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Archive 1 |
Recent gains in his shares in the America Movil group are largely responsible for his recent increase in wealth, boosting his fortune to an estimated 49.0 billion dollars compared with the estimated fortune of 59.2 billion dollars for Bill Gates.
But the Net worth in the infobox says that he's worth 67.8 billion. So which is true? I suggest that we follow Forbes Magazine's Billionaires list as a standard. Check it out here: http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/10/07billionaires_The-Worlds-Billionaires_Rank.html
-- Pavithran 15:01, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Why is this guy (User name:Diegojoven ) writheting himself in? I am not saying it is not true, I only question the relevance of "Carlos Slim also has a very close relationship with Diego Gonzalez Joven, an electrical engineering student at the St. Mary's University, Texas. Carlos Slim once said that this young talented student reminds him when he was a student at the UNAM in Mexico". What's next the name of Mr. Slim's Dog? -- LS1010 13:43, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
He said it today. I am too lazy to do it myself with referencing etc... Nick
Huh, I think he said he was putting in something like $10 bil. So not most. Dunno someone need to check that.
I have rewritten the article taking most of the information which was there already. I have also changed his photograph. I gave it some structure, and removed great tracts which are more relevant to Telmex than Carlos Slim personally, although I left some references to Telmex and monopoly charging, citing his political influences.
I also fixed some bodged formatting which had masked the paragraphs about his father. His children only get passing mentions, as more detailed information on them should be part of a Wiki entry for same
As I do not know the dates, someone needs to update the section of his directorships and achievements with information, and perhaps presenting it in a list form with from-to dates, and sorting the list into chronoligical order Ohconfucius 06:38, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
I don't see his son's name on the Altria article. -- Gbleem 17:46, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
Don't see a reason why he shouldn't be at Carlos Slim. — Cantus… ☎ 02:41, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
His full name is Carlos Slim Helú, right? And since Carlos Slim forwards to this article, I don't see a reason why it should be changed. Basseq 19:12, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
"He is also the third richest man on earth mostly because he got the Telefonos de Mexico company as a bargain from Mexican ex-president Carlos Salinas De Gortari due to their friendship, he has also made his fortune with that company charging extra fees to every family who owns a telephone in Mexico, charging a very expensive service. An example of this fraud is: An average telephone service in U.S.A. or Canada costs around 25 dollars per month, with unlimited local phone calls, when in Mexico cost around 200 pesos = 20 U.S. dollars for just 30 local calls and every extra minute is charged in the monthly bill."
This is a very negative outlook on the man, and I'd like to see sources on this information. Are he and De Gortari friends? To what extent? Has he been indicted on charges of fraud, or is this just an opinion? Did anyone take into account the fact that costs are likely more in Mexico than the US? I suggest a re-examination of this paragraph, and at least a rewrite, as the grammar is less than desirable. (e.g. "The source of most of his wealth is the telecommunications company Telefonos de Mexico, acquired at a bargain from president Carlos Salinas De Gortari, a close friend. He has attracted criticism from some for alledged gouging of telecommunications prices, as the services offered do not equal similarly-priced options in the United States.") Basseq 19:22, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
IMHO, that whole section is NPOV; I've tagged it as such. Dweekly 18:52, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
USING HIS MOTHER'S LAST NAME.
His last name is SLIM, not Helu. To refer to him as Helu or Mr. Helu is say that he is illegitimate. In Latin/Hispanic surnames there are usually two last names with NO hypen between the two last names. The first of the two last names is his father's surname which passes on to Carlos and then the second of the two last names is his mother's surname.
Why isn't he on the list in other years? he seems to have come out of no where.
I understand this now that he has been in the media. A recent AP article said his wealth increased by 19 billion last year more than anyone else and since Gates and Buffet are focusing on giving there money way there is a good chance he will be the richest man in the world. Time to use to hearing the name Carlos Slim Helu.
Addendum from a different reader: it would be interesting to demonstrate how the holdings control the various corporations. For example he controls Grupo Carso (which is "just" a holding company) which downstream controls Telmex -- however Telmex trades on its own on the Mexican and US exchanges too. A percentage of ownership at each level equates to control. I think this type of control amplifies more than direct ownership Sr. Slim's net worth as each component has escalated in value.
Is Helú a Jew? It says that his father was a Lebanese Christian (though no source is given), but we have very little information about his mother, only that she was the "daughter of [a] prosperous Mexican merchant." So is it possible that his mother was a Jew or came from a Jewish family (either Sephardi or Ashkenazi)? Do we have any more information about his ethnic/religious background or that of his mother? -- 172.146.128.109 21:11, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
Helu is Lebanese-MariaLaGitana
¿Hay algún problema si Carlos Slim Helú es judio o no? -- User: Morris237 11:41, 14 de abril del 2007 (UTC -8:00)
Es un problema decir que lo es cuando no lo es 189.141.54.43 18:30, 12 May 2007 (UTC)ZealotKommunizma
Helu is not a Jew. His family comes from a village at the very northern tip of Southern Lebanon, a town called Jezzine. He is neither a Jew nor a Turk like some ridiculous idiots keep insisting by changing his family background to Turkish or Jewish. He is a Maronite Catholic whose father was born in the area of Lebanon under Ottoman Empire occupation, this does not by any chance mean he was a Turk at all. We need to stop allowing anonymous users editing this page. Prince Cadmus II 14:28, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
As usual, Jews and turks try to make famous Lebanese arab christian belong to them, he is Lebanese Arab from both sides. He is Mexican Lebanese Arab christian and thats all!!
yeah after few days some jews will say nasser al-kharafi is jew lol!
There is more of them..almost all are Lebanese and everyone is 1st generation Mexicans. I wonder how it makes the others feel who's family has been there for generations that people can come to your country and do better than you. [1] -MariaLaGitana —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 21:31, 12 April 2007 (UTC).
Thank god Mexico is a
Jus soli country, and most people don't care much about this kind of useless questions! --
LS1010 22:36, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
Actually they're not first generation, some have been there for over 100 years.
His mother is lebanese too
Slim Haddad married Linda Helu, daughter of another prosperous Lebanese merchant, and had six children. Carlos Slim Helu was the fifth of the six children. Carlos credits his father as his mentor in business, retailing and finance. Julian Slim Haddad died in 1952 , leaving his family a moderately prosperous economic base from which Carlos launched his successful financial career.
I'm pretty sure his mother is Mexican, I guess we have to ask Slim himself??
Slim is a son of a migrant and so is Slim's wife. They migrated from Lebanon. Of course Slim and his wife were both born in Mexico so they are Lebanese Mexicans. Prince Cadmus II 14:31, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
"Slim" has got to be the all-time best name in the world for a non-English person to have but I think the article should be consistent as to whether it refers to him as Carlos or as Slim. Haplolology 18:59, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
Carlos Slim Helu's family comes from a Native Christian community of Lebanon, the Maronite Catholic Church. Everytime I keep updating his family section on the site, some idiot keeps removing the title "Christian" from the reference to his father. His father Julian was a Lebanese Christian, a Maronite Catholic. This is his native title to his homeland. He was born in the Christian autonomous region of Mount Lebanon (the precursor to the modern Lebanese republic), which had been handed autonomous power under the Ottoman Empire (not to be confused with the Turkish Republic, nor any "Arab" republic)
He was thus neither a Turk, nor explicitly Arab. People were called by their religious sect and the land they come from. He was an inhabitant of Lebanon, of the Christian Mutasarrifiyya (governorate) of Mount Lebanon, (a region under the Vilayet of Beirut) and he was a Christian. He is therefore a Lebanese Christian. Please stop trying to change this. Prince Cadmus II 03:13, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
This article has been cited by Information Week.
http://www.informationweek.com/news/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=200900492
does that mean it gets a special template?
hi. found it this morning. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ft/20070706/bs_ft/fto070620071924033550;_ylt=Av3svwHJrQ_aF6iiLDgpOTTMWM0F
yah , i added he is LEBANESE MEXICAN becasue it previosly said he is MEXICAN which he isnt because he has LEBANESE desendant and no MEXICAN blood, his family are migrants from LEBANON, sorry for being critical, but i had to point this out.
I've deleted Lebanese Mexican from the beginning of the article because I consider it redundancy.
I got a source here, claiming he's an Assyrian [2]. Now, him being Assyrian, does not necessarily have to be true. But, let's get one thing clear: Lebanese, is not an ethnicity. It is a country, with many different peoples living in it. Assyrians, are one ethnic group in Lebanon. Maronite, is not an ethnicity. It is a Syriac Church denomination. I repeat: Maronite, is not an ethnicity.
In fact, lots of Maronites, have Assyrian ancestry, though, they are very fond of denying their Assyrian roots, they do indeed have Assyrian ancestors. However, the Maronites have been intermixed with other ethnic groups, but there are still Assyrians who are members of the Maronite Church. Now, please, if you're going to revert, at the very least, provide better sources than the one I have, giving factual and credible information about his ancestry. Otherwise, leave the source until then. EliasAlucard| Talk 16:25 11 Jul, 2007 (UTC)
Elias, you have not stated any facts anywhere. One moment you propose that He is Assyrian by terms of blood, yet you have no proof of his genetic makeup, then the next moment you change it to his religion being Assyrian Christian when he is really a Maronite. You have no proof at all that he is an "Assyrian Christian", yet are quick to dispose of Phoenicia as "bullshit". You are forcing your heritage on others. There are hundreds of thousands of Maronites in Lebanon and only a few Assyrians, every Assyrian I have met so far has fair skin and fair eyes and fair coloured hair, except a few. The majority of Maronites are darker in features with exceptions to those who inherited Crusader blood. The Maronites spoke SYRIAC, SERTA SYRIAC is what they wrote. After 431 the Syriac language and script split into eastern and western branches. The western branch was called Serta and developed into two varieties, Jacobite and Melchite. Vigorous in pen graphics, Serta writing shows that, unlike the early Aramaic and Hebrew scripts, characters are fastened to a bottom horizontal. If you didn't realise this then I suggest you go back to school. West Syriac itself contains vowel letters above the characters to denote vowel changes on those consonants. These letters themselves are ORIGINALLY FROM THE PHOENICIAN ALPHABET YOU GOOSE! WHY IS THIS ONLY IN WEST SYRIAC(MARONITE/JACOBITE) SCRIPT AND NOT IN THE EASTERN ESTRANGELA SCRIPT THAT THE ASSYRIANS USE???? BECAUSE THEY TOOK IT FROM ORIGINAL PHOENICIAN ALPHABET!
The Maronites did speak Syriac and you tell me it's because of that that they are Assyrians? The Maronites speak Arabic now, does that make them Arabs? I speak English now, does that make me an Anglo-Saxon even though I know I'm clearly not?
Like most Lebanese people, the Maronite ethnic background is a mix of Phoenician, Assyrian, Greek, Israelite, Roman, Ghassanids (Arab), European Crusaders, Turks, and French. To single them out as "Assyrian" is narrow. It is the first settlers of the land who have more input in the genetic pool. Invaders only added to this. This is why people would say "Phoenician" because "Phoenician" is just them going back as far as possible to the earliest settlers, their ancestors. The Maronite Church in present day Lebanon has been there since Phoenicia and to separate it out and pretend that they originally hailed from Assyria is really narrow minded and misleading, just because they took on the new language of their conquerors.
Please leave your logic to idiots. Just because you read propaganda websites regarding denial of other people's historical background, it doesn't give you the right to persistently bash it into others on Wikipedia. The Assyrians, as they are known today, are the Eastern branch of Syriac Christianity. Original Phoenician alphabet characters were adapted into West Syriac script which is used by the Syrian Orthodox Church and Maronite Churches. Syriac became the language after Phoenician-Canaanite was phased out. The Jews did not wipe them out, they blended in with them, as did the Assyrians and their language, which was just a variation of Aramaic to begin with anyway. You have a really distorted view of history man. Just because an army conquers a land, it doesnt mean they wiped out the population. Can you say Iraqis now are all White Anglo Saxon Americans now that Iraq was invaded? This is precisely where your logic is leading people to believe, it is really DUMB! If Carlos Helu is an Assyrian (by race), then why is it you keep changing his RELIGION to Assyrian Christian? Are you then denying the fact that most people in Jezzine are actually Maronite Catholic? And you tell me you're originally from Lebanon? Are you blind or just plain stupid? Would you even like to try convince me that I'm a computer and not really a human too?
Why are you basing your stupid ideas on a bloody website that cannot even correct its grammar to an educated standard? Come on man Prince Cadmus II 01:37, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
Are you trying to tell me your pathetic little "facts" here are coming from YOUTUBE? Who are you trying to convince here? DONKEYS? How on earth can you base stupid ideas from YOUTUBE as facts? Nobody "became" Assyrians, just because they spoke a similar language in a different dialect does not mean they were genetically replenished and suddenly like a sonic boom converted into the Assyrian genetic pool you retard!! Dude did you even go to school as a student? Your denial of Phoenicia is really an insecurity of yours. The Maronites spoke Aramaic because that was the LINGUA FRANCA of the time. There was no "Phoenician Empire" Phoenicia was a group of independent cities just like the Greek states. The Canaanite tongue existed well and the Phoenician alphabet itself was used to develop the newer alphabet of Aramaic and other alphabets. Assyrian language itself is really just the eastern dialect of Aramaic, it does not necessarily mean it had any precedence or influence over the other dialects. Maronites speak Arabic now because it is the lingua franca of the region just as Aramaic was in the time of the Assyrian Empire. So are you trying to tell me that because the Assyrians once had an empire in that region that all people are now descendants of the Assyrians and are thus Assyrian? Are you retarded man? You may as well call Lebanese descendants of the TURKS since they were ruled by the Ottoman Empire for over 400 years.. Perhaps they are really Romans from the Roman Empire? Perhaps they are all Persians as well from the Persian Empire? Maybe you'd like to say they are also Hebrews, Syrians, Israelis, Iranians, French and every other army and nation throughout history that has passed through Lebanon or attacked it. Why don't you be consistent and just say that the people of Lebanon are Lebanese? It was you who brought up the Phoenician thing so it must be a Phoenician Complex you have. I'm sorry but the Maronites had always lived in and around modern day Lebanon. When St Maroun travelled south from Antioch, he converted the Phoenicians who lived on the coast as they then moved up to safety in the Lebanon Mountains. Go and make up whatever history you like about Assyria and Iraq but it wont get any further than being published in a child's scrapbook. Why not call Assyrians in Iraq as Arabs now since they are ruled by an Arab country?? Perhaps with your extremely retarded logic you would like to rename the Assyrians as Americans now since that the Americans are ruling Iraq with their military????? You are really stupid. Prince Cadmus II 07:01, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
Your source is situated on YOUTUBE, therefore the source is YOUTUBE. WIKIPEDIA doesnt give a shit about whoever this little professor is and whatever journal he writes in. If his work is situated in a journal, you can source it from that journal, but if he is the only person claiming it in the whole world, then I would hardly find that RELIABLE. You have a problem in labelling people according to your extremist views. Assyrian is only 1 branch of the Aramaic family of dialects, it does not embody the whole tree. The Maronites are situated on the other side of that tree, and since it was the Maronites/Syriacs who laid the foundations of the Arabic script, it is only right that the Arabic renaissance came from that part of the Arab world. In no part of the Lebanese constitution does it say Lebanon is Arab. Lebanon has always and always will be independent, and inclusive of all the cultures that settled there since the, (yes you guessed it), original Phoenician settlements. Archaeology does not lie my friend. And neither does genetics. Genetic testing has proven that most modern day Lebanese share an ancestor in the ancient Phoenicians (taken from well preserved Phoenician DNA from cemeteries.) Also, there is no use speaking a language that is not going to get you anywhere else other than Bible studies. Times change and so do languages, just because the Maronites adapted to newer cultures and languages for use in business and other success it does not mean that their previous one vanished, they are still the same people with the same customs. You cannot only take 1 tiny portion of Maronite history and rewrite it as "of Assyrian descend" (as your pathetic previous source states in incorrect spelling). That is just an extremist Assyrian propaganda tool (published on no other site in the world except that informal one) you provided at the beginning to harbour support for an independent Assyrian nation, trying to forge a relationship to the world's richest man (a Maronite Catholic) to a cause that he is not even faintly related to. If the Assyrians cannot get together and unite, then what does this have to do with the world's richest man? Do you think he is going to do anything for that cause? I don't think so.
Prince Cadmus II 14:16, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
RELIGIOUS BELIEF HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH RACIAL COMPOSITION YOU IDIOT! ETHNICALLY, the MARONITES are MARONITES NOT ASSYRIANS, the Patriarch of the Maronite Church is the Patriarch of Antioch and all the East!! Syriac Christianity is religion, not ethnicity you retard! Ethnicity involves being part of a distinct group, it has nothing to do with what ancestors they hail from. If someone converts to a religion, does that mean their whole physical appearance and chromosomes change too? No. If someone's name is Jacob does that then mean they are of Jewish blood?? No. Did you also know that surnames surfaced in Medieval times around the 10th century in the Eastern Roman Empire? What language did inhabitants of present day Lebanon speak then? Syriac. Of course their names would be either Syriac or Arabic. Once again, this refutes your whole argument of actual physical "Assyrian" lineage. Why do you keep asserting "Assyrian"? I can't see any Assyrian landmarks in Lebanon, therefore I do not believe Assyrians (as opposed to the Syriacs) had any relevant hold in Lebanon unless you can prove to me a direct GENETIC test.
Your only claim to Lebanese people really being "Assyrian" and not natives of their own land (with influences from outside) is one of extremism and rock-headed denial. Sure there may be some Assyrian genes in there, just like many other nations added to the gene pool as well, there is absolutely no reason to defy proven tests and archaeological facts.
Phoenicia, after becoming a Roman province in 64AD continued to be called that for 700 years until falling to the Arabs in the 7th century and put under greater Syria as part of the Bilad al-Sham, at which point the Maronite Church had already had its foot in that territory for 300 years! And who made up the body of people behind St Maroun? The Local PHOENICIANS!
Finally, Carlos Slim Helu is NOT ASSYRIAN! Give a real source to prove otherwise. It's really pathetic and arrogant to keep changing him to Assyrian because he does not even identify with any Assyrian cause or even church or political grouping. There is nothing Assyrian about him at all. He is a Lebanese Maronite Catholic and this has nothing to do with the land, the hearts and the aspirations of any Assyrian grouping. The only Assyrian you can try prove in him in a genetic link, and I haven't seen any proof of that yet. Prince Cadmus II 03:52, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
There are many more things that should be included here. Religion, personal life, family, other works, etc.
If I'm missing something (like the information is somewhere else but I just can't find it), then sorry for butting in.
7FlushSetzer 22:48, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
It is unbelievable that a man this rich has not attracted any criticism. Are his business practices this clean? No one becomes a multi-billionary by being "nice". This article looks like it was written by Carlos Helú himself or a friend. Thank you for any help there. Marco Alfarrobinha { chat} contributions 13:26, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
I can't help but wonder if his wealth isn't 7% of the GDP because he's evil or anything, but because Mexico lacks a free-market economy, and most people are unable to work their way up to wealth. Perhaps he's just very lucky, as well as a very intelligent businessman. - MSTCrow 17:18, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
Such a famous man might have created a website where he posted his personal history. Has anyone come across one? I could not find any personal details on the Telmex web site. EdJohnston 20:58, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
Is there any reliable source for that name being his or his father's? In German wikipedia we constantly revert it, because it gets changes are made without comment or source. In some other versions it survived, but maybe due to lack of control. Any sources? Apart from anonymous people stating things at article discussion pages? Thank you. Chigliak 21:33, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
The only thing consistent with all those names is Slim. I think from this that the family surname is Slim (Selim). We do need more sources though on Mexican naming format. Prince Cadmus II 04:24, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Here in México a child is typically given one or two first names. These names function very much like the first and middle names used in the naming system that is typically used in the U.S. For example, in the above kinship chart there is Ivan Miguel Rosado Rivas, who has two first names, and his son Ivan Rosado Mendez, who only has one first name. Those individuals who have two first names sometimes use one or the other, or sometimes both, as the name that they go by. For instance, Ivan Miguel Rosado Rivas may be called Ivan, Miguel, or Ivan Miguel, by his family and friends.
In addition to the first name(s), a person is given two apellidos (last names). In the cases above the apellidos are Rosado Rivas and Rosdao Mendez, respectively. The first of the two apellidos is the father´s first apellido, and the second of the two apellidos is the mother´s first apellido. Therefore, Ivan Rosado Mendez inherited the apellido Rosado from his father, Ivan Miguel Rosado Rivas, and the apellido Mendez from his mother Rosa Eugenia Mendez Vales.
This naming system allows the father´s apellido to exist for at lest two generations, if it is passed through a daughter, or indefinitely if passed through successive sons.
One other important aspect of the Mexican naming system is the way in which apellidos are exchanged through marriage. Usually the wife will drop her second apellido and replace it with her husband´s first apellido. Also, sometimes they will insert a “de” in front of the husband´s first apellido before it replaces the wife´s second apellido. Let´s consider the ego of our kinship chart, Hilda Rivas Aguilar. After marriage to her husband Ivan Rosado Nuñez, she can be known as Hilda Rivas Rosado or Hilda Rivas de Rosado.
Taken from Mexican naming system
Julian Slim Haddad would be thus the son of a man with the surname of Slim, and a mother with surname of Haddad.
Therefore their (Carlos Slim Helu + Soumaya Domit Gemayel) offspring would have surnames of Slim and Domit. Ie. Carlos Slim Domit, Patrick Slim Domit and Marco Antonio Slim Domit. (By always taking the first "appellido" of the father and the first "appellido" of the mother).
Therefore, Carlos Slim Helu, would really be just Carlos Slim, or Carlos Salim in non-Mexican format. So instead of "Helu", the paternal family surname is just Slim (Salim) from the village of Jezzine in Lebanon. Prince Cadmus II 05:29, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Disregarding all discussions regarding the use of the Mexican naming system vs. whatever other naming system, I want to propose that the article be moved to Carlos Slim on the grounds that The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, and Reuters all refer to him this way. The only major source that I have seen so far that calls him Helu is Forbes. Please discuss/vote here: -- DLand TALK 03:42, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Just because Forbes releases an annual list of the world's richest billionaires does not mean that it is somehow the "official" judge on the matter. Anyone can come out with a list. It's a gimmick Forbes uses to sell magazines. Both the Wall Street Journal and Fortune magazine—two very highly-respected business publications—are reporting that Carlos Slim has topped Bill Gates as the world's richest man. (WSJ actually has the highest reputation of all three publications.)
Carlos Slim's status as the world's richest man is backed up in this article with two references, one from the WSJ and one from Fortune. This article's claim that Carlos Slim is the world's richest man is fully compliant with WP:V and WP:RS. In addition, the WSJ and Fortune articles are newer than any Forbes article on the issue.
The fact that WSJ and Fortune are every bit as highly-regarded as Forbes, the fact that they outnumber Forbes, and the fact that the WSJ and Fortune articles are newer than any Forbes article on the issue, makes them more reliable than Forbes on the issue. -- JHP 09:51, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Forbes may not be the judge, but it is THE most reliable source in the world, and although it is not updated daily, if it were we would have to change the articles constantly as Gates, Helu, and Buffet are all extremely close. I think the best decision is to leave it the way it is; ie, According to Forbes hes the second richest, however it only updates annually. -- User:Leethal 23 August 2007 —The preceding signed but undated comment was added at 15:01, August 23, 2007 (UTC).
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
Recent gains in his shares in the America Movil group are largely responsible for his recent increase in wealth, boosting his fortune to an estimated 49.0 billion dollars compared with the estimated fortune of 59.2 billion dollars for Bill Gates.
But the Net worth in the infobox says that he's worth 67.8 billion. So which is true? I suggest that we follow Forbes Magazine's Billionaires list as a standard. Check it out here: http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/10/07billionaires_The-Worlds-Billionaires_Rank.html
-- Pavithran 15:01, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Why is this guy (User name:Diegojoven ) writheting himself in? I am not saying it is not true, I only question the relevance of "Carlos Slim also has a very close relationship with Diego Gonzalez Joven, an electrical engineering student at the St. Mary's University, Texas. Carlos Slim once said that this young talented student reminds him when he was a student at the UNAM in Mexico". What's next the name of Mr. Slim's Dog? -- LS1010 13:43, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
He said it today. I am too lazy to do it myself with referencing etc... Nick
Huh, I think he said he was putting in something like $10 bil. So not most. Dunno someone need to check that.
I have rewritten the article taking most of the information which was there already. I have also changed his photograph. I gave it some structure, and removed great tracts which are more relevant to Telmex than Carlos Slim personally, although I left some references to Telmex and monopoly charging, citing his political influences.
I also fixed some bodged formatting which had masked the paragraphs about his father. His children only get passing mentions, as more detailed information on them should be part of a Wiki entry for same
As I do not know the dates, someone needs to update the section of his directorships and achievements with information, and perhaps presenting it in a list form with from-to dates, and sorting the list into chronoligical order Ohconfucius 06:38, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
I don't see his son's name on the Altria article. -- Gbleem 17:46, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
Don't see a reason why he shouldn't be at Carlos Slim. — Cantus… ☎ 02:41, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
His full name is Carlos Slim Helú, right? And since Carlos Slim forwards to this article, I don't see a reason why it should be changed. Basseq 19:12, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
"He is also the third richest man on earth mostly because he got the Telefonos de Mexico company as a bargain from Mexican ex-president Carlos Salinas De Gortari due to their friendship, he has also made his fortune with that company charging extra fees to every family who owns a telephone in Mexico, charging a very expensive service. An example of this fraud is: An average telephone service in U.S.A. or Canada costs around 25 dollars per month, with unlimited local phone calls, when in Mexico cost around 200 pesos = 20 U.S. dollars for just 30 local calls and every extra minute is charged in the monthly bill."
This is a very negative outlook on the man, and I'd like to see sources on this information. Are he and De Gortari friends? To what extent? Has he been indicted on charges of fraud, or is this just an opinion? Did anyone take into account the fact that costs are likely more in Mexico than the US? I suggest a re-examination of this paragraph, and at least a rewrite, as the grammar is less than desirable. (e.g. "The source of most of his wealth is the telecommunications company Telefonos de Mexico, acquired at a bargain from president Carlos Salinas De Gortari, a close friend. He has attracted criticism from some for alledged gouging of telecommunications prices, as the services offered do not equal similarly-priced options in the United States.") Basseq 19:22, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
IMHO, that whole section is NPOV; I've tagged it as such. Dweekly 18:52, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
USING HIS MOTHER'S LAST NAME.
His last name is SLIM, not Helu. To refer to him as Helu or Mr. Helu is say that he is illegitimate. In Latin/Hispanic surnames there are usually two last names with NO hypen between the two last names. The first of the two last names is his father's surname which passes on to Carlos and then the second of the two last names is his mother's surname.
Why isn't he on the list in other years? he seems to have come out of no where.
I understand this now that he has been in the media. A recent AP article said his wealth increased by 19 billion last year more than anyone else and since Gates and Buffet are focusing on giving there money way there is a good chance he will be the richest man in the world. Time to use to hearing the name Carlos Slim Helu.
Addendum from a different reader: it would be interesting to demonstrate how the holdings control the various corporations. For example he controls Grupo Carso (which is "just" a holding company) which downstream controls Telmex -- however Telmex trades on its own on the Mexican and US exchanges too. A percentage of ownership at each level equates to control. I think this type of control amplifies more than direct ownership Sr. Slim's net worth as each component has escalated in value.
Is Helú a Jew? It says that his father was a Lebanese Christian (though no source is given), but we have very little information about his mother, only that she was the "daughter of [a] prosperous Mexican merchant." So is it possible that his mother was a Jew or came from a Jewish family (either Sephardi or Ashkenazi)? Do we have any more information about his ethnic/religious background or that of his mother? -- 172.146.128.109 21:11, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
Helu is Lebanese-MariaLaGitana
¿Hay algún problema si Carlos Slim Helú es judio o no? -- User: Morris237 11:41, 14 de abril del 2007 (UTC -8:00)
Es un problema decir que lo es cuando no lo es 189.141.54.43 18:30, 12 May 2007 (UTC)ZealotKommunizma
Helu is not a Jew. His family comes from a village at the very northern tip of Southern Lebanon, a town called Jezzine. He is neither a Jew nor a Turk like some ridiculous idiots keep insisting by changing his family background to Turkish or Jewish. He is a Maronite Catholic whose father was born in the area of Lebanon under Ottoman Empire occupation, this does not by any chance mean he was a Turk at all. We need to stop allowing anonymous users editing this page. Prince Cadmus II 14:28, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
As usual, Jews and turks try to make famous Lebanese arab christian belong to them, he is Lebanese Arab from both sides. He is Mexican Lebanese Arab christian and thats all!!
yeah after few days some jews will say nasser al-kharafi is jew lol!
There is more of them..almost all are Lebanese and everyone is 1st generation Mexicans. I wonder how it makes the others feel who's family has been there for generations that people can come to your country and do better than you. [1] -MariaLaGitana —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 21:31, 12 April 2007 (UTC).
Thank god Mexico is a
Jus soli country, and most people don't care much about this kind of useless questions! --
LS1010 22:36, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
Actually they're not first generation, some have been there for over 100 years.
His mother is lebanese too
Slim Haddad married Linda Helu, daughter of another prosperous Lebanese merchant, and had six children. Carlos Slim Helu was the fifth of the six children. Carlos credits his father as his mentor in business, retailing and finance. Julian Slim Haddad died in 1952 , leaving his family a moderately prosperous economic base from which Carlos launched his successful financial career.
I'm pretty sure his mother is Mexican, I guess we have to ask Slim himself??
Slim is a son of a migrant and so is Slim's wife. They migrated from Lebanon. Of course Slim and his wife were both born in Mexico so they are Lebanese Mexicans. Prince Cadmus II 14:31, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
"Slim" has got to be the all-time best name in the world for a non-English person to have but I think the article should be consistent as to whether it refers to him as Carlos or as Slim. Haplolology 18:59, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
Carlos Slim Helu's family comes from a Native Christian community of Lebanon, the Maronite Catholic Church. Everytime I keep updating his family section on the site, some idiot keeps removing the title "Christian" from the reference to his father. His father Julian was a Lebanese Christian, a Maronite Catholic. This is his native title to his homeland. He was born in the Christian autonomous region of Mount Lebanon (the precursor to the modern Lebanese republic), which had been handed autonomous power under the Ottoman Empire (not to be confused with the Turkish Republic, nor any "Arab" republic)
He was thus neither a Turk, nor explicitly Arab. People were called by their religious sect and the land they come from. He was an inhabitant of Lebanon, of the Christian Mutasarrifiyya (governorate) of Mount Lebanon, (a region under the Vilayet of Beirut) and he was a Christian. He is therefore a Lebanese Christian. Please stop trying to change this. Prince Cadmus II 03:13, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
This article has been cited by Information Week.
http://www.informationweek.com/news/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=200900492
does that mean it gets a special template?
hi. found it this morning. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ft/20070706/bs_ft/fto070620071924033550;_ylt=Av3svwHJrQ_aF6iiLDgpOTTMWM0F
yah , i added he is LEBANESE MEXICAN becasue it previosly said he is MEXICAN which he isnt because he has LEBANESE desendant and no MEXICAN blood, his family are migrants from LEBANON, sorry for being critical, but i had to point this out.
I've deleted Lebanese Mexican from the beginning of the article because I consider it redundancy.
I got a source here, claiming he's an Assyrian [2]. Now, him being Assyrian, does not necessarily have to be true. But, let's get one thing clear: Lebanese, is not an ethnicity. It is a country, with many different peoples living in it. Assyrians, are one ethnic group in Lebanon. Maronite, is not an ethnicity. It is a Syriac Church denomination. I repeat: Maronite, is not an ethnicity.
In fact, lots of Maronites, have Assyrian ancestry, though, they are very fond of denying their Assyrian roots, they do indeed have Assyrian ancestors. However, the Maronites have been intermixed with other ethnic groups, but there are still Assyrians who are members of the Maronite Church. Now, please, if you're going to revert, at the very least, provide better sources than the one I have, giving factual and credible information about his ancestry. Otherwise, leave the source until then. EliasAlucard| Talk 16:25 11 Jul, 2007 (UTC)
Elias, you have not stated any facts anywhere. One moment you propose that He is Assyrian by terms of blood, yet you have no proof of his genetic makeup, then the next moment you change it to his religion being Assyrian Christian when he is really a Maronite. You have no proof at all that he is an "Assyrian Christian", yet are quick to dispose of Phoenicia as "bullshit". You are forcing your heritage on others. There are hundreds of thousands of Maronites in Lebanon and only a few Assyrians, every Assyrian I have met so far has fair skin and fair eyes and fair coloured hair, except a few. The majority of Maronites are darker in features with exceptions to those who inherited Crusader blood. The Maronites spoke SYRIAC, SERTA SYRIAC is what they wrote. After 431 the Syriac language and script split into eastern and western branches. The western branch was called Serta and developed into two varieties, Jacobite and Melchite. Vigorous in pen graphics, Serta writing shows that, unlike the early Aramaic and Hebrew scripts, characters are fastened to a bottom horizontal. If you didn't realise this then I suggest you go back to school. West Syriac itself contains vowel letters above the characters to denote vowel changes on those consonants. These letters themselves are ORIGINALLY FROM THE PHOENICIAN ALPHABET YOU GOOSE! WHY IS THIS ONLY IN WEST SYRIAC(MARONITE/JACOBITE) SCRIPT AND NOT IN THE EASTERN ESTRANGELA SCRIPT THAT THE ASSYRIANS USE???? BECAUSE THEY TOOK IT FROM ORIGINAL PHOENICIAN ALPHABET!
The Maronites did speak Syriac and you tell me it's because of that that they are Assyrians? The Maronites speak Arabic now, does that make them Arabs? I speak English now, does that make me an Anglo-Saxon even though I know I'm clearly not?
Like most Lebanese people, the Maronite ethnic background is a mix of Phoenician, Assyrian, Greek, Israelite, Roman, Ghassanids (Arab), European Crusaders, Turks, and French. To single them out as "Assyrian" is narrow. It is the first settlers of the land who have more input in the genetic pool. Invaders only added to this. This is why people would say "Phoenician" because "Phoenician" is just them going back as far as possible to the earliest settlers, their ancestors. The Maronite Church in present day Lebanon has been there since Phoenicia and to separate it out and pretend that they originally hailed from Assyria is really narrow minded and misleading, just because they took on the new language of their conquerors.
Please leave your logic to idiots. Just because you read propaganda websites regarding denial of other people's historical background, it doesn't give you the right to persistently bash it into others on Wikipedia. The Assyrians, as they are known today, are the Eastern branch of Syriac Christianity. Original Phoenician alphabet characters were adapted into West Syriac script which is used by the Syrian Orthodox Church and Maronite Churches. Syriac became the language after Phoenician-Canaanite was phased out. The Jews did not wipe them out, they blended in with them, as did the Assyrians and their language, which was just a variation of Aramaic to begin with anyway. You have a really distorted view of history man. Just because an army conquers a land, it doesnt mean they wiped out the population. Can you say Iraqis now are all White Anglo Saxon Americans now that Iraq was invaded? This is precisely where your logic is leading people to believe, it is really DUMB! If Carlos Helu is an Assyrian (by race), then why is it you keep changing his RELIGION to Assyrian Christian? Are you then denying the fact that most people in Jezzine are actually Maronite Catholic? And you tell me you're originally from Lebanon? Are you blind or just plain stupid? Would you even like to try convince me that I'm a computer and not really a human too?
Why are you basing your stupid ideas on a bloody website that cannot even correct its grammar to an educated standard? Come on man Prince Cadmus II 01:37, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
Are you trying to tell me your pathetic little "facts" here are coming from YOUTUBE? Who are you trying to convince here? DONKEYS? How on earth can you base stupid ideas from YOUTUBE as facts? Nobody "became" Assyrians, just because they spoke a similar language in a different dialect does not mean they were genetically replenished and suddenly like a sonic boom converted into the Assyrian genetic pool you retard!! Dude did you even go to school as a student? Your denial of Phoenicia is really an insecurity of yours. The Maronites spoke Aramaic because that was the LINGUA FRANCA of the time. There was no "Phoenician Empire" Phoenicia was a group of independent cities just like the Greek states. The Canaanite tongue existed well and the Phoenician alphabet itself was used to develop the newer alphabet of Aramaic and other alphabets. Assyrian language itself is really just the eastern dialect of Aramaic, it does not necessarily mean it had any precedence or influence over the other dialects. Maronites speak Arabic now because it is the lingua franca of the region just as Aramaic was in the time of the Assyrian Empire. So are you trying to tell me that because the Assyrians once had an empire in that region that all people are now descendants of the Assyrians and are thus Assyrian? Are you retarded man? You may as well call Lebanese descendants of the TURKS since they were ruled by the Ottoman Empire for over 400 years.. Perhaps they are really Romans from the Roman Empire? Perhaps they are all Persians as well from the Persian Empire? Maybe you'd like to say they are also Hebrews, Syrians, Israelis, Iranians, French and every other army and nation throughout history that has passed through Lebanon or attacked it. Why don't you be consistent and just say that the people of Lebanon are Lebanese? It was you who brought up the Phoenician thing so it must be a Phoenician Complex you have. I'm sorry but the Maronites had always lived in and around modern day Lebanon. When St Maroun travelled south from Antioch, he converted the Phoenicians who lived on the coast as they then moved up to safety in the Lebanon Mountains. Go and make up whatever history you like about Assyria and Iraq but it wont get any further than being published in a child's scrapbook. Why not call Assyrians in Iraq as Arabs now since they are ruled by an Arab country?? Perhaps with your extremely retarded logic you would like to rename the Assyrians as Americans now since that the Americans are ruling Iraq with their military????? You are really stupid. Prince Cadmus II 07:01, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
Your source is situated on YOUTUBE, therefore the source is YOUTUBE. WIKIPEDIA doesnt give a shit about whoever this little professor is and whatever journal he writes in. If his work is situated in a journal, you can source it from that journal, but if he is the only person claiming it in the whole world, then I would hardly find that RELIABLE. You have a problem in labelling people according to your extremist views. Assyrian is only 1 branch of the Aramaic family of dialects, it does not embody the whole tree. The Maronites are situated on the other side of that tree, and since it was the Maronites/Syriacs who laid the foundations of the Arabic script, it is only right that the Arabic renaissance came from that part of the Arab world. In no part of the Lebanese constitution does it say Lebanon is Arab. Lebanon has always and always will be independent, and inclusive of all the cultures that settled there since the, (yes you guessed it), original Phoenician settlements. Archaeology does not lie my friend. And neither does genetics. Genetic testing has proven that most modern day Lebanese share an ancestor in the ancient Phoenicians (taken from well preserved Phoenician DNA from cemeteries.) Also, there is no use speaking a language that is not going to get you anywhere else other than Bible studies. Times change and so do languages, just because the Maronites adapted to newer cultures and languages for use in business and other success it does not mean that their previous one vanished, they are still the same people with the same customs. You cannot only take 1 tiny portion of Maronite history and rewrite it as "of Assyrian descend" (as your pathetic previous source states in incorrect spelling). That is just an extremist Assyrian propaganda tool (published on no other site in the world except that informal one) you provided at the beginning to harbour support for an independent Assyrian nation, trying to forge a relationship to the world's richest man (a Maronite Catholic) to a cause that he is not even faintly related to. If the Assyrians cannot get together and unite, then what does this have to do with the world's richest man? Do you think he is going to do anything for that cause? I don't think so.
Prince Cadmus II 14:16, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
RELIGIOUS BELIEF HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH RACIAL COMPOSITION YOU IDIOT! ETHNICALLY, the MARONITES are MARONITES NOT ASSYRIANS, the Patriarch of the Maronite Church is the Patriarch of Antioch and all the East!! Syriac Christianity is religion, not ethnicity you retard! Ethnicity involves being part of a distinct group, it has nothing to do with what ancestors they hail from. If someone converts to a religion, does that mean their whole physical appearance and chromosomes change too? No. If someone's name is Jacob does that then mean they are of Jewish blood?? No. Did you also know that surnames surfaced in Medieval times around the 10th century in the Eastern Roman Empire? What language did inhabitants of present day Lebanon speak then? Syriac. Of course their names would be either Syriac or Arabic. Once again, this refutes your whole argument of actual physical "Assyrian" lineage. Why do you keep asserting "Assyrian"? I can't see any Assyrian landmarks in Lebanon, therefore I do not believe Assyrians (as opposed to the Syriacs) had any relevant hold in Lebanon unless you can prove to me a direct GENETIC test.
Your only claim to Lebanese people really being "Assyrian" and not natives of their own land (with influences from outside) is one of extremism and rock-headed denial. Sure there may be some Assyrian genes in there, just like many other nations added to the gene pool as well, there is absolutely no reason to defy proven tests and archaeological facts.
Phoenicia, after becoming a Roman province in 64AD continued to be called that for 700 years until falling to the Arabs in the 7th century and put under greater Syria as part of the Bilad al-Sham, at which point the Maronite Church had already had its foot in that territory for 300 years! And who made up the body of people behind St Maroun? The Local PHOENICIANS!
Finally, Carlos Slim Helu is NOT ASSYRIAN! Give a real source to prove otherwise. It's really pathetic and arrogant to keep changing him to Assyrian because he does not even identify with any Assyrian cause or even church or political grouping. There is nothing Assyrian about him at all. He is a Lebanese Maronite Catholic and this has nothing to do with the land, the hearts and the aspirations of any Assyrian grouping. The only Assyrian you can try prove in him in a genetic link, and I haven't seen any proof of that yet. Prince Cadmus II 03:52, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
There are many more things that should be included here. Religion, personal life, family, other works, etc.
If I'm missing something (like the information is somewhere else but I just can't find it), then sorry for butting in.
7FlushSetzer 22:48, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
It is unbelievable that a man this rich has not attracted any criticism. Are his business practices this clean? No one becomes a multi-billionary by being "nice". This article looks like it was written by Carlos Helú himself or a friend. Thank you for any help there. Marco Alfarrobinha { chat} contributions 13:26, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
I can't help but wonder if his wealth isn't 7% of the GDP because he's evil or anything, but because Mexico lacks a free-market economy, and most people are unable to work their way up to wealth. Perhaps he's just very lucky, as well as a very intelligent businessman. - MSTCrow 17:18, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
Such a famous man might have created a website where he posted his personal history. Has anyone come across one? I could not find any personal details on the Telmex web site. EdJohnston 20:58, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
Is there any reliable source for that name being his or his father's? In German wikipedia we constantly revert it, because it gets changes are made without comment or source. In some other versions it survived, but maybe due to lack of control. Any sources? Apart from anonymous people stating things at article discussion pages? Thank you. Chigliak 21:33, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
The only thing consistent with all those names is Slim. I think from this that the family surname is Slim (Selim). We do need more sources though on Mexican naming format. Prince Cadmus II 04:24, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Here in México a child is typically given one or two first names. These names function very much like the first and middle names used in the naming system that is typically used in the U.S. For example, in the above kinship chart there is Ivan Miguel Rosado Rivas, who has two first names, and his son Ivan Rosado Mendez, who only has one first name. Those individuals who have two first names sometimes use one or the other, or sometimes both, as the name that they go by. For instance, Ivan Miguel Rosado Rivas may be called Ivan, Miguel, or Ivan Miguel, by his family and friends.
In addition to the first name(s), a person is given two apellidos (last names). In the cases above the apellidos are Rosado Rivas and Rosdao Mendez, respectively. The first of the two apellidos is the father´s first apellido, and the second of the two apellidos is the mother´s first apellido. Therefore, Ivan Rosado Mendez inherited the apellido Rosado from his father, Ivan Miguel Rosado Rivas, and the apellido Mendez from his mother Rosa Eugenia Mendez Vales.
This naming system allows the father´s apellido to exist for at lest two generations, if it is passed through a daughter, or indefinitely if passed through successive sons.
One other important aspect of the Mexican naming system is the way in which apellidos are exchanged through marriage. Usually the wife will drop her second apellido and replace it with her husband´s first apellido. Also, sometimes they will insert a “de” in front of the husband´s first apellido before it replaces the wife´s second apellido. Let´s consider the ego of our kinship chart, Hilda Rivas Aguilar. After marriage to her husband Ivan Rosado Nuñez, she can be known as Hilda Rivas Rosado or Hilda Rivas de Rosado.
Taken from Mexican naming system
Julian Slim Haddad would be thus the son of a man with the surname of Slim, and a mother with surname of Haddad.
Therefore their (Carlos Slim Helu + Soumaya Domit Gemayel) offspring would have surnames of Slim and Domit. Ie. Carlos Slim Domit, Patrick Slim Domit and Marco Antonio Slim Domit. (By always taking the first "appellido" of the father and the first "appellido" of the mother).
Therefore, Carlos Slim Helu, would really be just Carlos Slim, or Carlos Salim in non-Mexican format. So instead of "Helu", the paternal family surname is just Slim (Salim) from the village of Jezzine in Lebanon. Prince Cadmus II 05:29, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Disregarding all discussions regarding the use of the Mexican naming system vs. whatever other naming system, I want to propose that the article be moved to Carlos Slim on the grounds that The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, and Reuters all refer to him this way. The only major source that I have seen so far that calls him Helu is Forbes. Please discuss/vote here: -- DLand TALK 03:42, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Just because Forbes releases an annual list of the world's richest billionaires does not mean that it is somehow the "official" judge on the matter. Anyone can come out with a list. It's a gimmick Forbes uses to sell magazines. Both the Wall Street Journal and Fortune magazine—two very highly-respected business publications—are reporting that Carlos Slim has topped Bill Gates as the world's richest man. (WSJ actually has the highest reputation of all three publications.)
Carlos Slim's status as the world's richest man is backed up in this article with two references, one from the WSJ and one from Fortune. This article's claim that Carlos Slim is the world's richest man is fully compliant with WP:V and WP:RS. In addition, the WSJ and Fortune articles are newer than any Forbes article on the issue.
The fact that WSJ and Fortune are every bit as highly-regarded as Forbes, the fact that they outnumber Forbes, and the fact that the WSJ and Fortune articles are newer than any Forbes article on the issue, makes them more reliable than Forbes on the issue. -- JHP 09:51, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Forbes may not be the judge, but it is THE most reliable source in the world, and although it is not updated daily, if it were we would have to change the articles constantly as Gates, Helu, and Buffet are all extremely close. I think the best decision is to leave it the way it is; ie, According to Forbes hes the second richest, however it only updates annually. -- User:Leethal 23 August 2007 —The preceding signed but undated comment was added at 15:01, August 23, 2007 (UTC).