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this is not a list of LGBT events it is a listof rights certain events here are not rights, just because they happen doesnt mean any right was fained or lost. (for that matter even the deaths are dubious) This is same discussion as the 2010 page. Lihaas ( talk) 21:56, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
One user thinks that this article should be list of rights that were gained or lost during 2011 (see above discussion). He is removing large parts of article. I disagree with him. I think that this article should document events that affected LGBT rights, just like the intro says. This article is also target of sockpuppetry, but that shouldn't affect this discussion. This discussion is about the article content.-- В и к и T 14:21, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
I think that drawing a line between "LGBT rights gained/lost" and "events affecting LGBT rights" is unnecessary and arbitrary. The title "2011 in LGBT rights" doesn't imply to me a limitation to events in which a right was specifically gained or lost, and as others have pointed out, the lead says, "events in 2011 that affected LGBT rights" not "LGBT rights gained or lost in 2011". That being said, I do feel that some of the disputed events aren't notable enough to be included in this list; but most of then are. (Full disclosure: this was brought to my attention by the notice on WT:LGBT, but I have previously been involved with "X in LGBT rights" articles.) - htonl ( talk) 20:43, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Disclaimer: LGBT content isn't my usual content area. Looking over the page, I think the biggest issue is geographical coverage. I suggest that whatever coverage rule is settled upon, it actively encourages coverage of rights-related events in non-Western and non-English speaking countries / cultures. Stuartyeates ( talk) 21:23, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
Having an article about rights gained versus lost in a year is an interesting idea. But it's not this article. This article is part of a series of articles that follows the event format. Lihaas seems to be making good-faith edits (unless he is an excellent troll) so I wouldn't say he's a vandal. But he is definitely a combative editor. If he's sockpuppeting, why hasn't he been blocked? Johnathlon ( talk) 20:21, 28 December 2011 (UTC)
The question here is whether you take a broad or narrow definition of the word "rights" in the article name. If you take it to mean rights in a wider context of issues affecting LBGT rights in 2011 then the article should be about anything affecting those rights. I think celebrities would be included in that definition, on the basis of addressing increasing public acceptance of openly gay people. However, if you read "rights" as a narrow more legal definition, essentially meaning LGBT civil rights, then really only legal issues should be included or events that impact on legal issues. Personally, I'd go for the narrower legal definition. It reflects the article more accurately as it currently stands and is also consistant with the usage of the word in other articles, such as the Civil Rights Act of 1964 which talks about the specific legal issues without looking at the wider social context. Robinr22 ( talk) 12:32, 29 December 2011 (UTC)
Please feel free to interpolate your comments inbetween mine since this is quite a long list. This of course only represents my opinion.
I'll come back later and comment on the rest of the disputed items. - htonl ( talk) 18:48, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
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this is not a list of LGBT events it is a listof rights certain events here are not rights, just because they happen doesnt mean any right was fained or lost. (for that matter even the deaths are dubious) This is same discussion as the 2010 page. Lihaas ( talk) 21:56, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
One user thinks that this article should be list of rights that were gained or lost during 2011 (see above discussion). He is removing large parts of article. I disagree with him. I think that this article should document events that affected LGBT rights, just like the intro says. This article is also target of sockpuppetry, but that shouldn't affect this discussion. This discussion is about the article content.-- В и к и T 14:21, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
I think that drawing a line between "LGBT rights gained/lost" and "events affecting LGBT rights" is unnecessary and arbitrary. The title "2011 in LGBT rights" doesn't imply to me a limitation to events in which a right was specifically gained or lost, and as others have pointed out, the lead says, "events in 2011 that affected LGBT rights" not "LGBT rights gained or lost in 2011". That being said, I do feel that some of the disputed events aren't notable enough to be included in this list; but most of then are. (Full disclosure: this was brought to my attention by the notice on WT:LGBT, but I have previously been involved with "X in LGBT rights" articles.) - htonl ( talk) 20:43, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Disclaimer: LGBT content isn't my usual content area. Looking over the page, I think the biggest issue is geographical coverage. I suggest that whatever coverage rule is settled upon, it actively encourages coverage of rights-related events in non-Western and non-English speaking countries / cultures. Stuartyeates ( talk) 21:23, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
Having an article about rights gained versus lost in a year is an interesting idea. But it's not this article. This article is part of a series of articles that follows the event format. Lihaas seems to be making good-faith edits (unless he is an excellent troll) so I wouldn't say he's a vandal. But he is definitely a combative editor. If he's sockpuppeting, why hasn't he been blocked? Johnathlon ( talk) 20:21, 28 December 2011 (UTC)
The question here is whether you take a broad or narrow definition of the word "rights" in the article name. If you take it to mean rights in a wider context of issues affecting LBGT rights in 2011 then the article should be about anything affecting those rights. I think celebrities would be included in that definition, on the basis of addressing increasing public acceptance of openly gay people. However, if you read "rights" as a narrow more legal definition, essentially meaning LGBT civil rights, then really only legal issues should be included or events that impact on legal issues. Personally, I'd go for the narrower legal definition. It reflects the article more accurately as it currently stands and is also consistant with the usage of the word in other articles, such as the Civil Rights Act of 1964 which talks about the specific legal issues without looking at the wider social context. Robinr22 ( talk) 12:32, 29 December 2011 (UTC)
Please feel free to interpolate your comments inbetween mine since this is quite a long list. This of course only represents my opinion.
I'll come back later and comment on the rest of the disputed items. - htonl ( talk) 18:48, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
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