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"In Norse mythology, the Svartalfar or the black elves (but literally "swart elves")" In modern scandinavian languages, "svart" means black, "swart" is the true cognate, but I would think black would be a better translation. (Unless someone would correct me with usages from old norse. I only know the modern scandinavian languages, such as swedish, dansih and norwegian.)
Actually 'swart' is still in use (outside of 'swarthy' even), it may not be as common as dark or back, but anyone with half a brain knows what it means, and you'd find it in any dictionary. I have myself heard folk use it in every day speach, maybe it is a northern thing but the word is by no means dead! Sigurd Dragon Slayer ( talk) 15:37, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
"Swart" is a known word (and one I tend to like), but the only 20th century place I've seen it is in Tolkien. 66.20.170.4 ( talk) 13:48, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
In the Silmarillion it explains that one of the elves lives in a small forest seperate from the others, and the trees hardly let light through. The elf who lived here was called a dark elf due to living in the shade, not due to skin color. I don't have the book on hand...
dark elves can be seen as the counterparts of the blonde elves, that being, dark elves lower then low elves, as blonde elves are higher then high elves. maybe this paralel should have a sentence in the article?-- Lygophile 05:44, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
The Orkneys and Shetlands have a more Nordic than Gaelic heritage, surely? Given that I think they're much more likely to be related to trolls than to anything in Gaelic folklore, just as trow suggests. — Ashley Y 02:42, 2005 Jun 2 (UTC)
Yes, I agree. In fact, I'd really like to see some evidence to back up the connection of trow and "black elves", drow and "dark elves" that's made here. It seems very like it's just being made out of convenience, with nothing to back it up. The whole section could do with a rewrite. Thorf 15:05, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
all three of you need to look for the facts. In Matthew Bison's Rule Book version 7.2 it is put very clear that 'Drow' are the male species of dark elves, not trolls. i bet you guys still play with six sided dice. what dorks... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mammy0088 ( talk • contribs) 05:45, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
i dont think the night elves should be on this list. they are less dark then the wood-elves in warhammer. the're just nocturnal wood elves, not dark elves. also bloodelves are no dark elves. they arent necessarily evil, they just changed their plot to have an elven race added to the horde, and most elven kindred would distrust and dislike the blood elves for sure, being greedy and delving in the forbidden magic, but they arent evil. they would at worst be neutral.-- Lygophile 05:15, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
Is there any ordering in both the "Dark elves in fiction" and "Famous Dark Elves in fiction" sections? It seems to me all the entries are just randomly placed after each other. Perhaps a alphabetical ordering would be nicer? -- Mighty Jay 18:35, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
How about adding Michael Moorcock`s Elric to fictional dark elves? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Guzzleguts ( talk • contribs).
Dark elf → Dark elves — after much research the light elves and dark elves are plural in original Eddic texts, they hardly ever travel alone and the original Norse word is plural. There are existing redirects the admin will need to clear. I cannot move the pages myself without hurting the page histories. Thank you for your consideration in advance. Goldenrowley 18:41, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
Moved. I have, however, marked the article for merging with svartálfar, and it is unclear to me which of those two titles is the better. Stemonitis 10:03, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
I removed the Daoi-Sith reference as the elves dont feature in celtic mythology and are norse in origin. Also the British folklore section was norse influenced in Orkney and Shetland and didnt spread to the rest of Scotland, England or Ireland. Its all a bit misleading to the reader and looks like the celtic reference is just being added for the hell of it. Blacksands 05:45, 10th May 2007 (UTC)
Also, is it really necessary to have 21 different examples of dark elves in fiction? It makes the page seem kind of messy. I reckon a fair few could be removed. Belzub 21:28, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
I also removed one of the entries for Famous Dark Elves in Fiction, namely Shadow Darkfire. The description of the character, as well as the poor formatting, spelling, and grammar of the entry implied to me that it was someone's character on Gaia Online, whom they decided to add to this page on a whim. Therefore, I thought it was safe to consider it not notable enough to be included in this list. Executor32 ( talk) 11:21, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
Because they contain practically the same information and refer back and forth to one another. I elect for Dark elves to be the main article since this is the English language wikipedia, and because "Dark elves" is the name by which the race is most commonly known. Godheval ( talk) 01:31, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
I absolutely second that. These are two different article on the exact same topic. -- Sparviere ( talk) 22:10, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
Merge. The development in modern fantasy can be mentioned in the article. Trigaranus ( talk) 17:46, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
Svartálfar has 9,930 Drow has 1,080,000 Moriquendi has 42,700 And Trow gets plenty of hits, but mostly for other things.
Redirecting searches for "Dark elf" to the item that gets the least attention, makes no sense at all. I'm going to change that. Dream Focus 17:21, 25 October 2009 (UTC)
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"In Norse mythology, the Svartalfar or the black elves (but literally "swart elves")" In modern scandinavian languages, "svart" means black, "swart" is the true cognate, but I would think black would be a better translation. (Unless someone would correct me with usages from old norse. I only know the modern scandinavian languages, such as swedish, dansih and norwegian.)
Actually 'swart' is still in use (outside of 'swarthy' even), it may not be as common as dark or back, but anyone with half a brain knows what it means, and you'd find it in any dictionary. I have myself heard folk use it in every day speach, maybe it is a northern thing but the word is by no means dead! Sigurd Dragon Slayer ( talk) 15:37, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
"Swart" is a known word (and one I tend to like), but the only 20th century place I've seen it is in Tolkien. 66.20.170.4 ( talk) 13:48, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
In the Silmarillion it explains that one of the elves lives in a small forest seperate from the others, and the trees hardly let light through. The elf who lived here was called a dark elf due to living in the shade, not due to skin color. I don't have the book on hand...
dark elves can be seen as the counterparts of the blonde elves, that being, dark elves lower then low elves, as blonde elves are higher then high elves. maybe this paralel should have a sentence in the article?-- Lygophile 05:44, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
The Orkneys and Shetlands have a more Nordic than Gaelic heritage, surely? Given that I think they're much more likely to be related to trolls than to anything in Gaelic folklore, just as trow suggests. — Ashley Y 02:42, 2005 Jun 2 (UTC)
Yes, I agree. In fact, I'd really like to see some evidence to back up the connection of trow and "black elves", drow and "dark elves" that's made here. It seems very like it's just being made out of convenience, with nothing to back it up. The whole section could do with a rewrite. Thorf 15:05, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
all three of you need to look for the facts. In Matthew Bison's Rule Book version 7.2 it is put very clear that 'Drow' are the male species of dark elves, not trolls. i bet you guys still play with six sided dice. what dorks... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mammy0088 ( talk • contribs) 05:45, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
i dont think the night elves should be on this list. they are less dark then the wood-elves in warhammer. the're just nocturnal wood elves, not dark elves. also bloodelves are no dark elves. they arent necessarily evil, they just changed their plot to have an elven race added to the horde, and most elven kindred would distrust and dislike the blood elves for sure, being greedy and delving in the forbidden magic, but they arent evil. they would at worst be neutral.-- Lygophile 05:15, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
Is there any ordering in both the "Dark elves in fiction" and "Famous Dark Elves in fiction" sections? It seems to me all the entries are just randomly placed after each other. Perhaps a alphabetical ordering would be nicer? -- Mighty Jay 18:35, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
How about adding Michael Moorcock`s Elric to fictional dark elves? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Guzzleguts ( talk • contribs).
Dark elf → Dark elves — after much research the light elves and dark elves are plural in original Eddic texts, they hardly ever travel alone and the original Norse word is plural. There are existing redirects the admin will need to clear. I cannot move the pages myself without hurting the page histories. Thank you for your consideration in advance. Goldenrowley 18:41, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
Moved. I have, however, marked the article for merging with svartálfar, and it is unclear to me which of those two titles is the better. Stemonitis 10:03, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
I removed the Daoi-Sith reference as the elves dont feature in celtic mythology and are norse in origin. Also the British folklore section was norse influenced in Orkney and Shetland and didnt spread to the rest of Scotland, England or Ireland. Its all a bit misleading to the reader and looks like the celtic reference is just being added for the hell of it. Blacksands 05:45, 10th May 2007 (UTC)
Also, is it really necessary to have 21 different examples of dark elves in fiction? It makes the page seem kind of messy. I reckon a fair few could be removed. Belzub 21:28, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
I also removed one of the entries for Famous Dark Elves in Fiction, namely Shadow Darkfire. The description of the character, as well as the poor formatting, spelling, and grammar of the entry implied to me that it was someone's character on Gaia Online, whom they decided to add to this page on a whim. Therefore, I thought it was safe to consider it not notable enough to be included in this list. Executor32 ( talk) 11:21, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
Because they contain practically the same information and refer back and forth to one another. I elect for Dark elves to be the main article since this is the English language wikipedia, and because "Dark elves" is the name by which the race is most commonly known. Godheval ( talk) 01:31, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
I absolutely second that. These are two different article on the exact same topic. -- Sparviere ( talk) 22:10, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
Merge. The development in modern fantasy can be mentioned in the article. Trigaranus ( talk) 17:46, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
Svartálfar has 9,930 Drow has 1,080,000 Moriquendi has 42,700 And Trow gets plenty of hits, but mostly for other things.
Redirecting searches for "Dark elf" to the item that gets the least attention, makes no sense at all. I'm going to change that. Dream Focus 17:21, 25 October 2009 (UTC)