of_God_hates_fags_preacher_angry_with_fathers_teaching-8640.aspx
I don't exactly doubt it, but is his alleged "Hyper-calvinism" actually citeable? Normal "Hyper-calvinists" usually don't profess such a label, that among "Calvinists" is like: "someone who have misunderstood even the basics". Rursus dixit. ( mbork3!) 20:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
Since there is such common misconception about Phelps being associated with the Republican party as opposed to the Democratic party I recommended including the adj. "Democratic" in the introduction: "former Democratic candidate for political office". 128.175.146.153 ( talk) 17:49, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
I think the Democratic Party subsection would suffice; laying it out in the introduction implies that he has some meaningful connection to the party, which he does not - particularly considering that the article describes various major Democratic figures that he despises. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bkverve99 ( talk • contribs) 12:04, 15 June 2010 (UTC)
This nutcase is proposing that his fellow nutcases should protest Dio's funeral. We should add an article about that, I didn't see one. What the hell's wrong with this guy? He ESTRANGED his children? What a creep! But, we should add this to his crazy shit he does list. BlackSabbath1996 ( talk) 23:58, 22 May 2010 (UTC)
The lead section fails to incorporate these serious allegations or mention his penchant for delusional behavior. Viriditas ( talk) 23:58, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
Where is it? Viriditas ( talk) 00:29, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
This page could do with sources from interviews of Phelps, both done by like-minded people and people with different views than him. The questions asked in such interviews would be wildly different from each other and bring out different aspects of his life, personality, views, etc. If anyone knows of any interviews of him, please post the links here so we can get to work! --- cymru lass (hit me up)⁄ (background check) 17:19, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
MAssive amounts of Primary sources used that are not supported by any secondary soures and WP:UNDUE issues as well PArts need a rewrite or are being removed entirly. Currently fixing issues. Weaponbb7 ( talk) 23:07, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
Regarding this edit, [6] I believe that www.godhatesfags.com is run by Phelps, so it's not a BLP violation. However, I would agree that a secondary reliable source is preferable. A Quest For Knowledge ( talk) 17:19, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
I've confirmed from WHOIS data that godhatesfags.com is licensed to the WBC, and added that source to the article. I suggest restoring the information sourced to godhatesfags.com as an interim measure until a reliable source is found with the same info. Ma t c hups 18:18, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
Phelps was first arrested in 1951 and found guilty of misdemeanor battery after attacking a Pasadena police officer. citation needed He has since been arrested for assault, battery, threats, trespassing, disorderly conduct, contempt of court, and several other charges; citation neededeach time, he (along with Westboro and its other members) has filed suit against the city, the police, and the arresting officers. citation needed
This content was uncited and really needs citing before replacing. Off2riorob ( talk) 05:46, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Leviticus doesn't seem to say much on them. 206.130.174.42 ( talk) 19:28, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Since this entry lists Phelps as a Primitive Baptist, it would be very helpful to include a phrase denoting the Primitive Baptist's universal condemnation of Phelps.
Here are two sources: http://marchtozion.com/church/382-fred-phelps-and-westboro-baptist-church-are-not-primitive-baptists http://primitivebaptist.info/mambo/index2.php?option=com_content&do_pdf=1&id=1434
Phelps was ordained by a Southern Baptist church, not a PB church. To be a Primitive Baptist minister requires a Primitive Baptist ordination. Phelps has no such ordination. Also, each Primitive Baptist church comes from another PB church, as church succession is a crucial belief of Primitive Baptists. Westboro has no such lineage.
It is a serious misrepresentation of Primitive Baptists to list Phelps as a PB without clarification that he is rejected and condemned by them.
Bwinslett ( talk) 23:03, 8 October 2010 (UTC)
Helloannyong: Neither of those are "unreliable sources" You are mistaken. Those happen to be two Primitive Baptist ministries. Prove me wrong. Either remove the phrase that Phelps is a PB, or add a phrase that PBs condemn Phelps. He is counterfeit and it is shameful to cast an entire organization in such a negative light.
To your thought that the sources are unreliable, here is a news article substantiating Phelps' ordination with the Southern Baptists AND a reference to the "disclaimer" from Primitive Baptist Online. http://www.ydr.com/living/ci_16259961
—Preceding unsigned comment added by Bwinslett ( talk • contribs)
Canada should be added to the list of people, groups and countries he's against. He openly believes Canada is run and populated by gay Jewish Nazis {tell us, Mr. Phelps, how does that make ANY sense in your brain?}, claims that everyone in Canada is possessed by demons, and admitted that he likes to fly the Canadian flag upside-down as a show of disrespect.
He was also denied entry to Canada due to his intent to make what's defined by Canadian law as hate speech.
216.121.183.75 ( talk) 20:15, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
I tried connecting to godhatessweden.com but get a "Server not found" error. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.228.113.154 ( talk) 16:16, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
Keith Allen also interviewed the family. Should be added in the media section. The following link is the evidence. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7735501683185935638#docid=1255630606668114621 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.126.196.147 ( talk) 07:27, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
Why does the religious beliefs section contain his opinion on Sweden and his past political activity? -- Aquillion ( talk) 14:06, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
This line either needs to be removed or needs a new source. The current source specifically says "Members of Kansas’ Westboro Baptist Church were protesting outside the funeral for Staff Sgt. Michael Bock. Police say they weren’t believed to be involved in mace incident." 24.8.190.29 ( talk) 15:59, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
Based on Nate Phelps speech ( http://natephelps.com/10801.html) and a note he received from her on May 21, 2009 ( http://natephelps.com/32549.html), it sounds like she was estranged before she turned 18 but is no longer estranged from her family. More evidence can be found with her posting on this page ( http://www.me-me-me.tv/2008/02/13/what-are-we-going-to-wear/) from March 29th, 2008 at 10:29 pm.
Millers2000 ( talk) 05:46, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
{{Edit semi-protected}}
Under the "Lawsuit against Westboro Baptist Church" heading, please change, "Megan Phelps, one of Fred Phelps' children, represented the Westboro Baptist Church," to "Margie Phelps, one of Fred Phelps' children, represented the Westboro Baptist Church."
Megan Phelps is not an attorney, and is the daughter of Shirley Phelps-Roper. Margie Phelps, Fred's daughter, is the defense counsel for Westboro Baptist Church in the case being heard by SCotUS. Thank you. Jwj2xx4 ( talk) 02:01, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
Appreciate it, keep up the good work, Jwj2xx4 ( talk) 18:56, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
This section is un-sourced or under-sourced. Where does the estimate of 20,000 deceased Swedes come from? 2004_Indian_Ocean_earthquake estimates ~500. 67.244.89.230 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:18, 20 February 2011 (UTC). The second link in that section http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=818&date=20050107 has it. -- OuroborosCobra ( talk) 20:44, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
{{edit semi-protected}} In the "Responses - Laws limiting funeral protests" section please change
"On May 17, 2006, the state of Illinois enacted Senate Bill 1144, the "Let Them Rest In Peace Act", to shield grieving military families from protests during funerals and memorial services of fallen soldiers."
to "On May 17, 2006, the state of Illinois enacted Senate Bill 1144, the "Let Them Rest In Peace Act", to shield grieving military families from protests during funerals and memorial services of fallen troops."
Soldiers are members of the US Army, and it is not appropriate to refer to service members of other services as Soldiers, the term troops is a more appropriate word
Olaf66 ( talk) 14:35, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
Done
[7]. FYI for future requests you should make the request on the talk page for the specific article you want edited. E.g.
Talk:Westboro Baptist Church.
Sailsbystars (
talk)
14:45, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
To the section where his involvement in the civil rights movement is discussed it should be added.
instead of:
"I systematically brought down the Jim Crow laws of this town,"
this:
"I systematically brought down the Jim Crow laws of this town," he says. While this is clearly an overstatement, local officials confirm that he approached this earlier cause with customary zeal. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.32.126.14 ( talk • contribs)
This section stated: "In the 1980s, Phelps received awards from the Greater Kansas City Chapter of Blacks in Government and the Bonner Springs branch of the NAACP, for his work on behalf of black clients. [1]" However, this link does not make any mention of these awards. I replaced the citation with a reference that does. A search of the websites of Blacks in Government (www.bignet.org) and NAACP has no results for Phelps nor Westboro Church. FatTrebla ( talk) 05:41, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
He must have an expressed opinion on Prop. 8, DOMA (Defense of Marriage Act), Don't Ask Don't Tell repeal. He is not reticent about sharing his opinions about gays. It would really help the article. -- Javaweb ( talk) 13:02, 2 April 2011 (UTC)Javaweb
Somebody should add some info as to why Phelps would go after Reggie White. White was just as antigay as Phelps was. What was Pastor Fred's beef with the "Minister Of Defense"?
It's because the Minister of Defense Knows the truth about Fred Phelps. <BLP vio removed>—Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.240.68.18 ( talk) 06:37, 20 May 2011 (UTC)
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.174.72.208 ( talk • contribs) 09:07, December 4, 2008
The Mother Jones article footnoted (section 3.3) contains no information regarding Fred Phelps Jr. as being Gore's delegate to the 1988 Democratic National Convention. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Phlip217 ( talk • contribs) 04:34, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
I'm new to editing, but it looks like this article is at least semi-locked. What I wanted to add to the Media section is that there is a documentary on Fred Phelps and his family and church called "Fall from Grace" done in 2007, written and directed by K Ryan Jones. This includes interviews with Fred Phelps and several of his family members as well as some prominent Topekans. It is available on Netflix and is listed on the Internet Movie Database at http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0977649/. Can someone add this please? 69.42.34.173 ( talk) 04:31, 27 May 2011 (UTC)HistoryLunatic
Looks as if there's some dispute over whether or not Phelps should be included in Category:Kansas Democrats.
I'd say not. He's not really part of the structure of the Democratic Party in Kansas. He doesn't hold any leadership position or actually any position at all, paid or unpaid, in the party hierarchy. He doesn't hold any elective office or indeed any public office and I don't think he ever has, or even worked for the government, or had an patronage position or anything like that. He's not supported or embraced by the rank-and-file of the Kansas Democratic Party or even any small part of it. As far as I know he's never done fund-raising for the party or performed any other important service for the party. He doesn't adhere generally to the tenets of the party.
Maybe he usually votes Democratic in elections, but so what (and I'm not sure he votes or how we'd know how he votes, if he even does vote). If we used that criterion half the United States citizen with an article could be placed in Category:State XYZ Democrats (or Republicans). Is this where we want to go?
It's claimed that he he has run for office, as a Democrat. If this is true, so what. Anybody can do that. This doesn't change the fact that he's not really part of the state Democratic Party in any meaningful way. Charles Manson could run in a Republican primary, would we then include him in Category:California Republicans alongside Ronald Reagan and so forth? That would make the category overly broad and thus less useful, I would say. Herostratus ( talk) 01:03, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
So it's fine to have Tim McVeigh listed as a Republican, but not okay to have Phelps included in the Kansas Democrats category?
Thismightbezach ( talk) 03:12, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
I removed mcaveigh from the republican cat - if hes replaced then we will add Phelps to the democrat cat. Off2riorob ( talk) 03:36, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
At the request of a brand new user could someone update the page to include the recent events of the shooting at a Safeway parking lot in Arizona and the comments Fred Phelps made public on his infamous videos? Thanks. -- SHODAN 117 24:32, 11 January 2011 (PST)
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Under heading : Civil rights cases ... article states: His son Nate claims that his father was inclined towards prejudice against blacks, and took the cases simply to make money off them, which Phelps denies.[13] -this footnote does not support claim. I looked it up and found no reference to his son saying this. Please verify if I am in error.
Newtonsghost ( talk) 20:59, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
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The film Red State was released in 2011. I am currently watching it on Netflix.
wertperch ( talk) 03:13, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
I entered the bias tag on this article due to its overall tone and subtle tactics being used, such as questioning clearly reliable sources as unreliable. The entry sounds more like a publicity release than an objective article. WBC is known to troll Wikipedia and other sites to ensure that any critical entries are removed and the editors embarrassed and harassed. This article needs to be cleaned up for balance and also for citations and reference sources. The Moody Blue (Talk) 07:00, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
Would it be appropriate to mention that his law license was suspended for a two year period in 1969 as well (only five years after his admission to practice)? I just read this: http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=3352173787254565187&hl=en&as_sdt=2,50 and it appears that he misappropriated funds on one count and harassed a client who fired him on another. If so, does it belong under the disbarment heading or should it be separate? Jwj2xx4 ( talk) 16:41, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
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At the moment, the only thing in family life is from Nate. How many children are there in total ?
When Westboro start ? Has it always been run by him ? Was it always activist - or is that a later development ? -- Beardo ( talk) 22:56, 4 August 2012 (UTC)
In Louis Theroux's documentary "America's Most Hated Family" it is stated that Phelps has 14 children. Our article says 13. Any idea who's wrong here? Joefromrandb ( talk) 02:23, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
An RfC:
Which descriptor, if any, can be added in front of Southern Poverty Law Center when referenced in other articles? has been posted at the
Southern Poverty Law Center talk page. Your participation is welcomed. –
MrX
16:43, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
Fred Phelps is not a Calvinist. He is a Hyper-Calvinst. It is inaccurate information to classify him as such. We need to address this or this is a glaring inaccuracy in the article. I have created the Hyper-Calvinist sub-category, and assigned him to it (and have no problem going through and assigning others to populate the category) but it has been reverted twice (once inaccurately saying that it was a pseudo-attack, once just saying we don't have the category... which we do not).
What's the solution going forward? ReformedArsenal ( talk) 02:41, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
Rev. Fred Phelps bears an uncanny resemblance to Rev. Henry Kane.
http://www.myspace.com/538193544/photos/4812174 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.29.152.100 ( talk) 11:22, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/26/us/26funeral.html?pagewanted=print&_r=0 is a reference for an unreferenced quote in the article. "whether the defendant's actions would be highly offensive to a reasonable person, whether they were extreme and outrageous and whether these actions were so offensive and shocking as to not be entitled to First Amendment protection" CloudSurfer ( talk) 21:22, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
Have I missed something? What I reverted was added this morning. [8]. It is not about Phelps support for Al Gore, it was adding statements by Al Gore with no reference at all to Phelps. I'll assume that's an error and remove it again, both because the reason for reverting me seems incorrect and because it's about Gore's position on homosexuality, not Phelps. Also removing a statement that Gore attended a fundraiser as I can't find it in the source. Both are BLP violations in my opinion. Dougweller ( talk) 12:24, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
I suggested that Mr Phelps may harbor certain issues regarding his own sexuality ( 2008). Well lo and behold everything comes to pass, turns out here is an article that can now go in the article (published and therefore not original research). [ BLP violation redacted. Fat&Happy ( talk) 20:18, 18 March 2013 (UTC)] 86.176.21.174 ( talk) 19:44, 18 March 2013 (UTC)
We've been over this here. In order for Phelps to be categorized as a Calvinist, we need reliable sources to say as much. So far we only have him calling himself an Old School Baptist and saying he holds to the "Five Points of Calvinism" and holding some Calvinist beliefs. -- JFH ( talk) 20:42, 29 May 2013 (UTC)
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In the states considering laws section there is Texas. Texas has no clickable link. The link for texas is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas. Just was skimming over and saw this. Hope it helps! Andrewevans48 ( talk) 22:17, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
Under the heading "Phelps in the Media": ″A Song for Fred" by canadian heavy metal band Torture for Pleasure [2] is references Fred Phelps, his church and his beliefs. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Torture1 ( talk • contribs) 01:31, 8 March 2014 (UTC)
Question as asked. I do not follow this group closely, but has this gentlemen been seen alive in the past six month or so? Paul, in Saudi ( talk) 13:33, 9 March 2014 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: IAR Non-admin closure, as this is not going to be moved from the looks of it. Kevin Rutherford ( talk) 03:15, 17 March 2014 (UTC) Kevin Rutherford ( talk) 03:15, 17 March 2014 (UTC)
Fred Phelps → Fred W. Phelps – To avoid confusion with Olympian Michael Phelps' dad, M. Fred Phelps. 76.105.96.92 ( talk) 21:49, 16 March 2014 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.CNN is reporting the date is 11:15 pm, Wednesday the 19th [9], while the Houston Chronicle is reporting "shortly after midnight" on Thursday the 20th [10]. There needs to be some clarification of this, and what date to put for his death in the article. Iamcuriousblue ( talk) 18:23, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
The information regarding his supposed excommunication is a bit confusing. For one, the source is his son Nate, who is known to be estranged from both the church and family - how can he then be considered a reliable source? Second, he gives the date of communication as being in August, but the article then goes on to say that Phelps' final sermon was delivered in September. Congregations aren't generally in the practice of allowing excommunicated members to enter the church, much less give the sermon. I would suggest that the allegation of excommunication (and the timing thereof), sourced only to an estranged son with no known firsthand knowledge of the situation, should be stricken until independently verified. 97.68.84.119 ( talk) 22:21, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
@ Connormah: I updated the Infobox with the correct parameter name (death_cause, not cause_of_death), and it summarizes what's in the article (see Fred Phelps § Death). If you want to remove it from the Infobox, you have to remove it from the article, though there was already a battle earlier on that subject, so I'd suggest you discuss it first. Until then, the Infobox should say the same as the body of the article. The "no natural causes" thing is a policy peculiarity of the "Deaths in ..." Wikipedia articles only, AFAIK. —[ AlanM1( talk)]— 01:11, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | ← | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 |
Is there an early life section that one would normally expect in a Wikipedia biography of a person? If so, I don't see it. Mechamind90 ( talk) 03:21, 31 October 2009 (UTC)
This is his current bio on the church's website, which states:
Fred Phelps was born Nov. 13, 1929, in Meridian, Mississippi. Graduated Meridian High at 16 with highest academic honors, American Legion Citizenship Award, track letter, Bausch-Lomb Science Award, Eagle Scout, Principal Appointment to West Point Military Academy. The summer following graduation, he had a profound religious experience, gave up West Point, enrolled instead for Bible/ministerial training at Bob Jones College, Cleveland, Tennessee (later moving with them as they transitioned to Bob Jones University, Greenville, South Carolina)...
Apparently, he claims that he attended West Point and left after a profound religious experience. Is there any evidence to support these claims or are they simply fabrications? I think it would be important to include information that either substantiates or refutes his West Point attendance. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Christoofor ( talk • contribs) 15:04, October 30, 2008
User:KyuubiSeal has exchanged all links for links to 4chan.com imageboard. Not registered, can't revert this vandalism. 74.97.80.79 ( talk) 19:20, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Just so we're all clear, per Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2010 January 18#Category:Homophobia, "no articles for allegedly homophobic people (including fictional people), organizations, or media should exist in this category." Therefore, the article about Fred Phelps - who is allegedly homophobic - should not appear in the Homophobia category... so stop adding it. — HelloAnnyong (say whaaat?!) 16:44, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
Can We get a source on that? It seems debatable but it implies a lot of things.... Weaponbb7 ( talk) 21:13, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
Seems to me that Phelps easily meets the definition of a vexatious litigant, especially when reading through this source. Any thought on the best we to introduce this to the article without being OR? Beach drifter ( talk) 23:36, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Editors, please read this note [1] left on the help desk and incorporate the necessary points. In case there are issues, kindly discuss. ♪ ♫ Wifione ♫ ♪ ―Œ ♣Łeave Ξ мessage♣ 08:01, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
I'd say this might be considered a bit slanted against him... though its pretty hard to paint anything good about him, considering everything... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.228.195.210 ( talk) 06:04, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
Since several persons involved are described as lawyers - who do they file lawsuits on behalf of or against? When I search I find scanty and apparently unreliable sources that I don't think I'll be able to use. For example, there is a document posted in several places on the Web that describes him suing people who attacked him [2]; however, one site I found couldn't confirm that there was any truth to it [3] and even that probably isn't a proper Wikipedia source let alone for a BLP. The Southern Poverty Law Center has a page that is probably citable [4] and describes some lawsuits by the church - but what they describe doesn't sound profitable. This leaves me all very confused, as I'd think that lawyers inevitably make money from their profession, and everything is on the record. Has anyone here tried to dig into this? Wnt ( talk) 05:14, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
A recent interview with one of his sons speaking about many of the various issues and clarifying a few points. http://www.xtra.ca/public/National/Son_of_God_hates_fags_preacher_angry_with_fathers_teaching-8640.aspx
I don't exactly doubt it, but is his alleged "Hyper-calvinism" actually citeable? Normal "Hyper-calvinists" usually don't profess such a label, that among "Calvinists" is like: "someone who have misunderstood even the basics". Rursus dixit. ( mbork3!) 20:18, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
Since there is such common misconception about Phelps being associated with the Republican party as opposed to the Democratic party I recommended including the adj. "Democratic" in the introduction: "former Democratic candidate for political office". 128.175.146.153 ( talk) 17:49, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
I think the Democratic Party subsection would suffice; laying it out in the introduction implies that he has some meaningful connection to the party, which he does not - particularly considering that the article describes various major Democratic figures that he despises. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bkverve99 ( talk • contribs) 12:04, 15 June 2010 (UTC)
This nutcase is proposing that his fellow nutcases should protest Dio's funeral. We should add an article about that, I didn't see one. What the hell's wrong with this guy? He ESTRANGED his children? What a creep! But, we should add this to his crazy shit he does list. BlackSabbath1996 ( talk) 23:58, 22 May 2010 (UTC)
The lead section fails to incorporate these serious allegations or mention his penchant for delusional behavior. Viriditas ( talk) 23:58, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
Where is it? Viriditas ( talk) 00:29, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
This page could do with sources from interviews of Phelps, both done by like-minded people and people with different views than him. The questions asked in such interviews would be wildly different from each other and bring out different aspects of his life, personality, views, etc. If anyone knows of any interviews of him, please post the links here so we can get to work! --- cymru lass (hit me up)⁄ (background check) 17:19, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
MAssive amounts of Primary sources used that are not supported by any secondary soures and WP:UNDUE issues as well PArts need a rewrite or are being removed entirly. Currently fixing issues. Weaponbb7 ( talk) 23:07, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
Regarding this edit, [6] I believe that www.godhatesfags.com is run by Phelps, so it's not a BLP violation. However, I would agree that a secondary reliable source is preferable. A Quest For Knowledge ( talk) 17:19, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
I've confirmed from WHOIS data that godhatesfags.com is licensed to the WBC, and added that source to the article. I suggest restoring the information sourced to godhatesfags.com as an interim measure until a reliable source is found with the same info. Ma t c hups 18:18, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
Phelps was first arrested in 1951 and found guilty of misdemeanor battery after attacking a Pasadena police officer. citation needed He has since been arrested for assault, battery, threats, trespassing, disorderly conduct, contempt of court, and several other charges; citation neededeach time, he (along with Westboro and its other members) has filed suit against the city, the police, and the arresting officers. citation needed
This content was uncited and really needs citing before replacing. Off2riorob ( talk) 05:46, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Leviticus doesn't seem to say much on them. 206.130.174.42 ( talk) 19:28, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Since this entry lists Phelps as a Primitive Baptist, it would be very helpful to include a phrase denoting the Primitive Baptist's universal condemnation of Phelps.
Here are two sources: http://marchtozion.com/church/382-fred-phelps-and-westboro-baptist-church-are-not-primitive-baptists http://primitivebaptist.info/mambo/index2.php?option=com_content&do_pdf=1&id=1434
Phelps was ordained by a Southern Baptist church, not a PB church. To be a Primitive Baptist minister requires a Primitive Baptist ordination. Phelps has no such ordination. Also, each Primitive Baptist church comes from another PB church, as church succession is a crucial belief of Primitive Baptists. Westboro has no such lineage.
It is a serious misrepresentation of Primitive Baptists to list Phelps as a PB without clarification that he is rejected and condemned by them.
Bwinslett ( talk) 23:03, 8 October 2010 (UTC)
Helloannyong: Neither of those are "unreliable sources" You are mistaken. Those happen to be two Primitive Baptist ministries. Prove me wrong. Either remove the phrase that Phelps is a PB, or add a phrase that PBs condemn Phelps. He is counterfeit and it is shameful to cast an entire organization in such a negative light.
To your thought that the sources are unreliable, here is a news article substantiating Phelps' ordination with the Southern Baptists AND a reference to the "disclaimer" from Primitive Baptist Online. http://www.ydr.com/living/ci_16259961
—Preceding unsigned comment added by Bwinslett ( talk • contribs)
Canada should be added to the list of people, groups and countries he's against. He openly believes Canada is run and populated by gay Jewish Nazis {tell us, Mr. Phelps, how does that make ANY sense in your brain?}, claims that everyone in Canada is possessed by demons, and admitted that he likes to fly the Canadian flag upside-down as a show of disrespect.
He was also denied entry to Canada due to his intent to make what's defined by Canadian law as hate speech.
216.121.183.75 ( talk) 20:15, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
I tried connecting to godhatessweden.com but get a "Server not found" error. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.228.113.154 ( talk) 16:16, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
Keith Allen also interviewed the family. Should be added in the media section. The following link is the evidence. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7735501683185935638#docid=1255630606668114621 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.126.196.147 ( talk) 07:27, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
Why does the religious beliefs section contain his opinion on Sweden and his past political activity? -- Aquillion ( talk) 14:06, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
This line either needs to be removed or needs a new source. The current source specifically says "Members of Kansas’ Westboro Baptist Church were protesting outside the funeral for Staff Sgt. Michael Bock. Police say they weren’t believed to be involved in mace incident." 24.8.190.29 ( talk) 15:59, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
Based on Nate Phelps speech ( http://natephelps.com/10801.html) and a note he received from her on May 21, 2009 ( http://natephelps.com/32549.html), it sounds like she was estranged before she turned 18 but is no longer estranged from her family. More evidence can be found with her posting on this page ( http://www.me-me-me.tv/2008/02/13/what-are-we-going-to-wear/) from March 29th, 2008 at 10:29 pm.
Millers2000 ( talk) 05:46, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
{{Edit semi-protected}}
Under the "Lawsuit against Westboro Baptist Church" heading, please change, "Megan Phelps, one of Fred Phelps' children, represented the Westboro Baptist Church," to "Margie Phelps, one of Fred Phelps' children, represented the Westboro Baptist Church."
Megan Phelps is not an attorney, and is the daughter of Shirley Phelps-Roper. Margie Phelps, Fred's daughter, is the defense counsel for Westboro Baptist Church in the case being heard by SCotUS. Thank you. Jwj2xx4 ( talk) 02:01, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
Appreciate it, keep up the good work, Jwj2xx4 ( talk) 18:56, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
This section is un-sourced or under-sourced. Where does the estimate of 20,000 deceased Swedes come from? 2004_Indian_Ocean_earthquake estimates ~500. 67.244.89.230 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:18, 20 February 2011 (UTC). The second link in that section http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=818&date=20050107 has it. -- OuroborosCobra ( talk) 20:44, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
{{edit semi-protected}} In the "Responses - Laws limiting funeral protests" section please change
"On May 17, 2006, the state of Illinois enacted Senate Bill 1144, the "Let Them Rest In Peace Act", to shield grieving military families from protests during funerals and memorial services of fallen soldiers."
to "On May 17, 2006, the state of Illinois enacted Senate Bill 1144, the "Let Them Rest In Peace Act", to shield grieving military families from protests during funerals and memorial services of fallen troops."
Soldiers are members of the US Army, and it is not appropriate to refer to service members of other services as Soldiers, the term troops is a more appropriate word
Olaf66 ( talk) 14:35, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
Done
[7]. FYI for future requests you should make the request on the talk page for the specific article you want edited. E.g.
Talk:Westboro Baptist Church.
Sailsbystars (
talk)
14:45, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
To the section where his involvement in the civil rights movement is discussed it should be added.
instead of:
"I systematically brought down the Jim Crow laws of this town,"
this:
"I systematically brought down the Jim Crow laws of this town," he says. While this is clearly an overstatement, local officials confirm that he approached this earlier cause with customary zeal. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.32.126.14 ( talk • contribs)
This section stated: "In the 1980s, Phelps received awards from the Greater Kansas City Chapter of Blacks in Government and the Bonner Springs branch of the NAACP, for his work on behalf of black clients. [1]" However, this link does not make any mention of these awards. I replaced the citation with a reference that does. A search of the websites of Blacks in Government (www.bignet.org) and NAACP has no results for Phelps nor Westboro Church. FatTrebla ( talk) 05:41, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
He must have an expressed opinion on Prop. 8, DOMA (Defense of Marriage Act), Don't Ask Don't Tell repeal. He is not reticent about sharing his opinions about gays. It would really help the article. -- Javaweb ( talk) 13:02, 2 April 2011 (UTC)Javaweb
Somebody should add some info as to why Phelps would go after Reggie White. White was just as antigay as Phelps was. What was Pastor Fred's beef with the "Minister Of Defense"?
It's because the Minister of Defense Knows the truth about Fred Phelps. <BLP vio removed>—Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.240.68.18 ( talk) 06:37, 20 May 2011 (UTC)
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.174.72.208 ( talk • contribs) 09:07, December 4, 2008
The Mother Jones article footnoted (section 3.3) contains no information regarding Fred Phelps Jr. as being Gore's delegate to the 1988 Democratic National Convention. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Phlip217 ( talk • contribs) 04:34, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
I'm new to editing, but it looks like this article is at least semi-locked. What I wanted to add to the Media section is that there is a documentary on Fred Phelps and his family and church called "Fall from Grace" done in 2007, written and directed by K Ryan Jones. This includes interviews with Fred Phelps and several of his family members as well as some prominent Topekans. It is available on Netflix and is listed on the Internet Movie Database at http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0977649/. Can someone add this please? 69.42.34.173 ( talk) 04:31, 27 May 2011 (UTC)HistoryLunatic
Looks as if there's some dispute over whether or not Phelps should be included in Category:Kansas Democrats.
I'd say not. He's not really part of the structure of the Democratic Party in Kansas. He doesn't hold any leadership position or actually any position at all, paid or unpaid, in the party hierarchy. He doesn't hold any elective office or indeed any public office and I don't think he ever has, or even worked for the government, or had an patronage position or anything like that. He's not supported or embraced by the rank-and-file of the Kansas Democratic Party or even any small part of it. As far as I know he's never done fund-raising for the party or performed any other important service for the party. He doesn't adhere generally to the tenets of the party.
Maybe he usually votes Democratic in elections, but so what (and I'm not sure he votes or how we'd know how he votes, if he even does vote). If we used that criterion half the United States citizen with an article could be placed in Category:State XYZ Democrats (or Republicans). Is this where we want to go?
It's claimed that he he has run for office, as a Democrat. If this is true, so what. Anybody can do that. This doesn't change the fact that he's not really part of the state Democratic Party in any meaningful way. Charles Manson could run in a Republican primary, would we then include him in Category:California Republicans alongside Ronald Reagan and so forth? That would make the category overly broad and thus less useful, I would say. Herostratus ( talk) 01:03, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
So it's fine to have Tim McVeigh listed as a Republican, but not okay to have Phelps included in the Kansas Democrats category?
Thismightbezach ( talk) 03:12, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
I removed mcaveigh from the republican cat - if hes replaced then we will add Phelps to the democrat cat. Off2riorob ( talk) 03:36, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
At the request of a brand new user could someone update the page to include the recent events of the shooting at a Safeway parking lot in Arizona and the comments Fred Phelps made public on his infamous videos? Thanks. -- SHODAN 117 24:32, 11 January 2011 (PST)
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Under heading : Civil rights cases ... article states: His son Nate claims that his father was inclined towards prejudice against blacks, and took the cases simply to make money off them, which Phelps denies.[13] -this footnote does not support claim. I looked it up and found no reference to his son saying this. Please verify if I am in error.
Newtonsghost ( talk) 20:59, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
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The film Red State was released in 2011. I am currently watching it on Netflix.
wertperch ( talk) 03:13, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
I entered the bias tag on this article due to its overall tone and subtle tactics being used, such as questioning clearly reliable sources as unreliable. The entry sounds more like a publicity release than an objective article. WBC is known to troll Wikipedia and other sites to ensure that any critical entries are removed and the editors embarrassed and harassed. This article needs to be cleaned up for balance and also for citations and reference sources. The Moody Blue (Talk) 07:00, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
Would it be appropriate to mention that his law license was suspended for a two year period in 1969 as well (only five years after his admission to practice)? I just read this: http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=3352173787254565187&hl=en&as_sdt=2,50 and it appears that he misappropriated funds on one count and harassed a client who fired him on another. If so, does it belong under the disbarment heading or should it be separate? Jwj2xx4 ( talk) 16:41, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
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At the moment, the only thing in family life is from Nate. How many children are there in total ?
When Westboro start ? Has it always been run by him ? Was it always activist - or is that a later development ? -- Beardo ( talk) 22:56, 4 August 2012 (UTC)
In Louis Theroux's documentary "America's Most Hated Family" it is stated that Phelps has 14 children. Our article says 13. Any idea who's wrong here? Joefromrandb ( talk) 02:23, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
An RfC:
Which descriptor, if any, can be added in front of Southern Poverty Law Center when referenced in other articles? has been posted at the
Southern Poverty Law Center talk page. Your participation is welcomed. –
MrX
16:43, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
Fred Phelps is not a Calvinist. He is a Hyper-Calvinst. It is inaccurate information to classify him as such. We need to address this or this is a glaring inaccuracy in the article. I have created the Hyper-Calvinist sub-category, and assigned him to it (and have no problem going through and assigning others to populate the category) but it has been reverted twice (once inaccurately saying that it was a pseudo-attack, once just saying we don't have the category... which we do not).
What's the solution going forward? ReformedArsenal ( talk) 02:41, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
Rev. Fred Phelps bears an uncanny resemblance to Rev. Henry Kane.
http://www.myspace.com/538193544/photos/4812174 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.29.152.100 ( talk) 11:22, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/26/us/26funeral.html?pagewanted=print&_r=0 is a reference for an unreferenced quote in the article. "whether the defendant's actions would be highly offensive to a reasonable person, whether they were extreme and outrageous and whether these actions were so offensive and shocking as to not be entitled to First Amendment protection" CloudSurfer ( talk) 21:22, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
Have I missed something? What I reverted was added this morning. [8]. It is not about Phelps support for Al Gore, it was adding statements by Al Gore with no reference at all to Phelps. I'll assume that's an error and remove it again, both because the reason for reverting me seems incorrect and because it's about Gore's position on homosexuality, not Phelps. Also removing a statement that Gore attended a fundraiser as I can't find it in the source. Both are BLP violations in my opinion. Dougweller ( talk) 12:24, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
I suggested that Mr Phelps may harbor certain issues regarding his own sexuality ( 2008). Well lo and behold everything comes to pass, turns out here is an article that can now go in the article (published and therefore not original research). [ BLP violation redacted. Fat&Happy ( talk) 20:18, 18 March 2013 (UTC)] 86.176.21.174 ( talk) 19:44, 18 March 2013 (UTC)
We've been over this here. In order for Phelps to be categorized as a Calvinist, we need reliable sources to say as much. So far we only have him calling himself an Old School Baptist and saying he holds to the "Five Points of Calvinism" and holding some Calvinist beliefs. -- JFH ( talk) 20:42, 29 May 2013 (UTC)
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In the states considering laws section there is Texas. Texas has no clickable link. The link for texas is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas. Just was skimming over and saw this. Hope it helps! Andrewevans48 ( talk) 22:17, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
Under the heading "Phelps in the Media": ″A Song for Fred" by canadian heavy metal band Torture for Pleasure [2] is references Fred Phelps, his church and his beliefs. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Torture1 ( talk • contribs) 01:31, 8 March 2014 (UTC)
Question as asked. I do not follow this group closely, but has this gentlemen been seen alive in the past six month or so? Paul, in Saudi ( talk) 13:33, 9 March 2014 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: IAR Non-admin closure, as this is not going to be moved from the looks of it. Kevin Rutherford ( talk) 03:15, 17 March 2014 (UTC) Kevin Rutherford ( talk) 03:15, 17 March 2014 (UTC)
Fred Phelps → Fred W. Phelps – To avoid confusion with Olympian Michael Phelps' dad, M. Fred Phelps. 76.105.96.92 ( talk) 21:49, 16 March 2014 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.CNN is reporting the date is 11:15 pm, Wednesday the 19th [9], while the Houston Chronicle is reporting "shortly after midnight" on Thursday the 20th [10]. There needs to be some clarification of this, and what date to put for his death in the article. Iamcuriousblue ( talk) 18:23, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
The information regarding his supposed excommunication is a bit confusing. For one, the source is his son Nate, who is known to be estranged from both the church and family - how can he then be considered a reliable source? Second, he gives the date of communication as being in August, but the article then goes on to say that Phelps' final sermon was delivered in September. Congregations aren't generally in the practice of allowing excommunicated members to enter the church, much less give the sermon. I would suggest that the allegation of excommunication (and the timing thereof), sourced only to an estranged son with no known firsthand knowledge of the situation, should be stricken until independently verified. 97.68.84.119 ( talk) 22:21, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
@ Connormah: I updated the Infobox with the correct parameter name (death_cause, not cause_of_death), and it summarizes what's in the article (see Fred Phelps § Death). If you want to remove it from the Infobox, you have to remove it from the article, though there was already a battle earlier on that subject, so I'd suggest you discuss it first. Until then, the Infobox should say the same as the body of the article. The "no natural causes" thing is a policy peculiarity of the "Deaths in ..." Wikipedia articles only, AFAIK. —[ AlanM1( talk)]— 01:11, 21 March 2014 (UTC)