![]() | Kurdistan Template‑class | ||||||
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![]() | Turkey Template‑class | ||||||
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Pbfreespace3 You've done a great job by creating this map but adding Syria to it is a step too far, the map doesn't support it and this is the Turkish Insurgency map and not the Middle east insurgency map (although there is a seperate module which includes all maps from the middle east into one map. [1]) So i think we should stick to turkish locations.
Also we should set a standard for village sizes like i did with the Libyan civil war map Module:Libyan_Civil_War_detailed_map and i think we should add all big cities / important airbases first. How do you think about that? Spenk01 ( talk) 01:17, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
Pbfreespace3 thanks for your efforts on the coloring issue. GreyShark ( dibra) 10:13, 20 August 2015 (UTC)
So the problem is that Turkish sources do not report about Kurdish cities/towns/villages being 'liberated', so it is difficult to verify reliable sources, but I guess HDP (people) is one of those reliable sources. HDP parliamentarian Ziya Pir has announced that Turkish forces have retreated from Silvan. [2] -- Ahmetyal ( talk) 17:37, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm going to add Kurdish cities with greater than 7,000 population and Turkish cities with something like 500,000. Guess I'll have to figure out how to use this module thing. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 01:39, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
How do we define it? Just the PKK or also the DBP? on DBP held cities -- Monochrome_ Monitor 02:59, 23 August 2015 (UTC) I'm assuming it's just kurdish held places that have declared autonomy from Turkey, no? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:00, 23 August 2015 (UTC) Cause a bunch of towns are declaring self-governance. I'll try to find them. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:05, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
Istanbul's Gazi neighborhood reportedly declared autonomy, but Istanbul is WAY too big to use a split-color icon. So we'll need to make maps like for major cities in Syria. I also think it would be worthwhile doing this for Batman and Van. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:53, 23 August 2015 (UTC) Pbfreespace3 I'm considering uploading a submap. What tools are used for this? Wikimapia? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 13:57, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
I feel like this title isn't quite fitting. Maybe it will be later, but none of the Kurdish places are really "insurgencies", which implies A: lack of legitimacy and often B: violence. They peacefully declared autonomy. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 14:09, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
How exactly should I put this on the map (the dot overlaps with Sur city)? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:02, 24 August 2015 (UTC)
I feel like we usually use reddish colors for government. Green seems too Syrian Rebel. Maybe mauve? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 04:07, 24 August 2015 (UTC)
Apparently declaring autonomy is a crime. [5]
I can't get the damn template to update, but here's an awesome map. It's in french but fairly easy to understand through cognates. It shows active fighting and places that have declared autonomy. Both should be on this map-pkk/HGP controlled and kurdish autonomous.-- Monochrome_ Monitor 06:47, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm going to focus on North Kurdistan (putting all the districts on, and all the populated towns listed on wikipedia) with a few exceptions—the PKK targets oil pipelines for sabotage, and they do it quite a bit. We should really have a map of natural gas/oil pipelines on here. And if anyone finds it, it would be nice to put the PKK's mountain bases (rural settlements) on here too. -- Monochrome_ Monitor!~
Is there a wikipedia page that corresponds to this? A conflict is definitely underway. Over 70 Turkish security personnel have been killed. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 12:48, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
Apparently Syria used to be a part of this module but was removed. Why? The PKK has a presence in Syria and showing Syria gives more regional context. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 12:59, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
Monochrome What vandalism are you talking about? Prohibited Area ( talk) 17:23, 19 December 2015 (UTC)
There is no such "liberated zones" in Turkey right now. Only some clashes with police at some points,and attacks at outskits. İn cities shown as "held by Pkk" still Turkish flag waves and Turkish police, soldiers present. Those declarations of autonomy are only nominal, they are not really helding cities. Sources of this map aren't reliable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.175.107.106 ( talk • contribs) 16:58, 4 October 2015 UTC
Unfortunately this page's creator was banned indefinitely, but I'm hoping recent increased coverage may translate to more contributors. Anyway, here's what should be on the template, in loose order of general priority.
In fact, every country should have one of these, not just those in war time -- Monochrome_ Monitor 15:07, 30 November 2015 (UTC)
Kurdish party that won 10% in the polls a while ago. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 18:32, 19 December 2015 (UTC)
This was never supposed to be a kurdish propaganda map. It was supposed to reflect places that have declared autonomy and places controlled by the PKK. Not places where there is intermittent clashing. I wish there were a way to reflect this somehow in the title or distinguish between pkk/military autonomy and legal/administrative autonomy on the template. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 18:00, 20 December 2015 (UTC) I was worried about this becoming anti-kurdish propaganda with the vandalism but any sort of npov violation is bad. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 01:54, 21 December 2015 (UTC)
Conflicts here is between the Turkish state and the Kurds. Also PKK, HPG, KCK, YDG-H, YPS are all Kurdish organizations. Generally conflicts is known as between Turkey and Kurds in World. Bruskom talk to me 09:55, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
Comment: In this issue
Mttll is right. Labelling one side as "Kurds" and the other as "Government" aint fair or balanced. What would be logic is either called them "Kurds" & "Turks" or "Government" & "PKK/YPS, etc...".--
HC
PUNXKID
14:42, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
Why city icons is so large ? Can we change the size of cities as small icon? Bruskom talk to me 08:53, 23 December 2015 (UTC)
Hello, Who can make a Turkey location map for Turkish Insurgency ? Like Syria location map. But this does not seem to map rivers in Turkey. Anyone interested in creating a location map for the Turkish insurgency in Turkey? Personally I do not know how to create such a location map and hence I am asking if any other editors would be happy to create one? Who can add to this rivers map? for example, the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. And rivers in neighboring countries. For example, Iraq, Syria, Iran, Armenia, Russia, Bulgaria and Greece. The background color of the provinces on the map should be a little darker, a little white color .. .. And the borders of the provinces should be slightly thicker than black. Bruskom talk to me 14:36, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
This map needs improving alot. Pro-PKK forces control only parts of districts in Diyarbakir, Hakkari and Cizre where fighting is ongoing so only those areas should be represented as contested areas and there should be no PKK/"Kurdish" controlled areas (especially in Istanbul) because even though they declared autonomy the people who did have mostly been arrested (sources: [6] [7] [Three mayors in Diyarbakir arrested for autonomy declarations%0A%09%09%09%09%09%09%09]). Also since this is a map of the Turkish Insurgency there should be information on ISIS forces and Maoists. -- FPSTurkey ( talk) 12:21, 7 February 2016 (UTC)
IS and Maoists hold no territory in Turkey, not even rural areas. They have a presence, but not one you could mark in a specific area, because that indicates control. PutItOnAMap ( talk) 17:55, 13 February 2016 (UTC)
100% Turkish victory!
http://www.trtturk.com/haber/cizrede-operasyonlar-basariyla-sona-erdi-175665.html
Yes, you can trust. Tekin 12:58, 12 March 2016 (UTC)
1. Repeated, unsourced changes, all from contested or Kurdish autonomy/indepence-supporting-held to Turkish government held. 2. Changing the name of the map from 'Turkish insurgency' to 'Kurdish terrorism'. 3. Not even bothering to talk to editors who have problems with your edits.
These are the problems we face. You need to sort them out.
1. You may want the Turkish government to win, but here in wikipedia, we value accuracy and neutrality above POV pushing. We tell things like they are, not like we want them to be - otherwise, IS would not control anything on our maps, and neither would Al Qaeda. Stop making unsourced changes, even if they make your preferred side look stronger.
2. An insurgency is different from terrorism. Terrorism may be a tactic used in an insurgency, but this map is not for terrorism - it's for the insurgency itself. There is an insurgency going on, where militants from various Kurdish indepenence/autonomy-supporting groups are trying to take control of areas. This is what we are mapping here - not terrorist activities. Therefore, the appropriate name of the map is 'Turkish insurgency' (because it is an insurgency in Turkey), not 'Kurdish terrorism' (because we are not mapping terrorist activity, and we are certainly not associating the activities of the PKK with an entire race).
3. This is called an edit war, and it breaks the rules of wikipedia. If you and another editor consistently disagree over something, discuss it in the talk page - this page, in fact. This is the best way to do things, rather than changing the map over and over and giving our readers and viewers an inaccurate and rapidly changing picture of events.
Please sort these issues out, Omeristan. Thank you for your time. PutItOnAMap ( talk) 22:23, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
Did we get them all back? PutItOnAMap ( talk) 11:58, 24 February 2016 (UTC)
As we know, this insurgency is between the Turkish government and a number of Kurdish autonomy/independence-supporting groups operating in southeast Turkey. 'Kurds' is, in my opinion, not a correct term to use, as it implies that Kurds in general (and being Kurdish is just an ethnicity and perhaps a cultural background) are waging an insurgency, rather than specific armed groups.
I propose we change the label 'Kurds' on this map to 'Kurdish groups', 'Kurdish independence groups', 'Kurdish nationalists' or 'Kurdish autonomy/independence-supporting groups'. Something else along those lines might work, too: however, I think it's wrong to label armed groups as 'Kurds'. What are your thoughts on this? PutItOnAMap ( talk) 18:21, 25 February 2016 (UTC)
The districts of Hınıs, Karaçoban, Karayazı and Tekman in the province of Erzurum were/are/have always been under the complete control of the Turkish government. -- Mttll ( talk) 20:17, 25 February 2016 (UTC)
...is under the control of the Turkish government. The illegal far-left DHKP-C is active there, but then they are not an organization that can be put under the label Kurds. This module resembles an alternate world roleplay thing. -- Mttll ( talk) 20:26, 25 February 2016 (UTC)
This map is obviously outdated. My work on it has almost all been in adding stuff to it, not determining what color things should be. I was told by a user (who since got banned from this topic) that several districts in Erzurum had declared autonomy. I made em yellow, I'll switch them back. I greatly appreciate your reasoned and logical arguments as opposed to many assholes who just blank the entire page. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:41, 26 February 2016 (UTC) This article is in a transition phase. It began as a map which showed places that declared autonomy, but that stage is over since all of those people got arrested months ago. Now it should only show places where kurds are clashing with police, or no-go zones for turkish forces. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:43, 26 February 2016 (UTC) @ Mttll:
Oh, so the original edits were not based on sources, then? It's ok to revert them in that case. If you were just told by someone else that they had declared autonomy, then revert. If they actually did and there has been no government crackdown, mark in lime, or there has been a curfew lifted since that time, then mark in yellow. PutItOnAMap ( talk) 09:26, 26 February 2016 (UTC)
Oh to clarify, the gazi thing was sourced. The erzurum things weren't adequately sourced. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 09:45, 26 February 2016 (UTC) The f*ck.... who changed the version of the map?!?!? It was supposed to be the alt version. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 09:47, 26 February 2016 (UTC)
The Bulanık district is still Turkish-held.
"Diyarbakır Governor: 98 percent of area in six neighborhoods have been cleared from [PKK] terrorists."
Soon very soon, Turkish victory. ;)
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/Turkish_Insurgency.svg
All these towns you guys show in yellow suggests that these towns are under TOTAL control of the PKK and that is totally wrong information. Right now at this moment there are clashes happening in Varto, Derik, Semdinli, Silvan and literally every other yellow dot. There are either clashes in those towns or those towns are actually under Turkey's control.
But the weirdest part of this whole map is showing two neighborhoods in Istanbul to be under control of the PKK. Do you guys seriously believe to stuff like this? What's up with this anti-Turkey agenda pushing and this map?
If you don't like something in the module, please don't make huge sweeping changes or blank the page to get attention. This page is still in its infancy. Well, perhaps its childhood. Locations need to be added still and logistics worked out... Anyway, I agree much of it is out of date. If you want to make a boldish change please ping me or putinonamap or someone on the talk page about it. Not necessarily for approval, but so it doesn't get rolled back. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 22:36, 2 March 2016 (UTC) I have admittedly been neglecting developments on the ground since a few months ago, and focused instead on adding new districts and towns and whatnot. I can't speak turkish or kurdmanji so there are people better qualified to update the current military situation. Unfortunately its barely covered in English. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 22:36, 2 March 2016 (UTC)
What do you guys think I should add next? It's a bit overwhelming to put in locations for such a developed country like Turkey, as opposed to say Yemen, which has only like 10 important cities. I'm ignoring the non-Kurdish majority places unless they become relevant strategically. I think I did all the border crossings... @ SMB99thx: did a lot (or all?) of the airbases... what's next? Adding all the cities which aren't district centers would be a pain in the ass and take a while. I don't think seaports are a priority... but oil pipelines definitely are. The PKK often sabotages pipelines from the Kurdish autonomous region of Iraq. Also, rural areas. The PKK's main presence is in the mountains. But I have no clue about the coordinates. It would be great if someone did know or could find out. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 00:39, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
Considering other precedents, the module name should correspond the name of the main article on PKK rebellion -
PKK rebellion (2015–present). Furhtermore, the title "Turkish insurgency" may confuse readers and editors, since it could both refer to insurgency in Turkey or insurgency by Turks (which is incorrect). I herewith propose:
Your thoughts are welcome. GreyShark ( dibra) 06:43, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
This template should not be speedy deleted as an unambiguous misrepresentation of policy, because this map displays the military situation during the PKK rebellion in Turkey right now, similar to the Template:Syrian Civil War detailed map and the Template:Libyan Civil War detailed map. It also uses reliable sources to document changes; there's no reason to delete this map at all. -- LightandDark2000 ( talk) 06:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
Please make the dot 3 times bigger. Istanbul is 3 times bigger then Ankara. Beshogur ( talk) 15:10, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
Istanbul is waaaay bigger than that dot. The dot isn't a good shape in the first place, Instanbul is very long. Are there any um... ovals we can use? Yes, that sounds silly. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:35, 4 March 2016 (UTC)
100% Turkish victory! Beshogur ( talk) 12:31, 9 March 2016 (UTC)
http://www.kentgundemi.net/dunya/idil-deki-operasyonlar-tamamlandi-h51995.html http://www.sondakika.com/haber/haber-idil-de-teror-operasyonlari-bitti-114-terorist-8238094/ http://odatv.com/o-ilcede-operasyonlar-bitti-0803161200.html http://www.hurhaber.com/idil-de-operasyon-bitti-haberi-62002.html
100% Turkish victory! [1] Beshogur ( talk) 15:54, 9 March 2016 (UTC)
Why do you keep changing it? The one by nordnordwest is accurate, the current one isn't. Can we get a consensus on this? I hate making the same points over and over again and not being listened to.... it's exhausting. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:53, 11 March 2016 (UTC)
It might be better to make the govt red instead of green, to make it more distinguishable
What is up with these colors? TWO greens for Turkey? Is there a reasoning or can I change it? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 16:19, 18 May 2016 (UTC)
![]() | Kurdistan Template‑class | ||||||
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![]() | Turkey Template‑class | ||||||
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Pbfreespace3 You've done a great job by creating this map but adding Syria to it is a step too far, the map doesn't support it and this is the Turkish Insurgency map and not the Middle east insurgency map (although there is a seperate module which includes all maps from the middle east into one map. [1]) So i think we should stick to turkish locations.
Also we should set a standard for village sizes like i did with the Libyan civil war map Module:Libyan_Civil_War_detailed_map and i think we should add all big cities / important airbases first. How do you think about that? Spenk01 ( talk) 01:17, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
Pbfreespace3 thanks for your efforts on the coloring issue. GreyShark ( dibra) 10:13, 20 August 2015 (UTC)
So the problem is that Turkish sources do not report about Kurdish cities/towns/villages being 'liberated', so it is difficult to verify reliable sources, but I guess HDP (people) is one of those reliable sources. HDP parliamentarian Ziya Pir has announced that Turkish forces have retreated from Silvan. [2] -- Ahmetyal ( talk) 17:37, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm going to add Kurdish cities with greater than 7,000 population and Turkish cities with something like 500,000. Guess I'll have to figure out how to use this module thing. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 01:39, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
How do we define it? Just the PKK or also the DBP? on DBP held cities -- Monochrome_ Monitor 02:59, 23 August 2015 (UTC) I'm assuming it's just kurdish held places that have declared autonomy from Turkey, no? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:00, 23 August 2015 (UTC) Cause a bunch of towns are declaring self-governance. I'll try to find them. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:05, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
Istanbul's Gazi neighborhood reportedly declared autonomy, but Istanbul is WAY too big to use a split-color icon. So we'll need to make maps like for major cities in Syria. I also think it would be worthwhile doing this for Batman and Van. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:53, 23 August 2015 (UTC) Pbfreespace3 I'm considering uploading a submap. What tools are used for this? Wikimapia? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 13:57, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
I feel like this title isn't quite fitting. Maybe it will be later, but none of the Kurdish places are really "insurgencies", which implies A: lack of legitimacy and often B: violence. They peacefully declared autonomy. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 14:09, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
How exactly should I put this on the map (the dot overlaps with Sur city)? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:02, 24 August 2015 (UTC)
I feel like we usually use reddish colors for government. Green seems too Syrian Rebel. Maybe mauve? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 04:07, 24 August 2015 (UTC)
Apparently declaring autonomy is a crime. [5]
I can't get the damn template to update, but here's an awesome map. It's in french but fairly easy to understand through cognates. It shows active fighting and places that have declared autonomy. Both should be on this map-pkk/HGP controlled and kurdish autonomous.-- Monochrome_ Monitor 06:47, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm going to focus on North Kurdistan (putting all the districts on, and all the populated towns listed on wikipedia) with a few exceptions—the PKK targets oil pipelines for sabotage, and they do it quite a bit. We should really have a map of natural gas/oil pipelines on here. And if anyone finds it, it would be nice to put the PKK's mountain bases (rural settlements) on here too. -- Monochrome_ Monitor!~
Is there a wikipedia page that corresponds to this? A conflict is definitely underway. Over 70 Turkish security personnel have been killed. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 12:48, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
Apparently Syria used to be a part of this module but was removed. Why? The PKK has a presence in Syria and showing Syria gives more regional context. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 12:59, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
Monochrome What vandalism are you talking about? Prohibited Area ( talk) 17:23, 19 December 2015 (UTC)
There is no such "liberated zones" in Turkey right now. Only some clashes with police at some points,and attacks at outskits. İn cities shown as "held by Pkk" still Turkish flag waves and Turkish police, soldiers present. Those declarations of autonomy are only nominal, they are not really helding cities. Sources of this map aren't reliable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.175.107.106 ( talk • contribs) 16:58, 4 October 2015 UTC
Unfortunately this page's creator was banned indefinitely, but I'm hoping recent increased coverage may translate to more contributors. Anyway, here's what should be on the template, in loose order of general priority.
In fact, every country should have one of these, not just those in war time -- Monochrome_ Monitor 15:07, 30 November 2015 (UTC)
Kurdish party that won 10% in the polls a while ago. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 18:32, 19 December 2015 (UTC)
This was never supposed to be a kurdish propaganda map. It was supposed to reflect places that have declared autonomy and places controlled by the PKK. Not places where there is intermittent clashing. I wish there were a way to reflect this somehow in the title or distinguish between pkk/military autonomy and legal/administrative autonomy on the template. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 18:00, 20 December 2015 (UTC) I was worried about this becoming anti-kurdish propaganda with the vandalism but any sort of npov violation is bad. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 01:54, 21 December 2015 (UTC)
Conflicts here is between the Turkish state and the Kurds. Also PKK, HPG, KCK, YDG-H, YPS are all Kurdish organizations. Generally conflicts is known as between Turkey and Kurds in World. Bruskom talk to me 09:55, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
Comment: In this issue
Mttll is right. Labelling one side as "Kurds" and the other as "Government" aint fair or balanced. What would be logic is either called them "Kurds" & "Turks" or "Government" & "PKK/YPS, etc...".--
HC
PUNXKID
14:42, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
Why city icons is so large ? Can we change the size of cities as small icon? Bruskom talk to me 08:53, 23 December 2015 (UTC)
Hello, Who can make a Turkey location map for Turkish Insurgency ? Like Syria location map. But this does not seem to map rivers in Turkey. Anyone interested in creating a location map for the Turkish insurgency in Turkey? Personally I do not know how to create such a location map and hence I am asking if any other editors would be happy to create one? Who can add to this rivers map? for example, the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. And rivers in neighboring countries. For example, Iraq, Syria, Iran, Armenia, Russia, Bulgaria and Greece. The background color of the provinces on the map should be a little darker, a little white color .. .. And the borders of the provinces should be slightly thicker than black. Bruskom talk to me 14:36, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
This map needs improving alot. Pro-PKK forces control only parts of districts in Diyarbakir, Hakkari and Cizre where fighting is ongoing so only those areas should be represented as contested areas and there should be no PKK/"Kurdish" controlled areas (especially in Istanbul) because even though they declared autonomy the people who did have mostly been arrested (sources: [6] [7] [Three mayors in Diyarbakir arrested for autonomy declarations%0A%09%09%09%09%09%09%09]). Also since this is a map of the Turkish Insurgency there should be information on ISIS forces and Maoists. -- FPSTurkey ( talk) 12:21, 7 February 2016 (UTC)
IS and Maoists hold no territory in Turkey, not even rural areas. They have a presence, but not one you could mark in a specific area, because that indicates control. PutItOnAMap ( talk) 17:55, 13 February 2016 (UTC)
100% Turkish victory!
http://www.trtturk.com/haber/cizrede-operasyonlar-basariyla-sona-erdi-175665.html
Yes, you can trust. Tekin 12:58, 12 March 2016 (UTC)
1. Repeated, unsourced changes, all from contested or Kurdish autonomy/indepence-supporting-held to Turkish government held. 2. Changing the name of the map from 'Turkish insurgency' to 'Kurdish terrorism'. 3. Not even bothering to talk to editors who have problems with your edits.
These are the problems we face. You need to sort them out.
1. You may want the Turkish government to win, but here in wikipedia, we value accuracy and neutrality above POV pushing. We tell things like they are, not like we want them to be - otherwise, IS would not control anything on our maps, and neither would Al Qaeda. Stop making unsourced changes, even if they make your preferred side look stronger.
2. An insurgency is different from terrorism. Terrorism may be a tactic used in an insurgency, but this map is not for terrorism - it's for the insurgency itself. There is an insurgency going on, where militants from various Kurdish indepenence/autonomy-supporting groups are trying to take control of areas. This is what we are mapping here - not terrorist activities. Therefore, the appropriate name of the map is 'Turkish insurgency' (because it is an insurgency in Turkey), not 'Kurdish terrorism' (because we are not mapping terrorist activity, and we are certainly not associating the activities of the PKK with an entire race).
3. This is called an edit war, and it breaks the rules of wikipedia. If you and another editor consistently disagree over something, discuss it in the talk page - this page, in fact. This is the best way to do things, rather than changing the map over and over and giving our readers and viewers an inaccurate and rapidly changing picture of events.
Please sort these issues out, Omeristan. Thank you for your time. PutItOnAMap ( talk) 22:23, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
Did we get them all back? PutItOnAMap ( talk) 11:58, 24 February 2016 (UTC)
As we know, this insurgency is between the Turkish government and a number of Kurdish autonomy/independence-supporting groups operating in southeast Turkey. 'Kurds' is, in my opinion, not a correct term to use, as it implies that Kurds in general (and being Kurdish is just an ethnicity and perhaps a cultural background) are waging an insurgency, rather than specific armed groups.
I propose we change the label 'Kurds' on this map to 'Kurdish groups', 'Kurdish independence groups', 'Kurdish nationalists' or 'Kurdish autonomy/independence-supporting groups'. Something else along those lines might work, too: however, I think it's wrong to label armed groups as 'Kurds'. What are your thoughts on this? PutItOnAMap ( talk) 18:21, 25 February 2016 (UTC)
The districts of Hınıs, Karaçoban, Karayazı and Tekman in the province of Erzurum were/are/have always been under the complete control of the Turkish government. -- Mttll ( talk) 20:17, 25 February 2016 (UTC)
...is under the control of the Turkish government. The illegal far-left DHKP-C is active there, but then they are not an organization that can be put under the label Kurds. This module resembles an alternate world roleplay thing. -- Mttll ( talk) 20:26, 25 February 2016 (UTC)
This map is obviously outdated. My work on it has almost all been in adding stuff to it, not determining what color things should be. I was told by a user (who since got banned from this topic) that several districts in Erzurum had declared autonomy. I made em yellow, I'll switch them back. I greatly appreciate your reasoned and logical arguments as opposed to many assholes who just blank the entire page. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:41, 26 February 2016 (UTC) This article is in a transition phase. It began as a map which showed places that declared autonomy, but that stage is over since all of those people got arrested months ago. Now it should only show places where kurds are clashing with police, or no-go zones for turkish forces. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:43, 26 February 2016 (UTC) @ Mttll:
Oh, so the original edits were not based on sources, then? It's ok to revert them in that case. If you were just told by someone else that they had declared autonomy, then revert. If they actually did and there has been no government crackdown, mark in lime, or there has been a curfew lifted since that time, then mark in yellow. PutItOnAMap ( talk) 09:26, 26 February 2016 (UTC)
Oh to clarify, the gazi thing was sourced. The erzurum things weren't adequately sourced. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 09:45, 26 February 2016 (UTC) The f*ck.... who changed the version of the map?!?!? It was supposed to be the alt version. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 09:47, 26 February 2016 (UTC)
The Bulanık district is still Turkish-held.
"Diyarbakır Governor: 98 percent of area in six neighborhoods have been cleared from [PKK] terrorists."
Soon very soon, Turkish victory. ;)
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/Turkish_Insurgency.svg
All these towns you guys show in yellow suggests that these towns are under TOTAL control of the PKK and that is totally wrong information. Right now at this moment there are clashes happening in Varto, Derik, Semdinli, Silvan and literally every other yellow dot. There are either clashes in those towns or those towns are actually under Turkey's control.
But the weirdest part of this whole map is showing two neighborhoods in Istanbul to be under control of the PKK. Do you guys seriously believe to stuff like this? What's up with this anti-Turkey agenda pushing and this map?
If you don't like something in the module, please don't make huge sweeping changes or blank the page to get attention. This page is still in its infancy. Well, perhaps its childhood. Locations need to be added still and logistics worked out... Anyway, I agree much of it is out of date. If you want to make a boldish change please ping me or putinonamap or someone on the talk page about it. Not necessarily for approval, but so it doesn't get rolled back. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 22:36, 2 March 2016 (UTC) I have admittedly been neglecting developments on the ground since a few months ago, and focused instead on adding new districts and towns and whatnot. I can't speak turkish or kurdmanji so there are people better qualified to update the current military situation. Unfortunately its barely covered in English. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 22:36, 2 March 2016 (UTC)
What do you guys think I should add next? It's a bit overwhelming to put in locations for such a developed country like Turkey, as opposed to say Yemen, which has only like 10 important cities. I'm ignoring the non-Kurdish majority places unless they become relevant strategically. I think I did all the border crossings... @ SMB99thx: did a lot (or all?) of the airbases... what's next? Adding all the cities which aren't district centers would be a pain in the ass and take a while. I don't think seaports are a priority... but oil pipelines definitely are. The PKK often sabotages pipelines from the Kurdish autonomous region of Iraq. Also, rural areas. The PKK's main presence is in the mountains. But I have no clue about the coordinates. It would be great if someone did know or could find out. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 00:39, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
Considering other precedents, the module name should correspond the name of the main article on PKK rebellion -
PKK rebellion (2015–present). Furhtermore, the title "Turkish insurgency" may confuse readers and editors, since it could both refer to insurgency in Turkey or insurgency by Turks (which is incorrect). I herewith propose:
Your thoughts are welcome. GreyShark ( dibra) 06:43, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
This template should not be speedy deleted as an unambiguous misrepresentation of policy, because this map displays the military situation during the PKK rebellion in Turkey right now, similar to the Template:Syrian Civil War detailed map and the Template:Libyan Civil War detailed map. It also uses reliable sources to document changes; there's no reason to delete this map at all. -- LightandDark2000 ( talk) 06:54, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
Please make the dot 3 times bigger. Istanbul is 3 times bigger then Ankara. Beshogur ( talk) 15:10, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
Istanbul is waaaay bigger than that dot. The dot isn't a good shape in the first place, Instanbul is very long. Are there any um... ovals we can use? Yes, that sounds silly. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:35, 4 March 2016 (UTC)
100% Turkish victory! Beshogur ( talk) 12:31, 9 March 2016 (UTC)
http://www.kentgundemi.net/dunya/idil-deki-operasyonlar-tamamlandi-h51995.html http://www.sondakika.com/haber/haber-idil-de-teror-operasyonlari-bitti-114-terorist-8238094/ http://odatv.com/o-ilcede-operasyonlar-bitti-0803161200.html http://www.hurhaber.com/idil-de-operasyon-bitti-haberi-62002.html
100% Turkish victory! [1] Beshogur ( talk) 15:54, 9 March 2016 (UTC)
Why do you keep changing it? The one by nordnordwest is accurate, the current one isn't. Can we get a consensus on this? I hate making the same points over and over again and not being listened to.... it's exhausting. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 03:53, 11 March 2016 (UTC)
It might be better to make the govt red instead of green, to make it more distinguishable
What is up with these colors? TWO greens for Turkey? Is there a reasoning or can I change it? -- Monochrome_ Monitor 16:19, 18 May 2016 (UTC)