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Removed "where he is stranded on a tiny planet", because that misleading information. He is stranded in the desert of Sahara, where he meets the Little Prince who's been on Earth a whole year. Sigg3.net — Preceding undated comment added 08:46, 6 January 2003 (UTC)
"It seems he was also an aircraft designer." I don't think you're right. Of course he was interrested by aircraft design. Where does the quote comme from ? Ericd — Preceding undated comment added 19:16, 23 January 2003 (UTC)
I got this quote from: http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/cathedral-bazaar/ar01s07.html. Ppareit — Preceding undated comment added 19:38, 23 January 2003 (UTC)
It's a fair chance he was interested in aircraft design, I don't think he was a designer himself though. Above all he was a pilot. This was long before advanced technology was implemented into the airplanes, and Saint-Exupéry had numerous crashes, also in the Sahara desert. Sigg3.net — Preceding undated comment added 22:05, 11 May 2003 (UTC)
I added some english quotes, but I do not have the french text as someone supplied for the other quotes. -- Ds13 06:40, 2004 Apr 23 (UTC)
This statement seems fishy to me: and is the third most read book only to the Holy Bible and the muslim Ku'ran. Who says so? How can anybody possibly know which is the third most [widely] read book? --???? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Heron ( talk • contribs) 08:20, 20 September 2004 (UTC)
I read, somewhere, that his name was credited as "Saint Exupéry" with no hyphen. Can someone tell me why that was? Mike H 17:45, Jun 23, 2005 (UTC)
The use of the hyphen is general correct usage in French. So, everybody who hears the name over the phone, will write it with a hyphen, like contemporary newspaper editors... Besides, all books were published under his name with the hyphen, which amounts to the hyphened version being his pseudonym. The name of the article should be the hyphened version (the name he is known under in the English speaking world (see WP:Manual of Style), and in the introduction his full name without the hyphen and an explanation should be mentioned. Kraxler ( talk) 15:36, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
User:Cross Reference, above, was correct, as stated in the Forward of Schiff's 1994 biography. It was after his arrival in the United States that Saint-Exupéry himself adopted the hyphen within his surname, as he was annoyed when Americans addressed him as "Mr. Exupéry" (Schiff, 1994). This has now been noted in the article. Best HarryZilber ( talk) 13:20, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
It would be nice to have some sources for these "suicide theories". Are they based on any factual evidence, or just someones opinion? It could just as easily be someone interested in gaining publicity for themselves by taking a contrarian position. It seems.. I'm not even sure this is noteworthy enough to add to the article, anyone who dies in unknown conditions could have a "suicide theory", it almost goes without saying. -- Stbalbach 17:48, 15 January 2006 (UTC)
Would be helpful to add pronunciation and/or a recording to know how to say his name properly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.237.23.72 ( talk • contribs) 20:54, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
I've included a section entitled "Other literary references" to appropriately link to Tom Wolfe's The Right Stuff. The quote is one of the most poignant mentions of the definition of The Right Stuff . Mark5677 09:51, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
I quote:
Today it is regarded as very improbable that Saint-Exupéry was shot down by a German pilot (in spite of the bragging of a German airman who later claimed so). The German aerial combat records of July 31, 1944 do not list any shooting down in the Mediterranean that day.
Where are the sources proving these claims? Who was the pilot bragging about it? Is there a link to the aerial combat records? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.151.172.236 ( talk • contribs) 02:35, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
In #Works some titles are written using uppercases while in fr.wp in lowercases. Unfortunately I don't speak French at all but found a book in amazon.fr for fr:Terre des hommes (not Hommes). Should we fix them, or? -- marsian 07:22, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
From looking through Town of Huntington documents on an unrelated matter this morning, I found that Saint-Exupery actually in Northport New York, not NYC (that's also where he wrote "The Little Prince". I've changed the sentence dealing with his New York location to reflect this. BigKahuna13 01:26, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
I just did a search in Stacy Schiff's biography for "Huntington" and only found one minor reference. [1] I think we need a source to show he lived in Huntington and not NYC. -- Stbalbach 15:33, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Of note - the relatively new airport servicing the Lyon, Rhone region is named after St. Exupery. The architecture of the airport is also striking as it resembles an eagle in flight through glass and metal armatures. 68.62.16.211 16:42, 6 January 2007 (UTC)ant1
The article doesn't explain why he was christened Jean-Baptiste Marie Roger de Saint-Exupéry, yet he's known as Antoine. JackofOz 00:51, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
Added an {{ Infobox Writer}} infobox using for the most part information already contained in the article. Please modify it as may be necessary. Cantabwarrior 03:06, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
In the description of Antoine's experience in the desert there is the line: "Both of the men began seeing mirages." As a mirage is a natural phenomena, dependenant on the environment, not the health of the observer, shouldn't this read "Both of the men began to hallucinate."? —Preceding unsigned comment added by DangerLaef ( talk • contribs) 01:28, 11 January 2008 (UTC)
Despite the news headlines of late, Horst Rippert, an unknown Luftwaffe pilot, does NOT belong in the opening paragraph of this article. Wikipedia puts salient informaton first and least salient information last. Please, at the very least after this flurry of headlines (not even confirmable and sourced only by this man's soon-to-be-published memoir) ends, remove this from the opening paragraph. Thanks! I'm not even sure Antoine's death belongs in the opening paragraph. Softlavender ( talk) 03:44, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
Please keep the hyphens out of Saint Exupéry's name, and remove them when they crop up. Thanks! Softlavender ( talk) 02:14, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm starting to question the veracity of this man's story:
Sure, the story could certainly be true, but I'm just saying, don't automatically believe everything you read. Softlavender ( talk) 22:44, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
Dr. Jean-Pierre de Villers wrote a book in 2000 about a pilot who also claimed to have shot down Saint Exupery. His book is called "The Last Flight of the Little Prince". Here is the amazon.com link to the title and its discription: http://www.amazon.com/Last-Flight-Little-Prince/dp/1895873835/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1207781012&sr=1-5 172.168.13.222 ( talk) 22:50, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
I find Rippert's story quite credible: a) why wait 60+ years to make a false claim; b) why make a false claim in '06 and then not begin to exploit it immediately? c) he claims he made diary entries--what's the date of those entries? MWShort ( talk) 12:22, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
It needs to be noted that Rippert brought out this story one month after his brother, the singer, had died who would have recalled what was said at the time. He waited, until nobody could refute his story. I have known the singer between 1966 and 1969 who was full of spin to further his own ends, fortune more precisely. He knew exactly what he could tell that people could not check up on. The Rippert brothers were estranged then, and while we met some of his friends, we did not meet his brother. I find Rippert's story about shooting down the writer not credible. 121.209.51.121 ( talk) 04:27, 13 October 2009 (UTC)
I am a great fan of Saint Exupéry, as no doubt many readers of his article and this talk page are. The idea of his suiciding is sad, but after wearily reading about his death for years, I begin to wonder whether it's provable, in any sense that Wiki likes to establish facts, and if it is the case, what difference it makes?
As I understand, many people stopped from suiciding are later grateful. If he had tried to suicide, and lived, would he have wanted this incident to be endlessly examined? There are so many important aspects to him. This global discussion isn't about him, not what the man what about, not about the legacy he left. Alpha Ralpha Boulevard ( talk) 15:53, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
I removed the "It remains unclear why the fragments that were recovered of Saint Exupéry's P-38 showed no traces of combat" line [4] as aero-relic.org explains:
“ | Right side - No specific element remains. The fin has been completely torn away, carrying away with it the right side if the boom. As the aicraft has been identified as a military Lightning, thus being a war machine, it was not appropriate to direct our investigations on suspect traces such as impacts, possibly coming from shots, either ground ones (AA/Flak) or aerial ones (7.92 and 13 mm bullets or 20 mm shells, as is the case for a P-38 lying in the Bay of La Ciotat).In fact, after careful analysis of the surfaces of these remains, no particular mark or hole caused by possible shots could be found. In the light of the low percentage of recovered parts, this does not however preclude a crash due to shots, either ground or aerial ones. | ” |
58.8.5.244 ( talk) 02:25, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
Everyone refers to him as Saint-Exupéry; his books are published under that name. French legal documents and birth certificates have no bearing on what his name should be called; Mark Twain is Mark Twain not "Samuel Clemens" and so on. I know that an adopted pseudonym is not the same as a spelling difference, but the rule is to use the most common name. What did he sign his name as? What was he referred to as in the newspapers? shreevatsa ( talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 05:08, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
I believe that the IPA pronunciation of "Antoine de Saint Exupery" in this article is a bit wrong. The lede indicates that the name is pronounced as follows: ɑ̃twan də sɛ̃tɛgzypeˈʀi. I'm not an expert, but this is my understanding of the French pronunciation: au-twon de san-tegz-yooh-pe-ree. (I'm using regular English since I'm not proficient with the phonetic alphabet.)
The first difference between this pronunciation and the pronunciation in the article is that, in this version, the "a" in "antoine" is pronounced "au," like the beginning of the English word "auto." The second difference is that, in this version, the "n" in "saint" is sounded out, not silent. The third difference here has to do with French pronunciation rules. Consonants that end French words are silent, unless the following word begins with a vowel. In this case the following word begins with an "e," causing the "t" in "saint" to be pronounced. In French, whenever this consonant-vowel coupling occurs, the two words in question are sounded out as one word or as if the final consonant of the first word is the first letter of the second word. As a result, in this case, one would pronounce the name as "saintexupery" or "sain texupery."
If anyone has a problem with changing the phonetics, please let me know. If not, I'll change it. I'm not proficient with the IPA, but I can take a stab at reworking the IPA spelling. Or someone who's good with the IPA can do it instead.
For those who are curious, check out http://www.acapela-group.com/text-to-speech-interactive-demo.html to hear the pronunciation by a French speaker. If you type in his full name, the site will sound the whole thing out for you. Cheers, ask123 ( talk) 18:26, 12 November 2008 (UTC)
The text says "... crashed in the Libyan Sahara desert en route to Saigon. [...] The crash site is believed to have been located in the Wadi Natrun." The Link of Wadi Natrun is to an article about the Wadi El Natrun. That Article says the Wadi described "is located in Beheira Governorate, Egypt".
I guess the link in the Article about Saint Exupery is inappropriate, becuase it points to a similarly named but different wadi. I suggest to remove the link. Derflohe ( talk) 14:33, 30 November 2008 (UTC)
Café Saint-Ex in Washington, DC, is named after Antoine de Saint Exupéry. But that's not noteworthy enough to put in the article, is it? Quacks Like a Duck ( talk) 02:49, 19 December 2008 (UTC)
General René Bouscat commander of the Free French Air Force was partly responsible for the sojourn of Saint Exupéry in New York. After Saint Exupéry was grounded in 1943, he also used his position and contacts to convince General Eaker, to get him reinstated and flying with the prestigious group 2/33, based in Sardinia, despite his age, health and his reputation as a second rate pilote. —Preceding unsigned comment added by MichèleVassal ( talk • contribs) 08:52, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
It is claimed an unknown French soldier wearing French "colours" was washed on Carqueiranne beach. This is pure fiction. The French Acte de décès or death certificate quoted after L´Express speaks of a badly mutiladed body wearing fragments of clothing that resembled military garb. See the difference ? H.L. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.172.114.56 ( talk) 11:14, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
Our infobox carries the notation of his writing work timeline, stating: "Period 1929–1948 (posthumous)" However we know that that covers his French publications only up to Citadelle. Is there an established protocol that describes the publication timeline of an author posthumously? HarryZilber ( talk) 16:08, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
According to the French Wikipedia, his father was a " vicomte" ( viscount), not a " comte" ( count). Besides, before adding it again check where it stands in French names, "officially" (i.e. in French) it should be "Antoine Marie Jean-Baptiste Roger, vicomte [sic, lower case] de Saint Exupéry". Besides check if he or his brother inherited the title. Besides, give at least one example where he did indeed use the title, since the note says "rarely" but not "never", or change the note. Thank you for the research. Kraxler ( talk) 17:01, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
His younger brother Francois appears not to have inherited such a title, since he died at age 15 (Schiff, p.61). Regarding your observation of the usage of 'Viscount' on the French Wikipedia, I'm quite perplexed by it, since a 'Viscount' is the British equivalent to a 'Count'. I have no idea why they (the French Wikipedia) use such a title, but in any event it is largely irrelevant unless a reliable source citation can be found and is referenced.I understand that since this article is in the English Wikipedia, English style syntax is required, which would require Saint-Ex's proper name to read as 'Count Antoine Marie...... etc...." Please provide an English Wikipedia MOS source saying otherwise if you would like to present his full name differently. Best: HarryZilber ( talk) 14:44, 4 October 2011 (UTC)"Antoine de Saint Exupéry was born in Lyon on 29th June 1900 into a family with an aristocratic lineage extending back seven centuries. When his father died before his fourth birthday he inherited the title Le Comte de Saint-Exupéry (though he rarely used it)." [1]
Additionally, the official Saint-Exupéry website's chronology for him, shown here as the caption of the first image at the very left, states categorically:"Time Magazine (1944) Milestones, Aug. 14, 1944. Missing in Action: Count Antoine de Saint Exupéry, Time Magazine, 14 August 1944. Quote: "Saint Exupery, veteran of over 13,000 flying hours, was grounded last March by a U.S. Army Air Forces officer because of age, was later put back into his plane... flew some 15 flak-riddled missions in a P-38 before his disappearance."
Unless we can find a reliable source stating why his father, and therefore the author, should actually be considered Viscounts, then the preponderance of evidence requires us to use the rank of Count. Best: HarryZilber ( talk) 00:02, 1 November 2011 (UTC)"Antoine Jean Baptiste Marie Roger de Saint-Exupéry naît le 29 juin 1900 au 8 rue Peyrat à Lyon 2e (aujourd'hui rue Saint-Exupéry). Après Marie-Madeleine (26/01/1897) et Simone (26/01/1898), il est le troisième enfant du comte Jean de Saint-Exupéry et de Marie, née Boyer de Fonscolombe."
References
The sentence "Saint-Exupéry continued to write until the spring of 1943, when he left the United States with American troops bound for North Africa in World War II. " at the start of the "American and Canadian Sojourn..." section seems to me to be out of chronological sequence, as it is followed by his early WW2 posting with the 2/33rd recon squadron. I think there should also be a mention of his book "Pilote de guerre" ("Flight to Arras") here, as it is based on his experience flying reconnaissance on 22 May 1940. [1] Hchalkley ( talk) 15:23, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
References
The allegation that "de Gaulle struck back at the author by ... having his literary works banned in France's North African colonies" is not supported by the reference and is not credible.
De Gaulle only moved his headquarters from London to Algiers in May 1943 - a month *after* Saint-Exupéry rejoined the French air force in North Africa. Furthermore, de Gaulle's position within the Comité français de libération nationale (CFLN) was initially weak because of US and (to a lesser extent) British support for General Giraud and other former Pétainists.
It was only in the period from August to November 1943 that de Gaulle gradually came to dominate the CFLN. Far from imposing stricter controls on freedom of expression in North Africa, his growing influence actually saw the dismantlement of restrictions imposed by the Vichy régime, the release of political prisoners, the ending of anti-semitic laws, etc.
And even if de Gaulle had favoured censorship, why would he have wanted to ban the works of a pilot who was serving in his own air force? 86.44.72.234 ( talk) 16:18, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
Editor Handcuff36 has added new material next to the sentence describing Saint-Exupéry's crash site 'near' the Natrum Valley, saying: "Far from being in the Natrum Valley, he was in Lybia. Ref Terre des Hommes, last paragraph : Quand à toi qui nous sauve, Bédouin de Libye".
Referring to Wind, Sand and Starts, Handcuff talks of a Bedouin of Libya saving Saint-Exupéry and Prevost in Lybia. I'm parking this new material here for comment after having checked the original material cited as Schiff, p. 263, and confirmed that it does place Saint-Ex and Prevost' crash near to the area of the Wadi Natrum, and says directly: "It made no sense that he was back again, Wadi Natrun being somewhat off the beaten track...." (discussing the impressions of the woman the Bedouin took Saint-Ex and Prevost to).
I don't have a copy of WWS/TDH handy so can't confirm the new text. One thought that came to mind is that while the Bedouin on the camel was from Libya, he was actually passing by the Natrum Valley when he found them. Google Maps shows the Natrum to be about a 90 minute drive northwest of Cairo. HarryZilber ( talk) 04:01, 6 February 2013 (UTC)
User:John has removed the article's last section of twenty-odd quotations that another editor added several months ago, to our joint loss, i.m.h.o. John has listed a few WP help pages that he feels supports his decision to remove the quotes, namely (as provided in his last edit summary): "Quotations: WP:V, WP:NOR, WP:NOT....".
While there's no outright prohibition against several quotations listed plainly in their own section, John is pointing to issues which he uses to support their exclusion. I wouldn't agree with WP:NOT which summarizes policy items on how to work towards a better encyclopedia. The list of 20 odd quotations doesn't appear excessive in an article of about 88 kB length since the quotations reflecting Saint-Ex's philosophies on life are not "an indiscriminate collection of information". As well, WP:NOR doesn't appear correct as quoting an author hardly constitutes original research. Quotes are exactly that: no OR is involved in repeating them word for word. That leaves WP:Verification, which will require some searching out of the quotes to provide their sources. Time permitting that shouldn't be an issue. Comments/suggestions on this are welcome. HarryZilber ( talk) 17:04, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
I'm confused that there isn't a section on the period between the desert crash and his sojourn in North America, when he was in the French air force up to the French capitulation? 128.148.231.12 ( talk) 17:43, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
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![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Removed "where he is stranded on a tiny planet", because that misleading information. He is stranded in the desert of Sahara, where he meets the Little Prince who's been on Earth a whole year. Sigg3.net — Preceding undated comment added 08:46, 6 January 2003 (UTC)
"It seems he was also an aircraft designer." I don't think you're right. Of course he was interrested by aircraft design. Where does the quote comme from ? Ericd — Preceding undated comment added 19:16, 23 January 2003 (UTC)
I got this quote from: http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/cathedral-bazaar/ar01s07.html. Ppareit — Preceding undated comment added 19:38, 23 January 2003 (UTC)
It's a fair chance he was interested in aircraft design, I don't think he was a designer himself though. Above all he was a pilot. This was long before advanced technology was implemented into the airplanes, and Saint-Exupéry had numerous crashes, also in the Sahara desert. Sigg3.net — Preceding undated comment added 22:05, 11 May 2003 (UTC)
I added some english quotes, but I do not have the french text as someone supplied for the other quotes. -- Ds13 06:40, 2004 Apr 23 (UTC)
This statement seems fishy to me: and is the third most read book only to the Holy Bible and the muslim Ku'ran. Who says so? How can anybody possibly know which is the third most [widely] read book? --???? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Heron ( talk • contribs) 08:20, 20 September 2004 (UTC)
I read, somewhere, that his name was credited as "Saint Exupéry" with no hyphen. Can someone tell me why that was? Mike H 17:45, Jun 23, 2005 (UTC)
The use of the hyphen is general correct usage in French. So, everybody who hears the name over the phone, will write it with a hyphen, like contemporary newspaper editors... Besides, all books were published under his name with the hyphen, which amounts to the hyphened version being his pseudonym. The name of the article should be the hyphened version (the name he is known under in the English speaking world (see WP:Manual of Style), and in the introduction his full name without the hyphen and an explanation should be mentioned. Kraxler ( talk) 15:36, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
User:Cross Reference, above, was correct, as stated in the Forward of Schiff's 1994 biography. It was after his arrival in the United States that Saint-Exupéry himself adopted the hyphen within his surname, as he was annoyed when Americans addressed him as "Mr. Exupéry" (Schiff, 1994). This has now been noted in the article. Best HarryZilber ( talk) 13:20, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
It would be nice to have some sources for these "suicide theories". Are they based on any factual evidence, or just someones opinion? It could just as easily be someone interested in gaining publicity for themselves by taking a contrarian position. It seems.. I'm not even sure this is noteworthy enough to add to the article, anyone who dies in unknown conditions could have a "suicide theory", it almost goes without saying. -- Stbalbach 17:48, 15 January 2006 (UTC)
Would be helpful to add pronunciation and/or a recording to know how to say his name properly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.237.23.72 ( talk • contribs) 20:54, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
I've included a section entitled "Other literary references" to appropriately link to Tom Wolfe's The Right Stuff. The quote is one of the most poignant mentions of the definition of The Right Stuff . Mark5677 09:51, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
I quote:
Today it is regarded as very improbable that Saint-Exupéry was shot down by a German pilot (in spite of the bragging of a German airman who later claimed so). The German aerial combat records of July 31, 1944 do not list any shooting down in the Mediterranean that day.
Where are the sources proving these claims? Who was the pilot bragging about it? Is there a link to the aerial combat records? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.151.172.236 ( talk • contribs) 02:35, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
In #Works some titles are written using uppercases while in fr.wp in lowercases. Unfortunately I don't speak French at all but found a book in amazon.fr for fr:Terre des hommes (not Hommes). Should we fix them, or? -- marsian 07:22, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
From looking through Town of Huntington documents on an unrelated matter this morning, I found that Saint-Exupery actually in Northport New York, not NYC (that's also where he wrote "The Little Prince". I've changed the sentence dealing with his New York location to reflect this. BigKahuna13 01:26, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
I just did a search in Stacy Schiff's biography for "Huntington" and only found one minor reference. [1] I think we need a source to show he lived in Huntington and not NYC. -- Stbalbach 15:33, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Of note - the relatively new airport servicing the Lyon, Rhone region is named after St. Exupery. The architecture of the airport is also striking as it resembles an eagle in flight through glass and metal armatures. 68.62.16.211 16:42, 6 January 2007 (UTC)ant1
The article doesn't explain why he was christened Jean-Baptiste Marie Roger de Saint-Exupéry, yet he's known as Antoine. JackofOz 00:51, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
Added an {{ Infobox Writer}} infobox using for the most part information already contained in the article. Please modify it as may be necessary. Cantabwarrior 03:06, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
In the description of Antoine's experience in the desert there is the line: "Both of the men began seeing mirages." As a mirage is a natural phenomena, dependenant on the environment, not the health of the observer, shouldn't this read "Both of the men began to hallucinate."? —Preceding unsigned comment added by DangerLaef ( talk • contribs) 01:28, 11 January 2008 (UTC)
Despite the news headlines of late, Horst Rippert, an unknown Luftwaffe pilot, does NOT belong in the opening paragraph of this article. Wikipedia puts salient informaton first and least salient information last. Please, at the very least after this flurry of headlines (not even confirmable and sourced only by this man's soon-to-be-published memoir) ends, remove this from the opening paragraph. Thanks! I'm not even sure Antoine's death belongs in the opening paragraph. Softlavender ( talk) 03:44, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
Please keep the hyphens out of Saint Exupéry's name, and remove them when they crop up. Thanks! Softlavender ( talk) 02:14, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm starting to question the veracity of this man's story:
Sure, the story could certainly be true, but I'm just saying, don't automatically believe everything you read. Softlavender ( talk) 22:44, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
Dr. Jean-Pierre de Villers wrote a book in 2000 about a pilot who also claimed to have shot down Saint Exupery. His book is called "The Last Flight of the Little Prince". Here is the amazon.com link to the title and its discription: http://www.amazon.com/Last-Flight-Little-Prince/dp/1895873835/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1207781012&sr=1-5 172.168.13.222 ( talk) 22:50, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
I find Rippert's story quite credible: a) why wait 60+ years to make a false claim; b) why make a false claim in '06 and then not begin to exploit it immediately? c) he claims he made diary entries--what's the date of those entries? MWShort ( talk) 12:22, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
It needs to be noted that Rippert brought out this story one month after his brother, the singer, had died who would have recalled what was said at the time. He waited, until nobody could refute his story. I have known the singer between 1966 and 1969 who was full of spin to further his own ends, fortune more precisely. He knew exactly what he could tell that people could not check up on. The Rippert brothers were estranged then, and while we met some of his friends, we did not meet his brother. I find Rippert's story about shooting down the writer not credible. 121.209.51.121 ( talk) 04:27, 13 October 2009 (UTC)
I am a great fan of Saint Exupéry, as no doubt many readers of his article and this talk page are. The idea of his suiciding is sad, but after wearily reading about his death for years, I begin to wonder whether it's provable, in any sense that Wiki likes to establish facts, and if it is the case, what difference it makes?
As I understand, many people stopped from suiciding are later grateful. If he had tried to suicide, and lived, would he have wanted this incident to be endlessly examined? There are so many important aspects to him. This global discussion isn't about him, not what the man what about, not about the legacy he left. Alpha Ralpha Boulevard ( talk) 15:53, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
I removed the "It remains unclear why the fragments that were recovered of Saint Exupéry's P-38 showed no traces of combat" line [4] as aero-relic.org explains:
“ | Right side - No specific element remains. The fin has been completely torn away, carrying away with it the right side if the boom. As the aicraft has been identified as a military Lightning, thus being a war machine, it was not appropriate to direct our investigations on suspect traces such as impacts, possibly coming from shots, either ground ones (AA/Flak) or aerial ones (7.92 and 13 mm bullets or 20 mm shells, as is the case for a P-38 lying in the Bay of La Ciotat).In fact, after careful analysis of the surfaces of these remains, no particular mark or hole caused by possible shots could be found. In the light of the low percentage of recovered parts, this does not however preclude a crash due to shots, either ground or aerial ones. | ” |
58.8.5.244 ( talk) 02:25, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
Everyone refers to him as Saint-Exupéry; his books are published under that name. French legal documents and birth certificates have no bearing on what his name should be called; Mark Twain is Mark Twain not "Samuel Clemens" and so on. I know that an adopted pseudonym is not the same as a spelling difference, but the rule is to use the most common name. What did he sign his name as? What was he referred to as in the newspapers? shreevatsa ( talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 05:08, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
I believe that the IPA pronunciation of "Antoine de Saint Exupery" in this article is a bit wrong. The lede indicates that the name is pronounced as follows: ɑ̃twan də sɛ̃tɛgzypeˈʀi. I'm not an expert, but this is my understanding of the French pronunciation: au-twon de san-tegz-yooh-pe-ree. (I'm using regular English since I'm not proficient with the phonetic alphabet.)
The first difference between this pronunciation and the pronunciation in the article is that, in this version, the "a" in "antoine" is pronounced "au," like the beginning of the English word "auto." The second difference is that, in this version, the "n" in "saint" is sounded out, not silent. The third difference here has to do with French pronunciation rules. Consonants that end French words are silent, unless the following word begins with a vowel. In this case the following word begins with an "e," causing the "t" in "saint" to be pronounced. In French, whenever this consonant-vowel coupling occurs, the two words in question are sounded out as one word or as if the final consonant of the first word is the first letter of the second word. As a result, in this case, one would pronounce the name as "saintexupery" or "sain texupery."
If anyone has a problem with changing the phonetics, please let me know. If not, I'll change it. I'm not proficient with the IPA, but I can take a stab at reworking the IPA spelling. Or someone who's good with the IPA can do it instead.
For those who are curious, check out http://www.acapela-group.com/text-to-speech-interactive-demo.html to hear the pronunciation by a French speaker. If you type in his full name, the site will sound the whole thing out for you. Cheers, ask123 ( talk) 18:26, 12 November 2008 (UTC)
The text says "... crashed in the Libyan Sahara desert en route to Saigon. [...] The crash site is believed to have been located in the Wadi Natrun." The Link of Wadi Natrun is to an article about the Wadi El Natrun. That Article says the Wadi described "is located in Beheira Governorate, Egypt".
I guess the link in the Article about Saint Exupery is inappropriate, becuase it points to a similarly named but different wadi. I suggest to remove the link. Derflohe ( talk) 14:33, 30 November 2008 (UTC)
Café Saint-Ex in Washington, DC, is named after Antoine de Saint Exupéry. But that's not noteworthy enough to put in the article, is it? Quacks Like a Duck ( talk) 02:49, 19 December 2008 (UTC)
General René Bouscat commander of the Free French Air Force was partly responsible for the sojourn of Saint Exupéry in New York. After Saint Exupéry was grounded in 1943, he also used his position and contacts to convince General Eaker, to get him reinstated and flying with the prestigious group 2/33, based in Sardinia, despite his age, health and his reputation as a second rate pilote. —Preceding unsigned comment added by MichèleVassal ( talk • contribs) 08:52, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
It is claimed an unknown French soldier wearing French "colours" was washed on Carqueiranne beach. This is pure fiction. The French Acte de décès or death certificate quoted after L´Express speaks of a badly mutiladed body wearing fragments of clothing that resembled military garb. See the difference ? H.L. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.172.114.56 ( talk) 11:14, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
Our infobox carries the notation of his writing work timeline, stating: "Period 1929–1948 (posthumous)" However we know that that covers his French publications only up to Citadelle. Is there an established protocol that describes the publication timeline of an author posthumously? HarryZilber ( talk) 16:08, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
According to the French Wikipedia, his father was a " vicomte" ( viscount), not a " comte" ( count). Besides, before adding it again check where it stands in French names, "officially" (i.e. in French) it should be "Antoine Marie Jean-Baptiste Roger, vicomte [sic, lower case] de Saint Exupéry". Besides check if he or his brother inherited the title. Besides, give at least one example where he did indeed use the title, since the note says "rarely" but not "never", or change the note. Thank you for the research. Kraxler ( talk) 17:01, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
His younger brother Francois appears not to have inherited such a title, since he died at age 15 (Schiff, p.61). Regarding your observation of the usage of 'Viscount' on the French Wikipedia, I'm quite perplexed by it, since a 'Viscount' is the British equivalent to a 'Count'. I have no idea why they (the French Wikipedia) use such a title, but in any event it is largely irrelevant unless a reliable source citation can be found and is referenced.I understand that since this article is in the English Wikipedia, English style syntax is required, which would require Saint-Ex's proper name to read as 'Count Antoine Marie...... etc...." Please provide an English Wikipedia MOS source saying otherwise if you would like to present his full name differently. Best: HarryZilber ( talk) 14:44, 4 October 2011 (UTC)"Antoine de Saint Exupéry was born in Lyon on 29th June 1900 into a family with an aristocratic lineage extending back seven centuries. When his father died before his fourth birthday he inherited the title Le Comte de Saint-Exupéry (though he rarely used it)." [1]
Additionally, the official Saint-Exupéry website's chronology for him, shown here as the caption of the first image at the very left, states categorically:"Time Magazine (1944) Milestones, Aug. 14, 1944. Missing in Action: Count Antoine de Saint Exupéry, Time Magazine, 14 August 1944. Quote: "Saint Exupery, veteran of over 13,000 flying hours, was grounded last March by a U.S. Army Air Forces officer because of age, was later put back into his plane... flew some 15 flak-riddled missions in a P-38 before his disappearance."
Unless we can find a reliable source stating why his father, and therefore the author, should actually be considered Viscounts, then the preponderance of evidence requires us to use the rank of Count. Best: HarryZilber ( talk) 00:02, 1 November 2011 (UTC)"Antoine Jean Baptiste Marie Roger de Saint-Exupéry naît le 29 juin 1900 au 8 rue Peyrat à Lyon 2e (aujourd'hui rue Saint-Exupéry). Après Marie-Madeleine (26/01/1897) et Simone (26/01/1898), il est le troisième enfant du comte Jean de Saint-Exupéry et de Marie, née Boyer de Fonscolombe."
References
The sentence "Saint-Exupéry continued to write until the spring of 1943, when he left the United States with American troops bound for North Africa in World War II. " at the start of the "American and Canadian Sojourn..." section seems to me to be out of chronological sequence, as it is followed by his early WW2 posting with the 2/33rd recon squadron. I think there should also be a mention of his book "Pilote de guerre" ("Flight to Arras") here, as it is based on his experience flying reconnaissance on 22 May 1940. [1] Hchalkley ( talk) 15:23, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
References
The allegation that "de Gaulle struck back at the author by ... having his literary works banned in France's North African colonies" is not supported by the reference and is not credible.
De Gaulle only moved his headquarters from London to Algiers in May 1943 - a month *after* Saint-Exupéry rejoined the French air force in North Africa. Furthermore, de Gaulle's position within the Comité français de libération nationale (CFLN) was initially weak because of US and (to a lesser extent) British support for General Giraud and other former Pétainists.
It was only in the period from August to November 1943 that de Gaulle gradually came to dominate the CFLN. Far from imposing stricter controls on freedom of expression in North Africa, his growing influence actually saw the dismantlement of restrictions imposed by the Vichy régime, the release of political prisoners, the ending of anti-semitic laws, etc.
And even if de Gaulle had favoured censorship, why would he have wanted to ban the works of a pilot who was serving in his own air force? 86.44.72.234 ( talk) 16:18, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
Editor Handcuff36 has added new material next to the sentence describing Saint-Exupéry's crash site 'near' the Natrum Valley, saying: "Far from being in the Natrum Valley, he was in Lybia. Ref Terre des Hommes, last paragraph : Quand à toi qui nous sauve, Bédouin de Libye".
Referring to Wind, Sand and Starts, Handcuff talks of a Bedouin of Libya saving Saint-Exupéry and Prevost in Lybia. I'm parking this new material here for comment after having checked the original material cited as Schiff, p. 263, and confirmed that it does place Saint-Ex and Prevost' crash near to the area of the Wadi Natrum, and says directly: "It made no sense that he was back again, Wadi Natrun being somewhat off the beaten track...." (discussing the impressions of the woman the Bedouin took Saint-Ex and Prevost to).
I don't have a copy of WWS/TDH handy so can't confirm the new text. One thought that came to mind is that while the Bedouin on the camel was from Libya, he was actually passing by the Natrum Valley when he found them. Google Maps shows the Natrum to be about a 90 minute drive northwest of Cairo. HarryZilber ( talk) 04:01, 6 February 2013 (UTC)
User:John has removed the article's last section of twenty-odd quotations that another editor added several months ago, to our joint loss, i.m.h.o. John has listed a few WP help pages that he feels supports his decision to remove the quotes, namely (as provided in his last edit summary): "Quotations: WP:V, WP:NOR, WP:NOT....".
While there's no outright prohibition against several quotations listed plainly in their own section, John is pointing to issues which he uses to support their exclusion. I wouldn't agree with WP:NOT which summarizes policy items on how to work towards a better encyclopedia. The list of 20 odd quotations doesn't appear excessive in an article of about 88 kB length since the quotations reflecting Saint-Ex's philosophies on life are not "an indiscriminate collection of information". As well, WP:NOR doesn't appear correct as quoting an author hardly constitutes original research. Quotes are exactly that: no OR is involved in repeating them word for word. That leaves WP:Verification, which will require some searching out of the quotes to provide their sources. Time permitting that shouldn't be an issue. Comments/suggestions on this are welcome. HarryZilber ( talk) 17:04, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
I'm confused that there isn't a section on the period between the desert crash and his sojourn in North America, when he was in the French air force up to the French capitulation? 128.148.231.12 ( talk) 17:43, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
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