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The article linked in reference number 6 (Robinson, Simon (2006-05-28). "The deadliest war in the world". Time.com. Retrieved 2010-05-02) does not speak of 5.4 million but of 3.9 million people killed. Reference number 7, which is more up to date, indeed speaks of 5.4 million however. I would suggest that the reference number 6 will be deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JohKar ( talk • contribs) 17:14, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
Calling the section of history before Europeans arrived "pre-history" suggests the country had no history before Europeans arrived. This is enthno-centric and ignores the existence of the native people. The section should be called Early History. Metromatch ( talk) 08:53, 12 October 2009 (UTC)
I think that in the section about history mention should be made of this important declaration, that's been published in the Osservatore romano. 151.67.232.61 ( talk) 01:55, 18 November 2008 (UTC)
See also Talk:Foreign_relations_of_the_Democratic_Republic_of_the_Congo
I removed ": the Belgians are the only European power that built a university in their colony and the colonists were carefully picked by the Belgian Government, to name only a few examples". I know, for example, that the British built Universities in India. Probably the sentence needs rewording to something more exact. DJ Clayworth 13:41, 10 Sep 2004 (UTC)
The formatting appears messed up in Firefox, all other pages look fine. OMouse 10:56, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)
It's a lengthy lead, but I felt several key items needed to be mentioned. These are, and the length of the lead is, therefore, compunded by:
El_C 12:43, 15 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Zaire is 3rd largest in Africa.
The Democratic Republic of the Congo is Zaire, the country was renamed in 1997.-- Gozar 06:20, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
i spent a good hour attempting to reformat the table on the right with all the stats and information and it refused to cooperate, i have most of it done and saved in Word if anyone wants to work on it and see if they cant get it functioning, i however am not competent enough in the code to do so. also, I had a numbered map of the provinces with corresponding names, as well as changing the picture for the geography section from the river basin satellite image to the political map of the country. more to come! -- Gozar 02:01, 12 July 2005 (UTC)
In the article it states; "Lumumba escaped to join his supporters in Stanleyville but was recaptured and then flown (January, 1961), on orders from the Belgian Minister for African affairs, to his sworn enemies in Katanga. On the way he and two of his assistants were harshly tortured and shot by a Belgian-Congolese command."
This makes it sound like Lumumba and his two assistants were killed on the plane. To my understanding Lumumba and his assistants were killed after arriving in Elizabethville, as they were taken out to a clearing in the jungle and faced a firing squad.
Any thoughts?
Most of my info on his assassination comes from Ludo De Witte's book, "The Assassination of Lumumba". -- Seanh 14:31, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
Yes, i was under the impression that this was the case as well, i hadnt noticed the error in the text though.-- Gozar 14:51, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
alright, i think that's an improvement. replaced with stated version of what happened. -- Gozar 00:20, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
Thanks, it now much better-- Seanh 18:33, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
We have to be careful not to call thing with the colonisation as the post of reference, i.e. post-colonization, pre-colonization. The history of the Congo shouldn't be build around the occupation/administration of the country by Europeans. (occupation and administration are a bit extreme but could be more accurate than colonization). The historian Ndaywel è Nziem suggests calling the periods: "ancient period", "colonization (exploitation and administration)", "indepedance" and etc... What do you think? --- moyogo
i think 'Early Congolese History' has a nice ring to it, ulimately im going to be for anything that makes the articles less centered around European colonization, i just could not conceive of how it would be done. that said, renaming "pre-colonial" to "Early Congolese History" seems like a good first step. Also, more Congolese input is definately needed, but i assume that this is also unlikely due to a lack of internet accessibility in the country. i guess the question now is, who wants to do all the changing of names!? (if you agree, that is)-- Gozar 18:13, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
yeah, the article on the main page is mostly pasted material from the section on the kongo. i think we should condense the section on the Kongo, as well as add info on the kuba, luba, and other groups (which Xed mentioned on the Early History talk page) so we may want to make it slightly longer to accomadate for more information.i definately want to make it fairly thourough to make up for the lack of information on the period as opposed to the post-colonial period. as Moyogo said, a lot of emphasis should be put on this section because it will be the only one containing much information on the country as a nation not defined solely by the European portion of its history. Congolese history certainly did not begin with the arrival of Europeans and I think this needs to drive that point home.-- Gozar 00:17, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
Do the colonial names of the cities really have to be in the main article? Should there be a different article or in the articles about each city? Who still uses those names nowdays? How are they relevant on the main article about the whole country? --- moyogo 10:00, August 15, 2005 (UTC)
yeah, although i understand exactly where you're coming from (i put up most of the pre-colonial history, there was NOTHING there before, which was naturally just disgusting) i cant really come up with anything else to call the period. the fact of the matter is the area's history is split between two periods with a sharp dividing line: pre-colonial and post-colonial. and if you really read the whole page(i'm not saying you didnt, just pointing it out), it's pretty obvious that the brutality of European rule is definately not being glossed over.-- Gozar 13:42, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
I'm not saying we should change everything, it's just that we could try to have a less european centered history or version of the article. I think we need more congolese contributing here --- moyogo 17:35, August 15, 2005 (UTC)
I want to make a remark: please mind that there is a big difference between The Congo Free state-period and the Congo colonisation-period. During The Congo Free state, King Leopold II was the personal owner of the Congo, the Belgian Government had nothing to say there. Many reports, testimonies,... indicated that life situations improved very well when Belgium took over the Congo from its king.
Btw, the old names of the cities are still used somethimes in reports, etc. So I'm sure it's necessary to keep them in the article.
im seriously considering an earlier suggestion that the Early Congolese History should be split in two(at least on the main page) with one section one pre-/ancient history and one with a title similar to the one on the Early Congolese page (On the Eve of Colonial Rule doesnt seem academic enough for its own section on the main page). i will likely wait for the input of others before updating. also, i created the geography, politics, and wildlife sections for the main page and havent had much feedback. if anyone could let me know what they think (i feel like i have a tendency to add a lot of unneccessary information) it would be appreciated. thanks. -- Gozar 00:24, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
Tired of typing "the Democratic Republic of the Congo"? Me too. I've created a bunch of redirecting articles to which mean you can just type DRC instead, with or without the the, ie History of DRC, Politics of the DRC etc. As a precedent, the USA articles have a similar thing. It's almost as complicated as the China/Taiwan thing. (Taiwan can also be known as ROC, which can also be the name for Republic of Congo, which can also be the name for Congo-Kinshasa's first republic etc etc - confused?)- Xed 15:00, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
yeah, id noticed that you pretty much had to type the whole thing, but i think 'DR Congo' was the fastest previously. i had considered making some more pages just to redirect but never got around to it. also, after looking over other history pages, i think you're right about the history on the main page. it needs to be shortened, id never noticed but all the other national pages have just one section for the history, DRC has like 9 sections. we should probably try to reduce to one section (as difficult as that will be) and concentrate most of the stuff from this main page onto the History of the DRC page as you stated previously.-- Gozar 15:04, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
i think the history is getting pretty out of control and needs to be condensed, there's simply too much information. it takes up almost half the DRC page, most of other national history pages are very terse. we can simply transfer most of it the History of the DRC article.-- Gozar 00:39, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
Article mentions the high mountains at north east of DRC territory. Are these the mysterious 'Mountains of the Moon' that provide the annual surge/flood in the White Nile? If so then the link is worth mentioning -- Egypt and Sudan would be very different without this regular phenomenon. Wikipedia's only article on Mountains of the Moon concerns a film.
we do have an article on the phyiscal Mountains of the Moon, but for some reason that search paged sent you to the film, the article can be found here (ive editted the page so it does a link disambiguation). Also, you can find more info in the Ruwenzori_Range article.-- Gozar 17:18, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
That graph of smoothly rising population, census measurements every year: I don't believe it, does anybody?
What was this country's official name when it achieved independence? Was it "Democratic Republic of Congo" or was it "Republic of Congo"?
The Wikipedia article Heads of state of the Democratic Republic of the Congo indicates that the country began as "Republic of Congo", became "Democratic Republic of Congo" in 1966, became "Zaire" in 1971, and reverted to "Democratic Republic of Congo" in 1997.
So, in 1960, at the moment of independence, what was the country called? Were there two countries called "Republic of Congo"?
When Congo was the private property of King Leopold II of Belgium, the name was The Congo Free State (1887-1908). From 1908 untill 1960, when it was a Belgian Colony, its official name was Belgian Congo (Congo belge, Belgisch Congo).
Is it "The Democratic Republic of Congo" or "The Democratic Republic of the Congo", because various news networks use different names, the US government uses "...the Congo", but the U.N. uses "..of Congo". The article uses "...of the Congo." What causes the disperity?
Unfortunately the official long title the Democratic Republic of the Congo has become accepted as the name for this country. I guess I am running aginst the tide, but I think we should use the name Congo-Zaire. I mean what does "the Democratic Republic" actually convey? That it is more democratic than its neighbour across the Congo? While it is correct to say that the country was always the Congo and that the Zaire period, as an aberation, the personal creation of Mobutu, it was Zaire when I was there, and the one thing that distinguishes it from the other not-so Democratic Congo is that it was once known as Zaire. In the 1960s media often used to refer to it as the former Belgian Congo to distinguish the two. Which leads me to a joke: Why the President of the Democratic Republic of the Congo, formerly Zaire, formerly, the Republic of the Congo-Kinshasa, formerly the Republic of the Congo-Leopoldville, formerly the Belgian Congo, formerly the Congo Free State, should change the name of his country to Kitchy-Kitchy? That way anyone who removes him from power will be known forever as the man who pulled off the Kitchy Kitchy coup. 09:32, 18 March 2009 (UTC)~ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Noel Ellis ( talk • contribs)
The country has a new coat of arms which can be found here:
http://www.presidentrdc.cd/accueil.html
Should the english name be included to the header? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.101.190.167 ( talk)
The constitution is clear on this, the 26 provinces will be in place in the 36 months after the installations of the institutions defined in it, see Article 226, also at [4].
When were the 26 provinces set up when the institutions defined in the Constitution aren't even in place considering the elections haven't gone throught yet? ---
There is no intimation from Government or any official document including the constitution that Congo DRC will be having 26 provinces. They are only 11 and will remain so for now. I am currently fixing the geographical classification data of the country with Provinces, Districts, Territories and Sectors. Anyone wish to have them is welcome. Adeelzafarbioid 03:42, 10 March 2007 (UTC)
Mbɔ́tɛ na bínó, or Mbóte na bínó - à la kinoise ;-)
I started improvements on the
Image:Congo Kinshasa Template.svg. I'd like it to be a template for most general maps on the Congo. Eventually it should be able to generate a map like
Image:Cg-map.png and its translated forms.The SVG file already contains layers with different data. The Provinces' contours currently in the file are those of
2006,
1988,
1966, and
1960. I do not have access to a map of the provinces of 1963 at the moment. I'm currently working on adding major cities. I'd like to add the same Geo data as the CIA WorldBook map (latitude and longitude, scale, labels, Congo river) and maybe more for more detailed maps (rivers, territories, small cities, major roads, train tracks and resources). Please let me know if you're interested. ---
moyogo
07:26, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
The first line of the section on recent conflicts reads: Since 1994, the Congo has been rent by ethnic strife and civil war, touched off by a massive inflow of refugees fleeing the Rwandan Genocide. This sentence might easily contain the addendum, "which they participated in". Most Western readers will interpret this, as currently worded, to imply that the victims of the Rwandan genocide are thr refugees who touched off strife. In fact, the refugees are the Hutu Power government and Interahamwe militia who planned and commited the genocide, as while as anyone they could bully or trick into crossing the border with them. One wouldn't want an article on the Nuremburg trials to read "Many victims of World War II were hanged at Nuremberg", even though that might in the strictest sense be true. I suggest a change reflecing the fact that the refugees were largely from the groups participating in the genocide and that much of the "ethnic strife" they touched off was a continuation of their genocidal politics.
According to Book of the Year2006(Encyclopaedia Britannica), Official languages:"French, English" This is an error. http://www.britannica.com/nations/Congo,-Democratic-Republic-Of-The
Why does the DRC article have two sections, "Political divisions" and "Administrative divisions", both providing similar information?
The only content in the former is "Main article: Political divisions of the Democratic Republic of the Congo", which takes you to a text beginning "The administrative hierarchy of Political subdivisions in the Democratic Republic of the Congo is as follows:". Anyone oppose merging these two sections? Kahuzi 16:49, 29 August 2006 (UTC)
There are a lot of glaring grammatical errors in the article that make it extremely hard to read.
"The chopping tools and choppers are estimated to date back to before -200,000 years [200,000 years ago or 200,000 BCE], though we cannot be more specific today [?? what does that mean??]. The country was peopled in very ancient times by groups of hunter-collectors, some of them maybe ancestors of today's pygmies. In the large time period between the earliest hunter-gatherer inhabitants and the coming of the first villagers, Congo will always [will always be? should it be "was settled"?] be settled by various stone knapping nomad groups of different Traditions."
"Formerly the Belgian colony of the Belgian Congo, the country's post-independence name was changed in 1971, from Congo-Kinshasa (after its capital, to distinguish it from the Republic of Congo, or Congo-Brazzaville) to Zaire, until 1997. Since 1998, the country has suffered greatly from the devastating Second Congo War (sometimes referred to as the African World War[2][3]), the world's deadliest conflict since World War II."
I will return and try and correct some of these errors, but all in all I think this article needs to be tagged as not up to WIki's quality standards. If anyone knows how to, please do so.
Would be great to include the old ways of greeting in French that were taught the indigenous, e.g. the first two or three lessons on how to greet or introduce oneself. It is practically the didactic language (sorry, didnt know how best to contribute). --- User:147.142.186.54
The location map shows a very old map of the world, with Austria-Hungary and the German Empire among others, and so shows the DRC as part of Belgium. The map is currently being used in other articles as a map for the Congo Free State, so I don't think another map should be uploaded unless there isn't one already. So does anyone know if there is a modern-day map with the DRC highlighted? (And, if possible, one with the new border between Serbia and Montenegro?) Thank you! - Lewis R « т · c » 19:23, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
In my ongoing efforts to try to include every country on the planet included in the scope of a WikiProject, I have proposed a new project on Middle Africa at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals#Middle Africa whose scope would include the Democratic Republic of the Congo. Any interested parties are more than welcome to add their names there, so we can see if there is enough interest to start such a project. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 16:35, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
Belgian Congo mines supplied the uranium for the Hiroshima bomb but not the Nagasaki bomb because the latter was a plutonium weapon.
the table header is misleading. The French and Dutch names are the same as the Congolese ones. What is indicated are the pre-independence or pre-zairianisation names. Please adjust accordingly. -- moyogo 21:13, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
I'm replacing the table showing the major cities. It misleads to think the Congolese column names are used in Congolese languages, French column names are used in French, and that Dutch is used in the country. Such a table should be in a History pages not in a section displaying a liste of current major cities. Or is should be clearer. -- moyogo 00:15, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
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I'll move this table to the History Page, and change the column headings to make it clearer. Kahuzi 19:18, 21 February 2007 (UTC) Bold text
Should articles on DRC include the word "The" in their title? I'm thinking of National Assembly of the Democratic Republic of the Congo and others which have recently been moved. Personally I think yes they should, as this is what english speakers normally say (despite the general ban on articles in wikipedia). What do others think? AndrewRT( Talk) 21:09, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
I would like to add this article to one of your country's categories, but I can't decide which one. I notice everything has been neatly organised and I don't want to drop it somewhere arbitrary. Can someone help out? Bards 22:46, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
In regards to Congolese pre-colonial history, is it true that cannibalism was rampant? The only reliable accounts I can think of are those of the Begian government- well, if they really did have to deal with eliminating it during colonization- so what's the consensus on this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.5.136.64 ( talk) 01:07, August 27, 2007 (UTC)
Not at all. The cannibalization myth was first promulgated by King Leopold in an effort portray himself as the harbinger of civilization to barbaric peoples. There's no historical basis for this.
<!-Autosigned by A-M.w.e.z-->
I absolutely don't want to demean the situation in the Congo, obviously it's atrocious and something needs to be done about it, and immediately. But in the interests of accuracy and clarity: "This period of conflict has been the bloodiest in history since World War II.[10] Almost four million people have died as a result of the fighting." Almost four million, which is probably a pretty accurate number considering the inherent inaccuracies of reporting in such messy parts of the world, is really pretty close to a reasonable estimate of the deaths resultant from the complex of American actions in Southeast Asia many of which are called "the Vietnam War", in fact it may even be a little lower. Depending on your definitions and sources, a guess about Southeast Asian deaths strictly due to American actions ranges anywhere between 2 million and 6.
Further, I checked the link given as a source, and all it did was simply state the assertion "bloodiest conflict since WWII", at least in the part of the article not requiring subscription. I get that a statement made in the Economist is generally regarded as of sufficient reliability for inclusion in a Wiki article, but I wouldn't be so credulous. While the Congo situation is among a teeny handful of the worst, and may indeed be the worst, I think we should be a little more careful in making bold and certain claims. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jammoe ( talk • contribs) 04:48, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
There is a debate on categories for discussion about whether it is appropriate to use "Democratic Republic of the Congo" as an adjective. For example, it is ok to refer to "Democratic Republic of the Congo writers," or should they be called "Writers of the Democratic Republic of the Congo." If you have an opinion on or information about this matter, please comment here. Thank you. LeSnail ( talk) 17:59, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
The article currently says, "Then-President Mobutu renamed the country Zaire, from a Portuguese mispronunciation of the Kikongo word nzere or nzadi, which translates to "the river that swallows all rivers." There is a citation for this claim, but how can either of these quite short words possibly translate into such a complex concept as "the river that swallows all rivers"??? Anyone more familiar with Kikongo? 65.183.135.231 ( talk) 16:31, 30 October 2008 (UTC)
"The earliest evidence further to the west is known in Cameroon, and near to the small town of Bouar in Central Africa. Though further studies are needed to establish a better chronology for the start of iron production in Central Africa, the Cameroonian data places iron smelting north of the Equatorial Forest around 2,600 BC to 2,500 BC ."
How can the claims of this article with regards to iron smelting be reconciled with the article History of ferrous metallurgy? If these claims are right, then the peoples of the Congo would have invented iron smelting and forging a thousand years before any other civilization of the world. 87.78.252.88 ( talk) 12:33, 16 November 2008 (UTC)
I think that is a non-issue. We can't actually pinpoint the invention of metallurgy within a thousand years anyway, can we?
I notice this huge gap in the "history" section. Why are we ignoring the period of European imperialism? Surely something happened, and surely Belgian colonists kept records, so I don't see why it is omitted, especially when colonialism is what created the atmosphere that is causing the war today. Perhaps it used to be their but someone deleted it? Special:Contributions/x ( talk) 08:53, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Is there a reason that the opening does not mention that the country was formerly called Zaire? 136.152.180.121 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:36, 18 March 2009 (UTC).
History: The Belgian Congo. After Belgian administration for 52 years (including two World Wars when Belgium was occupied by Germany for a total of eight years) the Congo was poorly developed and faced independence with few people experienced in administration and a large unproductive public service. With the neighbouring French colonies progressing towards independence Belgium agreed to quit the Congo in 1960. French President Charles de Gaulle made a speech in Brazzaville, French Congo saying that the French colonies could have independence whenever they wanted it. The Congolese on the other side of the river in the Belgian Congo insisted on the same. But the only thing the local politician agreed on was that they wanted immediate independence. The Republic of the Congo (Leopoldville). Because the former French Moyen (Middle) Congo gained independence as the Congo (Brazzaville) in the same year, the ex-Belgian Congo was referred to as the Congo (Leopoldville). The new nation was beset by rebellion and disunity. The only national-wide political party was the Mouvement Populaire Congolaise, led by Patrice Lumumba who became Prime Minister. His main rival, Joseph Kassavubu of the predominantly KiKongo Akabo party, was named as President in an attempt to achieve national unity. Most parties were locally based and primarily tribal in identity. Rivalry between Lumumba and Kasavubu led to the President and Prime Minister both trying to dismiss each other, and calls for outside assistance to hold the country together in face of provincial secession and army mutiny. Belgian forces remained in the country after independence, and a failure to promote native Congolese to positions of command in the colonial Force Publique, renamed the Armée National Congolaise (ANC), led to a mutiny by Congolese soldiers against their Belgian officers and widespread disorder throughout the country. The Katanga Secession In the southern province of Katanga (later Shaba region) Belgian forces disarmed and removed mutinous ANC forces leaving control in the hands of provincial premier Moises Tshombe. He had favoured a federal system of government and when this was not granted used his local power base to oppose the central government in Leopoldville, as well as rival governments at Stanleyville (now Kisangani). He was assisted by the white settlers in Katanga and foreign mercenary volunteers from South Africa and the neighbouring Federation of Rhodesia and Nyasaland. French and Belgian military interests were also represented with considerable financial backing from the Union Minière du Haut Katanga who benefited from the absence of central government control in the mineral-rich province. Independence was declared 11 July 1960 until 15 January 1963 when United Nations forces aided the Congolese central government regain control. The success of the Katanga secession also inspired Albert Kalonji to declare himself King of the South Kasai Mining State (1961-62). At the same time as he continued to hold a seat in the central Parliament. The Congo Crisis. A former sergeant in the Force Publique turned journalist, Joseph Mobutu, organised a counter-coup against Prime Minister Lumumba who was detained at his residence under U.N. protection. Lumumba attempted to flee to Stanleyville where his supporters had formed a rival administration, but was captured by Mobutu, who handed him over to Moises Tshombe's Katanganese regime. After suffering at the hands of both Mobutu's and Tshombe's bullyboys, Patrice Lumumba was reported dead in 1961, supposedly shot by tribesmen while fleeing. Eventually a government at Leopoldville was formed suitable to Lumumba's MPC supporters, and U.N. forces and international pressure forced the end of the Katanga secession January 1963. The Simba Uprisings. No sooner were the U.N. forces withdrawn than the Congo had to face a new problem: widespread uprisings in the name of Lumumba. The insurgents rapidly overrun the eastern part of the country, capturing Stanleyville 1964 and taking white residents hostages. President Kasavubu formed a strong government to deal with this problem by inviting back the former secessionist leader Moises Tshombe to head a new administration, known as the Democratic Republic of the Congo. To combat the rebels Tshombe used the means he had used so successfully before: white mercenaries from South Africa, Rhodesia, and Europe. With these forces, and Belgian paratroops and American planes, Stanleyville was recaptured and the revolt suppressed. With the rebel threat gone, President Kasavubu dismissed P.M. Tshombe in 1965 shortly before he himself was overthrown in a coup by Joseph Mobutu. The Mercenaries and the Stanleyville Uprisings. Most of the mercenaries failed to support an uprising in 1966 by Katanganese gendarmes at Stanleyville (the First Stanleyville Revolt or Katanganese Mutiny), calling for the restoration of Tshombe. After dealing with the Katanganese, Mobutu began making plans to get rid of the foreign mercenaries in the country. Belatedly the mercenaries seized Stanleyville in the Second Stanleyville revolt, or Mercenaries Mutiny, in July 1967. While they had the military advantage, they lacked political support and suffered a setback because a key player, the exiled premier Tshombe, was kidnapped 30 June and taken to Algeria, where he reportedly died in 1968. An invasion from Portuguese Angola by mercenaries under Frenchman Robert Denard came too late to save the main body who retreated from Stanleyville to Bukavu in August under Col. Jean (`Black Jack’) Schrame, a gay Belgian-planter turned mercenary. From their stronghold on Lake Kivu they resisted the Congolese army before evacuating to Rwanda across the lake with about 1,000 Katanganese in October 1967. Although the Congolese government called for their extradition, the mercenaries were eventually repatriated to Europe in 1968. Noel Ellis ( talk) 00:53, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm just curious, why no mention of health or the AIDS/HIV pandemic? Didn't the first confirmed case of HIV-disease take place in Kinshasa? What about Ebola? This nation is of extreme interest to outsiders, among other reasons, because of its pivotal role in the development of new diseases and pandemics. Is there a reason these have not been added to the article? Am I missing something? If not, perhaps I shall show some initiative, God forbid, and add some content myself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Adamacious ( talk • contribs) 22:35, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
PLEASE RENOUNCE WEAPS AND RAE —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
QazimA (
talk •
contribs)
22:12, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
Someone looking at this page can help out with the deletion discussion of this person from the DR of the Congo ... here. Thanks.-- Epeefleche ( talk) 17:59, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
Some historical material is POV, and seems to be written with the explicit intentions of portraying "evil white men and poor natives". While there is solid and indisputable proof that there is much to be ashamed of in the colonial era, it should still be treated with a scientific and objective mind. 94.220.254.186 ( talk) 04:34, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
As I continue reading there are plenty of other instances of POV, odd statements, paragraphs with fargoing content backed by a single reference. Other oddities include the claim "In 2009 people in the Congo may still be dying at a rate of an estimated 45,000 per month". Well, duh: That makes roughly half a million a year. The total population is claimed at 68 million, which with any reasonable estimate of average life expectancy makes the number low and entirely unremarkable. 94.220.254.186 ( talk) 04:55, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
"1.5.2 International Community Response" is extremely POV. I don't like the use of the words "incommensurate" (I'd say it has pejorative connotations), "effective" or "little will". -- The Fwanksta ( talk) 00:27, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
This table includes a blank column. Is there a reason? Varlaam ( talk) 02:52, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
There are not enough editors who are from the DRC to confirm the information in this article.--Gniniv ( talk) 04:55, 12 September 2010 (UTC)
The opening paragraph states the coastline is 37km long, the second paragraph gives the length of coastline as 40km. Which is correct?
Religion | English WP | French WP | German WP | Difference | Encyclopaedia Universalis (rec. 1980) |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
christian | (90%)* | 50% | (80%)* | 50-90% | (94.5%)* * = calculated |
catholic | 55% | 50% | 48.4% | ||
protestant | 35% incl. kimbanguist | 20% | 29.0% | ||
kimbanguist | (included in protestant) | 15% | 10% | (17.1%) sectes chrétiennes africaines | |
muslim | 5% | 15% | 10% | 5-15% | 1.4% |
animist | 2.4% | 20% | 10% | 2.4-20% | 3.4% |
-- Eruedin ( talk) 15:43, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
les élection es que kabila reusirra? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
208.95.113.148 (
talk)
16:17, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
Answer: Yes it is, the neighbouring Republic of Congo (not to be confused) has Kia Ora as it's national drink.
— Preceding
unsigned comment added by
80.42.150.86 (
talk)
14:14, 13 August 2011 (UTC)
Congo is the second largest country in Africa after Algeria, not the largest. Mightymights ( talk) 17:02, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
Congo-Kinshasa and Congo-Brazaville are historical names; they are also names which are used informally in the capital cities of the two countries, probably because the people who live there think they represent the whole country. It's pretty similar to people in London, or Paris, who think they represent the whole of their respective countries. However, those names are not the official names of any country in present times. It's not even open to discussion really. This is an encyclopaedia - and the names of the two countries are The Democratic Republic of the Congo and The Republic of the Congo (with or without "the") and nothing else. We are going into dangerous territory if we think we can change things. Remember, Wikipedia is used by millions of people as a primary reference. Francis Hannaway 08:06, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
Agree with Moyogo. There is no consensus to be making these changes to use an unwieldy official name. Wikipedia practice is to use common names. Everyking ( talk) 15:21, 25 October 2011 (UTC)
Maybe some useful info here. Lugnuts ( talk) 13:55, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ipXVKU789GdE5omsWQN4h5o0nPXw?docId=700127f6203d4a7f82be1bf20e0122c6 http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/03/congo-democratic-election-reject-idUSL5E7N30DZ20111203
I'm going to do some preliminary edits to the history, maybe we could get a veteran in here to help me out.
Whalen207 ( talk) 03:38, 4 December 2011
Much as people might wish - especially the armchair politicians amongst us - Joseph Kabila is the incumbent president. More than that; he is de facto president because he's still the boss of everything. Therefore, Étienne Tshisekedi's name has no place - even as disputed president - in this article. Francis Hannaway 18:56, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
I think under political crisis 1960-1965 the name 'Danny Ndungu' is incorrect. I can't find any Danny Ndungu references online. Does anyone know who he is? The name use also seems inconsistent. Thanks. JimReaperX ( talk) 19:18, 11 March 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by JimReaperX ( talk • contribs) 19:15, 11 March 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. DrKiernan ( talk) 18:19, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
Democratic Republic of the Congo → Democratic Republic of Congo
Per WP:POVTITLE. Wikipedia practice is to use common names.
BBC, CNN, AL English, NY times and others all use "Democratic Republic of Congo":
Mightymights ( talk) 20:36, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: page not moved. Arbitrarily0 ( talk) 17:03, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
Democratic Republic of the Congo → DR Congo – By far the most widely used name of this country is simply "Congo," so the current title certainly isn't the common one. For example, it's "Congo" in this New York Times profile. Very few countries on Wiki are titled under an extended constitutional name of this kind. Presumably the reason it is done this way is to disambiguate this subject from the Republic of the Congo. If so, this is a poor form of disambiguation since the two names are still confusingly similar. Kauffner ( talk) 13:33, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 |
The article linked in reference number 6 (Robinson, Simon (2006-05-28). "The deadliest war in the world". Time.com. Retrieved 2010-05-02) does not speak of 5.4 million but of 3.9 million people killed. Reference number 7, which is more up to date, indeed speaks of 5.4 million however. I would suggest that the reference number 6 will be deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JohKar ( talk • contribs) 17:14, 7 June 2010 (UTC)
Calling the section of history before Europeans arrived "pre-history" suggests the country had no history before Europeans arrived. This is enthno-centric and ignores the existence of the native people. The section should be called Early History. Metromatch ( talk) 08:53, 12 October 2009 (UTC)
I think that in the section about history mention should be made of this important declaration, that's been published in the Osservatore romano. 151.67.232.61 ( talk) 01:55, 18 November 2008 (UTC)
See also Talk:Foreign_relations_of_the_Democratic_Republic_of_the_Congo
I removed ": the Belgians are the only European power that built a university in their colony and the colonists were carefully picked by the Belgian Government, to name only a few examples". I know, for example, that the British built Universities in India. Probably the sentence needs rewording to something more exact. DJ Clayworth 13:41, 10 Sep 2004 (UTC)
The formatting appears messed up in Firefox, all other pages look fine. OMouse 10:56, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)
It's a lengthy lead, but I felt several key items needed to be mentioned. These are, and the length of the lead is, therefore, compunded by:
El_C 12:43, 15 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Zaire is 3rd largest in Africa.
The Democratic Republic of the Congo is Zaire, the country was renamed in 1997.-- Gozar 06:20, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
i spent a good hour attempting to reformat the table on the right with all the stats and information and it refused to cooperate, i have most of it done and saved in Word if anyone wants to work on it and see if they cant get it functioning, i however am not competent enough in the code to do so. also, I had a numbered map of the provinces with corresponding names, as well as changing the picture for the geography section from the river basin satellite image to the political map of the country. more to come! -- Gozar 02:01, 12 July 2005 (UTC)
In the article it states; "Lumumba escaped to join his supporters in Stanleyville but was recaptured and then flown (January, 1961), on orders from the Belgian Minister for African affairs, to his sworn enemies in Katanga. On the way he and two of his assistants were harshly tortured and shot by a Belgian-Congolese command."
This makes it sound like Lumumba and his two assistants were killed on the plane. To my understanding Lumumba and his assistants were killed after arriving in Elizabethville, as they were taken out to a clearing in the jungle and faced a firing squad.
Any thoughts?
Most of my info on his assassination comes from Ludo De Witte's book, "The Assassination of Lumumba". -- Seanh 14:31, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
Yes, i was under the impression that this was the case as well, i hadnt noticed the error in the text though.-- Gozar 14:51, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
alright, i think that's an improvement. replaced with stated version of what happened. -- Gozar 00:20, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
Thanks, it now much better-- Seanh 18:33, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
We have to be careful not to call thing with the colonisation as the post of reference, i.e. post-colonization, pre-colonization. The history of the Congo shouldn't be build around the occupation/administration of the country by Europeans. (occupation and administration are a bit extreme but could be more accurate than colonization). The historian Ndaywel è Nziem suggests calling the periods: "ancient period", "colonization (exploitation and administration)", "indepedance" and etc... What do you think? --- moyogo
i think 'Early Congolese History' has a nice ring to it, ulimately im going to be for anything that makes the articles less centered around European colonization, i just could not conceive of how it would be done. that said, renaming "pre-colonial" to "Early Congolese History" seems like a good first step. Also, more Congolese input is definately needed, but i assume that this is also unlikely due to a lack of internet accessibility in the country. i guess the question now is, who wants to do all the changing of names!? (if you agree, that is)-- Gozar 18:13, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
yeah, the article on the main page is mostly pasted material from the section on the kongo. i think we should condense the section on the Kongo, as well as add info on the kuba, luba, and other groups (which Xed mentioned on the Early History talk page) so we may want to make it slightly longer to accomadate for more information.i definately want to make it fairly thourough to make up for the lack of information on the period as opposed to the post-colonial period. as Moyogo said, a lot of emphasis should be put on this section because it will be the only one containing much information on the country as a nation not defined solely by the European portion of its history. Congolese history certainly did not begin with the arrival of Europeans and I think this needs to drive that point home.-- Gozar 00:17, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
Do the colonial names of the cities really have to be in the main article? Should there be a different article or in the articles about each city? Who still uses those names nowdays? How are they relevant on the main article about the whole country? --- moyogo 10:00, August 15, 2005 (UTC)
yeah, although i understand exactly where you're coming from (i put up most of the pre-colonial history, there was NOTHING there before, which was naturally just disgusting) i cant really come up with anything else to call the period. the fact of the matter is the area's history is split between two periods with a sharp dividing line: pre-colonial and post-colonial. and if you really read the whole page(i'm not saying you didnt, just pointing it out), it's pretty obvious that the brutality of European rule is definately not being glossed over.-- Gozar 13:42, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
I'm not saying we should change everything, it's just that we could try to have a less european centered history or version of the article. I think we need more congolese contributing here --- moyogo 17:35, August 15, 2005 (UTC)
I want to make a remark: please mind that there is a big difference between The Congo Free state-period and the Congo colonisation-period. During The Congo Free state, King Leopold II was the personal owner of the Congo, the Belgian Government had nothing to say there. Many reports, testimonies,... indicated that life situations improved very well when Belgium took over the Congo from its king.
Btw, the old names of the cities are still used somethimes in reports, etc. So I'm sure it's necessary to keep them in the article.
im seriously considering an earlier suggestion that the Early Congolese History should be split in two(at least on the main page) with one section one pre-/ancient history and one with a title similar to the one on the Early Congolese page (On the Eve of Colonial Rule doesnt seem academic enough for its own section on the main page). i will likely wait for the input of others before updating. also, i created the geography, politics, and wildlife sections for the main page and havent had much feedback. if anyone could let me know what they think (i feel like i have a tendency to add a lot of unneccessary information) it would be appreciated. thanks. -- Gozar 00:24, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
Tired of typing "the Democratic Republic of the Congo"? Me too. I've created a bunch of redirecting articles to which mean you can just type DRC instead, with or without the the, ie History of DRC, Politics of the DRC etc. As a precedent, the USA articles have a similar thing. It's almost as complicated as the China/Taiwan thing. (Taiwan can also be known as ROC, which can also be the name for Republic of Congo, which can also be the name for Congo-Kinshasa's first republic etc etc - confused?)- Xed 15:00, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
yeah, id noticed that you pretty much had to type the whole thing, but i think 'DR Congo' was the fastest previously. i had considered making some more pages just to redirect but never got around to it. also, after looking over other history pages, i think you're right about the history on the main page. it needs to be shortened, id never noticed but all the other national pages have just one section for the history, DRC has like 9 sections. we should probably try to reduce to one section (as difficult as that will be) and concentrate most of the stuff from this main page onto the History of the DRC page as you stated previously.-- Gozar 15:04, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
i think the history is getting pretty out of control and needs to be condensed, there's simply too much information. it takes up almost half the DRC page, most of other national history pages are very terse. we can simply transfer most of it the History of the DRC article.-- Gozar 00:39, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
Article mentions the high mountains at north east of DRC territory. Are these the mysterious 'Mountains of the Moon' that provide the annual surge/flood in the White Nile? If so then the link is worth mentioning -- Egypt and Sudan would be very different without this regular phenomenon. Wikipedia's only article on Mountains of the Moon concerns a film.
we do have an article on the phyiscal Mountains of the Moon, but for some reason that search paged sent you to the film, the article can be found here (ive editted the page so it does a link disambiguation). Also, you can find more info in the Ruwenzori_Range article.-- Gozar 17:18, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
That graph of smoothly rising population, census measurements every year: I don't believe it, does anybody?
What was this country's official name when it achieved independence? Was it "Democratic Republic of Congo" or was it "Republic of Congo"?
The Wikipedia article Heads of state of the Democratic Republic of the Congo indicates that the country began as "Republic of Congo", became "Democratic Republic of Congo" in 1966, became "Zaire" in 1971, and reverted to "Democratic Republic of Congo" in 1997.
So, in 1960, at the moment of independence, what was the country called? Were there two countries called "Republic of Congo"?
When Congo was the private property of King Leopold II of Belgium, the name was The Congo Free State (1887-1908). From 1908 untill 1960, when it was a Belgian Colony, its official name was Belgian Congo (Congo belge, Belgisch Congo).
Is it "The Democratic Republic of Congo" or "The Democratic Republic of the Congo", because various news networks use different names, the US government uses "...the Congo", but the U.N. uses "..of Congo". The article uses "...of the Congo." What causes the disperity?
Unfortunately the official long title the Democratic Republic of the Congo has become accepted as the name for this country. I guess I am running aginst the tide, but I think we should use the name Congo-Zaire. I mean what does "the Democratic Republic" actually convey? That it is more democratic than its neighbour across the Congo? While it is correct to say that the country was always the Congo and that the Zaire period, as an aberation, the personal creation of Mobutu, it was Zaire when I was there, and the one thing that distinguishes it from the other not-so Democratic Congo is that it was once known as Zaire. In the 1960s media often used to refer to it as the former Belgian Congo to distinguish the two. Which leads me to a joke: Why the President of the Democratic Republic of the Congo, formerly Zaire, formerly, the Republic of the Congo-Kinshasa, formerly the Republic of the Congo-Leopoldville, formerly the Belgian Congo, formerly the Congo Free State, should change the name of his country to Kitchy-Kitchy? That way anyone who removes him from power will be known forever as the man who pulled off the Kitchy Kitchy coup. 09:32, 18 March 2009 (UTC)~ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Noel Ellis ( talk • contribs)
The country has a new coat of arms which can be found here:
http://www.presidentrdc.cd/accueil.html
Should the english name be included to the header? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.101.190.167 ( talk)
The constitution is clear on this, the 26 provinces will be in place in the 36 months after the installations of the institutions defined in it, see Article 226, also at [4].
When were the 26 provinces set up when the institutions defined in the Constitution aren't even in place considering the elections haven't gone throught yet? ---
There is no intimation from Government or any official document including the constitution that Congo DRC will be having 26 provinces. They are only 11 and will remain so for now. I am currently fixing the geographical classification data of the country with Provinces, Districts, Territories and Sectors. Anyone wish to have them is welcome. Adeelzafarbioid 03:42, 10 March 2007 (UTC)
Mbɔ́tɛ na bínó, or Mbóte na bínó - à la kinoise ;-)
I started improvements on the
Image:Congo Kinshasa Template.svg. I'd like it to be a template for most general maps on the Congo. Eventually it should be able to generate a map like
Image:Cg-map.png and its translated forms.The SVG file already contains layers with different data. The Provinces' contours currently in the file are those of
2006,
1988,
1966, and
1960. I do not have access to a map of the provinces of 1963 at the moment. I'm currently working on adding major cities. I'd like to add the same Geo data as the CIA WorldBook map (latitude and longitude, scale, labels, Congo river) and maybe more for more detailed maps (rivers, territories, small cities, major roads, train tracks and resources). Please let me know if you're interested. ---
moyogo
07:26, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
The first line of the section on recent conflicts reads: Since 1994, the Congo has been rent by ethnic strife and civil war, touched off by a massive inflow of refugees fleeing the Rwandan Genocide. This sentence might easily contain the addendum, "which they participated in". Most Western readers will interpret this, as currently worded, to imply that the victims of the Rwandan genocide are thr refugees who touched off strife. In fact, the refugees are the Hutu Power government and Interahamwe militia who planned and commited the genocide, as while as anyone they could bully or trick into crossing the border with them. One wouldn't want an article on the Nuremburg trials to read "Many victims of World War II were hanged at Nuremberg", even though that might in the strictest sense be true. I suggest a change reflecing the fact that the refugees were largely from the groups participating in the genocide and that much of the "ethnic strife" they touched off was a continuation of their genocidal politics.
According to Book of the Year2006(Encyclopaedia Britannica), Official languages:"French, English" This is an error. http://www.britannica.com/nations/Congo,-Democratic-Republic-Of-The
Why does the DRC article have two sections, "Political divisions" and "Administrative divisions", both providing similar information?
The only content in the former is "Main article: Political divisions of the Democratic Republic of the Congo", which takes you to a text beginning "The administrative hierarchy of Political subdivisions in the Democratic Republic of the Congo is as follows:". Anyone oppose merging these two sections? Kahuzi 16:49, 29 August 2006 (UTC)
There are a lot of glaring grammatical errors in the article that make it extremely hard to read.
"The chopping tools and choppers are estimated to date back to before -200,000 years [200,000 years ago or 200,000 BCE], though we cannot be more specific today [?? what does that mean??]. The country was peopled in very ancient times by groups of hunter-collectors, some of them maybe ancestors of today's pygmies. In the large time period between the earliest hunter-gatherer inhabitants and the coming of the first villagers, Congo will always [will always be? should it be "was settled"?] be settled by various stone knapping nomad groups of different Traditions."
"Formerly the Belgian colony of the Belgian Congo, the country's post-independence name was changed in 1971, from Congo-Kinshasa (after its capital, to distinguish it from the Republic of Congo, or Congo-Brazzaville) to Zaire, until 1997. Since 1998, the country has suffered greatly from the devastating Second Congo War (sometimes referred to as the African World War[2][3]), the world's deadliest conflict since World War II."
I will return and try and correct some of these errors, but all in all I think this article needs to be tagged as not up to WIki's quality standards. If anyone knows how to, please do so.
Would be great to include the old ways of greeting in French that were taught the indigenous, e.g. the first two or three lessons on how to greet or introduce oneself. It is practically the didactic language (sorry, didnt know how best to contribute). --- User:147.142.186.54
The location map shows a very old map of the world, with Austria-Hungary and the German Empire among others, and so shows the DRC as part of Belgium. The map is currently being used in other articles as a map for the Congo Free State, so I don't think another map should be uploaded unless there isn't one already. So does anyone know if there is a modern-day map with the DRC highlighted? (And, if possible, one with the new border between Serbia and Montenegro?) Thank you! - Lewis R « т · c » 19:23, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
In my ongoing efforts to try to include every country on the planet included in the scope of a WikiProject, I have proposed a new project on Middle Africa at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals#Middle Africa whose scope would include the Democratic Republic of the Congo. Any interested parties are more than welcome to add their names there, so we can see if there is enough interest to start such a project. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 16:35, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
Belgian Congo mines supplied the uranium for the Hiroshima bomb but not the Nagasaki bomb because the latter was a plutonium weapon.
the table header is misleading. The French and Dutch names are the same as the Congolese ones. What is indicated are the pre-independence or pre-zairianisation names. Please adjust accordingly. -- moyogo 21:13, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
I'm replacing the table showing the major cities. It misleads to think the Congolese column names are used in Congolese languages, French column names are used in French, and that Dutch is used in the country. Such a table should be in a History pages not in a section displaying a liste of current major cities. Or is should be clearer. -- moyogo 00:15, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
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I'll move this table to the History Page, and change the column headings to make it clearer. Kahuzi 19:18, 21 February 2007 (UTC) Bold text
Should articles on DRC include the word "The" in their title? I'm thinking of National Assembly of the Democratic Republic of the Congo and others which have recently been moved. Personally I think yes they should, as this is what english speakers normally say (despite the general ban on articles in wikipedia). What do others think? AndrewRT( Talk) 21:09, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
I would like to add this article to one of your country's categories, but I can't decide which one. I notice everything has been neatly organised and I don't want to drop it somewhere arbitrary. Can someone help out? Bards 22:46, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
In regards to Congolese pre-colonial history, is it true that cannibalism was rampant? The only reliable accounts I can think of are those of the Begian government- well, if they really did have to deal with eliminating it during colonization- so what's the consensus on this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.5.136.64 ( talk) 01:07, August 27, 2007 (UTC)
Not at all. The cannibalization myth was first promulgated by King Leopold in an effort portray himself as the harbinger of civilization to barbaric peoples. There's no historical basis for this.
<!-Autosigned by A-M.w.e.z-->
I absolutely don't want to demean the situation in the Congo, obviously it's atrocious and something needs to be done about it, and immediately. But in the interests of accuracy and clarity: "This period of conflict has been the bloodiest in history since World War II.[10] Almost four million people have died as a result of the fighting." Almost four million, which is probably a pretty accurate number considering the inherent inaccuracies of reporting in such messy parts of the world, is really pretty close to a reasonable estimate of the deaths resultant from the complex of American actions in Southeast Asia many of which are called "the Vietnam War", in fact it may even be a little lower. Depending on your definitions and sources, a guess about Southeast Asian deaths strictly due to American actions ranges anywhere between 2 million and 6.
Further, I checked the link given as a source, and all it did was simply state the assertion "bloodiest conflict since WWII", at least in the part of the article not requiring subscription. I get that a statement made in the Economist is generally regarded as of sufficient reliability for inclusion in a Wiki article, but I wouldn't be so credulous. While the Congo situation is among a teeny handful of the worst, and may indeed be the worst, I think we should be a little more careful in making bold and certain claims. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jammoe ( talk • contribs) 04:48, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
There is a debate on categories for discussion about whether it is appropriate to use "Democratic Republic of the Congo" as an adjective. For example, it is ok to refer to "Democratic Republic of the Congo writers," or should they be called "Writers of the Democratic Republic of the Congo." If you have an opinion on or information about this matter, please comment here. Thank you. LeSnail ( talk) 17:59, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
The article currently says, "Then-President Mobutu renamed the country Zaire, from a Portuguese mispronunciation of the Kikongo word nzere or nzadi, which translates to "the river that swallows all rivers." There is a citation for this claim, but how can either of these quite short words possibly translate into such a complex concept as "the river that swallows all rivers"??? Anyone more familiar with Kikongo? 65.183.135.231 ( talk) 16:31, 30 October 2008 (UTC)
"The earliest evidence further to the west is known in Cameroon, and near to the small town of Bouar in Central Africa. Though further studies are needed to establish a better chronology for the start of iron production in Central Africa, the Cameroonian data places iron smelting north of the Equatorial Forest around 2,600 BC to 2,500 BC ."
How can the claims of this article with regards to iron smelting be reconciled with the article History of ferrous metallurgy? If these claims are right, then the peoples of the Congo would have invented iron smelting and forging a thousand years before any other civilization of the world. 87.78.252.88 ( talk) 12:33, 16 November 2008 (UTC)
I think that is a non-issue. We can't actually pinpoint the invention of metallurgy within a thousand years anyway, can we?
I notice this huge gap in the "history" section. Why are we ignoring the period of European imperialism? Surely something happened, and surely Belgian colonists kept records, so I don't see why it is omitted, especially when colonialism is what created the atmosphere that is causing the war today. Perhaps it used to be their but someone deleted it? Special:Contributions/x ( talk) 08:53, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Is there a reason that the opening does not mention that the country was formerly called Zaire? 136.152.180.121 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:36, 18 March 2009 (UTC).
History: The Belgian Congo. After Belgian administration for 52 years (including two World Wars when Belgium was occupied by Germany for a total of eight years) the Congo was poorly developed and faced independence with few people experienced in administration and a large unproductive public service. With the neighbouring French colonies progressing towards independence Belgium agreed to quit the Congo in 1960. French President Charles de Gaulle made a speech in Brazzaville, French Congo saying that the French colonies could have independence whenever they wanted it. The Congolese on the other side of the river in the Belgian Congo insisted on the same. But the only thing the local politician agreed on was that they wanted immediate independence. The Republic of the Congo (Leopoldville). Because the former French Moyen (Middle) Congo gained independence as the Congo (Brazzaville) in the same year, the ex-Belgian Congo was referred to as the Congo (Leopoldville). The new nation was beset by rebellion and disunity. The only national-wide political party was the Mouvement Populaire Congolaise, led by Patrice Lumumba who became Prime Minister. His main rival, Joseph Kassavubu of the predominantly KiKongo Akabo party, was named as President in an attempt to achieve national unity. Most parties were locally based and primarily tribal in identity. Rivalry between Lumumba and Kasavubu led to the President and Prime Minister both trying to dismiss each other, and calls for outside assistance to hold the country together in face of provincial secession and army mutiny. Belgian forces remained in the country after independence, and a failure to promote native Congolese to positions of command in the colonial Force Publique, renamed the Armée National Congolaise (ANC), led to a mutiny by Congolese soldiers against their Belgian officers and widespread disorder throughout the country. The Katanga Secession In the southern province of Katanga (later Shaba region) Belgian forces disarmed and removed mutinous ANC forces leaving control in the hands of provincial premier Moises Tshombe. He had favoured a federal system of government and when this was not granted used his local power base to oppose the central government in Leopoldville, as well as rival governments at Stanleyville (now Kisangani). He was assisted by the white settlers in Katanga and foreign mercenary volunteers from South Africa and the neighbouring Federation of Rhodesia and Nyasaland. French and Belgian military interests were also represented with considerable financial backing from the Union Minière du Haut Katanga who benefited from the absence of central government control in the mineral-rich province. Independence was declared 11 July 1960 until 15 January 1963 when United Nations forces aided the Congolese central government regain control. The success of the Katanga secession also inspired Albert Kalonji to declare himself King of the South Kasai Mining State (1961-62). At the same time as he continued to hold a seat in the central Parliament. The Congo Crisis. A former sergeant in the Force Publique turned journalist, Joseph Mobutu, organised a counter-coup against Prime Minister Lumumba who was detained at his residence under U.N. protection. Lumumba attempted to flee to Stanleyville where his supporters had formed a rival administration, but was captured by Mobutu, who handed him over to Moises Tshombe's Katanganese regime. After suffering at the hands of both Mobutu's and Tshombe's bullyboys, Patrice Lumumba was reported dead in 1961, supposedly shot by tribesmen while fleeing. Eventually a government at Leopoldville was formed suitable to Lumumba's MPC supporters, and U.N. forces and international pressure forced the end of the Katanga secession January 1963. The Simba Uprisings. No sooner were the U.N. forces withdrawn than the Congo had to face a new problem: widespread uprisings in the name of Lumumba. The insurgents rapidly overrun the eastern part of the country, capturing Stanleyville 1964 and taking white residents hostages. President Kasavubu formed a strong government to deal with this problem by inviting back the former secessionist leader Moises Tshombe to head a new administration, known as the Democratic Republic of the Congo. To combat the rebels Tshombe used the means he had used so successfully before: white mercenaries from South Africa, Rhodesia, and Europe. With these forces, and Belgian paratroops and American planes, Stanleyville was recaptured and the revolt suppressed. With the rebel threat gone, President Kasavubu dismissed P.M. Tshombe in 1965 shortly before he himself was overthrown in a coup by Joseph Mobutu. The Mercenaries and the Stanleyville Uprisings. Most of the mercenaries failed to support an uprising in 1966 by Katanganese gendarmes at Stanleyville (the First Stanleyville Revolt or Katanganese Mutiny), calling for the restoration of Tshombe. After dealing with the Katanganese, Mobutu began making plans to get rid of the foreign mercenaries in the country. Belatedly the mercenaries seized Stanleyville in the Second Stanleyville revolt, or Mercenaries Mutiny, in July 1967. While they had the military advantage, they lacked political support and suffered a setback because a key player, the exiled premier Tshombe, was kidnapped 30 June and taken to Algeria, where he reportedly died in 1968. An invasion from Portuguese Angola by mercenaries under Frenchman Robert Denard came too late to save the main body who retreated from Stanleyville to Bukavu in August under Col. Jean (`Black Jack’) Schrame, a gay Belgian-planter turned mercenary. From their stronghold on Lake Kivu they resisted the Congolese army before evacuating to Rwanda across the lake with about 1,000 Katanganese in October 1967. Although the Congolese government called for their extradition, the mercenaries were eventually repatriated to Europe in 1968. Noel Ellis ( talk) 00:53, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm just curious, why no mention of health or the AIDS/HIV pandemic? Didn't the first confirmed case of HIV-disease take place in Kinshasa? What about Ebola? This nation is of extreme interest to outsiders, among other reasons, because of its pivotal role in the development of new diseases and pandemics. Is there a reason these have not been added to the article? Am I missing something? If not, perhaps I shall show some initiative, God forbid, and add some content myself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Adamacious ( talk • contribs) 22:35, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
PLEASE RENOUNCE WEAPS AND RAE —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
QazimA (
talk •
contribs)
22:12, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
Someone looking at this page can help out with the deletion discussion of this person from the DR of the Congo ... here. Thanks.-- Epeefleche ( talk) 17:59, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
Some historical material is POV, and seems to be written with the explicit intentions of portraying "evil white men and poor natives". While there is solid and indisputable proof that there is much to be ashamed of in the colonial era, it should still be treated with a scientific and objective mind. 94.220.254.186 ( talk) 04:34, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
As I continue reading there are plenty of other instances of POV, odd statements, paragraphs with fargoing content backed by a single reference. Other oddities include the claim "In 2009 people in the Congo may still be dying at a rate of an estimated 45,000 per month". Well, duh: That makes roughly half a million a year. The total population is claimed at 68 million, which with any reasonable estimate of average life expectancy makes the number low and entirely unremarkable. 94.220.254.186 ( talk) 04:55, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
"1.5.2 International Community Response" is extremely POV. I don't like the use of the words "incommensurate" (I'd say it has pejorative connotations), "effective" or "little will". -- The Fwanksta ( talk) 00:27, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
This table includes a blank column. Is there a reason? Varlaam ( talk) 02:52, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
There are not enough editors who are from the DRC to confirm the information in this article.--Gniniv ( talk) 04:55, 12 September 2010 (UTC)
The opening paragraph states the coastline is 37km long, the second paragraph gives the length of coastline as 40km. Which is correct?
Religion | English WP | French WP | German WP | Difference | Encyclopaedia Universalis (rec. 1980) |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
christian | (90%)* | 50% | (80%)* | 50-90% | (94.5%)* * = calculated |
catholic | 55% | 50% | 48.4% | ||
protestant | 35% incl. kimbanguist | 20% | 29.0% | ||
kimbanguist | (included in protestant) | 15% | 10% | (17.1%) sectes chrétiennes africaines | |
muslim | 5% | 15% | 10% | 5-15% | 1.4% |
animist | 2.4% | 20% | 10% | 2.4-20% | 3.4% |
-- Eruedin ( talk) 15:43, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
les élection es que kabila reusirra? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
208.95.113.148 (
talk)
16:17, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
Answer: Yes it is, the neighbouring Republic of Congo (not to be confused) has Kia Ora as it's national drink.
— Preceding
unsigned comment added by
80.42.150.86 (
talk)
14:14, 13 August 2011 (UTC)
Congo is the second largest country in Africa after Algeria, not the largest. Mightymights ( talk) 17:02, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
Congo-Kinshasa and Congo-Brazaville are historical names; they are also names which are used informally in the capital cities of the two countries, probably because the people who live there think they represent the whole country. It's pretty similar to people in London, or Paris, who think they represent the whole of their respective countries. However, those names are not the official names of any country in present times. It's not even open to discussion really. This is an encyclopaedia - and the names of the two countries are The Democratic Republic of the Congo and The Republic of the Congo (with or without "the") and nothing else. We are going into dangerous territory if we think we can change things. Remember, Wikipedia is used by millions of people as a primary reference. Francis Hannaway 08:06, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
Agree with Moyogo. There is no consensus to be making these changes to use an unwieldy official name. Wikipedia practice is to use common names. Everyking ( talk) 15:21, 25 October 2011 (UTC)
Maybe some useful info here. Lugnuts ( talk) 13:55, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ipXVKU789GdE5omsWQN4h5o0nPXw?docId=700127f6203d4a7f82be1bf20e0122c6 http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/03/congo-democratic-election-reject-idUSL5E7N30DZ20111203
I'm going to do some preliminary edits to the history, maybe we could get a veteran in here to help me out.
Whalen207 ( talk) 03:38, 4 December 2011
Much as people might wish - especially the armchair politicians amongst us - Joseph Kabila is the incumbent president. More than that; he is de facto president because he's still the boss of everything. Therefore, Étienne Tshisekedi's name has no place - even as disputed president - in this article. Francis Hannaway 18:56, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
I think under political crisis 1960-1965 the name 'Danny Ndungu' is incorrect. I can't find any Danny Ndungu references online. Does anyone know who he is? The name use also seems inconsistent. Thanks. JimReaperX ( talk) 19:18, 11 March 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by JimReaperX ( talk • contribs) 19:15, 11 March 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. DrKiernan ( talk) 18:19, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
Democratic Republic of the Congo → Democratic Republic of Congo
Per WP:POVTITLE. Wikipedia practice is to use common names.
BBC, CNN, AL English, NY times and others all use "Democratic Republic of Congo":
Mightymights ( talk) 20:36, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: page not moved. Arbitrarily0 ( talk) 17:03, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
Democratic Republic of the Congo → DR Congo – By far the most widely used name of this country is simply "Congo," so the current title certainly isn't the common one. For example, it's "Congo" in this New York Times profile. Very few countries on Wiki are titled under an extended constitutional name of this kind. Presumably the reason it is done this way is to disambiguate this subject from the Republic of the Congo. If so, this is a poor form of disambiguation since the two names are still confusingly similar. Kauffner ( talk) 13:33, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
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