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This part of the article is lacking in citations and puts forth some pretty bold statements that definitely requires some backing up (specifically, I'm referring to "The Guru discovered that from reading the Ad Granth the Sikhs became feeble-hearted. Therefore (said the Guru), I myself will prepare such a Granth that the Sikhs from reading it will learn the art of ruling, the use of weapons, and other skills so that they will become fit for warfare; so from that very day he began the compositions of a huge volume, and when it was completed on Sunday, on the eighth day of the new moon in the month of Bhadon 1753 Bikrami (1696) he named it "The Granth of the Tenth Sovereign.").
For all I know, this information may have been derived from legitimate sources. But, the source should be made explicitly clear so people can verify it for themselves. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.228.135.31 ( talk) 16:37, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
IP: 70.66.40.224
Please stop. If you continue to
vandalize Wikipedia, you will be
blocked from editing.
This article in its [ current version] makes extraordinary claims that the text called "Dasam Granth" or "Daven Padshah Da Granth" is entirely written by Sikh Guru Gobind Singh. This is POV propaganda of a certain group of people. There is no consensus on this issue among the historians. A deeper digging of the issue shows that renowned historians have expressed the view that only a small part of this text could have been written by Sikh Guru Gobind Singh. Furthermore, this text has no coherent content and is circulating in various different forms currently. Its wikipedia policy that "extra-ordinary" claims need extra-ordinary evidences to support them on wikipedia. That aside, this claim does not even has any verifiability. The Shiromani Gurudwara Prabandhak Committee had issued "hukamnama" specifically stating that this text is not to be considered "holy" or "sacred" or placed at par with Guru Granth Sahib, therefore, its wrong to call it holy or sacred. The importance of the text is just for the sake of history and research at the present. Please do not make wikipedia a victim of your blind and baseless beliefs and do not try to generalize your POV as the belief of the entire Sikh population. If you disagree, feel free to discuss your points here. Regards, -- RoadAhead Discuss 18:26, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
It has become a trend to jump into controversies by saying things based on hearsay. The subject of Dasam Granth has become a victim of this too.
One with the name of Daljit Singh was the first person to write against Bhai Mani Singh letter in 1991. Apart from Daljit Singh (who was not even a Sikh historian but a physician by profession) all Sikh historians support the letter. (Ref: http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhai-mani-singh-letter-analysis-dr-harbhajan-singh.html)
This is not true. The first person to argue against the authenticity of the 'Bhai Mani Singh Letter' was Prof Rattan Singh Jaggi whose PhD thesis at Punjabi University Patiala was focused on the authorship of Dasam Granth during mid-sixties. This was later published in book form entitled 'Dasam Granth da Krititav' (Authorship of Dasam Granth). As an expert on the ancient Gurmukhi scripts he argued that:
1.Unlike the practice of writing sentences with no spaces between words the said letter had words separated as done at present. 2. The writing had been done using a metallic nib that had been invented only during the first decade of the nineteenth century nealy a hundred years after the period claimed for the letter writing. Incidentally, metallic nib had been invented in Birmingham in England around 1805. 3. The shapes of Gurmukhi characters in the purported letter are closer to their modern shape than to that prevalent in early eithgteenth century. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Anandpuria ( talk • contribs) 14:22, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
There is no such edict by SGPC. In fact SGPC has no right to issue hukamnamas. However in 2006 Akal Takhat had passed an edict declaring those speaking against Dasam Granth as mischievous miscreants. Please see that edict here http://sridasamgranth.com/#/dasamgranthhukumnamanov200/4528978466).
Most Sikh historians like Dr. Ganda Singh, Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha, Dr. Taran Singh, Principal Satbir Singh, Kapur Singh, Prof Sahib Singh, Dr. Kirpal Singh etc agree that the complete Dasam Granth was penned by tenth Sikh Guru. Many articles written by these historians are posted on http://www.patshahi10.org
Interestingly there was no debate on the authorship before 1980s. Bhag Singh Ambala was the first person to cast doubts on the authorship and he was excommunicated from Sikhism (Ref: http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhagsingh.html).
Hence the onus is on those detractors, who are carried by baseless propaganda, to come up with references for their preposterous claims.
Gurmatscholar (
talk) 19:55, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
ਕਿਤੇ ਕਿਸਨ ਸੇ ਕੀਟ ਕੋਟੈ ਉਪਾਏ, ਉਸਾਰੇ ਗੜੇ ਫਿਰ ਮੇਟੇ ਬਨਾਏ॥
I challenge anyone to find the page on which this is on. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SKRON ( talk • contribs) 03:15, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
One or more portions of this article duplicated other source(s). The material was copied from: http://www.dasamgranth.org/dasamgranth/glory.shtml and http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhaimanisinghletter.html Infringing material has been removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a license compatible with GFDL. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.) For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use external websites as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 01:00, 21 December 2008 (UTC)
Content deleted from article and reproduced here:
On 20 February, 2000, at Gobind Sadan, Virsa Singh released the first complete Punjabi translation of the writings of Guru Gobind Singh, plus other scholarly works about the life and teachings of Guru Gobind Singh. "Jaap Sahib" "Tawprasad Sawayeya" and "Kabiobach Bainty Chawpaye" are compulsory for reciting in nitnem of a Khalsa (baptised Sikh) every morning. These writings are also recited during Sikh baptism.
Problems:
-- Roadahead ★ 21:01, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
The following added by an editor contains Punjabi copied pasted from http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhai-mani-singh-letter-analysis-dr-harbhajan-singh.html
ਸਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਸੈ ਅਠਤ੍ਰੈ ਸਾਲ. ਪੰਥ ਇਕਠਾ ਭਯੋ ਬਿਸਾਲ....
ਇਕ ਦਿਨ ਆਗਿਆ ਪੰਥ ਕੀ ਮਨੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਪਾਇ.
ਬਾਣੀ ਦਸਮੇਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਕੀ ਸੰਗ੍ਰਹਿ ਕਰ ਧਰ ਭਾਇ. 20.
ਏਕ ਜਿਲਦ ਮੈ ਕੀਨੀ ਕਰ ਹੈ. ਤਿਸ ਕਾ ਭੋਗ ਹਕਾਇਤ ਪਰ ਹੈ.
(ਗਿਆਨੀ ਗਿਆਨ ਸਿੰਘ. ਪੰਥ ਪ੍ਰਕਾਸ਼)
One day in 1778 Bikrami (1721 AD) the panth got together...
Bhai Mani Singh accepted the orders of the panth
And he collected the banees of the Dasam Guru.
Compiled in one bind (the beerh) ends at Hikayat
(Giani Gian Singh, Panth Parkash. Page 305)
Problems:
-- Roadahead ★ 22:19, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
Gurmatscholar ( talk) 22:26, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
In these lines there no mention of British visit to Ludhiana, but clear mention of "Asal dasam gurwala Granth" (the real granth of tenth guru) and ghallughara (holocaust). What publication of this work are you reading?ਅਸਲ ਦਸਮ ਗੁਰਵਾਲਾ ਗਰੰਥ ।ਰਹਿਤ ਿਬ੍ਰੱਧ ਦਲ ਮੈਂ ਮੱਧ ਪੰਥ ।
ਘਲੂਘਾਰਾ ਜਬ ਵੱਡ ਭਯੋ ।ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੁਰਾਨੀ ਸਿਹ ਸੋ ਲੀਉ ।
ਅਬ ਸੋ ਹੈ ਕਾਬਲ ਮੱਧ ਜਾਨੋ ।ਬੜੀ ਧਰਮਸ਼ਾਲਾ ਮੈਂ ਮਾਨੋ ।
I have just removed the following, thus emptying the External links section
I really couldn't care less which link we supply (apart from those linking to booksellers) but we do not need links to umpteen versions of similar material and this looks like spammed stuff. Please read WP:EL and gain consensus here for the inclusion of just one appropriate link. - Sitush ( talk) 09:04, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
The structure section is mainly unsourced and is making claims with no evidence. It also includes writings found in no varient of Dasam Granth. CanadianSingh1469 ( talk) 00:37, 6 October 2021 (UTC)
Why do we need pages for each of the 17 (excluding Zafarnama) constituent texts and further constituents thereof? All of these articles are downright shabby with no sources that pass WP:RS (and WP:HISTRS) and there is nil scope to get anything more than a decent stub/start-class article either. Here, at this page, all of them can be covered in the proper context: the constituents are interlinked. I have the same opinion for our page on the History of Dasam Granth. TrangaBellam ( talk) 10:40, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 12:08, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
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|
![]() | The contents of the Bachittar Natak page were merged into Dasam Granth on 18 March 2023. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
![]() | The contents of the Chandi Charitar II page were merged into Dasam Granth on 18 March 2023. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
![]() | The contents of the Das Granthi page were merged into Dasam Granth on 18 March 2023. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
![]() | The contents of the Tav-Prasad Savaiye page were merged into Dasam Granth on 26 December 2022. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
![]() | The contents of the Ugardanti page were merged into Dasam Granth on 26 December 2022. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
This part of the article is lacking in citations and puts forth some pretty bold statements that definitely requires some backing up (specifically, I'm referring to "The Guru discovered that from reading the Ad Granth the Sikhs became feeble-hearted. Therefore (said the Guru), I myself will prepare such a Granth that the Sikhs from reading it will learn the art of ruling, the use of weapons, and other skills so that they will become fit for warfare; so from that very day he began the compositions of a huge volume, and when it was completed on Sunday, on the eighth day of the new moon in the month of Bhadon 1753 Bikrami (1696) he named it "The Granth of the Tenth Sovereign.").
For all I know, this information may have been derived from legitimate sources. But, the source should be made explicitly clear so people can verify it for themselves. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.228.135.31 ( talk) 16:37, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
IP: 70.66.40.224
Please stop. If you continue to
vandalize Wikipedia, you will be
blocked from editing.
This article in its [ current version] makes extraordinary claims that the text called "Dasam Granth" or "Daven Padshah Da Granth" is entirely written by Sikh Guru Gobind Singh. This is POV propaganda of a certain group of people. There is no consensus on this issue among the historians. A deeper digging of the issue shows that renowned historians have expressed the view that only a small part of this text could have been written by Sikh Guru Gobind Singh. Furthermore, this text has no coherent content and is circulating in various different forms currently. Its wikipedia policy that "extra-ordinary" claims need extra-ordinary evidences to support them on wikipedia. That aside, this claim does not even has any verifiability. The Shiromani Gurudwara Prabandhak Committee had issued "hukamnama" specifically stating that this text is not to be considered "holy" or "sacred" or placed at par with Guru Granth Sahib, therefore, its wrong to call it holy or sacred. The importance of the text is just for the sake of history and research at the present. Please do not make wikipedia a victim of your blind and baseless beliefs and do not try to generalize your POV as the belief of the entire Sikh population. If you disagree, feel free to discuss your points here. Regards, -- RoadAhead Discuss 18:26, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
It has become a trend to jump into controversies by saying things based on hearsay. The subject of Dasam Granth has become a victim of this too.
One with the name of Daljit Singh was the first person to write against Bhai Mani Singh letter in 1991. Apart from Daljit Singh (who was not even a Sikh historian but a physician by profession) all Sikh historians support the letter. (Ref: http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhai-mani-singh-letter-analysis-dr-harbhajan-singh.html)
This is not true. The first person to argue against the authenticity of the 'Bhai Mani Singh Letter' was Prof Rattan Singh Jaggi whose PhD thesis at Punjabi University Patiala was focused on the authorship of Dasam Granth during mid-sixties. This was later published in book form entitled 'Dasam Granth da Krititav' (Authorship of Dasam Granth). As an expert on the ancient Gurmukhi scripts he argued that:
1.Unlike the practice of writing sentences with no spaces between words the said letter had words separated as done at present. 2. The writing had been done using a metallic nib that had been invented only during the first decade of the nineteenth century nealy a hundred years after the period claimed for the letter writing. Incidentally, metallic nib had been invented in Birmingham in England around 1805. 3. The shapes of Gurmukhi characters in the purported letter are closer to their modern shape than to that prevalent in early eithgteenth century. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Anandpuria ( talk • contribs) 14:22, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
There is no such edict by SGPC. In fact SGPC has no right to issue hukamnamas. However in 2006 Akal Takhat had passed an edict declaring those speaking against Dasam Granth as mischievous miscreants. Please see that edict here http://sridasamgranth.com/#/dasamgranthhukumnamanov200/4528978466).
Most Sikh historians like Dr. Ganda Singh, Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha, Dr. Taran Singh, Principal Satbir Singh, Kapur Singh, Prof Sahib Singh, Dr. Kirpal Singh etc agree that the complete Dasam Granth was penned by tenth Sikh Guru. Many articles written by these historians are posted on http://www.patshahi10.org
Interestingly there was no debate on the authorship before 1980s. Bhag Singh Ambala was the first person to cast doubts on the authorship and he was excommunicated from Sikhism (Ref: http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhagsingh.html).
Hence the onus is on those detractors, who are carried by baseless propaganda, to come up with references for their preposterous claims.
Gurmatscholar (
talk) 19:55, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
ਕਿਤੇ ਕਿਸਨ ਸੇ ਕੀਟ ਕੋਟੈ ਉਪਾਏ, ਉਸਾਰੇ ਗੜੇ ਫਿਰ ਮੇਟੇ ਬਨਾਏ॥
I challenge anyone to find the page on which this is on. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SKRON ( talk • contribs) 03:15, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
One or more portions of this article duplicated other source(s). The material was copied from: http://www.dasamgranth.org/dasamgranth/glory.shtml and http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhaimanisinghletter.html Infringing material has been removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a license compatible with GFDL. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.) For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use external websites as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. -- Moonriddengirl (talk) 01:00, 21 December 2008 (UTC)
Content deleted from article and reproduced here:
On 20 February, 2000, at Gobind Sadan, Virsa Singh released the first complete Punjabi translation of the writings of Guru Gobind Singh, plus other scholarly works about the life and teachings of Guru Gobind Singh. "Jaap Sahib" "Tawprasad Sawayeya" and "Kabiobach Bainty Chawpaye" are compulsory for reciting in nitnem of a Khalsa (baptised Sikh) every morning. These writings are also recited during Sikh baptism.
Problems:
-- Roadahead ★ 21:01, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
The following added by an editor contains Punjabi copied pasted from http://www.santsipahi.org/patshahi10/bhai-mani-singh-letter-analysis-dr-harbhajan-singh.html
ਸਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਸੈ ਅਠਤ੍ਰੈ ਸਾਲ. ਪੰਥ ਇਕਠਾ ਭਯੋ ਬਿਸਾਲ....
ਇਕ ਦਿਨ ਆਗਿਆ ਪੰਥ ਕੀ ਮਨੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਪਾਇ.
ਬਾਣੀ ਦਸਮੇਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਕੀ ਸੰਗ੍ਰਹਿ ਕਰ ਧਰ ਭਾਇ. 20.
ਏਕ ਜਿਲਦ ਮੈ ਕੀਨੀ ਕਰ ਹੈ. ਤਿਸ ਕਾ ਭੋਗ ਹਕਾਇਤ ਪਰ ਹੈ.
(ਗਿਆਨੀ ਗਿਆਨ ਸਿੰਘ. ਪੰਥ ਪ੍ਰਕਾਸ਼)
One day in 1778 Bikrami (1721 AD) the panth got together...
Bhai Mani Singh accepted the orders of the panth
And he collected the banees of the Dasam Guru.
Compiled in one bind (the beerh) ends at Hikayat
(Giani Gian Singh, Panth Parkash. Page 305)
Problems:
-- Roadahead ★ 22:19, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
Gurmatscholar ( talk) 22:26, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
In these lines there no mention of British visit to Ludhiana, but clear mention of "Asal dasam gurwala Granth" (the real granth of tenth guru) and ghallughara (holocaust). What publication of this work are you reading?ਅਸਲ ਦਸਮ ਗੁਰਵਾਲਾ ਗਰੰਥ ।ਰਹਿਤ ਿਬ੍ਰੱਧ ਦਲ ਮੈਂ ਮੱਧ ਪੰਥ ।
ਘਲੂਘਾਰਾ ਜਬ ਵੱਡ ਭਯੋ ।ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੁਰਾਨੀ ਸਿਹ ਸੋ ਲੀਉ ।
ਅਬ ਸੋ ਹੈ ਕਾਬਲ ਮੱਧ ਜਾਨੋ ।ਬੜੀ ਧਰਮਸ਼ਾਲਾ ਮੈਂ ਮਾਨੋ ।
I have just removed the following, thus emptying the External links section
I really couldn't care less which link we supply (apart from those linking to booksellers) but we do not need links to umpteen versions of similar material and this looks like spammed stuff. Please read WP:EL and gain consensus here for the inclusion of just one appropriate link. - Sitush ( talk) 09:04, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
The structure section is mainly unsourced and is making claims with no evidence. It also includes writings found in no varient of Dasam Granth. CanadianSingh1469 ( talk) 00:37, 6 October 2021 (UTC)
Why do we need pages for each of the 17 (excluding Zafarnama) constituent texts and further constituents thereof? All of these articles are downright shabby with no sources that pass WP:RS (and WP:HISTRS) and there is nil scope to get anything more than a decent stub/start-class article either. Here, at this page, all of them can be covered in the proper context: the constituents are interlinked. I have the same opinion for our page on the History of Dasam Granth. TrangaBellam ( talk) 10:40, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 12:08, 4 June 2023 (UTC)