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I don't believe it's debatable that Francine Patterson taught a gorilla sign language. I'm removing the word "claims". Philosophr ( talk) 09:16, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
Find one intelligable quote from Koko that would constitute Language anywhere. "banana me give" would suffice. It makes no sense that you wouldn't be able to find one sentence that would clearly be a case of language, even if you hold the threashold very low, anywhere on the net by now, if she really knew language. Don't take it from me, research it yourself.
I don't mean to embarass you, because you are in good company, including National Geographic magazine. But you are wrong and can prove it to yourself. Chrisrus ( talk) 13:11, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
I don't feel embarrassed at all. This is not up for debate. I will go find a quote from National Geographic if I have to. I have watched multiple videos on Koko and she repeatedly uses language. Is it exactly american sign language? No, it's a modified form of gorilla sign language. But, it is sign language none-the-less.
Would "candy give-me" be an adequate suffice to you, for "banana me give"? If so, I have a transcript of her saying just that. "KOKO: candy give-me. (Then Koko reaches for Penny's pocket.)" from [1] Philosophr ( talk) 00:36, 26 February 2009 (UTC)
Lips fake candy give me. She touched her lips, formed a "fake"-like sign, and reached for the pocket? Chrisrus ( talk) 14:47, 28 February 2009 (UTC)
What's with the anti-Koko/Penny agenda? I don't get it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 159.153.4.51 ( talk) 18:23, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
=> the question is, what shall we call "language". If we stick to the definition of linguists (for example: Chomsky, Jackendoff, Pinker etc.), this would NOT be called Language. Koko learned Signs of ASL to communicate.
Patterson attended the University of Illinois High School. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 211.225.34.156 ( talk) 09:07, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
Dr. Patterson and her research have been significantly, severely, and notable criticized by her peers. Why is there no mention of it here? Rklawton ( talk) 14:21, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
None exists to support Francine Patterson's claims. She interprets Koko as saying what she wants people to believe Koko has said. The evidence suggests the gorilla just acts certain ways to get a treat. This is no different than teaching a dog to fetch a ball in return for a treat and I doubt any sensible person would interpret that as the dog communicating in sign language. All of the articles about Koko have been in consumer magazines without any peer-reviewed research at all. Why are the claims of this charlatan treated as fact when they have no more credibility than the claims of 9/11 "truthers"? Kdb1965 ( talk) 07:20, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
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This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
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![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on 2006 June 22. The result of the discussion was keep. |
I don't believe it's debatable that Francine Patterson taught a gorilla sign language. I'm removing the word "claims". Philosophr ( talk) 09:16, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
Find one intelligable quote from Koko that would constitute Language anywhere. "banana me give" would suffice. It makes no sense that you wouldn't be able to find one sentence that would clearly be a case of language, even if you hold the threashold very low, anywhere on the net by now, if she really knew language. Don't take it from me, research it yourself.
I don't mean to embarass you, because you are in good company, including National Geographic magazine. But you are wrong and can prove it to yourself. Chrisrus ( talk) 13:11, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
I don't feel embarrassed at all. This is not up for debate. I will go find a quote from National Geographic if I have to. I have watched multiple videos on Koko and she repeatedly uses language. Is it exactly american sign language? No, it's a modified form of gorilla sign language. But, it is sign language none-the-less.
Would "candy give-me" be an adequate suffice to you, for "banana me give"? If so, I have a transcript of her saying just that. "KOKO: candy give-me. (Then Koko reaches for Penny's pocket.)" from [1] Philosophr ( talk) 00:36, 26 February 2009 (UTC)
Lips fake candy give me. She touched her lips, formed a "fake"-like sign, and reached for the pocket? Chrisrus ( talk) 14:47, 28 February 2009 (UTC)
What's with the anti-Koko/Penny agenda? I don't get it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 159.153.4.51 ( talk) 18:23, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
=> the question is, what shall we call "language". If we stick to the definition of linguists (for example: Chomsky, Jackendoff, Pinker etc.), this would NOT be called Language. Koko learned Signs of ASL to communicate.
Patterson attended the University of Illinois High School. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 211.225.34.156 ( talk) 09:07, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
Dr. Patterson and her research have been significantly, severely, and notable criticized by her peers. Why is there no mention of it here? Rklawton ( talk) 14:21, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
None exists to support Francine Patterson's claims. She interprets Koko as saying what she wants people to believe Koko has said. The evidence suggests the gorilla just acts certain ways to get a treat. This is no different than teaching a dog to fetch a ball in return for a treat and I doubt any sensible person would interpret that as the dog communicating in sign language. All of the articles about Koko have been in consumer magazines without any peer-reviewed research at all. Why are the claims of this charlatan treated as fact when they have no more credibility than the claims of 9/11 "truthers"? Kdb1965 ( talk) 07:20, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Francine Patterson. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 09:06, 14 December 2017 (UTC)