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The more I read about Wikipedia and realize its power the more I respect folks for working with it. I do, however, disagree with your removing my additions on 1 August. Not wishing to sound upset by any means, as I am still learning... Why did you remove it. I thought it might be a bit wordy and wanted to go back to edit it, but I still believe the basic information to be relevant. I am involved in the B&B industry Gnew18 02:43, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
CAIK does not appear to have a website and is not anything more than a discussion group that does get together every so often. IT is not a formal organization with an association as it were behind it. While it is probably helpful for the innkeepers involved it does not really belong here as a resource.
I need to know the definition of turn-key when selling a Bed and Breakfast. Just what is to be left behind when selling a Bed and Breakfast turnkey? I have received three different answers so one more would help.
Thank you —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.119.230.86 ( talk • contribs) .
If you have already sign the contract without clarification of what will be included, then you are depending on the sellers to be gracious and leave you with everything needed to help you succeed. If the previous owners help with the financing, they may be more inclined to leave you with more items.
Regarding External links on this article: Please see Wikpedia's External links guideline:
Note that anyone who can find their way to Wikipedia can also Google "Bed and breakfast". However, if editors really feel that we need to help our readers find commercial establishments, see
Also note from this article's history, that every time a few links are added, they are immediately joined by half a dozen more. I would propose that we have no links at all, for the reasons given, or at most a dmoz link, if we really think that our readers are too feeble to find their way to Google results.
I would, of course, make an exception of the sort of link that External links are really meant for, that is, a page discussing, say, the history of such establishments. -- Mwanner | Talk 16:40, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I would like more of the B&B history. Stephanie — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stephanie Do ( talk • contribs) 20:05, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
According to the relevant Wikipedia article, DMOZ recently suffered a catastrophic failure, and I have pointed this out in the external links that I have re-instated this morning.
I clarify that I have no commercial interest in DMOZ, privatestay.com or Bedandbreakfast.com other than the probability that some of their programmers, shareholders, officers and contributors may have been or currently are private clients.
My interest in all this is, presumably, identical to most users of Wikipedia: to have a useful, accurate and growing resource.
Finally, may I say that I am disappointed that nobody has commented upon my suggestion that "rather than throw the baby out with the bath water and have no links at all, is there no process by which two or three links can be chosen on objective criteria and then locked down?" Gaimhreadhan 03:06, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I saw Gaimhreadhan's request for page-protection at WP:RFPP. I just wanted to intervene and add my personal view on the issue. I believe the external links are fine. There's no advertising, and it appears to be helpful to other users who may need information on bed and breakfast places. Just my opinion, though. I'm still fully protecting the page, and you guys let me know when you reach a consensus/decision. Nishkid 64 22:05, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
I would also like to make the following concrete proposals for external links on the renamed Bed and Breakfast article:
1) Reinstate the DMOZ external link
2) Reach agreement in principle to having ONE authoritative, global and up-to-date external link for at least as long as DMOZ is broken.
3) Reach agreement in principle to having the minimum number of regional directory links if the consensus is that ONE authoritative, global and up-to-date external link does not yet exist and for at least as long as DMOZ is broken.
4) Try and reach a consensus here as to which external link(s) conform to (2) and (3) above.
5) If and when a consensus has been reached, submit that consensus to Nishkid 64 so that he can incorporate those two or three external links in the protected page if he deems it appropriate.
6) Explore whether it is technically possible to then open up the article for normal editing but retain the protection only on the external links section. Gaimhreadhan 00:35, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
OK, now that we have a cease-fire, I thought it might make sense to put together a joint final position, with the (faint) hope that we might actually come to an agreement that way, and (more realistically) that we will at least provide whatever mediators we call on with a more concise statement of positions, so they don't have to wade through all of our diatribes at each other. So, as simply as possible, my position is as follows:
Forgive me for not responding to your points above; I am not at all ready to concede the principles that they call for. -- Mwanner | Talk 00:52, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Two major quibbles:
It is yourself and similar zealots that have made many articles arid and less practically helpful by deleting all external links - so please do not cite those self-same articles as precedent - you have simply worn people down and into resigned submission.
I think we should attempt to reach consensus on my concrete principles first; if we can't it will be inevitably fruitless to attempt to discuss specific external links later.
A minor quibble: It is not myself that originally proposed www.bedandbreakfast.com as an external link. I am rather neutral about it and merely repaired your (perceived) link sabotage spasms.
Apart from those quibbles, you are forgiven.
Now I think it might be instructive to go and look again at the first article I ever edited:
Star Alliance
That article has pertinent external links to more than a score of commercial websites that seek to sell air transport services - principally those of the airline members of that alliance.
Do you seriously think that article would be improved by deleting all those external links?
And if not, please draw the distinction between the (commercial) topics of Airline Alliances and the (commercial) topics of Hosted Accommodation.
Finally, please excuse me if I do not reply for a few days - I have to travel to clients on the other side of the world... Gaimhreadhan 01:21, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
I suggest moving the article to Bed and Breakfast (both Bed, Breakfast capitalised) to conform with Wikipedia naming conventions. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
W. Frank (
talk •
contribs) (but actually made by
Gaimhreadhan, when logged into W. Frank's account by mistake on a shared workstation and a relatively new editor - sorry!)
"In the British Isles where hotel prices are often outrageous". I agree they are outrageous compared with most of the rest of Europe, but this word is probably POV. - —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.238.139.18 ( talk • contribs)
I'm somewhat confused about the baby throw out with the bathwater on this specific topic. While there are no "commercial" link on hotel or motel in a link section, there are multiple links to specific hotels and those specific hotels all link to their commerical external site.
if i can wiki hotel, pop to "library hotel" via embedded link to wiki entry, then pop to the commercial site from there, why would the exclusion of such links be required here?
perhaps do what hotels does, or motels to a greatly lesser extent.
link to several rating, recommendation sites, set up a wiki stub or article on them, then allow the visiter who links bed & breakfasts to be able to get to external information on that lodging as the can for the library hotel, hilton hotel, motel6, etc..
Childhoodtrauma 01:24, 22 January 2007 (UTC)childhood
Reasoning: There have been Justices of the Peace performing non-religious weddings for many many years. B&B's are just trying to stay competitive
Actually there are 20,000 B&B's / Country Inns in the US. Many are located in small towns with no discernible attraction. (Except the owners of the B & B's think there is...) One could say that the more profitable or successful or prominent B & B's are often located in destination towns as alternatives to Hotels and Motels. Very often, smaller B & B's are they are the only lodging in a small town.
...."in some smaller B&Bs they will be expected to be away from the B&B during the main part of the day. This arrangement, however, may not be inconvenient since many popular B&Bs are located in beach and mountain areas, such as Hawaii, New England, and Colorado where daytime recreation and tourism activities are popular."
OK, almost none of the B&Bs in the world are situated in the afforemention U.S. states, or even 'beach and mountain areas.' How about we phrase it "many B&Bs are located in areas which offer a range of tourist and recreation activities"? Mark76uk 22:56, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
Is there any rational for using the term "The North East Atlantic Archipelago" rather than "British Isles". The term is well used and means essentially the same as "British Isles" (indeed the page redirects there). While I appreciate the Irish nationalists (and others) might dislike the alternative is not common, I do not see why a dispute needs to be raised in _this_ article.
I removed it because I believed it caused unnecessary confusion but it was reverted. Caffm8 21:38, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
We are encouraged to be bold - but this does not mean that we should risk being incivil by neglecting to discuss the reasons to make many changes here first: please see Wikipedia:Consensus#Note_on_use_of_discussion_page this policy statement. This is particularly relevant where editors 'parachute' in and out of the article, do not cite any references for change (or only misleading ones in their edit summary) and make changes to consensual text that has no technical errors, does not breach policy or guidelines and that has endured for many months (and, therefore, constitutes the consensual position).
This article is currently written in commonwealth English and there need to be rational arguments advanced to change this. Consequently, unless logical reasons are advanced, I intend to modify some of the recent changes made earlier today in line with the above and as per Wikipedia:Manual of Style#National varieties of English...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ) talk • 09:11, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for adding this section, Gila!...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ) talk • 12:19, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
news site for b&b owners (worldwide site) [[User_talk:rwrhallam| —Preceding
undated comment added 10:46, 10 June 2010 (UTC).
Accommodation for independent travellers (worldwide site)...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ)
talk •
16:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
dmoz open directory project (worldwide site)...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ)
talk •
16:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
B&Bs in Israel, booking directly with owners -
User:Gilabrand
16:42, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
B&B Association of Rome, with international B&B links -
User:Gilabrand
16:42, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
Bed and Breakfasts in Belgium and Netherlands —The preceding
unsigned comment was added by
Raeyos (
talk •
contribs) 18:55, August 23, 2007 (UTC).
Have you checked, Gila, to see if there are any sites in B&Bs in Israel, booking directly with owners and B&B Association of Rome, with international B&B links that are not also replicated in the two prior suggestions?
If there are,I would still see dangers in a national list proliferating - there is the potential for more than 100 external links if only one site per country is allowed. I think we should stick to Worldwide directories, and, if those are insufficiently helpful, a few Regional sites...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ) talk • 16:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
Apart from general article cleanup, it might be worth mentioning the UK situation regarding the use of bed and breakfast for overnight accommodation for the homeless - a commonly exploitative arrangement due to the lack of tenancy rights. See Shelter ( Bed and breakfast hotels). 86.161.33.49 ( talk) 02:02, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
Oppose merge The French concept is quite different, always being located at the heart of a village. Let these two articles evolve separately and respect their cultural differences. Hadrianheugh ( talk) 21:42, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
Merger a good idea. Sorry I don't speak english very well but I think that the french "chambre d'hôtes" may be in a section of "bed and breakfast" as a national difference. Cardabelle ( talk) 12:16, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
Support merge. Per Cardabelle, could easily be accommodated as a national variant (as with the other countries variances listed). At the moment in fact the article has little independent value - focusing as it does on COMPARING chambre d'hôtes to B&Bs. A value which would more readily achieved as a subset of this article than it can as a standalone. Guliolopez ( talk) 17:23, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
Question? -- What exactly is there to merge? Chambre d'hotes has been tagged as unreferenced since 2007. If it remains a distinct article it would be highly vulnerable to a nomination for deletion, on the grounds it does not comply with the verifiability policy and the policy prohibiting original research. If we were to merge that article here, I suggest there is really nothing that could be brought over, because every statement there is unreferenced. Geo Swan ( talk) 16:40, 19 October 2008 (UTC)
This request was added to the wrong talk page (The user was following the request to discuss new ELs but the wrong address was given in the article) I've copied it here for viewing by others - X201 ( talk) 07:54, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
I am keen to add an external link to the Bed_and_Breakfast section which currently has NO external links
www.stay-swaps.com is a new site which has an intention of allowing home owners to trade or swap accommodation and lodging principally bed and breakfast stays.
The site is believed to be unique and is built on principals of home exchange where home owners trade homes at the same time across country or international.
Under a trade of bed and breakfast each party to the trade would trade at different times so some degree of honesty is required.
the web site is free to register offered bed and breakfast stays and those sought, when and where, together with the number of people involved in the trade.
I consider the site and suitable description is sufficiently useful and unique to warrant inclusion in this section.
I welcome comments in support or opposition.
Websi7 ( talk) 09:03, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
"Since 1879 the average per capita disposable income of Australians has been greater than that of New Zealanders"
I know my economic history, and Australian incomes didn't overtake those of NZ until well after the second world war, not until the 1960s - if not later. At the end of the 1800s, NZers had the highest incomes in the world, ahead of Britain, the USA or Australia.
I have changed the sentence to read "Since the 1960s the average per capita disposable income of Australians has been greater than that of New Zealanders"
121.73.7.84 ( talk) 08:44, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
Can User:Travelegia please explain the addition of links to various B&B directories. Particularly in relationship to the following.
Thanks. -- Escape Orbit (Talk) 16:41, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
In case there are any questions or issues with the removal of the "Trade Association" subsections recently - it was done for several reasons:
The section is (now) much better served describing the concept of self-regulation and rating in general. Rather than dealing with the benefits/details of every single B&B trade association. Cheers. Guliolopez ( talk) 17:44, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
To the users (with apparent conflict of interest) who insist on using this encyclopedic article as an advocacy platform for the concept of B&Bs in general, or a specific B&B, B&B type, industry group or whatever, I have a simple message: STOP!. Wikipedia has very clear policies on SPAM and soapboxing. Put simply, Wikipedia articles should not be worded to promote advocacy for anything. As such, there is no place in this article for recently added advertising fluff like the following: "a Bed and Breakfast is much, much more", "(B&B's offer) a unique environment of hospitality", "(B&Bs allow enjoyment of a) visit to the fullest, and – perhaps most of all – to leave guests with a memorable visit that will encourage them to come back year after year." This form of commentary, uncited opinion pushing and SPAM fails several Wikipedia guidelines. So stop pushing these agendas and find another medium to promote your business or industry.
Further, editors who insist on including links to "their" B&B industry group or regulatory body I would add this: There are hundreds of such organisations, and this article is no place to list or link them. There is a longstanding agreement here that new links need to be discussed before being added - to specifically avoid this article becoming a spam-ridden linkfarm.
Wikipedia IS NOT A FREE PROMOTIONAL CHANNEL. (We're interested in objective and verifiable encyclopedic content. Not spam.) Guliolopez ( talk) 11:54, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
Three new studies that have been added today-- while helpful, do you think
They seem to be cluttering the article fairly early in, like before we get to find out what a B&B is we are bombarded with study results.
Suggestions? SimonTrew ( talk) 14:52, 5 April 2009 (UTC)
The External links section which some of you know and love so well (talk here passim) is now all book citations. At the risk of starting a new External links war, should we rename the section to Further Reading or Bibliography or some such (I prefer the former as being simpler)? SimonTrew ( talk) 20:23, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
This article seems like a clearing house for research on bed and breakfast choice worldwide. Is that necessary? Does it add to the understanding of what B&Bs are? A lot of the discussion and analysis feels very much like original research.
As well, I feel there's some dodgy use of numbers in the claim that New Zealand has more B&Bs than Australia based on the number listed on one particular website that itself doesn't seem hugely notable. For a scale of comparison, I checked the breakdown by state in Australia and South Australia apparently has 3 B&Bs, compared to NSW with 10, and the remaining 36 all located in Victoria. Now, it may turn out that there are twelve times as many B&Bs in Victoria than there are in South Australia but unless we have a more reliable method, I'm going to put on my skeptic's hat and say that the B&Bs listed on the site are not a random sample of all Australian B&Bs.
I suspect that the nature of B&Bs means that they more than any other accomodation type are going to be underrepresented on the internet.
Finally, speculation about the reasons that a given area has more B&Bs doesn't become acceptable on wikipedia just because your theory is supported by citable evidence - no original research means you can only present theories that have been published elsewhere. 152.91.9.219 ( talk) 07:38, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
"Spain does not have a B&B culture like Great Britain."
This is true, we have hostales, hoteles, pensiones, and posadas.
B&B's which are intended for those tourists who only speak English and don't want to mix themselves with the "locals". And on top of that, Spaniards love to have dinner very late! At B&B's we'd have to go to bed with empty stomachs, good grief!
Furthermore, citation [5] is quite offensive and lacks scientific approach. Spaniards shake their heads of when they see people behaving like in their own country and not respecting the way of life of the hosting country.
So, why not mentioning that some British expats, or locals - who understand this market - open up B&B for English tourists who don't actually like to be abroad, but do it because of the weather? -- 217.154.84.2 ( talk) 11:37, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
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The more I read about Wikipedia and realize its power the more I respect folks for working with it. I do, however, disagree with your removing my additions on 1 August. Not wishing to sound upset by any means, as I am still learning... Why did you remove it. I thought it might be a bit wordy and wanted to go back to edit it, but I still believe the basic information to be relevant. I am involved in the B&B industry Gnew18 02:43, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
CAIK does not appear to have a website and is not anything more than a discussion group that does get together every so often. IT is not a formal organization with an association as it were behind it. While it is probably helpful for the innkeepers involved it does not really belong here as a resource.
I need to know the definition of turn-key when selling a Bed and Breakfast. Just what is to be left behind when selling a Bed and Breakfast turnkey? I have received three different answers so one more would help.
Thank you —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.119.230.86 ( talk • contribs) .
If you have already sign the contract without clarification of what will be included, then you are depending on the sellers to be gracious and leave you with everything needed to help you succeed. If the previous owners help with the financing, they may be more inclined to leave you with more items.
Regarding External links on this article: Please see Wikpedia's External links guideline:
Note that anyone who can find their way to Wikipedia can also Google "Bed and breakfast". However, if editors really feel that we need to help our readers find commercial establishments, see
Also note from this article's history, that every time a few links are added, they are immediately joined by half a dozen more. I would propose that we have no links at all, for the reasons given, or at most a dmoz link, if we really think that our readers are too feeble to find their way to Google results.
I would, of course, make an exception of the sort of link that External links are really meant for, that is, a page discussing, say, the history of such establishments. -- Mwanner | Talk 16:40, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
I would like more of the B&B history. Stephanie — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stephanie Do ( talk • contribs) 20:05, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
According to the relevant Wikipedia article, DMOZ recently suffered a catastrophic failure, and I have pointed this out in the external links that I have re-instated this morning.
I clarify that I have no commercial interest in DMOZ, privatestay.com or Bedandbreakfast.com other than the probability that some of their programmers, shareholders, officers and contributors may have been or currently are private clients.
My interest in all this is, presumably, identical to most users of Wikipedia: to have a useful, accurate and growing resource.
Finally, may I say that I am disappointed that nobody has commented upon my suggestion that "rather than throw the baby out with the bath water and have no links at all, is there no process by which two or three links can be chosen on objective criteria and then locked down?" Gaimhreadhan 03:06, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I saw Gaimhreadhan's request for page-protection at WP:RFPP. I just wanted to intervene and add my personal view on the issue. I believe the external links are fine. There's no advertising, and it appears to be helpful to other users who may need information on bed and breakfast places. Just my opinion, though. I'm still fully protecting the page, and you guys let me know when you reach a consensus/decision. Nishkid 64 22:05, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
I would also like to make the following concrete proposals for external links on the renamed Bed and Breakfast article:
1) Reinstate the DMOZ external link
2) Reach agreement in principle to having ONE authoritative, global and up-to-date external link for at least as long as DMOZ is broken.
3) Reach agreement in principle to having the minimum number of regional directory links if the consensus is that ONE authoritative, global and up-to-date external link does not yet exist and for at least as long as DMOZ is broken.
4) Try and reach a consensus here as to which external link(s) conform to (2) and (3) above.
5) If and when a consensus has been reached, submit that consensus to Nishkid 64 so that he can incorporate those two or three external links in the protected page if he deems it appropriate.
6) Explore whether it is technically possible to then open up the article for normal editing but retain the protection only on the external links section. Gaimhreadhan 00:35, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
OK, now that we have a cease-fire, I thought it might make sense to put together a joint final position, with the (faint) hope that we might actually come to an agreement that way, and (more realistically) that we will at least provide whatever mediators we call on with a more concise statement of positions, so they don't have to wade through all of our diatribes at each other. So, as simply as possible, my position is as follows:
Forgive me for not responding to your points above; I am not at all ready to concede the principles that they call for. -- Mwanner | Talk 00:52, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Two major quibbles:
It is yourself and similar zealots that have made many articles arid and less practically helpful by deleting all external links - so please do not cite those self-same articles as precedent - you have simply worn people down and into resigned submission.
I think we should attempt to reach consensus on my concrete principles first; if we can't it will be inevitably fruitless to attempt to discuss specific external links later.
A minor quibble: It is not myself that originally proposed www.bedandbreakfast.com as an external link. I am rather neutral about it and merely repaired your (perceived) link sabotage spasms.
Apart from those quibbles, you are forgiven.
Now I think it might be instructive to go and look again at the first article I ever edited:
Star Alliance
That article has pertinent external links to more than a score of commercial websites that seek to sell air transport services - principally those of the airline members of that alliance.
Do you seriously think that article would be improved by deleting all those external links?
And if not, please draw the distinction between the (commercial) topics of Airline Alliances and the (commercial) topics of Hosted Accommodation.
Finally, please excuse me if I do not reply for a few days - I have to travel to clients on the other side of the world... Gaimhreadhan 01:21, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
I suggest moving the article to Bed and Breakfast (both Bed, Breakfast capitalised) to conform with Wikipedia naming conventions. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
W. Frank (
talk •
contribs) (but actually made by
Gaimhreadhan, when logged into W. Frank's account by mistake on a shared workstation and a relatively new editor - sorry!)
"In the British Isles where hotel prices are often outrageous". I agree they are outrageous compared with most of the rest of Europe, but this word is probably POV. - —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.238.139.18 ( talk • contribs)
I'm somewhat confused about the baby throw out with the bathwater on this specific topic. While there are no "commercial" link on hotel or motel in a link section, there are multiple links to specific hotels and those specific hotels all link to their commerical external site.
if i can wiki hotel, pop to "library hotel" via embedded link to wiki entry, then pop to the commercial site from there, why would the exclusion of such links be required here?
perhaps do what hotels does, or motels to a greatly lesser extent.
link to several rating, recommendation sites, set up a wiki stub or article on them, then allow the visiter who links bed & breakfasts to be able to get to external information on that lodging as the can for the library hotel, hilton hotel, motel6, etc..
Childhoodtrauma 01:24, 22 January 2007 (UTC)childhood
Reasoning: There have been Justices of the Peace performing non-religious weddings for many many years. B&B's are just trying to stay competitive
Actually there are 20,000 B&B's / Country Inns in the US. Many are located in small towns with no discernible attraction. (Except the owners of the B & B's think there is...) One could say that the more profitable or successful or prominent B & B's are often located in destination towns as alternatives to Hotels and Motels. Very often, smaller B & B's are they are the only lodging in a small town.
...."in some smaller B&Bs they will be expected to be away from the B&B during the main part of the day. This arrangement, however, may not be inconvenient since many popular B&Bs are located in beach and mountain areas, such as Hawaii, New England, and Colorado where daytime recreation and tourism activities are popular."
OK, almost none of the B&Bs in the world are situated in the afforemention U.S. states, or even 'beach and mountain areas.' How about we phrase it "many B&Bs are located in areas which offer a range of tourist and recreation activities"? Mark76uk 22:56, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
Is there any rational for using the term "The North East Atlantic Archipelago" rather than "British Isles". The term is well used and means essentially the same as "British Isles" (indeed the page redirects there). While I appreciate the Irish nationalists (and others) might dislike the alternative is not common, I do not see why a dispute needs to be raised in _this_ article.
I removed it because I believed it caused unnecessary confusion but it was reverted. Caffm8 21:38, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
We are encouraged to be bold - but this does not mean that we should risk being incivil by neglecting to discuss the reasons to make many changes here first: please see Wikipedia:Consensus#Note_on_use_of_discussion_page this policy statement. This is particularly relevant where editors 'parachute' in and out of the article, do not cite any references for change (or only misleading ones in their edit summary) and make changes to consensual text that has no technical errors, does not breach policy or guidelines and that has endured for many months (and, therefore, constitutes the consensual position).
This article is currently written in commonwealth English and there need to be rational arguments advanced to change this. Consequently, unless logical reasons are advanced, I intend to modify some of the recent changes made earlier today in line with the above and as per Wikipedia:Manual of Style#National varieties of English...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ) talk • 09:11, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for adding this section, Gila!...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ) talk • 12:19, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
news site for b&b owners (worldwide site) [[User_talk:rwrhallam| —Preceding
undated comment added 10:46, 10 June 2010 (UTC).
Accommodation for independent travellers (worldwide site)...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ)
talk •
16:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
dmoz open directory project (worldwide site)...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ)
talk •
16:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
B&Bs in Israel, booking directly with owners -
User:Gilabrand
16:42, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
B&B Association of Rome, with international B&B links -
User:Gilabrand
16:42, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
Bed and Breakfasts in Belgium and Netherlands —The preceding
unsigned comment was added by
Raeyos (
talk •
contribs) 18:55, August 23, 2007 (UTC).
Have you checked, Gila, to see if there are any sites in B&Bs in Israel, booking directly with owners and B&B Association of Rome, with international B&B links that are not also replicated in the two prior suggestions?
If there are,I would still see dangers in a national list proliferating - there is the potential for more than 100 external links if only one site per country is allowed. I think we should stick to Worldwide directories, and, if those are insufficiently helpful, a few Regional sites...Gaimhreadhan (kiwiexile at DMOZ) talk • 16:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
Apart from general article cleanup, it might be worth mentioning the UK situation regarding the use of bed and breakfast for overnight accommodation for the homeless - a commonly exploitative arrangement due to the lack of tenancy rights. See Shelter ( Bed and breakfast hotels). 86.161.33.49 ( talk) 02:02, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
Oppose merge The French concept is quite different, always being located at the heart of a village. Let these two articles evolve separately and respect their cultural differences. Hadrianheugh ( talk) 21:42, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
Merger a good idea. Sorry I don't speak english very well but I think that the french "chambre d'hôtes" may be in a section of "bed and breakfast" as a national difference. Cardabelle ( talk) 12:16, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
Support merge. Per Cardabelle, could easily be accommodated as a national variant (as with the other countries variances listed). At the moment in fact the article has little independent value - focusing as it does on COMPARING chambre d'hôtes to B&Bs. A value which would more readily achieved as a subset of this article than it can as a standalone. Guliolopez ( talk) 17:23, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
Question? -- What exactly is there to merge? Chambre d'hotes has been tagged as unreferenced since 2007. If it remains a distinct article it would be highly vulnerable to a nomination for deletion, on the grounds it does not comply with the verifiability policy and the policy prohibiting original research. If we were to merge that article here, I suggest there is really nothing that could be brought over, because every statement there is unreferenced. Geo Swan ( talk) 16:40, 19 October 2008 (UTC)
This request was added to the wrong talk page (The user was following the request to discuss new ELs but the wrong address was given in the article) I've copied it here for viewing by others - X201 ( talk) 07:54, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
I am keen to add an external link to the Bed_and_Breakfast section which currently has NO external links
www.stay-swaps.com is a new site which has an intention of allowing home owners to trade or swap accommodation and lodging principally bed and breakfast stays.
The site is believed to be unique and is built on principals of home exchange where home owners trade homes at the same time across country or international.
Under a trade of bed and breakfast each party to the trade would trade at different times so some degree of honesty is required.
the web site is free to register offered bed and breakfast stays and those sought, when and where, together with the number of people involved in the trade.
I consider the site and suitable description is sufficiently useful and unique to warrant inclusion in this section.
I welcome comments in support or opposition.
Websi7 ( talk) 09:03, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
"Since 1879 the average per capita disposable income of Australians has been greater than that of New Zealanders"
I know my economic history, and Australian incomes didn't overtake those of NZ until well after the second world war, not until the 1960s - if not later. At the end of the 1800s, NZers had the highest incomes in the world, ahead of Britain, the USA or Australia.
I have changed the sentence to read "Since the 1960s the average per capita disposable income of Australians has been greater than that of New Zealanders"
121.73.7.84 ( talk) 08:44, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
Can User:Travelegia please explain the addition of links to various B&B directories. Particularly in relationship to the following.
Thanks. -- Escape Orbit (Talk) 16:41, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
In case there are any questions or issues with the removal of the "Trade Association" subsections recently - it was done for several reasons:
The section is (now) much better served describing the concept of self-regulation and rating in general. Rather than dealing with the benefits/details of every single B&B trade association. Cheers. Guliolopez ( talk) 17:44, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
To the users (with apparent conflict of interest) who insist on using this encyclopedic article as an advocacy platform for the concept of B&Bs in general, or a specific B&B, B&B type, industry group or whatever, I have a simple message: STOP!. Wikipedia has very clear policies on SPAM and soapboxing. Put simply, Wikipedia articles should not be worded to promote advocacy for anything. As such, there is no place in this article for recently added advertising fluff like the following: "a Bed and Breakfast is much, much more", "(B&B's offer) a unique environment of hospitality", "(B&Bs allow enjoyment of a) visit to the fullest, and – perhaps most of all – to leave guests with a memorable visit that will encourage them to come back year after year." This form of commentary, uncited opinion pushing and SPAM fails several Wikipedia guidelines. So stop pushing these agendas and find another medium to promote your business or industry.
Further, editors who insist on including links to "their" B&B industry group or regulatory body I would add this: There are hundreds of such organisations, and this article is no place to list or link them. There is a longstanding agreement here that new links need to be discussed before being added - to specifically avoid this article becoming a spam-ridden linkfarm.
Wikipedia IS NOT A FREE PROMOTIONAL CHANNEL. (We're interested in objective and verifiable encyclopedic content. Not spam.) Guliolopez ( talk) 11:54, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
Three new studies that have been added today-- while helpful, do you think
They seem to be cluttering the article fairly early in, like before we get to find out what a B&B is we are bombarded with study results.
Suggestions? SimonTrew ( talk) 14:52, 5 April 2009 (UTC)
The External links section which some of you know and love so well (talk here passim) is now all book citations. At the risk of starting a new External links war, should we rename the section to Further Reading or Bibliography or some such (I prefer the former as being simpler)? SimonTrew ( talk) 20:23, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
This article seems like a clearing house for research on bed and breakfast choice worldwide. Is that necessary? Does it add to the understanding of what B&Bs are? A lot of the discussion and analysis feels very much like original research.
As well, I feel there's some dodgy use of numbers in the claim that New Zealand has more B&Bs than Australia based on the number listed on one particular website that itself doesn't seem hugely notable. For a scale of comparison, I checked the breakdown by state in Australia and South Australia apparently has 3 B&Bs, compared to NSW with 10, and the remaining 36 all located in Victoria. Now, it may turn out that there are twelve times as many B&Bs in Victoria than there are in South Australia but unless we have a more reliable method, I'm going to put on my skeptic's hat and say that the B&Bs listed on the site are not a random sample of all Australian B&Bs.
I suspect that the nature of B&Bs means that they more than any other accomodation type are going to be underrepresented on the internet.
Finally, speculation about the reasons that a given area has more B&Bs doesn't become acceptable on wikipedia just because your theory is supported by citable evidence - no original research means you can only present theories that have been published elsewhere. 152.91.9.219 ( talk) 07:38, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
"Spain does not have a B&B culture like Great Britain."
This is true, we have hostales, hoteles, pensiones, and posadas.
B&B's which are intended for those tourists who only speak English and don't want to mix themselves with the "locals". And on top of that, Spaniards love to have dinner very late! At B&B's we'd have to go to bed with empty stomachs, good grief!
Furthermore, citation [5] is quite offensive and lacks scientific approach. Spaniards shake their heads of when they see people behaving like in their own country and not respecting the way of life of the hosting country.
So, why not mentioning that some British expats, or locals - who understand this market - open up B&B for English tourists who don't actually like to be abroad, but do it because of the weather? -- 217.154.84.2 ( talk) 11:37, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Bed & Breakfast (disambiguation) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. — RMCD bot 04:47, 1 May 2020 (UTC)