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This article badly needs some well-sourced discussion of Swartz's depression and possible bipolar disorder. Currently the article does not even mention it other than to lightly imply (via a footnote) that he was not depressed. Given that the subject committed suicide over a six-month prison term, I'd say that's a rather significant explanatory gap.
More generally, this article has a bit of an "evil government killed this poor boy" tone to it. Centrify (f / k / a FCAYS) (talk) (contribs) 14:55, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
Admin attention please: The original poster revives this dead thread from August 2014 for fresh discussion. They believe the subject suffered from a mental illness; our reliable sources have been scrupulous to restrict any mention of possible mental illness to the informal concerns of friends and associates. Assertions about the subject’s medical condition or history must, of course, be carefully limited to what is described in reliable sources. This discussion is rife with violations of BLP (in this case a recently deceased person) and WP:OR. MarkBernstein ( talk) 18:42, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
@
Bbb23:
"poorly sourced and poorly crafted"
i'm french, you can do a better sentence if you want, i have not reformulate, i had just put what the sources said (my english is too bad to permit me to reformulate).
->the
reference i had put say that: the vast majority of Wikipedia was created by new editors, mostly people who didn't even bother to create accounts, adding a couple sentences here and there. How did Wales make such a big mistake? He looked at the number of changes each user made to Wikipedia, but didn't look at the size of the change.
->if you read this paragraph of the article wikipedia on aaron
here: Swartz volunteered as an editor at Wikipedia, and in 2006, he ran unsuccessfully for the Wikimedia Foundation's Board of Trustees. Also in 2006, Swartz wrote an analysis of how Wikipedia articles are written, and concluded that the bulk of the actual content comes from tens of thousands of occasional contributors, or "outsiders", each of whom may not make many other contributions to the site, while a core group of 500 to 1,000 regular editors tend to correct spelling and other formatting errors.[52] According to Swartz: "the formatters aid the contributors, not the other way around."[52][53]
->the reference 52 of the article is a website of aaron.
->
https://aaronsw.jottit.com/ is a web site of aaron too. (aaron has created jottit, it is written in the article wikipedia) . If you read "
https://aaronsw.jottit.com/howtoget" on what he says about wikipedia correspond of what he says in reference 52 "
http://www.aaronsw.com/weblog/whowriteswikipedia" I found the user who had contributed it was not an active user of the site. They generally had made less than 50 edits (typically around 10), usually on related pages. Most never even bothered to create an account..
->aaron write this:
"But one day I got a call from Brewster Kahle. Brewster founded the Internet Archive, an incredible organization which tries to digitize everything it can get its hands on and put it all up on the Web. He said he wanted to get started on a project we'd talked about in the past. The idea was to collect information on all the books in the world in one place -- a free wiki. I got right to work and over the next couple months I began calling libraries, roping in programmers, working with a designer, and doing all sorts of other odd jobs to get the site online. That project ended up becoming Open Library and a demo version is now up at demo.openlibrary.org. Much of it was built by a very talented Indian programmer: Anand Chitipothu.".
His name on wikipedia was aaronsw (alias i had put).
Virgil_Griffith has his pseudo on wikipedia put in the box. I think, either the both, either none. But one yes and not the other, i'd like you explain me.
I'm not often on wiki en so, if you change of mind, you can add reformulating what i had putted.
In all cases, i would have a look here the next time i come to see your response.
Vatadoshu
french
22:27, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
I found another relevant source (self-published, but still useful) regarding the early history of OpenLibrary and where the Library of Congress data came from. This post from Scriblio: https://web.archive.org/web/20070701045054/http://about.scriblio.net/scribbles/73 . Hope this helps! JesseW, the juggling janitor 18:37, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
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This addition added a reference to a film by Dinesh D'Souza, referencing Swartz. The trouble is that I see this film as coatracking Swartz, not being about him, or being previously or otherwise aligned to his viewpoints.
Thoughts? Andy Dingley ( talk) 11:29, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 21:10, 24 June 2017 (UTC)
Some great reflections by Lessig on their relationship and the effect Aaron had on his life and career trajectory:
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/08/lawrence-lessig-aaron-swartz/537693/
Cheers, Ocaasi t | c 04:41, 25 August 2017 (UTC)
Why does this article single out Aaron to take the blame for RDF/XML? He did so much more work with RDF and RSS, it's a huge misunderstanding to see this as "RDF/XML". Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:14, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
Re these re-additions [2] [3] [4]
Does Dinesh D'Souza's 2014 documentary America: Imagine the World Without Her belong here? It's a film about D'Souza, not Swartz. It hangs onto Swartz' coat tails horribly as an apologia for D'Souza's own run-ins with the law. This is a filmaker highjacking someone who was no political fellow traveller of his, in order to try and collect his internet-liberal and libertarian followers. WP shouldn't be playing along with this. Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:19, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
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A history that has been all but erased; the real reasons Aaron Swartz was an enemy of the State: "He was working directly with them." Source: https://contraspin.co.nz/beingjulianassange - -- 87.170.201.201 ( talk) 01:29, 10 March 2018 (UTC)
Someone could write an article about his unfinished book? Thanks, Erick Soares3 ( talk) 23:49, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: Ethanpet113 ( talk · contribs) 04:12, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
I have begun review and will use the section numbers of the
relevant criteria as shorthand for which criteria is being evaluated.
Preliminary evaluation
Current conclusions This article does not meet the criteria for good article because it does not flow having several one line paragraphs just inserted in the appropriate section, rather than consistent smooth flowing prose. It seems to be fairly verifiable but is somewhat lopsided given the extreme circumstances of the subject's death. Some citations may be inappropriate according to wikipedia's policies on user generated and self published content, although some leeway is allowed for primary sources pertaining to the main subject of the article. Ethanpet113 ( talk) 04:12, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
@ Nemo bis: I don't see the creation of a person's Wikipedia account and the topics of their Wikipedia edits as something deserving of being in a Wikipedia article. It's just not notable. Plus, the secondary source given is from a blog by a Wikipedia editors about Wikipedia editors which seems hardly significant... MarkH21 ( talk) 15:56, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
His writing about Wikipedia published elsewhere could be included, and perhaps his unsuccessful bid for the board, but work as an ordinary volunteer editor doesn't belong in this article. Jonathunder ( talk) 19:12, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
It seems a majority of the sections are not about Aaron himself, rather what people did in his name. Does this belong to the biography? Should it be put in a different article? Viztor ( talk) 23:10, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
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Reviewer: Puddleglum2.0 ( talk · contribs) 20:11, 21 September 2019 (UTC)
I will be reviewing this article. :-) Puddleglum2.0 ( talk) 20:11, 21 September 2019 (UTC) Note: Having contrasted this article with the [ article criteria], I have deemed this article to be worthy of GA status. Puddleglum2.0 ( talk) 21:36, 21 September 2019 (UTC)
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Reviewer: Lizzy150 ( talk · contribs) 10:54, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Hi @ Viztor:, I'll be reading and reviewing this article shortly. Lizzy ( talk 10:54, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Assuming the nominator or other editors see this.. some comments below. These are glaring issues which should be addressed.
Thanks, Just Lizzy( talk) 18:28, 22 December 2019 (UTC)
Nominator hasn't been online since August and no changes to the article have been made. Closing this for now. Should be renominated when ready. Just Lizzy( talk) 16:00, 5 January 2020 (UTC)
You know, I don't really believe in one thing or the other when it comes to weather Schwartz actually killed himself. I can never know for certain because I was not there. However, omitting the large and active discussion about his death shortly after it happened from the official history is well...Orwellian.
The public reaction to his death included conspiracy theories. Overall, the discussion of his death was a referendum on the future of the free internet and what his death meant. Acknowledging the discussion does not endorse its most radical theories. His death was discussed by many people and this discussion was important.
Many moons ago, this site was dedicated to presenting the sides of the event itself and its discussion amongst the media, internet, and society. I cherished this site growing up because more than just getting the "Encyclopedic" facts on an event, I managed to gain perspective on the subject of the article in question.
I've seen articles edited to minimize or subtly discredit desperate theories concerning its subject. I've seen that all the time since I first began viewing Wikipedia in 2007.
But now, I see these whole sections being gutted and omitted from articles. I see articles gutted of not only the information on the page, but talk pages as well.
Winston clipping news articles and pictures and sending it down the memory hole to be incinerated.
I remember this article briefly once discussing this important discussion.
Now I feel like the article was edited to give the impression no conspiracy theories arose after his death. The public discussion was minute. Anyone who says they remember talking about how scared they were for the security of the internet after these events clearly was just being hyperbolic and malreporting. No one was really having that discussion based on this article.
"Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia." — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tjohnson1775 ( talk • contribs) 01:27, 17 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi @ReasonableCanadian. Related to the name of the company run by Alexis Ohanian and Steve Huffman when reddit was originally incubated (from the intro paragraph). In this [3] techcruch video, now archived, is is explained that, before reddit was created,
"[Steve] Huffman wanted to make a phone system to order subs while he was pumping gas at a local gas stand. Ohanian calls a lawyer and they formed a company called RedBrick Solutions, because Charlottesville is full of red brick buildings."
In turn, it was that company (RedBrick Solutions) that existed when Ohanian and Huffman brought their proposal to Paul Graham. This can be cross referenced based on the book "We Are the Nerds: The Birth and Tumultuous Life of Reddit, the Internet's Culture Laboratory" [4]
"Ohanian followed the playbook he’d learned in his business courses: market research and due diligence. He opened an account at Bank of America and filed papers for Redbrick Solutions, LLC, a name inspired by Charlottesville’s architecture that he figured sounded more official than “MMM.” Ohanian’s “market research,” however, mostly involved hoofing around Charlottesville, strutting into local shops and talking to business owners. He’d give them the pitch and shake hands that they’d try it out, someday." (Page 4)
A.Panda27 ( talk) 22:18, 20 May 2020 (UTC)
References
Thanks. Apokrif ( talk) 11:46, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
Stop trying to cover up the fact that Aaron Swartz was Assassinated. 50.238.205.34 ( talk) 23:51, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
It is not clear when has he released from arrest, only arrest date is mentioned, but not mentioned when and how was he released (guarded at home? etc.) JSoos ( talk) 11:43, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
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In new "WikiLeaks" section change sentence "In January 2013 shortly after he died, WikiLeaks said that Aaron Swartz had helped WikiLeaks and talked to talked Julian Assange in 2010 and 2011." to
In January 2013 shortly after he died, WikiLeaks said that Aaron Swartz helped WikiLeaks and talked to Julian Assange in 2010 and 2011.
Eruhinim (
talk)
05:41, 1 May 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
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Change targetted to targeted in the WikiLeaks section 192.76.8.72 ( talk) 21:09, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
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Change http://www.morganclaypool.com/doi/abs/10.2200/S00481ED1V01Y201302WBE005 to https://www.morganclaypoolpublishers.com/catalog_Orig/9781627051699_WEB.pdf for the "Aaron Swartz's A Programmable Web: An Unfinished Work" publication link. Old link gives 'page not found error. NotEvenDreams ( talk) 23:26, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | ← | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 |
Reason why this talk page section was restored |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
This talk page section was restored from the archives because the restoring editor believes it addresses an important but unresolved issue. Centrify (f / k / a Factchecker_has_annoying_username) (talk) (contribs) 14:11, 20 May 2015 (UTC) |
This article badly needs some well-sourced discussion of Swartz's depression and possible bipolar disorder. Currently the article does not even mention it other than to lightly imply (via a footnote) that he was not depressed. Given that the subject committed suicide over a six-month prison term, I'd say that's a rather significant explanatory gap.
More generally, this article has a bit of an "evil government killed this poor boy" tone to it. Centrify (f / k / a FCAYS) (talk) (contribs) 14:55, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
Admin attention please: The original poster revives this dead thread from August 2014 for fresh discussion. They believe the subject suffered from a mental illness; our reliable sources have been scrupulous to restrict any mention of possible mental illness to the informal concerns of friends and associates. Assertions about the subject’s medical condition or history must, of course, be carefully limited to what is described in reliable sources. This discussion is rife with violations of BLP (in this case a recently deceased person) and WP:OR. MarkBernstein ( talk) 18:42, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
@
Bbb23:
"poorly sourced and poorly crafted"
i'm french, you can do a better sentence if you want, i have not reformulate, i had just put what the sources said (my english is too bad to permit me to reformulate).
->the
reference i had put say that: the vast majority of Wikipedia was created by new editors, mostly people who didn't even bother to create accounts, adding a couple sentences here and there. How did Wales make such a big mistake? He looked at the number of changes each user made to Wikipedia, but didn't look at the size of the change.
->if you read this paragraph of the article wikipedia on aaron
here: Swartz volunteered as an editor at Wikipedia, and in 2006, he ran unsuccessfully for the Wikimedia Foundation's Board of Trustees. Also in 2006, Swartz wrote an analysis of how Wikipedia articles are written, and concluded that the bulk of the actual content comes from tens of thousands of occasional contributors, or "outsiders", each of whom may not make many other contributions to the site, while a core group of 500 to 1,000 regular editors tend to correct spelling and other formatting errors.[52] According to Swartz: "the formatters aid the contributors, not the other way around."[52][53]
->the reference 52 of the article is a website of aaron.
->
https://aaronsw.jottit.com/ is a web site of aaron too. (aaron has created jottit, it is written in the article wikipedia) . If you read "
https://aaronsw.jottit.com/howtoget" on what he says about wikipedia correspond of what he says in reference 52 "
http://www.aaronsw.com/weblog/whowriteswikipedia" I found the user who had contributed it was not an active user of the site. They generally had made less than 50 edits (typically around 10), usually on related pages. Most never even bothered to create an account..
->aaron write this:
"But one day I got a call from Brewster Kahle. Brewster founded the Internet Archive, an incredible organization which tries to digitize everything it can get its hands on and put it all up on the Web. He said he wanted to get started on a project we'd talked about in the past. The idea was to collect information on all the books in the world in one place -- a free wiki. I got right to work and over the next couple months I began calling libraries, roping in programmers, working with a designer, and doing all sorts of other odd jobs to get the site online. That project ended up becoming Open Library and a demo version is now up at demo.openlibrary.org. Much of it was built by a very talented Indian programmer: Anand Chitipothu.".
His name on wikipedia was aaronsw (alias i had put).
Virgil_Griffith has his pseudo on wikipedia put in the box. I think, either the both, either none. But one yes and not the other, i'd like you explain me.
I'm not often on wiki en so, if you change of mind, you can add reformulating what i had putted.
In all cases, i would have a look here the next time i come to see your response.
Vatadoshu
french
22:27, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
I found another relevant source (self-published, but still useful) regarding the early history of OpenLibrary and where the Library of Congress data came from. This post from Scriblio: https://web.archive.org/web/20070701045054/http://about.scriblio.net/scribbles/73 . Hope this helps! JesseW, the juggling janitor 18:37, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
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Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 09:59, 28 March 2016 (UTC)
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This addition added a reference to a film by Dinesh D'Souza, referencing Swartz. The trouble is that I see this film as coatracking Swartz, not being about him, or being previously or otherwise aligned to his viewpoints.
Thoughts? Andy Dingley ( talk) 11:29, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
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Some great reflections by Lessig on their relationship and the effect Aaron had on his life and career trajectory:
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/08/lawrence-lessig-aaron-swartz/537693/
Cheers, Ocaasi t | c 04:41, 25 August 2017 (UTC)
Why does this article single out Aaron to take the blame for RDF/XML? He did so much more work with RDF and RSS, it's a huge misunderstanding to see this as "RDF/XML". Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:14, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
Re these re-additions [2] [3] [4]
Does Dinesh D'Souza's 2014 documentary America: Imagine the World Without Her belong here? It's a film about D'Souza, not Swartz. It hangs onto Swartz' coat tails horribly as an apologia for D'Souza's own run-ins with the law. This is a filmaker highjacking someone who was no political fellow traveller of his, in order to try and collect his internet-liberal and libertarian followers. WP shouldn't be playing along with this. Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:19, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
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A history that has been all but erased; the real reasons Aaron Swartz was an enemy of the State: "He was working directly with them." Source: https://contraspin.co.nz/beingjulianassange - -- 87.170.201.201 ( talk) 01:29, 10 March 2018 (UTC)
Someone could write an article about his unfinished book? Thanks, Erick Soares3 ( talk) 23:49, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
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Reviewer: Ethanpet113 ( talk · contribs) 04:12, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
I have begun review and will use the section numbers of the
relevant criteria as shorthand for which criteria is being evaluated.
Preliminary evaluation
Current conclusions This article does not meet the criteria for good article because it does not flow having several one line paragraphs just inserted in the appropriate section, rather than consistent smooth flowing prose. It seems to be fairly verifiable but is somewhat lopsided given the extreme circumstances of the subject's death. Some citations may be inappropriate according to wikipedia's policies on user generated and self published content, although some leeway is allowed for primary sources pertaining to the main subject of the article. Ethanpet113 ( talk) 04:12, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
@ Nemo bis: I don't see the creation of a person's Wikipedia account and the topics of their Wikipedia edits as something deserving of being in a Wikipedia article. It's just not notable. Plus, the secondary source given is from a blog by a Wikipedia editors about Wikipedia editors which seems hardly significant... MarkH21 ( talk) 15:56, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
His writing about Wikipedia published elsewhere could be included, and perhaps his unsuccessful bid for the board, but work as an ordinary volunteer editor doesn't belong in this article. Jonathunder ( talk) 19:12, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
It seems a majority of the sections are not about Aaron himself, rather what people did in his name. Does this belong to the biography? Should it be put in a different article? Viztor ( talk) 23:10, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
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Reviewer: Puddleglum2.0 ( talk · contribs) 20:11, 21 September 2019 (UTC)
I will be reviewing this article. :-) Puddleglum2.0 ( talk) 20:11, 21 September 2019 (UTC) Note: Having contrasted this article with the [ article criteria], I have deemed this article to be worthy of GA status. Puddleglum2.0 ( talk) 21:36, 21 September 2019 (UTC)
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Reviewer: Lizzy150 ( talk · contribs) 10:54, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Hi @ Viztor:, I'll be reading and reviewing this article shortly. Lizzy ( talk 10:54, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Assuming the nominator or other editors see this.. some comments below. These are glaring issues which should be addressed.
Thanks, Just Lizzy( talk) 18:28, 22 December 2019 (UTC)
Nominator hasn't been online since August and no changes to the article have been made. Closing this for now. Should be renominated when ready. Just Lizzy( talk) 16:00, 5 January 2020 (UTC)
You know, I don't really believe in one thing or the other when it comes to weather Schwartz actually killed himself. I can never know for certain because I was not there. However, omitting the large and active discussion about his death shortly after it happened from the official history is well...Orwellian.
The public reaction to his death included conspiracy theories. Overall, the discussion of his death was a referendum on the future of the free internet and what his death meant. Acknowledging the discussion does not endorse its most radical theories. His death was discussed by many people and this discussion was important.
Many moons ago, this site was dedicated to presenting the sides of the event itself and its discussion amongst the media, internet, and society. I cherished this site growing up because more than just getting the "Encyclopedic" facts on an event, I managed to gain perspective on the subject of the article in question.
I've seen articles edited to minimize or subtly discredit desperate theories concerning its subject. I've seen that all the time since I first began viewing Wikipedia in 2007.
But now, I see these whole sections being gutted and omitted from articles. I see articles gutted of not only the information on the page, but talk pages as well.
Winston clipping news articles and pictures and sending it down the memory hole to be incinerated.
I remember this article briefly once discussing this important discussion.
Now I feel like the article was edited to give the impression no conspiracy theories arose after his death. The public discussion was minute. Anyone who says they remember talking about how scared they were for the security of the internet after these events clearly was just being hyperbolic and malreporting. No one was really having that discussion based on this article.
"Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia." — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tjohnson1775 ( talk • contribs) 01:27, 17 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi @ReasonableCanadian. Related to the name of the company run by Alexis Ohanian and Steve Huffman when reddit was originally incubated (from the intro paragraph). In this [3] techcruch video, now archived, is is explained that, before reddit was created,
"[Steve] Huffman wanted to make a phone system to order subs while he was pumping gas at a local gas stand. Ohanian calls a lawyer and they formed a company called RedBrick Solutions, because Charlottesville is full of red brick buildings."
In turn, it was that company (RedBrick Solutions) that existed when Ohanian and Huffman brought their proposal to Paul Graham. This can be cross referenced based on the book "We Are the Nerds: The Birth and Tumultuous Life of Reddit, the Internet's Culture Laboratory" [4]
"Ohanian followed the playbook he’d learned in his business courses: market research and due diligence. He opened an account at Bank of America and filed papers for Redbrick Solutions, LLC, a name inspired by Charlottesville’s architecture that he figured sounded more official than “MMM.” Ohanian’s “market research,” however, mostly involved hoofing around Charlottesville, strutting into local shops and talking to business owners. He’d give them the pitch and shake hands that they’d try it out, someday." (Page 4)
A.Panda27 ( talk) 22:18, 20 May 2020 (UTC)
References
Thanks. Apokrif ( talk) 11:46, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
Stop trying to cover up the fact that Aaron Swartz was Assassinated. 50.238.205.34 ( talk) 23:51, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
It is not clear when has he released from arrest, only arrest date is mentioned, but not mentioned when and how was he released (guarded at home? etc.) JSoos ( talk) 11:43, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
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In new "WikiLeaks" section change sentence "In January 2013 shortly after he died, WikiLeaks said that Aaron Swartz had helped WikiLeaks and talked to talked Julian Assange in 2010 and 2011." to
In January 2013 shortly after he died, WikiLeaks said that Aaron Swartz helped WikiLeaks and talked to Julian Assange in 2010 and 2011.
Eruhinim (
talk)
05:41, 1 May 2023 (UTC)
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Change targetted to targeted in the WikiLeaks section 192.76.8.72 ( talk) 21:09, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
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Change http://www.morganclaypool.com/doi/abs/10.2200/S00481ED1V01Y201302WBE005 to https://www.morganclaypoolpublishers.com/catalog_Orig/9781627051699_WEB.pdf for the "Aaron Swartz's A Programmable Web: An Unfinished Work" publication link. Old link gives 'page not found error. NotEvenDreams ( talk) 23:26, 18 May 2023 (UTC)