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Ok, many outlets are reporting her album is titled Brightest Blue and will be released on June 12, however others say it's title is unconfirmed and is out on June 5. Let's discuss. Musiceditor515 ( talk) 20:24, 17 May 2020 (UTC)
Worry about me is only available on the deluxe version. So is Power the lead single or maybe flux, because its also on the album? MotherofSnakes ( talk) 09:55, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
How was Worry About Me promoted as a single from the album? She never once mentioned anything about Brightest Blue while promoting the song. You’re just assuming it was promoted for the album since it was released close to the album release. You’re just making things up. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 22:04, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
Per {{ Infobox album}}, " Close to Me," " Flux" and " Hate Me" should not be included, as they were never released in promotion of the album; they were each released as stand-alone releases. Their inclusion on Brightest Blue is merely all they have in-common. Their releases were standalone, and not made in promotion of the album. livelikemusic ( TALK!) 17:00, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
I would just like to add that LiveLikeMusic is also edit-warring on the pages “
Close to Me”, “
Hate Me” and “
Flux”. For some reason he keeps removing the album (Brightest Blue) from the infobox, even though on all three pages it says in the opening paragraph that they are included on the album. This is clearly because while he recognizes that they’re included on the album, he is still insistent that they are not official singles from the album.
I’m not sure how to tell if they’re official singles or not, but what I do know is that on Ellie’s discography page, all five songs (the ones I mentioned plus “Worry About Me” and “Power”) are listed as singles from the album.
It seems that in Livelikemusic’s eyes, if an artist doesn’t mention an album while promoting a single, then it isn’t an official single for the album. But Falconer’s point still stands; the page for Dua’s debut includes all the pre-release singles, going back to nearly two years before the album was released (the same time between this and “Close to Me”, coincidentally). Clearly Dua wasn’t mentioning the album in 2015. I remember, she announced it in late 2016. All this to say that I agree with Falconer, we shouldn’t be cherry-picking what pre-release singles count as “official singles” or not. Unless Ellie herself says they were just promotional singles, they should be included on the album page as official singles.
Also LLM, I must say that I find it humorous that you came to my talk page to ask me to stop, but just the other day when I came to your talk page to ask how we could come to an agreement regarding Dedicated Side B, you promptly removed what I said from your page. You clearly have no intention of cooperating with others to come to an agreement. You instead choose to stubbornly stick to what you believe, even if the whole world disagrees with you. Maybe be more open to simply discussing things with people? I can almost guarantee it would be a better way to resolve things then what you currently do. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 21:53, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
Omg LLM, you really just accused Falconer of ignoring things while you ignored his diagram?? I can’t with the hypocrisy, it’s so strong with you. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 21:55, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
What I’ve realized is that LLM has realized that this website is basically a joke. Like, if two people are arguing or edit-warring, it really doesn’t actually matter who’s right or wrong, it just matters who knows more than the other person. I don’t know how to send people warnings, or how to report people. But LLM does. So now the admins here are going to side with him. LLM is only good at one thing, and that’s reporting people. He’s not good at defending his points or discussing things with people, so he rarely does. Instead, if someone disagrees with him and tries to talk to him about it, he deletes their comments and reports them. What a mature person. We hate to see it. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 22:11, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
References
"X" was released as a single of Brightest Blue
Where "X" can be: "Close to Me", "Flux", "Hate Me", "Worry About Me" or "Power". Because any "fact, allegation [or] idea for which no reliable, published sources exist" or any "combine[d] material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources" constitutes original research. Template:Infobox song#album already covers this precisely to avoid people adding songs solely because they were included in a subsequently released album. © Tbhotch ™ ( en-3). 01:46, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
In terms of recent releases and logic here are the some common themes to be mindful of:
I hope these comments help. I'm generally against the idea of pre-release singles. There are loads of reasons that songs are released and then excluded from the track listing. Record labels often downgrade unsuccessful singles or if an album is pushed back but stick to logic per WP:DUCK, if a song was released and is included on at least one version of an album its a single from that album unless the above applies. In Katy Perry's case she never said "Harleys", "Never Really Over" etc were from an album but clearly said that they were standalone singles. Bear that in mind too. Also note that the "lead single" from an album is the one that directly precedes its release, not necessarily the first one. → Lil-℧niquԐ1 - ( Talk) - 09:00, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
We have two reliable sources (i.e., Entertainment Weekly and Consequence of Sound) stating that "Worry About Me" is the album's lead single and one reliable source (i.e., The Line of Best Fit) stating that "Power" is such. With that in mind, any single released prior to both of those songs' releases wouldn't be official album singles, no? KyleJoan talk 10:55, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
Was anything actually concluded here? I don't see a clear consensus just a muddle of different (and very valid) opinions but not necessarily a direct answer about what is and isn't classified as a single from this album. There's already acknowledgement that press releases are not independent and therefore not the be all and end all as we all know record labels demote "singles" all the time when it doesn't suit them to call them singles from the album. The crux of the argument, per {{
Infobox album}}, they were released during the album's marketing i.e. had the album been mentioned at their time of release.
The lead single debate is a distraction from the "what songs are singles" debate. For me, it boils down to the fact that at the time of release of "Flux" Ellie was talking about her 4th album. A clear indication that it was promoted in release of her fourth album which she had not yet titled. Many artists release songs in a similar position. Given the similar discussion for Smile, what do you think tbhotch? And livelikemusic you didn't respond to the message I left on your talkpage, so in the interests of closing off this discussion properly with a consensus, what do you think? If we can't decide maybe a full and proper RFC needs to be opened. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 14:37, 15 July 2020 (UTC)
I (Theenforcer22) have a number of points to make:
- this approach to not including the 3 singles is not consistent with the approach to other albums on Wikipedia and the relationship with tracks previously released as singles.
- this is not consistent with the Wikipedia page of each of the singles which refers to them as being singles released from the album 'Brightest Blue'.
- It's been stated that the singles were not released to promote the album - the fact they are on the album is promoting the album. The 3 tracks in question are currently 3 of Ellie's top 5 most popular tracks on Spotify and it is the version available on the album Brightest Blue, not the single, that is popular. They are therefore quite clearly promoting the streaming of this album.
- This is not consistent with standalone singles going back decades where standalone singles were tracks that were never included in the regular track listing of a studio album (not bonus tracks). Going Out by Supergrass; Drown by Bring Me The Horizon; Mountains by Biffy Clyro: all examples of tracks released as standalone singles later to be included in the track listing of a subsequent album a year or so later. All listed as singles from the album on Wikipedia. There will be hundreds more examples of this.
- Misleading information. I used Wikipedia upon the album's release to investigate whether this album contained any popular singles. I concluded that it didn't based on the singles listed. This is clearly inaccurate given 3 of Ellie's current most popular songs are on this album and were in fact singles - but not listed as singles here — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theenforcer22 ( talk • contribs) 09:38, 11 September 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
There is a typo in the lead section. There should be a comma after Blackbear, not a period. 208.98.223.30 ( talk) 15:34, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
"Sixteen" is included as the closer to the latter side of the album. It might be a purely digital edition tracklisting, it's on Spotify and Apple Music as far as I know. Froyo Fox126 ( talk) 03:32, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
There is some difference of opinion as to what constitutes a single from an album when previously released songs are included on album's track listing but are not specifically called "singles" by the artist or record label. In the case of Brightest Blue the question is whether or not the songs: " Hate Me", " Flux", " Close to Me" are considered singles for the purpose of album's infobox. Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 11:09, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
Template:Infobox_album#Template:Singles states Do not add specialty- or limited-release singles, such as those supplied to radio stations and music publications, which are often marked as "Promo copy" or "Promotional". Do not include singles that were added as bonus tracks on a re-release of an album. For songs that appear on more than one album, list the song as a single only for the album(s) where the single was released as part of the marketing and promotion of that album
It also says For complex release scenarios where it may not be obvious that a single was released as part of the marketing and promotion of the album on which it appears, seek consensus on the talk page for the album.
Taking all of that into account here are my questions that I think we need resolving
When responding the RFC, it would be useful to refer to the three separate questions. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 11:09, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
Dear editors. I am currently adapting the Brightest Blue liner notes directly from the CD booklet and am using similar album articles as templates. I sincerely apologise if any sort of errors, misspellings and incorrect formatting that may arise from when I have completed the adaption, however I greatly appreciate friendly advice and corrections as I am not a very experienced editor on Wikipedia. I do not intend to create disruptive edits or any sort of vandalism, I simply wish to contribute and help!
Thanks very much. Emmaan01 ( talk) 08:13, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
I know the album has been certified by RIAA as gold but I wasn't certain how this was the case. The album opened at 29 which is also its peak. None of the singles did amazingly well on streaming or the Hot 100 yet in less than 3 months its certified as gold? ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 13:07, 10 October 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||
|
![]() | This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.
Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. |
Reporting errors |
Ok, many outlets are reporting her album is titled Brightest Blue and will be released on June 12, however others say it's title is unconfirmed and is out on June 5. Let's discuss. Musiceditor515 ( talk) 20:24, 17 May 2020 (UTC)
Worry about me is only available on the deluxe version. So is Power the lead single or maybe flux, because its also on the album? MotherofSnakes ( talk) 09:55, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
How was Worry About Me promoted as a single from the album? She never once mentioned anything about Brightest Blue while promoting the song. You’re just assuming it was promoted for the album since it was released close to the album release. You’re just making things up. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 22:04, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
Per {{ Infobox album}}, " Close to Me," " Flux" and " Hate Me" should not be included, as they were never released in promotion of the album; they were each released as stand-alone releases. Their inclusion on Brightest Blue is merely all they have in-common. Their releases were standalone, and not made in promotion of the album. livelikemusic ( TALK!) 17:00, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
I would just like to add that LiveLikeMusic is also edit-warring on the pages “
Close to Me”, “
Hate Me” and “
Flux”. For some reason he keeps removing the album (Brightest Blue) from the infobox, even though on all three pages it says in the opening paragraph that they are included on the album. This is clearly because while he recognizes that they’re included on the album, he is still insistent that they are not official singles from the album.
I’m not sure how to tell if they’re official singles or not, but what I do know is that on Ellie’s discography page, all five songs (the ones I mentioned plus “Worry About Me” and “Power”) are listed as singles from the album.
It seems that in Livelikemusic’s eyes, if an artist doesn’t mention an album while promoting a single, then it isn’t an official single for the album. But Falconer’s point still stands; the page for Dua’s debut includes all the pre-release singles, going back to nearly two years before the album was released (the same time between this and “Close to Me”, coincidentally). Clearly Dua wasn’t mentioning the album in 2015. I remember, she announced it in late 2016. All this to say that I agree with Falconer, we shouldn’t be cherry-picking what pre-release singles count as “official singles” or not. Unless Ellie herself says they were just promotional singles, they should be included on the album page as official singles.
Also LLM, I must say that I find it humorous that you came to my talk page to ask me to stop, but just the other day when I came to your talk page to ask how we could come to an agreement regarding Dedicated Side B, you promptly removed what I said from your page. You clearly have no intention of cooperating with others to come to an agreement. You instead choose to stubbornly stick to what you believe, even if the whole world disagrees with you. Maybe be more open to simply discussing things with people? I can almost guarantee it would be a better way to resolve things then what you currently do. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 21:53, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
Omg LLM, you really just accused Falconer of ignoring things while you ignored his diagram?? I can’t with the hypocrisy, it’s so strong with you. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 21:55, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
What I’ve realized is that LLM has realized that this website is basically a joke. Like, if two people are arguing or edit-warring, it really doesn’t actually matter who’s right or wrong, it just matters who knows more than the other person. I don’t know how to send people warnings, or how to report people. But LLM does. So now the admins here are going to side with him. LLM is only good at one thing, and that’s reporting people. He’s not good at defending his points or discussing things with people, so he rarely does. Instead, if someone disagrees with him and tries to talk to him about it, he deletes their comments and reports them. What a mature person. We hate to see it. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 ( talk) 22:11, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
References
"X" was released as a single of Brightest Blue
Where "X" can be: "Close to Me", "Flux", "Hate Me", "Worry About Me" or "Power". Because any "fact, allegation [or] idea for which no reliable, published sources exist" or any "combine[d] material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources" constitutes original research. Template:Infobox song#album already covers this precisely to avoid people adding songs solely because they were included in a subsequently released album. © Tbhotch ™ ( en-3). 01:46, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
In terms of recent releases and logic here are the some common themes to be mindful of:
I hope these comments help. I'm generally against the idea of pre-release singles. There are loads of reasons that songs are released and then excluded from the track listing. Record labels often downgrade unsuccessful singles or if an album is pushed back but stick to logic per WP:DUCK, if a song was released and is included on at least one version of an album its a single from that album unless the above applies. In Katy Perry's case she never said "Harleys", "Never Really Over" etc were from an album but clearly said that they were standalone singles. Bear that in mind too. Also note that the "lead single" from an album is the one that directly precedes its release, not necessarily the first one. → Lil-℧niquԐ1 - ( Talk) - 09:00, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
We have two reliable sources (i.e., Entertainment Weekly and Consequence of Sound) stating that "Worry About Me" is the album's lead single and one reliable source (i.e., The Line of Best Fit) stating that "Power" is such. With that in mind, any single released prior to both of those songs' releases wouldn't be official album singles, no? KyleJoan talk 10:55, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
Was anything actually concluded here? I don't see a clear consensus just a muddle of different (and very valid) opinions but not necessarily a direct answer about what is and isn't classified as a single from this album. There's already acknowledgement that press releases are not independent and therefore not the be all and end all as we all know record labels demote "singles" all the time when it doesn't suit them to call them singles from the album. The crux of the argument, per {{
Infobox album}}, they were released during the album's marketing i.e. had the album been mentioned at their time of release.
The lead single debate is a distraction from the "what songs are singles" debate. For me, it boils down to the fact that at the time of release of "Flux" Ellie was talking about her 4th album. A clear indication that it was promoted in release of her fourth album which she had not yet titled. Many artists release songs in a similar position. Given the similar discussion for Smile, what do you think tbhotch? And livelikemusic you didn't respond to the message I left on your talkpage, so in the interests of closing off this discussion properly with a consensus, what do you think? If we can't decide maybe a full and proper RFC needs to be opened. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 14:37, 15 July 2020 (UTC)
I (Theenforcer22) have a number of points to make:
- this approach to not including the 3 singles is not consistent with the approach to other albums on Wikipedia and the relationship with tracks previously released as singles.
- this is not consistent with the Wikipedia page of each of the singles which refers to them as being singles released from the album 'Brightest Blue'.
- It's been stated that the singles were not released to promote the album - the fact they are on the album is promoting the album. The 3 tracks in question are currently 3 of Ellie's top 5 most popular tracks on Spotify and it is the version available on the album Brightest Blue, not the single, that is popular. They are therefore quite clearly promoting the streaming of this album.
- This is not consistent with standalone singles going back decades where standalone singles were tracks that were never included in the regular track listing of a studio album (not bonus tracks). Going Out by Supergrass; Drown by Bring Me The Horizon; Mountains by Biffy Clyro: all examples of tracks released as standalone singles later to be included in the track listing of a subsequent album a year or so later. All listed as singles from the album on Wikipedia. There will be hundreds more examples of this.
- Misleading information. I used Wikipedia upon the album's release to investigate whether this album contained any popular singles. I concluded that it didn't based on the singles listed. This is clearly inaccurate given 3 of Ellie's current most popular songs are on this album and were in fact singles - but not listed as singles here — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theenforcer22 ( talk • contribs) 09:38, 11 September 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
There is a typo in the lead section. There should be a comma after Blackbear, not a period. 208.98.223.30 ( talk) 15:34, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
"Sixteen" is included as the closer to the latter side of the album. It might be a purely digital edition tracklisting, it's on Spotify and Apple Music as far as I know. Froyo Fox126 ( talk) 03:32, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
There is some difference of opinion as to what constitutes a single from an album when previously released songs are included on album's track listing but are not specifically called "singles" by the artist or record label. In the case of Brightest Blue the question is whether or not the songs: " Hate Me", " Flux", " Close to Me" are considered singles for the purpose of album's infobox. Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 11:09, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
Template:Infobox_album#Template:Singles states Do not add specialty- or limited-release singles, such as those supplied to radio stations and music publications, which are often marked as "Promo copy" or "Promotional". Do not include singles that were added as bonus tracks on a re-release of an album. For songs that appear on more than one album, list the song as a single only for the album(s) where the single was released as part of the marketing and promotion of that album
It also says For complex release scenarios where it may not be obvious that a single was released as part of the marketing and promotion of the album on which it appears, seek consensus on the talk page for the album.
Taking all of that into account here are my questions that I think we need resolving
When responding the RFC, it would be useful to refer to the three separate questions. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 11:09, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
Dear editors. I am currently adapting the Brightest Blue liner notes directly from the CD booklet and am using similar album articles as templates. I sincerely apologise if any sort of errors, misspellings and incorrect formatting that may arise from when I have completed the adaption, however I greatly appreciate friendly advice and corrections as I am not a very experienced editor on Wikipedia. I do not intend to create disruptive edits or any sort of vandalism, I simply wish to contribute and help!
Thanks very much. Emmaan01 ( talk) 08:13, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
I know the album has been certified by RIAA as gold but I wasn't certain how this was the case. The album opened at 29 which is also its peak. None of the singles did amazingly well on streaming or the Hot 100 yet in less than 3 months its certified as gold? ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 13:07, 10 October 2020 (UTC)