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as "inventor of the alphabet", has it been suggested that the name has a relation to that of the Phoenicians? dab (ᛏ) 20:26, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
What is the correct phonetic way to pronounce: Auraicept na n-Éces, Goídel mac Ethéoir? Thanks ፈቃደ ( ውይይት) 05:42, 29 December 2005 (UTC)
- "Auraicept na n-Éces, Goídel mac Ethéoir"
- Its obviously not modern irish but from my (limited) grasp of the tongue, i'd say; "Aura-kept na Nayk-esh, Gweeddle/Gwiddle Mack E(soft e)-hore. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 83.70.60.248 ( talk • contribs) 19:25, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
- See
Old Irish language#Phonology. My best guess for a 7th-century pronunciation is /ˈɑuɾˌɑkʲɛpt̪ n̪ɑ ˈɲeːgʲɛs/ and /ˈgoiðʲɛl mɑk ˈɛθʲeuɾʲ/. The modern versions would be Uraiceacht na nÉigeas (/ˈʊɾəkʲəxt̪ n̪ə ˈɲeːgʲəs/) and Gaoidheal (or Gael) Mac Eitheoir (/geːl mɑk ˈɛhoːɾʲ/). --
Angr
21:38, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- /ˈɑuɾˌɑgʲɛpt̪/?? Hence ModI Õraigeacht ~Õirigeacht?? Do you know what these names mean? Disposition(?) of the wise? Irishman son of liar??
Mongvras
22:25, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- The Modern Irish word uraiceacht means "first instruction, primer; elements, rudiments". "First instruction, primer" is also the translation given in the Dictionary of the Irish Language (i.e. Old/Middle Irish) for airaicecht, of which auraicept is a spelling variation (the p because aicecht/aicept is a loanword from Latin acceptus). So it's "The Sages' Primer". As for Goídel mac Etheoir, Goídel was probably first an ethnonym for Goidelic speakers and then given to a legendary "founder of the race". I have no idea what his father's name *Ethér (the presumed nominative to the genitive Etheoir) is supposed to mean. It's not in the dictionary. -- Angr 22:40, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- /ˈɑuɾˌɑgʲɛpt̪/?? Hence ModI Õraigeacht ~Õirigeacht?? Do you know what these names mean? Disposition(?) of the wise? Irishman son of liar??
Mongvras
22:25, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- See
Old Irish language#Phonology. My best guess for a 7th-century pronunciation is /ˈɑuɾˌɑkʲɛpt̪ n̪ɑ ˈɲeːgʲɛs/ and /ˈgoiðʲɛl mɑk ˈɛθʲeuɾʲ/. The modern versions would be Uraiceacht na nÉigeas (/ˈʊɾəkʲəxt̪ n̪ə ˈɲeːgʲəs/) and Gaoidheal (or Gael) Mac Eitheoir (/geːl mɑk ˈɛhoːɾʲ/). --
Angr
21:38, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the move request was: Move. Jafeluv ( talk) 08:49, 22 April 2010 (UTC)
Fenius Farsa → Fénius Farsaid — Most common name is Fénius Farsaid (currently a redirect). See for instance, the three references, all relatively recent, included under "Further reading". Looks uncontroversial to me, or am I missing something? Cavila ( talk) 10:17, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- And again in the entries for Koch's Celtic Culture, Duffy's Medieval Ireland, A New History of Ireland, and other articles by John Carey and so on. An exception, but a minor one as far as I can see, is Scowcroft, who has Féinius Farsaid in two articles on LGE. Cavila ( talk) 10:47, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- You're right, there are slightly more hits on google books for Farsaid then Farsa - about 733 to 612.
Til Eulenspiegel (
talk)
11:33, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- Thanks, a Google Books search is actually even more revealing than that: the overwhelming majority of sources using "Farsa" actually date from the 19th and early 20th century. For the newbies among us (not you of course), that's when Wikipedia was still a guild of door-to-door encyclopedia salesmen. Cavila ( talk) 14:35, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
- Support per the evidence presented by Cavila.-- Cúchullain t/ c 12:10, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- Support more common. — innotata 19:01, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- Support A clear case has been made. Skinsmoke ( talk) 02:04, 20 April 2010 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
|
| This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||
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as "inventor of the alphabet", has it been suggested that the name has a relation to that of the Phoenicians? dab (ᛏ) 20:26, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
What is the correct phonetic way to pronounce: Auraicept na n-Éces, Goídel mac Ethéoir? Thanks ፈቃደ ( ውይይት) 05:42, 29 December 2005 (UTC)
- "Auraicept na n-Éces, Goídel mac Ethéoir"
- Its obviously not modern irish but from my (limited) grasp of the tongue, i'd say; "Aura-kept na Nayk-esh, Gweeddle/Gwiddle Mack E(soft e)-hore. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 83.70.60.248 ( talk • contribs) 19:25, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
- See
Old Irish language#Phonology. My best guess for a 7th-century pronunciation is /ˈɑuɾˌɑkʲɛpt̪ n̪ɑ ˈɲeːgʲɛs/ and /ˈgoiðʲɛl mɑk ˈɛθʲeuɾʲ/. The modern versions would be Uraiceacht na nÉigeas (/ˈʊɾəkʲəxt̪ n̪ə ˈɲeːgʲəs/) and Gaoidheal (or Gael) Mac Eitheoir (/geːl mɑk ˈɛhoːɾʲ/). --
Angr
21:38, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- /ˈɑuɾˌɑgʲɛpt̪/?? Hence ModI Õraigeacht ~Õirigeacht?? Do you know what these names mean? Disposition(?) of the wise? Irishman son of liar??
Mongvras
22:25, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- The Modern Irish word uraiceacht means "first instruction, primer; elements, rudiments". "First instruction, primer" is also the translation given in the Dictionary of the Irish Language (i.e. Old/Middle Irish) for airaicecht, of which auraicept is a spelling variation (the p because aicecht/aicept is a loanword from Latin acceptus). So it's "The Sages' Primer". As for Goídel mac Etheoir, Goídel was probably first an ethnonym for Goidelic speakers and then given to a legendary "founder of the race". I have no idea what his father's name *Ethér (the presumed nominative to the genitive Etheoir) is supposed to mean. It's not in the dictionary. -- Angr 22:40, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- /ˈɑuɾˌɑgʲɛpt̪/?? Hence ModI Õraigeacht ~Õirigeacht?? Do you know what these names mean? Disposition(?) of the wise? Irishman son of liar??
Mongvras
22:25, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- See
Old Irish language#Phonology. My best guess for a 7th-century pronunciation is /ˈɑuɾˌɑkʲɛpt̪ n̪ɑ ˈɲeːgʲɛs/ and /ˈgoiðʲɛl mɑk ˈɛθʲeuɾʲ/. The modern versions would be Uraiceacht na nÉigeas (/ˈʊɾəkʲəxt̪ n̪ə ˈɲeːgʲəs/) and Gaoidheal (or Gael) Mac Eitheoir (/geːl mɑk ˈɛhoːɾʲ/). --
Angr
21:38, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
- The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the move request was: Move. Jafeluv ( talk) 08:49, 22 April 2010 (UTC)
Fenius Farsa → Fénius Farsaid — Most common name is Fénius Farsaid (currently a redirect). See for instance, the three references, all relatively recent, included under "Further reading". Looks uncontroversial to me, or am I missing something? Cavila ( talk) 10:17, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- And again in the entries for Koch's Celtic Culture, Duffy's Medieval Ireland, A New History of Ireland, and other articles by John Carey and so on. An exception, but a minor one as far as I can see, is Scowcroft, who has Féinius Farsaid in two articles on LGE. Cavila ( talk) 10:47, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- You're right, there are slightly more hits on google books for Farsaid then Farsa - about 733 to 612.
Til Eulenspiegel (
talk)
11:33, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- Thanks, a Google Books search is actually even more revealing than that: the overwhelming majority of sources using "Farsa" actually date from the 19th and early 20th century. For the newbies among us (not you of course), that's when Wikipedia was still a guild of door-to-door encyclopedia salesmen. Cavila ( talk) 14:35, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
- Support per the evidence presented by Cavila.-- Cúchullain t/ c 12:10, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- Support more common. — innotata 19:01, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- Support A clear case has been made. Skinsmoke ( talk) 02:04, 20 April 2010 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.