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Where is the citation for this? Flay has been criticized in some circles for what is perceived as a "culinary chauvinism" because he tries to, in his words, make traditional, long standing recipes "better." ? Skeeter08865 15:32, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I am also curious as to the citation for this sentence, as everything else in this article seems well-referenced. Additionally, it's poorly written as it states "...in his words, make traditional, long standing recipes 'better.;" Since the only word in quotes is "better", the sentence should read "in his word... " Aotcm 00:44, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
I have searched for a citation for claim a couple of times, but I have been unable to find anything. He does often state that he puts his own twist on recipes which can be seen in Throwdown. It seems that he often looses the challenges because the judges don't think his plate fits the traditional definition of the dish. I have never seen him criticized for it or claim that his way is better, just a different take on a classic. Larkworb 01:56, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
According to the IMDB, the episode in question is "Design", which originally aired September 27, 2005. Although rectal cattle prod violations are the kind of thing this series trafficks in, I am treating this claim as vandalism in the absence of a citation. Ribonucleic 20:57, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
The claim that Flay's character was rectally violated by a cattle prod is somewhat true. I was skeptical, so I watched the episode in question. Flay's character, listed as "Leo Ashford" by IMDB, is a restauranteur who "owns the hottest restaurant in New York". Ashford is one of several high-profile wealthy men who are drugged with Rohypnol by a stalker, who then harvests their sperm via electroejaculation—a procedure involving a rectally-inserted electric probe. While being briefed about the attacks on the men, Capt. Donald Cragen (played by Dann Florek) asks, "Any nightmares about cattle prods?" The instrument is referred to as a "cattle prod" at least once more in the episode.
I didn't add this information to the article, because I'm not sure how to cite it, other than to refer people to the episode itself. Maybe citing a script or transcript of the episode? -- 68.63.24.45 19:41, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Is it opinion, I'll give you that Calton, but any fact is indeed an opinion that a majority of people believe. The stated item in this article that every piece of equipment is sacred in Japan is a crock and the real reason Morimoto was upset is mostly because of unprofessionalism but also because of Flay's standing and popularity in the world dispite his lack of true culinary experience. Half of the items under "Publicity" are opinion. It is truth that his parents are rich, his father was one of the owners of the restaurant he claims to have worked at. He has used cocaine as well, though I won't spout that on a page. Most encylpedia articles are fair and balanced, something wikipedia has never obtained. As what is stated here about Mr. Flay is mostly half-truths skewed to make him look good, I felt a bit of well known opinions should be placed as to balance things out.
To replace the sections that were removed for anyone who is intereted:
"In the eyes of the American public Flay is a hero to many, though in the eyes of true culinary professionals he is an afront to the cooking senses. Morimoto's anger was not just because of flay standing on a cutting board, but because of his rashness and narrisicism, two of Flay's prominent traits. He gained both his fame and cooking reputation by using his family's money to gain culinary certifications and open his restaurants. Though self confidence is a large part of most chef's lives, Flay often goes to disrespectful extremes and has a superiority complex, thinking all other chefs are inferior. Though it is a very blunt statement, to most chefs he is a rich kid celebrity with little cooking prowess." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zanduar ( talk • contribs) 05:18, 28 April 2006
I understand fair and balanced and factual, of which this is not:
"Not realizing that all cooking instruments are sacred in Japan, he greatly angered Iron Chef Morimoto who criticized his professionalism, saying that Flay was "not a chef". After all this, Flay lost the battle, but the rivalry between him and Morimoto had just begun.
Flay challenged Morimoto to a rematch in Morimoto's native Japan. In this battle, at the end of the hour, Flay threw his cutting board across the room and stood on the counter yet again to raise the roof with the audience. This time, Flay won. Though they share a heated past, Flay and Morimoto, who are both Iron Chefs on Iron Chef America, are now friends."
Cooking equipment is "sacred" to all chefs, not just the Japanese. A knife or cutting board shouldn't be mistreated or misused. In Japan many things are "sacred" as its the Japanese culture to show respect and honor in almost everything they do and someone from Japan would be equally upset if you misused a telephone or ate food quickly without tasting it. The exact quote from Morimoto is "He is not a chef! In Japan, the cutting board and the knife is sacred. NO, he is not a chef!"
In the second paragraph we see pure hersay, that Morimoto and Flay are friends, something that only the two of them would know. Most likely they aren't, but that Morimoto played nice on camera to show respect and not dishonor himself.
I could disect the rest of the article, which has alot of minor flaws when it comes to facts, but I have more important things to do.
As for true culinary professionals, yes there are a few organizations, the ACF being one of them. They have certification programs and do talk about the current culinary world, especially the way the modern public views us because of TV chefs (who are generally not chefs at all). It would be absurd to think that a letter was sent out mudslinging Flay, but if you ask a chef who knows or has met Flay (which I have) then almost all of them will tell you things far worse then what I've mentioned here. Zanduar 17:03, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
The 'super chef' link just redirects to celebrity chef, yet the article makes it sound like a 'super chef' is something different. The terms means nothing to me so this needs to be clarified. -- Alexxx1 ( talk/ contribs) 03:16, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Anyone have win/loss stats on Bobby Flay's Throwdown show? David Bergan 03:44, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
Currently the article has contradicting dates of birth for Flay, 12/10/64 and 12/11/64. A Yahoo! group says 12/10 [1], but IMDb says 10/09/64 [2]. The Google search for "bobby flay date of birth" puts WP's article first, and for some reason it says "Bobby Flay — Date of Birth: October 9, 1964". Gonna go with IMDb's take, should try to find more sources that agree. 71.205.107.239 03:21, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
Although this looks like it is vandalism, I will make a note of it here and state that without documentation it would be inappropriate to make such a claim about a living person. Nightclerk 04:31, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
What is the origin of his surname? Badagnani ( talk) 05:22, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
Is he part German? He said on Throwdown (meatball throwdown, June 17, 2008) that his grandmother made sauerbraten rather than meatballs. Badagnani ( talk) 01:16, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
"As The New York Times reported, "An early draft of Bar Americain's menu had a beet and goat cheese salad with lentils, but Mr. Flay rejected it before the restaurant opened. 'When I go on vacation, they run specials on lentils,' he said."[6] In 2007, Flay stated that he had "made peace" with lentils.[7] Flay also dislikes fiddlehead ferns, stating that they "taste like grass."[8]"
but that is where it's presently situated. Anyone have a notion for a better placement? Irish Melkite ( talk) 00:48, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
Does anyone know if Flay is a Master Chef? I don't completely understand the title yet other than it's given after an eight to ten day test. I can't find anything other than a few articles (which are most likely mistaken) that Flay is a Master Chef. While Master Chef is a title given in the industry, it's not crazy to think that people would think that someone is a master at what they do and a chef; therefore they're a master chef. I can't find an actual list of certified master chefs but if he is, I think it needs to be added. If not, I don't think it should be mentioned that he's not as there are only 50-60 in the US. OlYeller Talktome 15:57, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
What's the point of saying on Iron Chef he lost a recent battle. Thats POV right there and is not needed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.2.40.7 ( talk) 05:25, May 17, 2009 (UTC)
I don't know if it is notable enough but on CSPAN they had a short bit showing a fathers day meal out on the white house lawn that took place on Friday, June 19, 2009 where the president mentioned Bobby Flay was cooking the meal. I did see Bobby Flay a couple times in the video.
Link: http://www.slashfood.com/2009/06/20/obama-grills-with-bobby-flay/
http://www.necn.com/Boston/Politics/2009/06/19/Commander-and-Chef-Obama/1245444636.html Jared555 ( talk) 06:05, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
I am interested to know HOW Bobby Flay became involved with the Food Network. There is no information as to the series of events that lead to his prominence on the network.
Stacy Cuthbertson 99.159.195.134 ( talk) 03:31, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
"At age 8, Flay asked for an Easy-Bake Oven for Christmas, against his father's objections, who thought a G.I. Joe would be more gender-appropriate. He ended up getting both."
This statement is unsourced and adds no value to the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.15.30.125 ( talk) 22:10, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
Is he brothers with Kevin O'Connor from The Old House? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.173.254.69 ( talk) 23:12, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
I did some Google-fu on Ishaan Gupta, and couldn't find anything on this "legendary" chef, so I looked up all the cites and they have no information on him and literally copy word for word the line in the wiki. So I have doubts as to his "legendary" status, and I even have doubts to his existence, so could some one with better google-fu than I look this Gupta guy up, thanks.
66.205.158.229 ( talk) 21:47, 1 September 2014 (UTC)A.C. Citizen
Any source for the assertion he played for Utah jazz? I can't find any verification 50.34.154.97 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:47, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
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He only learned the "culinary arts" after culinary school? What did they teach him there? Comportment? French? -- Richardson mcphillips ( talk) 14:07, 18 November 2016 (UTC)
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The Bobby's Burger Palace in Burlington, MA closed on 12/28/16, please remove it from his current restaurant list.
Source: https://boston.eater.com/2017/1/4/14165144/bobby-flay-burger-restaurant-burlington-closed 208.118.234.226 ( talk) 14:09, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
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This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Bobby Flay article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
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This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
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Where is the citation for this? Flay has been criticized in some circles for what is perceived as a "culinary chauvinism" because he tries to, in his words, make traditional, long standing recipes "better." ? Skeeter08865 15:32, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I am also curious as to the citation for this sentence, as everything else in this article seems well-referenced. Additionally, it's poorly written as it states "...in his words, make traditional, long standing recipes 'better.;" Since the only word in quotes is "better", the sentence should read "in his word... " Aotcm 00:44, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
I have searched for a citation for claim a couple of times, but I have been unable to find anything. He does often state that he puts his own twist on recipes which can be seen in Throwdown. It seems that he often looses the challenges because the judges don't think his plate fits the traditional definition of the dish. I have never seen him criticized for it or claim that his way is better, just a different take on a classic. Larkworb 01:56, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
According to the IMDB, the episode in question is "Design", which originally aired September 27, 2005. Although rectal cattle prod violations are the kind of thing this series trafficks in, I am treating this claim as vandalism in the absence of a citation. Ribonucleic 20:57, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
The claim that Flay's character was rectally violated by a cattle prod is somewhat true. I was skeptical, so I watched the episode in question. Flay's character, listed as "Leo Ashford" by IMDB, is a restauranteur who "owns the hottest restaurant in New York". Ashford is one of several high-profile wealthy men who are drugged with Rohypnol by a stalker, who then harvests their sperm via electroejaculation—a procedure involving a rectally-inserted electric probe. While being briefed about the attacks on the men, Capt. Donald Cragen (played by Dann Florek) asks, "Any nightmares about cattle prods?" The instrument is referred to as a "cattle prod" at least once more in the episode.
I didn't add this information to the article, because I'm not sure how to cite it, other than to refer people to the episode itself. Maybe citing a script or transcript of the episode? -- 68.63.24.45 19:41, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Is it opinion, I'll give you that Calton, but any fact is indeed an opinion that a majority of people believe. The stated item in this article that every piece of equipment is sacred in Japan is a crock and the real reason Morimoto was upset is mostly because of unprofessionalism but also because of Flay's standing and popularity in the world dispite his lack of true culinary experience. Half of the items under "Publicity" are opinion. It is truth that his parents are rich, his father was one of the owners of the restaurant he claims to have worked at. He has used cocaine as well, though I won't spout that on a page. Most encylpedia articles are fair and balanced, something wikipedia has never obtained. As what is stated here about Mr. Flay is mostly half-truths skewed to make him look good, I felt a bit of well known opinions should be placed as to balance things out.
To replace the sections that were removed for anyone who is intereted:
"In the eyes of the American public Flay is a hero to many, though in the eyes of true culinary professionals he is an afront to the cooking senses. Morimoto's anger was not just because of flay standing on a cutting board, but because of his rashness and narrisicism, two of Flay's prominent traits. He gained both his fame and cooking reputation by using his family's money to gain culinary certifications and open his restaurants. Though self confidence is a large part of most chef's lives, Flay often goes to disrespectful extremes and has a superiority complex, thinking all other chefs are inferior. Though it is a very blunt statement, to most chefs he is a rich kid celebrity with little cooking prowess." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zanduar ( talk • contribs) 05:18, 28 April 2006
I understand fair and balanced and factual, of which this is not:
"Not realizing that all cooking instruments are sacred in Japan, he greatly angered Iron Chef Morimoto who criticized his professionalism, saying that Flay was "not a chef". After all this, Flay lost the battle, but the rivalry between him and Morimoto had just begun.
Flay challenged Morimoto to a rematch in Morimoto's native Japan. In this battle, at the end of the hour, Flay threw his cutting board across the room and stood on the counter yet again to raise the roof with the audience. This time, Flay won. Though they share a heated past, Flay and Morimoto, who are both Iron Chefs on Iron Chef America, are now friends."
Cooking equipment is "sacred" to all chefs, not just the Japanese. A knife or cutting board shouldn't be mistreated or misused. In Japan many things are "sacred" as its the Japanese culture to show respect and honor in almost everything they do and someone from Japan would be equally upset if you misused a telephone or ate food quickly without tasting it. The exact quote from Morimoto is "He is not a chef! In Japan, the cutting board and the knife is sacred. NO, he is not a chef!"
In the second paragraph we see pure hersay, that Morimoto and Flay are friends, something that only the two of them would know. Most likely they aren't, but that Morimoto played nice on camera to show respect and not dishonor himself.
I could disect the rest of the article, which has alot of minor flaws when it comes to facts, but I have more important things to do.
As for true culinary professionals, yes there are a few organizations, the ACF being one of them. They have certification programs and do talk about the current culinary world, especially the way the modern public views us because of TV chefs (who are generally not chefs at all). It would be absurd to think that a letter was sent out mudslinging Flay, but if you ask a chef who knows or has met Flay (which I have) then almost all of them will tell you things far worse then what I've mentioned here. Zanduar 17:03, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
The 'super chef' link just redirects to celebrity chef, yet the article makes it sound like a 'super chef' is something different. The terms means nothing to me so this needs to be clarified. -- Alexxx1 ( talk/ contribs) 03:16, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Anyone have win/loss stats on Bobby Flay's Throwdown show? David Bergan 03:44, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
Currently the article has contradicting dates of birth for Flay, 12/10/64 and 12/11/64. A Yahoo! group says 12/10 [1], but IMDb says 10/09/64 [2]. The Google search for "bobby flay date of birth" puts WP's article first, and for some reason it says "Bobby Flay — Date of Birth: October 9, 1964". Gonna go with IMDb's take, should try to find more sources that agree. 71.205.107.239 03:21, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
Although this looks like it is vandalism, I will make a note of it here and state that without documentation it would be inappropriate to make such a claim about a living person. Nightclerk 04:31, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
What is the origin of his surname? Badagnani ( talk) 05:22, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
Is he part German? He said on Throwdown (meatball throwdown, June 17, 2008) that his grandmother made sauerbraten rather than meatballs. Badagnani ( talk) 01:16, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
"As The New York Times reported, "An early draft of Bar Americain's menu had a beet and goat cheese salad with lentils, but Mr. Flay rejected it before the restaurant opened. 'When I go on vacation, they run specials on lentils,' he said."[6] In 2007, Flay stated that he had "made peace" with lentils.[7] Flay also dislikes fiddlehead ferns, stating that they "taste like grass."[8]"
but that is where it's presently situated. Anyone have a notion for a better placement? Irish Melkite ( talk) 00:48, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
Does anyone know if Flay is a Master Chef? I don't completely understand the title yet other than it's given after an eight to ten day test. I can't find anything other than a few articles (which are most likely mistaken) that Flay is a Master Chef. While Master Chef is a title given in the industry, it's not crazy to think that people would think that someone is a master at what they do and a chef; therefore they're a master chef. I can't find an actual list of certified master chefs but if he is, I think it needs to be added. If not, I don't think it should be mentioned that he's not as there are only 50-60 in the US. OlYeller Talktome 15:57, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
What's the point of saying on Iron Chef he lost a recent battle. Thats POV right there and is not needed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.2.40.7 ( talk) 05:25, May 17, 2009 (UTC)
I don't know if it is notable enough but on CSPAN they had a short bit showing a fathers day meal out on the white house lawn that took place on Friday, June 19, 2009 where the president mentioned Bobby Flay was cooking the meal. I did see Bobby Flay a couple times in the video.
Link: http://www.slashfood.com/2009/06/20/obama-grills-with-bobby-flay/
http://www.necn.com/Boston/Politics/2009/06/19/Commander-and-Chef-Obama/1245444636.html Jared555 ( talk) 06:05, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
I am interested to know HOW Bobby Flay became involved with the Food Network. There is no information as to the series of events that lead to his prominence on the network.
Stacy Cuthbertson 99.159.195.134 ( talk) 03:31, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
"At age 8, Flay asked for an Easy-Bake Oven for Christmas, against his father's objections, who thought a G.I. Joe would be more gender-appropriate. He ended up getting both."
This statement is unsourced and adds no value to the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.15.30.125 ( talk) 22:10, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
Is he brothers with Kevin O'Connor from The Old House? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.173.254.69 ( talk) 23:12, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
I did some Google-fu on Ishaan Gupta, and couldn't find anything on this "legendary" chef, so I looked up all the cites and they have no information on him and literally copy word for word the line in the wiki. So I have doubts as to his "legendary" status, and I even have doubts to his existence, so could some one with better google-fu than I look this Gupta guy up, thanks.
66.205.158.229 ( talk) 21:47, 1 September 2014 (UTC)A.C. Citizen
Any source for the assertion he played for Utah jazz? I can't find any verification 50.34.154.97 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:47, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
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He only learned the "culinary arts" after culinary school? What did they teach him there? Comportment? French? -- Richardson mcphillips ( talk) 14:07, 18 November 2016 (UTC)
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The Bobby's Burger Palace in Burlington, MA closed on 12/28/16, please remove it from his current restaurant list.
Source: https://boston.eater.com/2017/1/4/14165144/bobby-flay-burger-restaurant-burlington-closed 208.118.234.226 ( talk) 14:09, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
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