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Who was English's deputy leader? -- Midnight tonight 01:24, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
Roger Sowry was his deputy. There is also a chronology error on this page, English's charity boxing happened in the run up to the 2002 election not after-- NZHack 23:02, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
There is absolutely no reason to post the names of Bill English's children or any relationship his wife might have with various outside groups. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.22.18.241 ( talk) 09:14, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
You have included a large number of things about Bill English's positions on a number of moral issues without citing any sources for your contentions at all. This is really a violation of the terms of Wiki's biography standards. Cite them or take them down - as it is, this is all opinion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.197.43.2 ( talk • contribs)
I think it is fine to say his wife is a doctor. I doubt it is reasonable to attribute any of her beliefs to him without objective evidence. If you think Mary English deserves her own page, start one.
I also notice that earlier comments about why the changes were made have been deleted. Did you do this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.197.43.2 ( talk • contribs)
I'm sorry, you may be acting in good faith but the source quoted supports the idea that he completely separates faith and his political role. Specifically: "English doesn't talk easily about his faith. It is personal and the personal and the political are separate, he says." This does not support your edit, which has his faith influencing his positions. Perhaps you should find a different source to support this contention if you insist on having it at all. I'd rather see it gone. It is controversial and not supported - or, at best, weakly supported by some rhetoric used by James in the piece (but not attributable directly to English), which is opinion only. Aweipogf ( talk) 00:19, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
I dunno. It's a charged and contentious allegation and it really is not supported by the article. Saying values have spiritual roots is not the same as saying or suggesting Catholic doctrine informs his political decisions in any way. This is aggravated by use of the allegation that he believes his religious beliefs are "not of public interest" rather than that he keeps them to one side. That really is a distortion. It is enough to say, as James says he did, that he believes "the personal and the political are separate." I encourage you to think about this all in terms of Wiki's guidelines on the biographies of living persons. Aweipogf ( talk) 07:34, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
It's a matter of implication, for me, more than anything. Cleary, James is telling a story - and it's a good story - but the direct quotes don't fully support his analysis. When it comes to the influence of the Church, for example, there's also this: "I go to mass every week. I don't understand all the theology and any religious faith is a continuous wrestle with doubt..." I certainly don't mind the line that you've suggested, Muchness, if you both/all think there's a need to discuss this aspect of his faith at all at the top. Perhaps my own Catholicism (though long lapsed) is making me overly sensitive, here. Aweipogf ( talk) 00:03, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
I suspect the problem will come in trying to assess the degree to which any faith's position on issues (eg, evolution) actually informs a politician's decisions, but I agree it could be of considerable interest if it could be strongly demonstrated as a causal factor. Aweipogf ( talk) 17:35, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
Just wondering if there are any citations that could be added to give support for this somewhat loaded statement: While Brash lacked overwhelming popularity, the electorate perceived English as highly ineffectual and prone to embarrassing mistakes. -- Asgar12 ( talk) 23:48, 8 July 2009 (UTC)
I'd still like to see some sort of supporting documentation from a credible source for this statement. As it stands, it seems to me to be the author's interpretation of a PM popularity poll. I'd also like clarification of what "the electorate" means here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Asgar12 ( talk • contribs) 22:56, 7 November 2009 (UTC)
English is an active Roman Catholic, opposes abortion, opposes voluntary euthanasia, opposes physician assisted suicide, opposes civil unions and opposes decriminalisation of prostitution, but considers his religious beliefs personal and separate from politics? Really? Kaiwhakahaere ( talk) 03:02, 1 October 2009 (UTC)
Is it worth adding a section on Bill English's phonecalls to TVNZ? It seems fairly well documented now that he called a high ranking TVNZ official and called him a 7-letter word following by a 4-letter word beginning with c. If such a section is added does it go against Wikipedia policy to print what he is purported to have said in full? Bactoid ( talk) 10:03, 27 October 2009 (UTC)
His place of birth is shown as Lumsden but the entry for Dipton says he was born there. But then the entry for Lumsden says he was born there. A crossword clue in the New Zealand newspaper The Wellingtonian (Dec.8 2015) asks what his home town was and the answer that fits is Dipton. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.31.171.92 ( talk) 16:37, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
So it could be that his birthplace was Lumsden but his home town was Lumsden.
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The current infobox image isn't bad, but it was taken in 2005. I've found and uploaded a couple newer images from Flickr, both from September 2016. Both are quite good quality as well, although the backgrounds are a little distracting (one has another person's face, the other has writing). What are people's preferences? IgnorantArmies (talk) 10:38, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
Media are reporting the English is now the new Prime Minister of NZ, but there seems to be come confusion over this, and some disagreement. For example, I have the BBC News app on my phone, which sent me an alert just now, that reads "Bill English is confirmed as New Zealand's new Prime Minister, after John Key's surprise resignation". But an anonymous user is arguing that this is not the case at present, as he has not been sworn in, and this will not happen for a few hours. So, can we have some clarity on the situation? I know this seems a small point as it won't matter in a few hours from now, but this scenario is bound to occur again when we have a change of PM in another country. This is Paul ( talk) 23:24, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
{{ITN nom}}- Ad Orientem ( talk) 01:25, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
There seems to be some disagreement over whether or not Bill English is the 39th Prime Minister of New Zealand, or the 39th leader of NZ. It's worth noting that articles such as Helen Clark and John Key identify them as the 37th and 38th Prime Ministers of NZ respectively, so maybe we should have some consistency. Either follow what we've done before or change the other articles. Any thoughts? This is Paul ( talk) 22:53, 18 December 2016 (UTC)
Quick question. Now he's Leader of the Opposition again, do we now refer to him as both the 29th Leader of the Opposition and 37th Leader of the Opposition (as the two terms are several years apart), or is he just 29th Leader of the Opposition? I tweaked the infobox accordingly to reflect the two terms, but I'm not really too sure. Any thoughts? This is Paul ( talk) 22:01, 25 October 2017 (UTC)
Page describes him as a farmer. Is that an accurate call? Dairyflat ( talk) 03:05, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
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Please change "Fifth National Government (2008–present)" to "Fifth National Government (2008–2017)", because the National party lost the general election and are currently in opposition to a Labour-Led Government. Skeletonkilljoy2 ( talk) 06:09, 7 November 2017 (UTC)
Can’t we just put his position as leader of the opposition at the top? He is currently leader of the opposition and so it’s misleading for readers to be shown that his last position was as prime minister Masterpha ( talk) 10:00, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
A dispute has arisen between @ Schwede66: and me over how the resignation should be worded. For the benefit of those whose first language may not be English, the announcement of a resignation does not point backwards to something that has happened and is now over. It points to an ongoing process which starts at the time the announcement is made and continues while the resigner closes unfinished matters on his/her desk, takes part in the process of selecting the successor, and (usually) participates in a farewell ceremony. Resignation is not a fait accompli at the time of the announcement. Akld guy ( talk) 23:52, 12 February 2018 (UTC)
Has he resigned as leader? I haven't read the sources, Akld guy, but listened to the live broadcast on RNZ. English said, in answer to a question, that he will remain party leader until 27 Feb. Schwede 66 00:05, 13 February 2018 (UTC)
Nurg, are you sure that "Sir William English" is the correct style for the infobox? I can see that he would be referred to as "Sir William", but is "William" still to be used when the surname is added? Hardly anybody knows him as William English. Schwede 66 04:16, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
Ok, I've had a look on Google. Searching for "Sir William English" produces many more results than searching for "Sir Bill English". For the former, only the NZ Herald refers to our previous PM as William; everything else seems to be about people in England's history. For the latter, all other media outlet seem to refer to Sir Bill English. From a common name perspective (ok, it's only been half a day), Sir Bill wins. MOS:HONORIFIC isn't of any use. I shall do similar searches for Rowling and Birch. Schwede 66 09:50, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
What should Sir Bill's "Official website" link be? The current link is
Anyone wish to be bold and change it? Jim1138 ( talk) 05:47, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
They refer to Bill English, a computer scientist, not the former Prime Minister of New Zealand — Preceding unsigned comment added by 150.107.173.91 ( talk) 01:49, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 01:50, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Bill English article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
![]() | This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | A news item involving Bill English was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the In the news section on the following dates: | ![]() |
Who was English's deputy leader? -- Midnight tonight 01:24, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
Roger Sowry was his deputy. There is also a chronology error on this page, English's charity boxing happened in the run up to the 2002 election not after-- NZHack 23:02, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
There is absolutely no reason to post the names of Bill English's children or any relationship his wife might have with various outside groups. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.22.18.241 ( talk) 09:14, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
You have included a large number of things about Bill English's positions on a number of moral issues without citing any sources for your contentions at all. This is really a violation of the terms of Wiki's biography standards. Cite them or take them down - as it is, this is all opinion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.197.43.2 ( talk • contribs)
I think it is fine to say his wife is a doctor. I doubt it is reasonable to attribute any of her beliefs to him without objective evidence. If you think Mary English deserves her own page, start one.
I also notice that earlier comments about why the changes were made have been deleted. Did you do this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.197.43.2 ( talk • contribs)
I'm sorry, you may be acting in good faith but the source quoted supports the idea that he completely separates faith and his political role. Specifically: "English doesn't talk easily about his faith. It is personal and the personal and the political are separate, he says." This does not support your edit, which has his faith influencing his positions. Perhaps you should find a different source to support this contention if you insist on having it at all. I'd rather see it gone. It is controversial and not supported - or, at best, weakly supported by some rhetoric used by James in the piece (but not attributable directly to English), which is opinion only. Aweipogf ( talk) 00:19, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
I dunno. It's a charged and contentious allegation and it really is not supported by the article. Saying values have spiritual roots is not the same as saying or suggesting Catholic doctrine informs his political decisions in any way. This is aggravated by use of the allegation that he believes his religious beliefs are "not of public interest" rather than that he keeps them to one side. That really is a distortion. It is enough to say, as James says he did, that he believes "the personal and the political are separate." I encourage you to think about this all in terms of Wiki's guidelines on the biographies of living persons. Aweipogf ( talk) 07:34, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
It's a matter of implication, for me, more than anything. Cleary, James is telling a story - and it's a good story - but the direct quotes don't fully support his analysis. When it comes to the influence of the Church, for example, there's also this: "I go to mass every week. I don't understand all the theology and any religious faith is a continuous wrestle with doubt..." I certainly don't mind the line that you've suggested, Muchness, if you both/all think there's a need to discuss this aspect of his faith at all at the top. Perhaps my own Catholicism (though long lapsed) is making me overly sensitive, here. Aweipogf ( talk) 00:03, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
I suspect the problem will come in trying to assess the degree to which any faith's position on issues (eg, evolution) actually informs a politician's decisions, but I agree it could be of considerable interest if it could be strongly demonstrated as a causal factor. Aweipogf ( talk) 17:35, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
Just wondering if there are any citations that could be added to give support for this somewhat loaded statement: While Brash lacked overwhelming popularity, the electorate perceived English as highly ineffectual and prone to embarrassing mistakes. -- Asgar12 ( talk) 23:48, 8 July 2009 (UTC)
I'd still like to see some sort of supporting documentation from a credible source for this statement. As it stands, it seems to me to be the author's interpretation of a PM popularity poll. I'd also like clarification of what "the electorate" means here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Asgar12 ( talk • contribs) 22:56, 7 November 2009 (UTC)
English is an active Roman Catholic, opposes abortion, opposes voluntary euthanasia, opposes physician assisted suicide, opposes civil unions and opposes decriminalisation of prostitution, but considers his religious beliefs personal and separate from politics? Really? Kaiwhakahaere ( talk) 03:02, 1 October 2009 (UTC)
Is it worth adding a section on Bill English's phonecalls to TVNZ? It seems fairly well documented now that he called a high ranking TVNZ official and called him a 7-letter word following by a 4-letter word beginning with c. If such a section is added does it go against Wikipedia policy to print what he is purported to have said in full? Bactoid ( talk) 10:03, 27 October 2009 (UTC)
His place of birth is shown as Lumsden but the entry for Dipton says he was born there. But then the entry for Lumsden says he was born there. A crossword clue in the New Zealand newspaper The Wellingtonian (Dec.8 2015) asks what his home town was and the answer that fits is Dipton. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.31.171.92 ( talk) 16:37, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
So it could be that his birthplace was Lumsden but his home town was Lumsden.
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Bill English. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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).
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
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(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 09:03, 2 November 2016 (UTC)
The current infobox image isn't bad, but it was taken in 2005. I've found and uploaded a couple newer images from Flickr, both from September 2016. Both are quite good quality as well, although the backgrounds are a little distracting (one has another person's face, the other has writing). What are people's preferences? IgnorantArmies (talk) 10:38, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
Media are reporting the English is now the new Prime Minister of NZ, but there seems to be come confusion over this, and some disagreement. For example, I have the BBC News app on my phone, which sent me an alert just now, that reads "Bill English is confirmed as New Zealand's new Prime Minister, after John Key's surprise resignation". But an anonymous user is arguing that this is not the case at present, as he has not been sworn in, and this will not happen for a few hours. So, can we have some clarity on the situation? I know this seems a small point as it won't matter in a few hours from now, but this scenario is bound to occur again when we have a change of PM in another country. This is Paul ( talk) 23:24, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
{{ITN nom}}- Ad Orientem ( talk) 01:25, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
There seems to be some disagreement over whether or not Bill English is the 39th Prime Minister of New Zealand, or the 39th leader of NZ. It's worth noting that articles such as Helen Clark and John Key identify them as the 37th and 38th Prime Ministers of NZ respectively, so maybe we should have some consistency. Either follow what we've done before or change the other articles. Any thoughts? This is Paul ( talk) 22:53, 18 December 2016 (UTC)
Quick question. Now he's Leader of the Opposition again, do we now refer to him as both the 29th Leader of the Opposition and 37th Leader of the Opposition (as the two terms are several years apart), or is he just 29th Leader of the Opposition? I tweaked the infobox accordingly to reflect the two terms, but I'm not really too sure. Any thoughts? This is Paul ( talk) 22:01, 25 October 2017 (UTC)
Page describes him as a farmer. Is that an accurate call? Dairyflat ( talk) 03:05, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please change "Fifth National Government (2008–present)" to "Fifth National Government (2008–2017)", because the National party lost the general election and are currently in opposition to a Labour-Led Government. Skeletonkilljoy2 ( talk) 06:09, 7 November 2017 (UTC)
Can’t we just put his position as leader of the opposition at the top? He is currently leader of the opposition and so it’s misleading for readers to be shown that his last position was as prime minister Masterpha ( talk) 10:00, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
A dispute has arisen between @ Schwede66: and me over how the resignation should be worded. For the benefit of those whose first language may not be English, the announcement of a resignation does not point backwards to something that has happened and is now over. It points to an ongoing process which starts at the time the announcement is made and continues while the resigner closes unfinished matters on his/her desk, takes part in the process of selecting the successor, and (usually) participates in a farewell ceremony. Resignation is not a fait accompli at the time of the announcement. Akld guy ( talk) 23:52, 12 February 2018 (UTC)
Has he resigned as leader? I haven't read the sources, Akld guy, but listened to the live broadcast on RNZ. English said, in answer to a question, that he will remain party leader until 27 Feb. Schwede 66 00:05, 13 February 2018 (UTC)
Nurg, are you sure that "Sir William English" is the correct style for the infobox? I can see that he would be referred to as "Sir William", but is "William" still to be used when the surname is added? Hardly anybody knows him as William English. Schwede 66 04:16, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
Ok, I've had a look on Google. Searching for "Sir William English" produces many more results than searching for "Sir Bill English". For the former, only the NZ Herald refers to our previous PM as William; everything else seems to be about people in England's history. For the latter, all other media outlet seem to refer to Sir Bill English. From a common name perspective (ok, it's only been half a day), Sir Bill wins. MOS:HONORIFIC isn't of any use. I shall do similar searches for Rowling and Birch. Schwede 66 09:50, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
What should Sir Bill's "Official website" link be? The current link is
Anyone wish to be bold and change it? Jim1138 ( talk) 05:47, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
They refer to Bill English, a computer scientist, not the former Prime Minister of New Zealand — Preceding unsigned comment added by 150.107.173.91 ( talk) 01:49, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 01:50, 1 December 2021 (UTC)