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You people have completely lost it.. look at this mess. Stop spamming wikipedia with so much crap. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.243.180.70 ( talk) 16:33, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
She is beginning to get more attention with a number of news articles focusing primarily on her [1]. I think at this point she merits her own article. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 18:33, 15 March 2008 (UTC) This page should be deleted —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jlafreak3551 ( talk • contribs) 19:15, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
Delete?
From the BLP policy
Wikipedia articles that present material about living people can affect their subjects' lives. Wikipedia editors who deal with these articles have a responsibility to consider the legal and ethical implications of their actions when doing so. An important rule of thumb when writing biographical material about living persons is "do no harm". Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid, and as such it is not our job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives. BLPs must be written conservatively, with regard for the subject's privacy.
When writing about a person notable only for one or two events, including every detail can lead to problems, even when the material is well-sourced. In the best case, it can lead to an unencyclopedic article. In the worst case, it can be a serious violation of our policies on neutrality. When in doubt, biographies should be pared back to a version that is completely sourced, neutral, and on-topic.
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This article should instead be merged with the Eliot Spitzer prostitution scandal. It isn't necessary to know every biographical detail such as what business her father owned, what languages her tattoos are in, where she lived, etc. The only thing that is notable is her contact with Spitzer. Cheers.-- Burzum ( talk) 02:36, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
when the 15 minutes is up this will be up for speedy deletion-- Wikiscribe ( talk) 17:56, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
In addition to this, I dont think we have heard the last from her yet. Besides as of now I think she may still continue to pop up in the news as long as the after affect of the Spitzer "Saga" continues.
205.210.159.33 ( talk) 21:26, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
Per Ecclesiastes, there's nothing new under the sun. MTV:
A former artist's model turned " Floradora Girl," Evelyn Nesbit (née Florence Nesbit) married Philadelphia society scion Harry K. Thaw in 1906. After dining at the famous Madison Square Garden roof a few months later, Thaw shot and killed Evelyn's reputed lover, famed architect Stanford White. Amazingly, this tragedy not only turned into the era's foremost cause célèbre but made a quasi-star of Nesbit, whose performance on the witness stand at her husband's trial was worthy of one of Broadway's better actresses. The case itself became the focal point of several films, at least one of which -- the Lubin company's The Unwritten Law (1907) -- still survives. Nesbit herself reportedly made her own screen debut in yet another depiction of the affair, the plainly titled The Great Thaw Trial (1909). [...] Sometime in the late 1910s, Nesbit made her final film, The Hidden Woman [...]. More than 30 years later, Nesbit's old studio, Fox, hired her as a "consultant" on The Girl in the Red Velvet Swing (1955), a highly fictionalized account of the Thaw affair featuring Joan Collins as Evelyn, Ray Milland as Stanford White, and Farley Granger as Harry. According to a friend, Nesbit was ill and nearly destitute at the time and in dire need of the salary. Years after her death, Evelyn Nesbit once again became the focal point of a fictive account of the Thaw affair, this time when author E. L. Doctorow incorporated the scandal into Ragtime, his sprawling indictment of the so-called " Gilded Age." Milos Forman's 1981 screen version featured Elizabeth McGovern as Evelyn, with author Norman Mailer as White and Robert Joy as Thaw. ~ Hans J. Wollstein, All Movie Guide
WP's article for the tragic artist's model/silver screen actress Virginia Rappe makes no mention of allegations she was from age 11 a sometime prostitute, despite being portrayed as such by Fatty Arbuckle's attorney. — Justmeherenow ( ) 12:17, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
Do either of these actually meet WP:RS? JoshuaZ ( talk) 22:31, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
The Daily News is IMHO just as much of a reliable source as the Boston Herald or Chicago Sun times is. Just because they publish in a tabloid format does not mean they are tabloid papers. The post has credibility issues but they are about on par with the television media. Calwatch ( talk) 01:25, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
One source says she worked with Dupre at the Viscaya club in 2004 while Itzler claims she was working at the Hotel Gansevoort in 2004. Are the two establishments connected at all? Of course, it's quite possible she worked at more than one bar at the same time (or consecutively in the same year) or that one of the sources is lying. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 03:03, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Update: Itzler's current social introduction/dating service is DNA Diamonds. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 22:01, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
It's patently obvious that the (nonetheless-primarily-sourced) web advertisement for escort "Kristen" does not in actuality have Miss Dupre in it (and this in part to probably help keep the real escorts' identities secret?) This from a description in the old New York Magazine piece about the workings of Emperors Club VIP's prototype high-cost call girl agency: namely, NY Confidential:
“If they ask for Nicolette, I take out the three-by-five card with NICOLETTE written on top. It lists the contacts of girls who kind of look like the fake Nicolette. What blows my mind is the stupid bastards spend hours searching the sites looking for their super-fantasy, are willing to shell out $700 an hour, and then when someone else knocks on the hotel-room door, they go, ‘Oh, whatever.’ They can still go back to Indianapolis, show the girl in the picture to their buddies, and say, ‘See her? Like, awesome, dude!’ ”
-- Justmeherenow ( talk) 02:27, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Would it violate copyright to add this image to the article. It is the most popular image of her, and its all over the internet particularly in use by news outlets.-- Uga Man ( talk) UGA MAN FOR PRESIDENT 2008 05:05, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
I nominated the page for WP:DYK here...if anyone can improve the hook, or think of a better one, you're absolutely welcome to take a crack at it. I'll do some more work on expanding the article and cleaning up the references today. Nesodak ( talk) 13:25, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
independent of Itzler's at the least hyberbole(?), let's shorten it to a phrase. I dunno. "...whose claims link Dupre to the, um, reformed badboy actor ? (sorry.. getting carried away.. ) And add to it Sheen's publicist's once denial in pro-forma reaction to Itzler's cell-block payphone calls to the Post about, in part, a mystery-girl "dark-haired former Hotel Gansevoort hostess." Since the Times' line was busy. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 14:56, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Dupre's attorney has issued a press release challenging fair use of his client's photos...see discussion at WP:ANI here. Nesodak ( talk) 04:20, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Just some links to some further sources, will cull later for useful info. Nesodak ( talk) 14:25, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Is "party girl" an occupation? If not it shouldn't be listed as such in the infobox. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 19:33, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
now it says journalist? give me a break... Extrabatteries ( talk) 23:50, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
She is actually 32 years old. -- Topk ( talk) 13:34, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
She is not a journalist she is a HOOKER —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.198.152.191 ( talk) 02:46, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
We are not going to include his statements, as they have not been verified by any other source, and the very sources reporting them have been questioning their veracity. This is a biography of a living person, and we are going to be sensitive as to what we include. Just because it's been published somewhere, doesn't mean we have to put it in a Wikipedia biography. Do not reinsert without discussing here on the talk page. FCYTravis ( talk) 02:55, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
"Spitzer was the attorney general who took down seven or eight escort agencies, mine being one of them, mine maybe being one of the more well-known. After Spitzer took down these escort agencies, in a weird way, I'm watching the story, I'm thinking he's a hypocrite, it's kind of funny. And all of a sudden, you know, one of the main people that he took down, my girl is the girl that took him down, so, it's kind of like, that's my girl. It's a little crazy."
(Veronica and NY Confidential)
Jason Itzler, who ran a New York escort service called NY Confidential from 2003 to 2005, claimed to have recognized Dupré when photos of her were shown on CNN in the first days of the Spitzer scandal. [1] According to Itzler, they met while she was working as a cocktail waitress at the Hotel Gansevoort in 2004, and she began working for him on the side, using the alias Victoria. [2] Itzler also claimed that he had sent Dupré, accompanied by another prostitute, for an assignation with the actor Charlie Sheen — a claim denied by Sheen. [3] NY Confidential was shut down and Itzler sent to prison by Spitzer's New York State Attorney General's office in 2005. [2] Michael Clancy of The Village Voice, citing reports that Dupré was not arrested when Itzler's operations were shut down, noted that Itzler's claims as yet remained unverified and wondered if "the self-proclaimed 'King of All Pimps' [was] angling for another 15 minutes in the spotlight." [1]
References
- ^ a b Clancy, Michael (2008-03-14). "Sex and the City: The Wild Life of Ashley Alexandra Dupre". Runnin' Scared. The Village Voice. Retrieved 2008-03-16.
{{ cite news}}
: Cite has empty unknown parameter:|coauthors=
( help); Italic or bold markup not allowed in:|publisher=
( help)- ^ a b Evans, Sean (2008-03-14). "She came to N.Y. looking for record deal instead she got hooker ring offer". Daily News. Retrieved 2008-03-16.
{{ cite news}}
: Unknown parameter|coauthors=
ignored (|author=
suggested) ( help)- ^ "Jailed pimp tattles on Sheen". PageSix.com. 2006-05-09. Retrieved 2008-03-16.
New York Magazine's 16 March piece references Natalie McLennan conversing with its author concerning her having gone to escort appointments in the company of Dupre. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 22:24, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
Court documents corroborate that Dupre work for NY Confidential and after its demise, for Velvet Traces a.k.a. Gateau Victoux. A confederate of Itzler's at Confidential was Dupre's b-friend, who then started Traces while Itzler was enjoying the 7-diamond cuisine on "the Rock" (Rikers). So I'm putting a NY Post citation into the appropriate place in the article and deleting our formerly necessary disclaimer. restoring deleted text to the "Earlier years" section that had been awaiting this corroboration. --
Justmeherenow (
talk) 06:11, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I find this unsubstantiated allegation to be, at the least, irritating. This has been jumped on by those claiming that all those entering this field of endeavour have been abused. At the same time, it does a diservice to those "street" prostitutes who are (and have) been truely abused by the authorities, the johns, the pimps, the drug dealers and quite often by someone in their past.
At this level, chosing this career is more a statement "I don't want to do the work needed to get a real career and earn my place in society". Unfortunately, such unsubstantiated comments will tend to be misused for perhaps decades to come.
209.115.238.67 ( talk) 20:33, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
I restored the birthdate - it was apparently released by her attorney, according to both TMZ and the Post Chronicle.[(unreliable source - do not use) www.postchronicle.com/news/original/article_212136957.shtml] I left a note at FCYTravis' talk page. Nesodak ( talk) 22:28, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
I notice that a lot of the original source material states that she grew up (at least during her teenage years) in Belmar, New Jersey, while our article says Wall, New Jersey (which redirects to Wall Township, where she went to high school.) Has anyone found clarification for this? Also the infobox says that she was born in Beachwood - do we have a source for that? Nesodak ( talk) 05:31, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
Ashlee was initially offerred by Girls Gone Wild to appear nude in its magazine. [7] It was later found out that she has already appeared nude in it's videos. [8] Bigdaddy718 ( talk) 12:31, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
Image:Girls Gone Wild - Ashley Dupre.jpg Image of the 17-year-old Dupré featured in the soft-porn Girls Gone Wild video Spring Break 2005: Anything Goes (which footage is advertised on Dupré's website)
On March 19, 2008, the soft-porn website Girls Gone Wild featured video of Dupré shot in Miami Beach, Florida, when Dupré was 17. [1] [2] and the footage soon thereafter came to be advertised on Ashley Dupré's self-titled website. [3] Girls Gone Wild founder Joe Francis said, "All nude images of Ms. Dupre were taken in public places and contain no sexual contact. In Florida, where Ms. Dupre was filmed, the law allows even women under the age of 18 to be filmed nude with their consent." [4]
References
{{
cite web}}
: Check date values in: |date=
(
help)
Here's a link to the number of views of this page since creation. Nesodak ( talk) 20:20, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Despite its "newspapery" sounding name, "The Post Chronicle" is a self-published opinion/blog organ, not a reliable, edited, fact-checked, vetted news source. At the bottom of the front page, its management specifically disclaims any responsibility for the truthfulness or accuracy of anything it posts. This, to me, is the hallmark of a "source" that we cannot consider reliable, especially for the biography of a living person. FCYTravis ( talk) 23:28, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
The fact that we are even debating this is an enigma. Techically, wikipedia isn't a reliable source since it can be edited by anyone. I find that to be ironic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Smokefan2007 ( talk • contribs) 01:08, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
TMZ runs rumor and gossip, NY Post as Smokefan points out, run rumor and gossip. In fact, just about every major publication now does so.
Smoke you should contact TPC again and see if they appreciate the way their company is being represented here. Frankly it's borderline slander and detrimental to their overall business. If it was me, I'd sue WP's arse off. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.125.122.202 ( talk) 08:23, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
Given FCYTravis' edit-warring over TMZ.com as a ref, can we have some comments on its reliability? Here is the article in USA Today stating that content of that website is is "researched and vetted for accuracy". Nesodak ( talk) 00:58, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I simply memorialize here that there was an "as-tasteful-as-possible-under-the-circumstances" screenshot (which is to say, the frontal view of Dupre-in-her-bikini, as she yanked on a pair of shorts used as a coverup) from a GGW spring break video was deleted in order for WP not to give too much weight to presumably embarrassing-to-her, youthful indiscretions. Yet I believe that should it become established she continues to authorize the video's sale, then our rationale in this regard would at that point no longer stand. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 08:44, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I hope I didn't step on anyone's toes by removing all the single-name call girl aliases from the infobox (though, on second thought, I will put "Kristen" back in after typing this note, because a lot of early press coverage referred to this). I think while it may be appropriate in the text of the article, it clutters the infobox without being helpful...nobody is going to refer to her by these names without also using her actual name. Even the "Kristen" thing faded away when her real name became known. Also I'm not sure if the "Amber Arpaio" name is really significant - it seems to have been a one-off thing. Thoughts? Nesodak ( talk) 15:16, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
The cover image from her "single", if you would even call it that, is not free to use on Wikipedia, and the fair use rationale for its use on this page is weak. The image is only being used for identification of the subject of the article, not the single, so I have removed it. ➪ HiDrNick! 18:38, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
Still to support the image's free use on WP
I've never seen anyone use the name "Nina Venetta" for her - it's the name of her MySpace page, that doesn't really mean anything. And "Spitzer girl," uh, no. FCYTravis ( talk) 19:32, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
Folks want to put "prostitute" into the name box and I see their point. Dupre put (at least at first) on her MySpace page, "I did it" and otherwise has in noways denied, whether herself or through a spokeperson, having been a hooker. Nonetheless I think it's better not to call this her profession currently since it remains a criminal misdemeanor in NY----and even if not, Emperors Club VIP is closed and we've no source asserting she continues to do sex work independly. (Or for another agency. Which would take cajones since----(Shocked, I tell you!)----she's outed as more than the hourly rate personal swimsuit model Emperors Club advertised.) — Justmeherenow ( ) 21:06, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
As she was described by the Emperors Club as being 5'5", it's unlikely that she's 5'6". Most people exaggerate their height, or at least round up, so she's probably 5'5" at the most. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.144.128.35 ( talk) 02:46, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
<unindent for clarity> Now the question is, which do we use? The figure reported to have been used by her escort agency in phone conversations, or the figure which is currently listed on a site maintained by Dupré herself? FCYTravis ( talk) 03:53, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Now also on WP German. (I'm not a member of the English WP, so I should not post it up. Delabarquera. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.181.129.144 ( talk) 09:44, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
Since she is already listed in Category:Sex scandal figures, I think it would be redundant and unnecessary to add further "scandal" categories to the page. Kelly hi! 12:39, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
I've fully protected this article for a period of 14 days, or until disputes are resolved, due to the edit warring between multiple users regarding the inclusion, or removal of certain categories. I encourage you all to use this talk page and discuss the disputed item(s) and reach consensus on the article. - Rjd0060 ( talk) 23:11, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
The whole "Music career" section is not relevant nor noteworthy. It should be removed. She is only noteworthy as a prostitute, as such the article should only contain information relevant to that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.92.146.86 ( talk) 19:03, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
I disagree - the music career is part of who she is and, actually, the aimee street aspect is notable. While I agree we would not have an article on her without the sex scandal I think we have to still be fairminded and recognize that that isn't all she is. This is supposed to be a bio of Dupre, not an article limited to her career as a prostitute. As long as other aspects of her life, such as her music career (such as it is) are properly sourced and have been mentioned in reliable sources I see no reason not to include the information here. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 19:28, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
W:ikipedia is not about being 'fair minded' it's an encyclopedia. It's not realvent to any encyclopedia entry. 68.34.4.188 ( talk) 00:10, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
This has come up before (see further up the page, also this), but FCYTravis ( talk · contribs) has again removed the TMZ.com reference for the birthdate as unreliable. I found the old discussion on this at WP:BLPN here. Apparently USA Today, Time, and Newsweek have profiled the website - the USA Today article specifically discusses that the info at TMZ.com is professionally vetted by journalists, despite its tabloidy nature. I'll give some time for Travis to respond before restoring the reference. Kelly hi! 13:33, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
For god's sake, do we really need a picture of a train? Does it add ANYTHING to the story? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.166.59.115 ( talk) 22:15, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
I know this a tough issue re WP:BLP, but the sources seem to indicate pretty reliably that Dupré, was, in fact, a prostitute (or call girl, or escort, or whatever euphemism is preferred.) The most frequent edit-warring on this article is over the occupation - should she be listed as a singer-songwriter (marginal notability) or a prostitute (the thing most reliable sources note her for)? I'm neutral and have edited both ways here, but I think we need to resolve this to bring stability to the article. Kelly hi! 23:24, 18 July 2008 (UTC)
As this person becomes more established as a newspaper columnist, the focus of the article should be a columnist who was a prostitute rather than a prostitute. Suomi Finland 2009 ( talk) 20:34, 1 February 2010 (UTC)
Why is their no "free" image for the main pictuer of this article?
Is the criteria for a main picture different than that for other pictures? If so, why? What is the legal or policy differences?
If there are no differences between the criteria for the main and alternate images, in re: to copyright issues, used for this article, why can't we use the other image appearing further down the page?
If the NYP (I think) cover pic with her holding her boobies is fine for the article why can't we use it for the "main" picture?-- Δζ ( talk) 02:27, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
Is she running for governor?
Oh wait, I guess it's the madam who is running for governor, not the call girl? But they both have the nickname "Kristin" or "Kristen," it seems. Tisane ( talk) 00:29, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
This is an ENCYCLOPEDIA entry and it's pretty pathetic that most of it seems like a fan site for her to showcase her "talents". When all is said and done, she still got her 15 minutes of fame because she had sex with a high profile figure, nothing more, nothing less, she is still a hooker at heart and that's why there's attention for her. If she was a male prostitute, there wouldn't be such adoration, so let's grow up and do what's right in terms of an encyclopedic barometer in terms of this site... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.173.77.186 ( talk) 22:16, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
{{ edit semi-protected}} Please change the spelling of Ms. Dupre's attorneys name from Don Buckwald to Don D. Buchwald. See this link: http://www.kelleydrye.com/attorneys/don_buchwald
Katie.briggs ( talk) 17:38, 23 November 2010 (UTC)
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This article was nominated for
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A fact from Ashley Alexandra Dupré appeared on Wikipedia's
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You people have completely lost it.. look at this mess. Stop spamming wikipedia with so much crap. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.243.180.70 ( talk) 16:33, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
She is beginning to get more attention with a number of news articles focusing primarily on her [1]. I think at this point she merits her own article. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 18:33, 15 March 2008 (UTC) This page should be deleted —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jlafreak3551 ( talk • contribs) 19:15, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
Delete?
From the BLP policy
Wikipedia articles that present material about living people can affect their subjects' lives. Wikipedia editors who deal with these articles have a responsibility to consider the legal and ethical implications of their actions when doing so. An important rule of thumb when writing biographical material about living persons is "do no harm". Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid, and as such it is not our job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives. BLPs must be written conservatively, with regard for the subject's privacy.
When writing about a person notable only for one or two events, including every detail can lead to problems, even when the material is well-sourced. In the best case, it can lead to an unencyclopedic article. In the worst case, it can be a serious violation of our policies on neutrality. When in doubt, biographies should be pared back to a version that is completely sourced, neutral, and on-topic.
(emphasis mine)
This article should instead be merged with the Eliot Spitzer prostitution scandal. It isn't necessary to know every biographical detail such as what business her father owned, what languages her tattoos are in, where she lived, etc. The only thing that is notable is her contact with Spitzer. Cheers.-- Burzum ( talk) 02:36, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
when the 15 minutes is up this will be up for speedy deletion-- Wikiscribe ( talk) 17:56, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
In addition to this, I dont think we have heard the last from her yet. Besides as of now I think she may still continue to pop up in the news as long as the after affect of the Spitzer "Saga" continues.
205.210.159.33 ( talk) 21:26, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
Per Ecclesiastes, there's nothing new under the sun. MTV:
A former artist's model turned " Floradora Girl," Evelyn Nesbit (née Florence Nesbit) married Philadelphia society scion Harry K. Thaw in 1906. After dining at the famous Madison Square Garden roof a few months later, Thaw shot and killed Evelyn's reputed lover, famed architect Stanford White. Amazingly, this tragedy not only turned into the era's foremost cause célèbre but made a quasi-star of Nesbit, whose performance on the witness stand at her husband's trial was worthy of one of Broadway's better actresses. The case itself became the focal point of several films, at least one of which -- the Lubin company's The Unwritten Law (1907) -- still survives. Nesbit herself reportedly made her own screen debut in yet another depiction of the affair, the plainly titled The Great Thaw Trial (1909). [...] Sometime in the late 1910s, Nesbit made her final film, The Hidden Woman [...]. More than 30 years later, Nesbit's old studio, Fox, hired her as a "consultant" on The Girl in the Red Velvet Swing (1955), a highly fictionalized account of the Thaw affair featuring Joan Collins as Evelyn, Ray Milland as Stanford White, and Farley Granger as Harry. According to a friend, Nesbit was ill and nearly destitute at the time and in dire need of the salary. Years after her death, Evelyn Nesbit once again became the focal point of a fictive account of the Thaw affair, this time when author E. L. Doctorow incorporated the scandal into Ragtime, his sprawling indictment of the so-called " Gilded Age." Milos Forman's 1981 screen version featured Elizabeth McGovern as Evelyn, with author Norman Mailer as White and Robert Joy as Thaw. ~ Hans J. Wollstein, All Movie Guide
WP's article for the tragic artist's model/silver screen actress Virginia Rappe makes no mention of allegations she was from age 11 a sometime prostitute, despite being portrayed as such by Fatty Arbuckle's attorney. — Justmeherenow ( ) 12:17, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
Do either of these actually meet WP:RS? JoshuaZ ( talk) 22:31, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
The Daily News is IMHO just as much of a reliable source as the Boston Herald or Chicago Sun times is. Just because they publish in a tabloid format does not mean they are tabloid papers. The post has credibility issues but they are about on par with the television media. Calwatch ( talk) 01:25, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
One source says she worked with Dupre at the Viscaya club in 2004 while Itzler claims she was working at the Hotel Gansevoort in 2004. Are the two establishments connected at all? Of course, it's quite possible she worked at more than one bar at the same time (or consecutively in the same year) or that one of the sources is lying. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 03:03, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Update: Itzler's current social introduction/dating service is DNA Diamonds. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 22:01, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
It's patently obvious that the (nonetheless-primarily-sourced) web advertisement for escort "Kristen" does not in actuality have Miss Dupre in it (and this in part to probably help keep the real escorts' identities secret?) This from a description in the old New York Magazine piece about the workings of Emperors Club VIP's prototype high-cost call girl agency: namely, NY Confidential:
“If they ask for Nicolette, I take out the three-by-five card with NICOLETTE written on top. It lists the contacts of girls who kind of look like the fake Nicolette. What blows my mind is the stupid bastards spend hours searching the sites looking for their super-fantasy, are willing to shell out $700 an hour, and then when someone else knocks on the hotel-room door, they go, ‘Oh, whatever.’ They can still go back to Indianapolis, show the girl in the picture to their buddies, and say, ‘See her? Like, awesome, dude!’ ”
-- Justmeherenow ( talk) 02:27, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Would it violate copyright to add this image to the article. It is the most popular image of her, and its all over the internet particularly in use by news outlets.-- Uga Man ( talk) UGA MAN FOR PRESIDENT 2008 05:05, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
I nominated the page for WP:DYK here...if anyone can improve the hook, or think of a better one, you're absolutely welcome to take a crack at it. I'll do some more work on expanding the article and cleaning up the references today. Nesodak ( talk) 13:25, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
independent of Itzler's at the least hyberbole(?), let's shorten it to a phrase. I dunno. "...whose claims link Dupre to the, um, reformed badboy actor ? (sorry.. getting carried away.. ) And add to it Sheen's publicist's once denial in pro-forma reaction to Itzler's cell-block payphone calls to the Post about, in part, a mystery-girl "dark-haired former Hotel Gansevoort hostess." Since the Times' line was busy. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 14:56, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Dupre's attorney has issued a press release challenging fair use of his client's photos...see discussion at WP:ANI here. Nesodak ( talk) 04:20, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Just some links to some further sources, will cull later for useful info. Nesodak ( talk) 14:25, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Is "party girl" an occupation? If not it shouldn't be listed as such in the infobox. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 19:33, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
now it says journalist? give me a break... Extrabatteries ( talk) 23:50, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
She is actually 32 years old. -- Topk ( talk) 13:34, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
She is not a journalist she is a HOOKER —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.198.152.191 ( talk) 02:46, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
We are not going to include his statements, as they have not been verified by any other source, and the very sources reporting them have been questioning their veracity. This is a biography of a living person, and we are going to be sensitive as to what we include. Just because it's been published somewhere, doesn't mean we have to put it in a Wikipedia biography. Do not reinsert without discussing here on the talk page. FCYTravis ( talk) 02:55, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
"Spitzer was the attorney general who took down seven or eight escort agencies, mine being one of them, mine maybe being one of the more well-known. After Spitzer took down these escort agencies, in a weird way, I'm watching the story, I'm thinking he's a hypocrite, it's kind of funny. And all of a sudden, you know, one of the main people that he took down, my girl is the girl that took him down, so, it's kind of like, that's my girl. It's a little crazy."
(Veronica and NY Confidential)
Jason Itzler, who ran a New York escort service called NY Confidential from 2003 to 2005, claimed to have recognized Dupré when photos of her were shown on CNN in the first days of the Spitzer scandal. [1] According to Itzler, they met while she was working as a cocktail waitress at the Hotel Gansevoort in 2004, and she began working for him on the side, using the alias Victoria. [2] Itzler also claimed that he had sent Dupré, accompanied by another prostitute, for an assignation with the actor Charlie Sheen — a claim denied by Sheen. [3] NY Confidential was shut down and Itzler sent to prison by Spitzer's New York State Attorney General's office in 2005. [2] Michael Clancy of The Village Voice, citing reports that Dupré was not arrested when Itzler's operations were shut down, noted that Itzler's claims as yet remained unverified and wondered if "the self-proclaimed 'King of All Pimps' [was] angling for another 15 minutes in the spotlight." [1]
References
- ^ a b Clancy, Michael (2008-03-14). "Sex and the City: The Wild Life of Ashley Alexandra Dupre". Runnin' Scared. The Village Voice. Retrieved 2008-03-16.
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( help)- ^ a b Evans, Sean (2008-03-14). "She came to N.Y. looking for record deal instead she got hooker ring offer". Daily News. Retrieved 2008-03-16.
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suggested) ( help)- ^ "Jailed pimp tattles on Sheen". PageSix.com. 2006-05-09. Retrieved 2008-03-16.
New York Magazine's 16 March piece references Natalie McLennan conversing with its author concerning her having gone to escort appointments in the company of Dupre. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 22:24, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
Court documents corroborate that Dupre work for NY Confidential and after its demise, for Velvet Traces a.k.a. Gateau Victoux. A confederate of Itzler's at Confidential was Dupre's b-friend, who then started Traces while Itzler was enjoying the 7-diamond cuisine on "the Rock" (Rikers). So I'm putting a NY Post citation into the appropriate place in the article and deleting our formerly necessary disclaimer. restoring deleted text to the "Earlier years" section that had been awaiting this corroboration. --
Justmeherenow (
talk) 06:11, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I find this unsubstantiated allegation to be, at the least, irritating. This has been jumped on by those claiming that all those entering this field of endeavour have been abused. At the same time, it does a diservice to those "street" prostitutes who are (and have) been truely abused by the authorities, the johns, the pimps, the drug dealers and quite often by someone in their past.
At this level, chosing this career is more a statement "I don't want to do the work needed to get a real career and earn my place in society". Unfortunately, such unsubstantiated comments will tend to be misused for perhaps decades to come.
209.115.238.67 ( talk) 20:33, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
I restored the birthdate - it was apparently released by her attorney, according to both TMZ and the Post Chronicle.[(unreliable source - do not use) www.postchronicle.com/news/original/article_212136957.shtml] I left a note at FCYTravis' talk page. Nesodak ( talk) 22:28, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
I notice that a lot of the original source material states that she grew up (at least during her teenage years) in Belmar, New Jersey, while our article says Wall, New Jersey (which redirects to Wall Township, where she went to high school.) Has anyone found clarification for this? Also the infobox says that she was born in Beachwood - do we have a source for that? Nesodak ( talk) 05:31, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
Ashlee was initially offerred by Girls Gone Wild to appear nude in its magazine. [7] It was later found out that she has already appeared nude in it's videos. [8] Bigdaddy718 ( talk) 12:31, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
Image:Girls Gone Wild - Ashley Dupre.jpg Image of the 17-year-old Dupré featured in the soft-porn Girls Gone Wild video Spring Break 2005: Anything Goes (which footage is advertised on Dupré's website)
On March 19, 2008, the soft-porn website Girls Gone Wild featured video of Dupré shot in Miami Beach, Florida, when Dupré was 17. [1] [2] and the footage soon thereafter came to be advertised on Ashley Dupré's self-titled website. [3] Girls Gone Wild founder Joe Francis said, "All nude images of Ms. Dupre were taken in public places and contain no sexual contact. In Florida, where Ms. Dupre was filmed, the law allows even women under the age of 18 to be filmed nude with their consent." [4]
References
{{
cite web}}
: Check date values in: |date=
(
help)
Here's a link to the number of views of this page since creation. Nesodak ( talk) 20:20, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Despite its "newspapery" sounding name, "The Post Chronicle" is a self-published opinion/blog organ, not a reliable, edited, fact-checked, vetted news source. At the bottom of the front page, its management specifically disclaims any responsibility for the truthfulness or accuracy of anything it posts. This, to me, is the hallmark of a "source" that we cannot consider reliable, especially for the biography of a living person. FCYTravis ( talk) 23:28, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
The fact that we are even debating this is an enigma. Techically, wikipedia isn't a reliable source since it can be edited by anyone. I find that to be ironic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Smokefan2007 ( talk • contribs) 01:08, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
TMZ runs rumor and gossip, NY Post as Smokefan points out, run rumor and gossip. In fact, just about every major publication now does so.
Smoke you should contact TPC again and see if they appreciate the way their company is being represented here. Frankly it's borderline slander and detrimental to their overall business. If it was me, I'd sue WP's arse off. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.125.122.202 ( talk) 08:23, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
Given FCYTravis' edit-warring over TMZ.com as a ref, can we have some comments on its reliability? Here is the article in USA Today stating that content of that website is is "researched and vetted for accuracy". Nesodak ( talk) 00:58, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I simply memorialize here that there was an "as-tasteful-as-possible-under-the-circumstances" screenshot (which is to say, the frontal view of Dupre-in-her-bikini, as she yanked on a pair of shorts used as a coverup) from a GGW spring break video was deleted in order for WP not to give too much weight to presumably embarrassing-to-her, youthful indiscretions. Yet I believe that should it become established she continues to authorize the video's sale, then our rationale in this regard would at that point no longer stand. -- Justmeherenow ( talk) 08:44, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I hope I didn't step on anyone's toes by removing all the single-name call girl aliases from the infobox (though, on second thought, I will put "Kristen" back in after typing this note, because a lot of early press coverage referred to this). I think while it may be appropriate in the text of the article, it clutters the infobox without being helpful...nobody is going to refer to her by these names without also using her actual name. Even the "Kristen" thing faded away when her real name became known. Also I'm not sure if the "Amber Arpaio" name is really significant - it seems to have been a one-off thing. Thoughts? Nesodak ( talk) 15:16, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
The cover image from her "single", if you would even call it that, is not free to use on Wikipedia, and the fair use rationale for its use on this page is weak. The image is only being used for identification of the subject of the article, not the single, so I have removed it. ➪ HiDrNick! 18:38, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
Still to support the image's free use on WP
I've never seen anyone use the name "Nina Venetta" for her - it's the name of her MySpace page, that doesn't really mean anything. And "Spitzer girl," uh, no. FCYTravis ( talk) 19:32, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
Folks want to put "prostitute" into the name box and I see their point. Dupre put (at least at first) on her MySpace page, "I did it" and otherwise has in noways denied, whether herself or through a spokeperson, having been a hooker. Nonetheless I think it's better not to call this her profession currently since it remains a criminal misdemeanor in NY----and even if not, Emperors Club VIP is closed and we've no source asserting she continues to do sex work independly. (Or for another agency. Which would take cajones since----(Shocked, I tell you!)----she's outed as more than the hourly rate personal swimsuit model Emperors Club advertised.) — Justmeherenow ( ) 21:06, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
As she was described by the Emperors Club as being 5'5", it's unlikely that she's 5'6". Most people exaggerate their height, or at least round up, so she's probably 5'5" at the most. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.144.128.35 ( talk) 02:46, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
<unindent for clarity> Now the question is, which do we use? The figure reported to have been used by her escort agency in phone conversations, or the figure which is currently listed on a site maintained by Dupré herself? FCYTravis ( talk) 03:53, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Now also on WP German. (I'm not a member of the English WP, so I should not post it up. Delabarquera. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.181.129.144 ( talk) 09:44, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
Since she is already listed in Category:Sex scandal figures, I think it would be redundant and unnecessary to add further "scandal" categories to the page. Kelly hi! 12:39, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
I've fully protected this article for a period of 14 days, or until disputes are resolved, due to the edit warring between multiple users regarding the inclusion, or removal of certain categories. I encourage you all to use this talk page and discuss the disputed item(s) and reach consensus on the article. - Rjd0060 ( talk) 23:11, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
The whole "Music career" section is not relevant nor noteworthy. It should be removed. She is only noteworthy as a prostitute, as such the article should only contain information relevant to that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.92.146.86 ( talk) 19:03, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
I disagree - the music career is part of who she is and, actually, the aimee street aspect is notable. While I agree we would not have an article on her without the sex scandal I think we have to still be fairminded and recognize that that isn't all she is. This is supposed to be a bio of Dupre, not an article limited to her career as a prostitute. As long as other aspects of her life, such as her music career (such as it is) are properly sourced and have been mentioned in reliable sources I see no reason not to include the information here. Reggie Perrin ( talk) 19:28, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
W:ikipedia is not about being 'fair minded' it's an encyclopedia. It's not realvent to any encyclopedia entry. 68.34.4.188 ( talk) 00:10, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
This has come up before (see further up the page, also this), but FCYTravis ( talk · contribs) has again removed the TMZ.com reference for the birthdate as unreliable. I found the old discussion on this at WP:BLPN here. Apparently USA Today, Time, and Newsweek have profiled the website - the USA Today article specifically discusses that the info at TMZ.com is professionally vetted by journalists, despite its tabloidy nature. I'll give some time for Travis to respond before restoring the reference. Kelly hi! 13:33, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
For god's sake, do we really need a picture of a train? Does it add ANYTHING to the story? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.166.59.115 ( talk) 22:15, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
I know this a tough issue re WP:BLP, but the sources seem to indicate pretty reliably that Dupré, was, in fact, a prostitute (or call girl, or escort, or whatever euphemism is preferred.) The most frequent edit-warring on this article is over the occupation - should she be listed as a singer-songwriter (marginal notability) or a prostitute (the thing most reliable sources note her for)? I'm neutral and have edited both ways here, but I think we need to resolve this to bring stability to the article. Kelly hi! 23:24, 18 July 2008 (UTC)
As this person becomes more established as a newspaper columnist, the focus of the article should be a columnist who was a prostitute rather than a prostitute. Suomi Finland 2009 ( talk) 20:34, 1 February 2010 (UTC)
Why is their no "free" image for the main pictuer of this article?
Is the criteria for a main picture different than that for other pictures? If so, why? What is the legal or policy differences?
If there are no differences between the criteria for the main and alternate images, in re: to copyright issues, used for this article, why can't we use the other image appearing further down the page?
If the NYP (I think) cover pic with her holding her boobies is fine for the article why can't we use it for the "main" picture?-- Δζ ( talk) 02:27, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
Is she running for governor?
Oh wait, I guess it's the madam who is running for governor, not the call girl? But they both have the nickname "Kristin" or "Kristen," it seems. Tisane ( talk) 00:29, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
This is an ENCYCLOPEDIA entry and it's pretty pathetic that most of it seems like a fan site for her to showcase her "talents". When all is said and done, she still got her 15 minutes of fame because she had sex with a high profile figure, nothing more, nothing less, she is still a hooker at heart and that's why there's attention for her. If she was a male prostitute, there wouldn't be such adoration, so let's grow up and do what's right in terms of an encyclopedic barometer in terms of this site... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.173.77.186 ( talk) 22:16, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
{{ edit semi-protected}} Please change the spelling of Ms. Dupre's attorneys name from Don Buckwald to Don D. Buchwald. See this link: http://www.kelleydrye.com/attorneys/don_buchwald
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