The
contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to articles about
living or recently deceased people, and edits relating to the subject (living or recently deceased) of such biographical articles, which has been
designated as a contentious topic. Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page. |
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Armie Hammer article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article has been viewed enough times in a single week to appear in the
Top 25 Report 2 times. The weeks in which this happened:
|
http://movies.yahoo.com/news/usmovies.accesshollywood.com/casting-call-armie-hammer-star-alongside-johnny-depp-lone-ranger Ryoung122 07:21, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
Hammer did not meet his wife at a gas station. They met through mutual friend Tyler Ramsey (artist). I'm editing to correct the error. Muldo ( talk) 18:39, 8 November 2011 (UTC)
I removed this same-day contrib from Armand Hammer:
It is (besides lacking verification) not about the entrepreneur, but about the actor -- in much the same way that an act of fan adoration is about the fan, not the actor. I can see an argument that this actor is more than an average fan of his ancestor, but i am not prepared to make an argument that his role as a fan of his ancestor is sufficiently notable for inclusion in the accompanying actor-bio. I leave it to others to hash that out.
More significantly, the text i quote above was placed under our copy-left provisions by the IP-user
86.133.194.88 (
talk ·
contribs ·
WHOIS), and any use of that text in an article must be attributed in the edit summary as having been contributed 06:32, 29 August 2012 and shortly thereafter at
Armand Hammer.
--
Jerzy•
t
01:06, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
He is listed in category "American people of Russian-Jewish descent", yes, his great-great-grandfather and great-grandfather were Russian Jews, but his other great-grandmother Olga Von Root was Russian and non Jew. So, I think it is better to introduce it in the category: "American people of Jewish descent" and "American people of Russian descent". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.187.72.210 ( talk) 06:35, 21 November 2012 (UTC)
Can you exactly tell me the statement which says where names of children cannot be added? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:03, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
{{
Infobox person}}
. As for putting them in the body of the article, that would be something you would have to get a consensus to do. Putting in their birth years is close to violating the privacy of the children when they are minors. Just because something is reported on a website or even in the legitimate press doesn't mean Wikipedia reports it. It has to be appropriate and encyclopedic. Here, including the children's names is not.--
Bbb23 (
talk)
18:20, 18 August 2018 (UTC)I noticed about the infobox. But Please tell me where does it say you can't add it in article? Do you know the children have been there in the article for days? As far as I know, consensus isn't just for adding something. It is you who needs to get a consensus because you tried to remove something that was there for long. I will be adding them back if you fail to present something that says you can't add their names or take a vote. 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:29, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
None of the above articles you have shown say children names cannot be included, or at least I can't find anything saying it. So either lift a statement directly from it and show it. I already told you WP:PRIVACY is about other editors. Only WP:NOTATABLOID is about children, but it doesn't prohibit naming them and says you should be careful about it. You have failed to prove me wrong. 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:36, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
I haven't found in anything you showed that children's names cannot be included. They have been there for days. I am not satisfied with what you say and have exposed you as in the wrong, I will be restoring them by tomorrow if you can't prove me wrong. 23.91.108.10 (talk) 18:44, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
Don't remove something there for days AGAIN after you are reverted. You likely wouldn't have discussed unless I reverted you again and again. 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:53, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
Neither the IndieWire article nor the Deadline article currently sourced in this article mention anything about abuse. Nor do they mention anything about the number of partners involved. What they do mention is "disturbing sexual fantasies", "cannibalism", and "soured love affairs". I'm not saying that there aren't sources claiming that Armie Hammer was abusive to his partners. But if you are going to make a claim as heavy as that, there should be a linked source that supports that claim. Nikki Lee 1999 ( talk) 07:35, 15 January 2021 (UTC)
Cannibal — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:5C1:4500:BED0:D088:926B:942:19FB ( talk) 22:48, 16 January 2021 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not a news outlet. The title of the section is sensationalized and disrespectful to the people who have allegedly been abused by Hammer. It is not accurate, there has been no evidence to suggest Hammer has engaged in anything other than fetish roleplay, whereas there is real evidence of emotional and physical abuse. This article should not be locked either. The references to cannibalism should stay, but the provocative title should be changed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.196.99.45 ( talk) 15:46, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Change Year Active From PRESENT to 2021 PierreCherry ( talk) 21:23, 6 February 2021 (UTC)
Is this section really warranted? I don't think one simple scuff with the law over a small quantity of marijuana is all that important. I can't help but wonder how many celebrities went through something similar and we don't bother with having a section on it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Byelf2007 ( talk • contribs)
Update: Guess we all agree? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Byelf2007 ( talk • contribs)
"Non-consensual BDSM" doesn't exist. If it is non-consensual, it is sadism, a paraphilia, a fetish, sexual abuse or assault&battery, plain and simple. "BDSM" is defined by being consensual. You can't use that term for anything else but a consensual activity. Grainsofsalt ( talk) 10:10, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
The policy on biographies of living persons requires that we do not report allegations of criminal acts unless there has been a conviction. There has been disagreement among editors of this article about exactly how much reporting of such allegations we should do, and in what way, and what sources are or aren't adequate, but the policy is perfectly clear: we don't report them at all. JBW ( talk) 22:35, 25 March 2021 (UTC)
Apologies if I'm not formatting this correctly. The allegations section needs better sources and a clearer timeline:
Hammer did not date anybody for five months in 2020. He was in quarantine/lockdown in the Cayman Islands from March 2020 and returned to the US approximately June 2020 (as per his Instagram and Twitter). He arrived in Los Angeles on July 10 and his divorce was announced shortly afterward.
He dated Courtney Vucekovich from approximately July 2020 to October 2020 (3 months). He dated Paige Lorenze from approximately October to December 2020 (2 months). Article confirming October 1 break up with Vucekovich: https://pagesix.com/2020/10/01/armie-hammer-had-brief-romance-with-app-founder-courtney-vucekovich/
Hammer was photographed on a date with Jessica Ciencin Henriquez in late August 2020. She denied pursuing him any further in a September 2020 statement to People Magazine: https://people.com/movies/armie-hammer-seen-with-josh-lucas-ex-jessica-ciencin-henriquez-amid-split-from-elizabeth-chambers/
Henriquez later tweeted in support of the woman leaking DMs on January 11, 2021: https://www.etalk.ca/celebrity/2021/1/jessica-ciencin-henriquez-claims-leaked-graphic-dms-from-armie-hammer-are-real.html
Vucekovich gave an interview to Page Six on January 14: https://pagesix.com/2021/01/14/armie-hammers-ex-courtney-vucekovich-he-wanted-to-barbecue-and-eat-me/
Lorenze gave an interview to Daily Mail on January 22: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9172615/This-Armie-Hammer-branded-ex-girlfriend-Paige-Lorenze-using-cutting-knife.html (She would also speak to Page Six, Inside Edition, Kyle and Jacki O, Sofia With An F and Dr Oz).
Hammer had stepped away from the Gaslit series prior to the allegations, due to scheduling conflicts. This February 2021 article notes he and several others exited "months ago":
https://variety.com/2021/tv/news/watergate-series-sam-esmail-armie-hammer-joel-edgerton-1234912162/
In March 2021, after a woman formally accused Hammer of rape, lawyers released a July 2020 WhatsApp message sent by the woman, requesting violent sex, which he declined:
Hammer returned to the Cayman Islands in December 2020 to see his children. He remained there until May 29 2021, when he flew to Florida to begin rehabilitation treatment on May 31: https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2021/06/armie-hammer-has-checked-into-a-treatment-program
Editingtoolss ( talk) 08:50, 17 June 2021 (UTC)
A couple of media outlets have reported that…
September 2022, Armie Hammer’s estranged wife allegedly used a friend’s email to communicate with journalists. A now former friend of Chambers, who allowed Chambers access to her email account, provided emails and screen shots of text messages, which show that Hammer’s ex allegedly posed as this woman and sent messages to press outlets using her account. CNN has also obtained screenshots of text messages between Chambers and her former friend discussing the impersonation.
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/09/26/entertainment/armie-hammer-elizabeth-chambers/index.html
September 22, pagesix reported, that the woman behind the sexual misconduct claims against Hammer, shared unverified text messages purportedly sent messages by pressuring her into pressing charges so she could get full custody of their two children. https://pagesix.com/2022/09/26/elizabeth-chambers-allegedly-posed-as-friend-to-leak-armie-hammer-stories/amp/
I feel this information is relevant and could be a useful addition to the main page. Barkingbard ( talk) 04:10, 5 November 2022 (UTC)
The allegation section doesn’t read like a set of facts. It’s so obviously slanted. Some random anonymous unsourced person says Gloria Allred dropped the case because the woman would be committing perjury? I mean, come on. Be better and stop protecting the Boys Club. 2601:1C2:1701:4AB0:65EA:770:9D3B:5AC2 ( talk) 16:24, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
The way it reads right now is seems non-neutral and not up to Wikipedia standards. Your Glutes ( talk) 03:49, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
Free edit to edit the career 2A02:DD07:800B:4E00:C18E:8DF7:7421:82C6 ( talk) 21:08, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
can you edit you career years active from 2005-2022 to 2005-present 2A02:DD07:800B:4E00:7C9E:BC1B:F0A2:6BA6 ( talk) 17:01, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
The
contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to articles about
living or recently deceased people, and edits relating to the subject (living or recently deceased) of such biographical articles, which has been
designated as a contentious topic. Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page. |
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Armie Hammer article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article has been viewed enough times in a single week to appear in the
Top 25 Report 2 times. The weeks in which this happened:
|
http://movies.yahoo.com/news/usmovies.accesshollywood.com/casting-call-armie-hammer-star-alongside-johnny-depp-lone-ranger Ryoung122 07:21, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
Hammer did not meet his wife at a gas station. They met through mutual friend Tyler Ramsey (artist). I'm editing to correct the error. Muldo ( talk) 18:39, 8 November 2011 (UTC)
I removed this same-day contrib from Armand Hammer:
It is (besides lacking verification) not about the entrepreneur, but about the actor -- in much the same way that an act of fan adoration is about the fan, not the actor. I can see an argument that this actor is more than an average fan of his ancestor, but i am not prepared to make an argument that his role as a fan of his ancestor is sufficiently notable for inclusion in the accompanying actor-bio. I leave it to others to hash that out.
More significantly, the text i quote above was placed under our copy-left provisions by the IP-user
86.133.194.88 (
talk ·
contribs ·
WHOIS), and any use of that text in an article must be attributed in the edit summary as having been contributed 06:32, 29 August 2012 and shortly thereafter at
Armand Hammer.
--
Jerzy•
t
01:06, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
He is listed in category "American people of Russian-Jewish descent", yes, his great-great-grandfather and great-grandfather were Russian Jews, but his other great-grandmother Olga Von Root was Russian and non Jew. So, I think it is better to introduce it in the category: "American people of Jewish descent" and "American people of Russian descent". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.187.72.210 ( talk) 06:35, 21 November 2012 (UTC)
Can you exactly tell me the statement which says where names of children cannot be added? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:03, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
{{
Infobox person}}
. As for putting them in the body of the article, that would be something you would have to get a consensus to do. Putting in their birth years is close to violating the privacy of the children when they are minors. Just because something is reported on a website or even in the legitimate press doesn't mean Wikipedia reports it. It has to be appropriate and encyclopedic. Here, including the children's names is not.--
Bbb23 (
talk)
18:20, 18 August 2018 (UTC)I noticed about the infobox. But Please tell me where does it say you can't add it in article? Do you know the children have been there in the article for days? As far as I know, consensus isn't just for adding something. It is you who needs to get a consensus because you tried to remove something that was there for long. I will be adding them back if you fail to present something that says you can't add their names or take a vote. 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:29, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
None of the above articles you have shown say children names cannot be included, or at least I can't find anything saying it. So either lift a statement directly from it and show it. I already told you WP:PRIVACY is about other editors. Only WP:NOTATABLOID is about children, but it doesn't prohibit naming them and says you should be careful about it. You have failed to prove me wrong. 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:36, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
I haven't found in anything you showed that children's names cannot be included. They have been there for days. I am not satisfied with what you say and have exposed you as in the wrong, I will be restoring them by tomorrow if you can't prove me wrong. 23.91.108.10 (talk) 18:44, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
Don't remove something there for days AGAIN after you are reverted. You likely wouldn't have discussed unless I reverted you again and again. 23.91.108.10 ( talk) 18:53, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
Neither the IndieWire article nor the Deadline article currently sourced in this article mention anything about abuse. Nor do they mention anything about the number of partners involved. What they do mention is "disturbing sexual fantasies", "cannibalism", and "soured love affairs". I'm not saying that there aren't sources claiming that Armie Hammer was abusive to his partners. But if you are going to make a claim as heavy as that, there should be a linked source that supports that claim. Nikki Lee 1999 ( talk) 07:35, 15 January 2021 (UTC)
Cannibal — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:5C1:4500:BED0:D088:926B:942:19FB ( talk) 22:48, 16 January 2021 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not a news outlet. The title of the section is sensationalized and disrespectful to the people who have allegedly been abused by Hammer. It is not accurate, there has been no evidence to suggest Hammer has engaged in anything other than fetish roleplay, whereas there is real evidence of emotional and physical abuse. This article should not be locked either. The references to cannibalism should stay, but the provocative title should be changed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.196.99.45 ( talk) 15:46, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Change Year Active From PRESENT to 2021 PierreCherry ( talk) 21:23, 6 February 2021 (UTC)
Is this section really warranted? I don't think one simple scuff with the law over a small quantity of marijuana is all that important. I can't help but wonder how many celebrities went through something similar and we don't bother with having a section on it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Byelf2007 ( talk • contribs)
Update: Guess we all agree? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Byelf2007 ( talk • contribs)
"Non-consensual BDSM" doesn't exist. If it is non-consensual, it is sadism, a paraphilia, a fetish, sexual abuse or assault&battery, plain and simple. "BDSM" is defined by being consensual. You can't use that term for anything else but a consensual activity. Grainsofsalt ( talk) 10:10, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
The policy on biographies of living persons requires that we do not report allegations of criminal acts unless there has been a conviction. There has been disagreement among editors of this article about exactly how much reporting of such allegations we should do, and in what way, and what sources are or aren't adequate, but the policy is perfectly clear: we don't report them at all. JBW ( talk) 22:35, 25 March 2021 (UTC)
Apologies if I'm not formatting this correctly. The allegations section needs better sources and a clearer timeline:
Hammer did not date anybody for five months in 2020. He was in quarantine/lockdown in the Cayman Islands from March 2020 and returned to the US approximately June 2020 (as per his Instagram and Twitter). He arrived in Los Angeles on July 10 and his divorce was announced shortly afterward.
He dated Courtney Vucekovich from approximately July 2020 to October 2020 (3 months). He dated Paige Lorenze from approximately October to December 2020 (2 months). Article confirming October 1 break up with Vucekovich: https://pagesix.com/2020/10/01/armie-hammer-had-brief-romance-with-app-founder-courtney-vucekovich/
Hammer was photographed on a date with Jessica Ciencin Henriquez in late August 2020. She denied pursuing him any further in a September 2020 statement to People Magazine: https://people.com/movies/armie-hammer-seen-with-josh-lucas-ex-jessica-ciencin-henriquez-amid-split-from-elizabeth-chambers/
Henriquez later tweeted in support of the woman leaking DMs on January 11, 2021: https://www.etalk.ca/celebrity/2021/1/jessica-ciencin-henriquez-claims-leaked-graphic-dms-from-armie-hammer-are-real.html
Vucekovich gave an interview to Page Six on January 14: https://pagesix.com/2021/01/14/armie-hammers-ex-courtney-vucekovich-he-wanted-to-barbecue-and-eat-me/
Lorenze gave an interview to Daily Mail on January 22: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9172615/This-Armie-Hammer-branded-ex-girlfriend-Paige-Lorenze-using-cutting-knife.html (She would also speak to Page Six, Inside Edition, Kyle and Jacki O, Sofia With An F and Dr Oz).
Hammer had stepped away from the Gaslit series prior to the allegations, due to scheduling conflicts. This February 2021 article notes he and several others exited "months ago":
https://variety.com/2021/tv/news/watergate-series-sam-esmail-armie-hammer-joel-edgerton-1234912162/
In March 2021, after a woman formally accused Hammer of rape, lawyers released a July 2020 WhatsApp message sent by the woman, requesting violent sex, which he declined:
Hammer returned to the Cayman Islands in December 2020 to see his children. He remained there until May 29 2021, when he flew to Florida to begin rehabilitation treatment on May 31: https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2021/06/armie-hammer-has-checked-into-a-treatment-program
Editingtoolss ( talk) 08:50, 17 June 2021 (UTC)
A couple of media outlets have reported that…
September 2022, Armie Hammer’s estranged wife allegedly used a friend’s email to communicate with journalists. A now former friend of Chambers, who allowed Chambers access to her email account, provided emails and screen shots of text messages, which show that Hammer’s ex allegedly posed as this woman and sent messages to press outlets using her account. CNN has also obtained screenshots of text messages between Chambers and her former friend discussing the impersonation.
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/09/26/entertainment/armie-hammer-elizabeth-chambers/index.html
September 22, pagesix reported, that the woman behind the sexual misconduct claims against Hammer, shared unverified text messages purportedly sent messages by pressuring her into pressing charges so she could get full custody of their two children. https://pagesix.com/2022/09/26/elizabeth-chambers-allegedly-posed-as-friend-to-leak-armie-hammer-stories/amp/
I feel this information is relevant and could be a useful addition to the main page. Barkingbard ( talk) 04:10, 5 November 2022 (UTC)
The allegation section doesn’t read like a set of facts. It’s so obviously slanted. Some random anonymous unsourced person says Gloria Allred dropped the case because the woman would be committing perjury? I mean, come on. Be better and stop protecting the Boys Club. 2601:1C2:1701:4AB0:65EA:770:9D3B:5AC2 ( talk) 16:24, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
The way it reads right now is seems non-neutral and not up to Wikipedia standards. Your Glutes ( talk) 03:49, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
Free edit to edit the career 2A02:DD07:800B:4E00:C18E:8DF7:7421:82C6 ( talk) 21:08, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
can you edit you career years active from 2005-2022 to 2005-present 2A02:DD07:800B:4E00:7C9E:BC1B:F0A2:6BA6 ( talk) 17:01, 9 July 2024 (UTC)