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Archive 15 | ← | Archive 18 | Archive 19 | Archive 20 | Archive 21 | Archive 22 | → | Archive 25 |
Someone just made this edit to change the Flag of South Africa to the one that was around in 1992. Many articles seem to be using the flag that was current at a point of time rather than a common one. I suppose it is unnecessary for us to do the same in cricket. Tintin ( talk) 08:59, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
Is it just me, or are some of his edits walking a fine line into POV and hagiography? I think that the George Giffen article is the prime example. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 04:16, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
It's done!!! *whoops*, *jumps*, *runs around shouting*, *sits down tired & resumes typing* Finally after nearly three months of work the ODI Bios list is finally complete. This means that Wikipedia now provides info on every player who has ever played international cricket! Wow, I gues that's a great achievement. I would like to thank all the members of the Cricket project for their support in reaching this goal. Anyway time to celebrate with cha-, no I don't think I have any so water will have to do!
Cheers
Srik e it( talk ¦ ✉) 00:52, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
Cheers!!!!! =Nichalp «Talk»= 10:03, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
I've noticed a trend recently to link to videos of cricketers from the See Also sections of their articles. The videos are usually a TV program uploaded to Google Video. I always remove these when I see them, because I'm convinced that they must be copyright violations. Am I correct to do this?
Stephen Turner ( Talk) 19:15, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
Indian cricket team has been Promoted to Good Article and is about to be promoted to Selected Article on the India Portal. So I've put it up for Peer Review at This location. Feel free to contribute with your comments. Thanks. Nobleeagle (Talk) 00:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
Is it just me, or do Cricket Team of the University of Göttingen, Lansing Cricket Club, Salesian Old Boys Cricket Club seem to be just random groups of cricket players who are non-notable. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 06:02, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
I have put these ones up also: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bessborough Cricket Club, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Brunswick Village (Hove) CC, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Micklehurst Cricket Club and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Heyside Cricket Club. Two are local cricket teams in a town of 20,000, one is in the third division of Middlesex county league, the other isn't even in a league. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 05:33, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
Cricket Team of the University of Göttingen is evolving into Cricket in German which probably is notable and probably needs some help from people who know more about cricket than I do. -- Bduke 09:19, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
The opening on Category:English cricket captains says: This is a list of the 76 cricketers who have captained England in at least one Test match. Are ODI only captains (eg. Adam Hollioake) excluded from this category? -- I@n ≡ talk 01:08, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
I have taken a rather bold move (for my standards) and unilaterally edited this article because I get a lot of TV and radio coverage of all Australian international games, so I felt confident in changing a lot of judgement calls which I think were obvious, but subtle POV.
Please review this extensive and possibly controversial changes. Thanks. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 02:05, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
Almost the first thing in the article is that Nehra is a Hindu and a Jat. Why is there such an undue prominence given to this. I think it should be removed. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 07:59, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
BBC's Test Match Special commentator, (probably Jonathan Agnew, but I'm not quite sure on their names yet), just mentioned our article on the doosra (which I think focuses a bit too much on chucking at present) if people wanted help understanding what it is, as it "was going to be mentioned a lot during this series". (Admittedly it was on an email from the viewer, but still :)) Sam Vimes 11:21, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
I have just added a greatly expanded article on Charles Llewellyn, the South African test cricketer of the late 19th and early 20th centuries. I thought I should mention a few points about the article that could prove controversial.
1. Llewellyn was South Africa's first black test cricketer. In my research (see the References section of the Llewellyn article), it was clearly stated that Llewellyn was South Africa's first black test cricketer (his mother was a black woman from the island of St Helena). The current Wikipedia article on Makhaya Ntini states that Ntini is the first Black African test cricketer, which is distinct from Llewellyn, as St Helena is not Africa.
2. Llewellyn invented the Chinaman: Our article on Left-arm unorthodox spin states that Llewellyn claimed to have invented the delivery. In my research I found nothing to back that up and so haven't mentioned it in the Llewellyn article.
3. Llewellyn photo: I would like to add a Puiblic Domain image to the article. Cricinfo has a couple of images (such as this one [1]). I have added a lot of PD images to articles in the past, as the law, at least in Australia, states than images taken prior to 1955 fall into public domain. Does anyone know whether this is the case with images like this one? -- Roisterer 12:34, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
As I proposed a month ago, I have now created the above two stub templates, and the associated stub categories, and also populated them. All 10 Test-playing nations now have their own cricketbio-stub template, which should be used in preference to the plain {{ cricketbio-stub}}. The other countries don't yet have enough biographies to justify their own stub, according to the criteria at Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Proposals.
Stephen Turner ( Talk) 03:34, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Hey, some anon is going around sticking Parsi tags on a few of the Indian Test cricketers. Does the same apply as the Nehra case above? ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 01:52, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
Blnguyen | Have your say!!! 08:11, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
As the person who reverted some anons for removing the info that Sania Mirza is a Muslim, I may be least qualified to talk about why religion should not be mentioned in the article. However, I'll still talk! In the case of Sania, it is important because of the controversy about her wardrobe and obstacles she faced in playing with Shahar Peer of Israel. If someone from a religion is the first to represent something, that info can still come in the article, but preferably not in the cat. All religious info is probly best kept in the religion pages or the religion sub-articles. For example an article on Parsis can talk of the low % of population they form, but positions they hold in business and cricket. It can even be a sub-article on Parsis in cricket etc. - the trick is in keeping them NPOV. Religion cats are probably divisive in the same way as user boxes are and so, probly not a good idea as a cat. A mention may be made of the religion in the article if it is relevant. -- Gurubrahma 05:35, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
An anon has been cutting and pasting Cricinfo biographies - 82.36.60.174 ( talk · contribs). -- ALoan (Talk) 11:57, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
There are a couple of cricket-related lists on FLC at the moment - List of first-class cricket quadruple centuries and One-day International cricket hat-tricks. Futher comments would be welcome. -- ALoan (Talk) 13:20, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
An anon User:219.74.40.72 has added a number of records to the Rahul Dravid article after the first ODI against the West Indies which although probably authentic, are IMO quite unnecessary. We can derive endless such records if we consider every match Dravid has played against every country & soon we will have a massive records section filled with meaningless records. I think only significant records (like the ones already present) should be included. Please let me know your opinion.
Thanks
Srik e it( talk ¦ ✉) 15:41, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
The article contains this line : He is also the only cricketer to be selected to play for England while playing league cricket. Is it true ? Tintin ( talk) 16:33, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
Can't think of any others. But Barnes had played half a dozen first-class matches (for Warwickshire and Lancashire) before Maclaren picked him out of the League for the 1901-02 tour, so he wasn't a total unknown. And after 1903, when he gave up first-class county cricket, he continued to play Minor Counties cricket for Staffordshire until the 1930s, as well as playing in some first-class matches for scratch teams and representative sides, so league cricket wasn't his only outlet. It's relatively common, of course, for touring teams in England to co-opt players from the Leagues when beset by injuries or loss of form. Johnlp 11:23, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Australian cricket tour of South Africa 2006 -- I@n ≡ talk 09:51, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
Has anybody looked at the edits by this IP? I have removed his edits to Shoaib Malik, and then looked at the edits to Jonty Rhodes and Boeta Dippenaar, and I am not sure whether they are joke edits or simply badly constructed. Blnguyen | Have your say!!! - review me 01:41, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Can someone take a look at Lord Frederick Beauclerk - it reads like a hatchet job right now. I came across it while on random article patrol. Cheers. Megapixie 03:11, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
User:Nichalp has commented that this infobox looks jaded and dull. Is there anyone with more knowledge about tables and templates that can make it look a little better? Thanks. Nobleeagle (Talk) 03:07, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Persondata is special metadata which can be added to biographical articles. With about 4500 cricketer and related people biographical articles now setup in Wikipedia, we are in a wonderful position to leverage off that and so I wonder whether we should embark on a side project to embed persondata tags into all of our biographies. I can see lots of possibilities once this has been done, but the task would be immense. I've added a persondata block into Donald Bradman so you can see what I'm talking about.
I'm interested what others think and if supportive, is there a way to (at least partially) automate the task? -- I@n ≡ talk 14:18, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
I noticed that the flags used in cricketer's bios are all .png. Can we use cricketbot to make the switch to the superior .svg format? =Nichalp «Talk»= 16:43, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
A new contributor who is, I think, well-intentioned has made some strange edits to Rohan Kanhai. I reverted similar edits from an anonymous IP-addressed editor at the weekend, but there are evidently things that this new editor wants to say, and though they aren't being said very clearly there may be some value in some of them. I'm loath to go back in and revert again: perhaps someone else could take a look? Johnlp 20:17, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. Nice work. Johnlp 20:55, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I've just created Category:Cricketer-politicians as it seems to have some potential. Someone may want to populate relevant articles with the cat after looking at the description on the cat page and cat_talk page. -- Gurubrahma 05:16, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
I noticed this is on the project list. I've done quite a bit of work on this recently, dropping great chunks of repetition, some POV, getting things into a sensible order etc. I'll continue working on it... and welcome contributions from others! Dweller 08:18, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
How easy is it to create one of these? Would be nice for the WikiProject participants to have their very own. Dweller 11:31, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
This user is a
participant in WikiProject Cricket. |
This user is a
member of WikiProject Cricket. |
Hmmm... it does make more sense for the background to be green! Dweller 06:44, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Just saw this on cricinfo:
110.2 Mohammed to Dravid, OUT, gone! (caught) 110.3 Mohammed to Jaffer, 1 run
Does anyone know why Jaffer, after Dravid was out caught, took the strike instead of the incoming batsman?
Thanks - and please let me know if I should ask this elsewhere. Thank you. -- Dbk331 20:18, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
I have added various images onto Wikipedia over the last few months, mainly from the Benefit Matches we host at Upminster Cricket Club, the photos are on our website [4] and I have used those for Wikipedia. The problem is one by one these are being flagged for deletion as I have used the original photographers name not mine. They have happily donated the photos for my website why can't they donate to Wikipedia? First case in point is Image:Acook.JPG kroome111 12:39, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Kroome111, Ahh, the copyright police have found you! Every image has some form of copyright automatically assigned to it which is "owned" by the creator of the image. Generally, only the copyright owner can reassign or rescind copyright. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for more details.
I can suggest two options for you:
I hope this helps. If you need any more help, just ask on my talk page or here. -- I@n ≡ talk 13:40, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
I feel that recent addition of certain records to this article is quite unnecessary. First is the re-addition of the Minor Records section which I think should be removed (see WT:CRIC#Rahul_Dravid above) as it only contains Dravid's records against the West Indies. It also contained a statement "Every cricketer in his life accumulates a host of minor records to his name, as an encyclopedia Wikipedia has a list of them" which I removed as a WP:ASR violation. Also the record referring to Dravid's success under Ganguly, although interesting, seems a bit out of place. I would appreciate if some of our "regulars" can check it out. Thanks. Srik e it( talk ¦ ✉) 16:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Please take a minute to read this
I'd like to create a new page that is devoted to whites, explaining what they are made of, look like, history, scope for personal expression, advertising on them, numbers etc etc.
This came about during my editing of a new page devoted to David M Ward, a biffer I loved watching.
The problem is that "whites" and "Whites" are currently simple redirections to " White people". I suspect that if I nab one or both of those pages, create what I want and include a disambig line at the top, I'll be soundly stamped on by dozens of irate Wikipedians.
That's not necessarily enough to deter me <grins> but I recognise I'm still a bit of a noob, so I'm asking advice here.
I don't want to wimp out and go for whites (cricket) or some such. Why? Well, because the current pages are merely redirects to a "proper" article which is correctly and unambiguously titled. Similarly, whites are called whites, not "whites (cricket)". And I think "cricket whites" is even worse. But I'm not sure why.
Do you get the impression of a slightly-bolshy yet slightly reticent-to-kick-things-off person? Hmmm... I sound deranged.
Anyway, please can some experienced Wikipedians who love cricket advise me.
Dweller 12:05, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Not a regular participant in this project, I have nevertheless created a list of first-class cricket records at List of first-class cricket records (by analogy with List of Test cricket records). I think a cricket encyclopedia definitely ought to contain such a list. I'd welcome feedback: I recognise there's plenty that could be added (links to match scores at cricketarchive.com, for instance). My rationale for the career lists was to set the qualification so that it included roughly the top 15 in each category runs, wickets, w/k dismissals. Given the current set-up of the game it does not appear to me that these career records will ever need modifying again after Hick retires (which, by the way, I hope won't be 2010 at the earliest :-). -- RobertG ♬ talk 16:27, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Tintin has pointed out that I have inadvertantly mixed ACS/cricket archive figures with Wisden figures - I think the mix-up is because I thought Wisden Almanack and Wisden Cricinfo would show the same :-). Which should we use? Tintin and I agree that since the player articles all use cricinfo/cricket archive it would be the more logical choice. Anyone with a different view? Either way, I'll fix it in due course. -- RobertG ♬ talk 10:48, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
In case others are interested, Sam Vimes has confirmed that he would accept a WP:RFA nomination - see Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Sam Vimes2. -- ALoan (Talk) 10:05, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
...are a bit confused.
I think we should lose the capital letter, and suspect that we ought to have a hyphen, but could live without it. And then there is "teams" versus "clubs".
Comments? -- ALoan (Talk) 10:53, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
This really should be a featured list, like List of Test cricket grounds by date. Its failings are:
Please help! (I have deliberately left off the number of Tests at each ground, by the way, to avoid having to update incessantly.) -- ALoan (Talk) 14:37, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
Just noticed on the SIGNPOST that this is a featured picture. I didn't know about it previuosly, but I feel that there are a couple of errors at least. Long leg is shown as being finer than fine lege, which I thought was supposed to be the other way around. Also the "backward short leg" is not close in, as it is supposed to be. It is shown close to the edge of the ODI fielding restriction circle. Blnguyen | rant-line 03:00, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
'Straight' is used only infront of the wicket, so it may be removed from near longleg. The 'deep forward' and 'deep sweeper' midwicket may be replaced with a single 'deep midwicket'. Backward short leg should be closer (as mentioned above) and leg slip should be made finer. The 'square' near the boundary in line with these cannot go with any other term. Tintin ( talk) 05:22, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
FYI, I was the image promoter, and only promoted it as it appeared (according to the discussion) that these kinds of technical issues had been worked out already. Personally, I have no knowledge whatsoever of Cricket. If the errors are particularly egregious, we could delist the image as a featured picture and later nominate a corrected version. Alternatively, if the errors are easy to fix and are corrected quickly, I see no reason to delist it. -- moondigger 14:47, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
Could you mark of corrected positions on the png image, (using Paint, GIMP, or a similar program) and then upload for reference? I can make the changes. Regards, =Nichalp «Talk»= 17:13, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
Are these edits correct ? Tintin ( talk) 05:37, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
"(b) Bowling of high full pitched balls (i) Any delivery, other than a slow paced one, which passes or would have passed on the full above waist height of the striker standing upright at the crease is to be deemed dangerous and unfair, whether or not it is likely to inflict physical injury on the striker. (ii) A slow delivery which passes or would have passed on the full above shoulder height of the striker standing upright at the crease is to be deemed dangerous and unfair, whether or not it is likely to inflict physical injury on the striker."
Subsequent Laws require the Umpire to call "No-ball" for a beamer and warn the bowler, with further punitive measures imposed for repetition of the offence. If the umpire decides that the beamer was deliberate, the bowler cannot bowl again in that innings. -- Dweller 09:10, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
I notice User:BlackJack has removed several articles from this category:
They are all articles about historical events in cricket, so I don't see why they should be removed. Comments? - dmmaus 22:50, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
This has become something like Topsy that has "just growed".
It has been evident to me for some time that there is no structure to the categories; that there are stray articles all over the place; that categories that were designed for generic items and as "holding categories" for relevant sub-categories are simply being used as additional bases for specific articles; and that what we have here is another fine mess.
What makes it worse is that I have been trying to get other cricket people interested in using WP for cricket reference and their feedback has been critical to say the least.
We MUST have a top-down structure to categories and we must stop piling things ad hoc into useless lists. If we have a structured categorisation, the lists will be redundant (they are anyway) and readers will easily be able to navigate.
I have identified 28 categories under Cricket and there should only be 10! As a rule of thumb, I would say that the number of sub-cats in one category should be a cricket team (plus perhaps an umpire) and that an XI (or a dozen) is the limit.
Here are my proposed level 2 categories under the level 1 Cricket "root":
Apart from the two in bold, all the above are existing categories. Apart from the generic article Cricket, the portal and the WikiProject, there should be no articles or pages held under the root category.
Level 3 should be the main sub-categories. For example, under skills at level 2 the level 3 cats would be batting, bowling, umpiring, etc. as above. Generally, there should be no pages at level 2 except for the standalone categories like culture, images and stubs. A couple of the level 2 cats like country and people should not have pages on level 3 either as level 3 is where they split up into countries and occupations respectively.
The worst categories of all are history, teams and Tests which frankly need completely restructuring or demolishing. They are a disgrace and I am especially embarrassed by history as I started it and put most of the original effort into it. History is carrying surplus articles that should be reassigned or else have sufficient specific categories already and should not be in a generic category like history. History had eight sub-cats and six of them were cross-cats that were already adequately located elsewhere, especially under the country or competition headings. The other two history cats were small specific items that should both be elsewhere: Olympics under competitions and Years under first-class cricket.
I have already started sorting out much of this mess but I will not change the root category's sub-cats until members have had chance to read this and respond to it. Pending any feedback, I will change the root cat on Sat 1 July. -- Jack 05:29, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
IMO, I think Category:Women's cricket should hold a position under the "root" category, as it does now. – AlbinoMonkey ( Talk) 09:37, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
Some of them have a few that might be moved down a tier, but only a few. This proposal is a radical departure from the normal standards for similar categories, and I think that is a reason to stop and think. It seems to me that in some cases you would have to know quite a bit about cricket to know what might be where and as User:Calsicol has observed, in one or two even then you would probably be stumped. Images and stubs are not very useful categories to the reader and do not deserve to be at a higher level than things like test cricket, ODI cricket and cricketers. Jack seems to think that it is a problem if articles are in more than a couple of categories, but it isn't within reason. Extra categories mean there are more access routes; if there are only a couple on an article and they do not match a particular user's way of thinking he will not find the article through the categories. Chicheley 17:53, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
Strong support in principle. I say in principle because I favour a phased approach to this. I agree with George Williams re history and I think User:Calsicol has made a fair point about governance as a category. I think we need a category of that sort but it needs to be thought about, especially the name which is a bit cumbersome. On the other hand, the skills category should be introduced immediately. I like the idea of keeping the stubs, culture, glossary and images at the top as standalones - these are like appendices in a book and it is very sensible to keep them here to maintain their profile.-- AlbertMW 06:28, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
Progress Discussion going well and it seems there is a consensus to retain history as a generic category that provides an additional route to the country material so I'll start working on that. Also I agree with Albert that a phased approach is necessary for things like governance but that skills can be introduced now (i.e., on 1 July). Thank you to everyone for contributing. Can we have more, please? -- Jack 04:20, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
History progress. I'm sure GeorgeWilliams meant to say something about the history category when he added his piece about the "Test cricket" category below. I notice he has tidied up the remaining stray articles, largely using his new sub-cats in "Test cricket", and it's a good bit of work as the history category now has just its generic articles and one relevant sub-cat. Given the comments above, I think we should add more sub-cats to provide the extra route mentioned (e.g., to historical articles that exist in the country categories). -- Jack 05:51, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Lists category See below re how I have ruined my own case for reduced sub-cats! -- Jack 06:08, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Live date has arrived and so this discussion is closed. The things I had most concern about were stray articles, the history category and the Test category. The strays have been rounded up and allocated to suitable categories while the generic categories now contain only generic articles: that was easy enough to do. The Test category has already been sorted (see below) by introduction of new sub-cats to deal with specific articles and Test history has been linked to cricket history to broaden access. I've done some more work on the history category this morning which is explained in detail in a new topic below. I've introduced a cricket skills category as this idea has got support. For the rest, I will adopt the phased approach which was recommended by two or three members and will make proposals re the other categories and topics individually in due course. Thank you to all the project members who took part in the discussion or else sent me personal messages. Much appreciated. -- Jack 09:47, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
I really cannot see the point of maintaining huge and difficult to use lists like List of cricket topics and List of cricketers. There are probably hundreds of articles not in them and who can be bothered to look there when it's so much easier (and reliable) to use the search facility or the cricket categories anyway?
Pending any feedback, I'm going to propose both of those lists for deletion on Sat 1 July. -- Jack 11:04, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
Agree. Doesn't look like they have been maintained. Johnlp 13:48, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
I think those two lists in particular are literally a waste of space. Definitely delete them. -- GeorgeWilliams 17:27, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
As far as
List of cricket topics is concerened, I spent a lot of time (unsuccesfully) trying to reorganise it some time ago and I'm ashamed to say it was just too hard and I gave up. The one useful thing these two lists do is to provide a reference for the Related changes feature -
here. But other than that, categories are probably the better way to go, subject to being reorganised per Jack above. Change my mind - I say keep, but major housekeeping is needed. --
I@n ≡
talk 02:07, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
List of cricket topics
List of cricketers is generated automatically by
user:CricketBot from the various country lists. If Stephen is happy to continue to run the bot, I'd keep that one. --
I@n ≡
talk 01:56, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
Revised proposal I think Tintin has made the best suggestion. Unless there is strong opposition from project members I will recategorise both of these lists (on Sat 1 July) to Category:WikiProject Cricket for "safe storage" and they will be there if anyone can find the time and motivation to make good use of them. Owzat? -- Jack 04:31, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Revised proposal Good point by Stephen. I've provisionally created a "Lists" section in the to-do box at the top of this page and added these two lists to it. Other difficult lists can be added in due course. Would anyone like to do anything else with the two large lists? -- Jack 05:29, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Category It goes against the grain but I've found a category:Cricket lists which was outside the cricket structure and existed only as a sub-cat of a general sports folder. This clearly belongs in the cricket category and it would be useful there as a marshalling yard for all cricket lists including these two, so I've effectively demolished my own argument for less sub-cats in the cricket category!!!! Groan! Having said that, I think the lists section in the to-do box above should stay as it highlights the problem of maintenance and might encourage someone to take a fresh approach to the big lists. -- Jack 06:07, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Someone has marked one of the lists for deletion: see my new notice below. -- Jack 07:02, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Please comment on the cricket categories included in Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Log/2006 June 24 Tintin ( talk) 18:28, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
The Cricket WikiProject now has scored a century with 100 participants. A fine innings... Nobleeagle (Talk) 05:55, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
I've nominated category:cricket dismissals for delete as it contains only four articles that are all in its own parent category:cricket terminology. This is pointless duplication especially as the parent cat is the one being developed (it has over 100 articles). -- GeorgeWilliams 20:07, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
One for delete. It has been under context request for ages and clearly no one can be bothered to develop it. Pointless list idea. -- GeorgeWilliams 21:00, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
This has been targeted by user:BlackJack for review and cleanup, mainly because of stray articles so I've made an attempt to do it. I've created a few new sub-categories such as history, grounds and competitions and moved the articles into it, leaving only three generic articles in the main category plus the one above that I've nominated for deletion. See what you think. -- GeorgeWilliams 21:16, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Good work but I agree "Famous Tests" is POV and will inevitably lead to a proliferation of recent Tests that do not warrant the inclusion. As there are only three of these at present, why not move them into the parent category and Cfd the famous Tests category? -- Jack 09:55, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
See this page and comment. I've requested further discussion given the project's topic above. -- Jack 07:04, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
I thought we'd had this debate before, but Jack has amended the Cricket Article Style Guide on WP:Cricket to say that seasons that cross years should now be referred to as 2005-2006, rather than 2005-06. I don't agree with this, but what do others think? Johnlp 08:13, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Apologies for an oversight here. For some reason I was sure that Wiki convention was as per Y2K which is to use all four digits in all years (probably confused with another site). I definitely prefer the Y2K convention but if consensus is to use 2005-06 then so be it. Can I be assured that we will not use 1899-00 and 1999-00, however? -- Jack 09:35, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Agreed! Johnlp 10:15, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Here as well. Sam Vimes 10:39, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Ditto -- I@n ≡ talk 11:33, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
With the recent spate of cricket related AfD nominations and the need to bring them to participants attention, I wonder what project members think of opening a page in Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting for cricket. Basically, AfD and CfD pages are transcluded to a separate page which you can then add to your watch list. A small notice is also placed in the AfD page indicating that the nomination has been included in associated deletion sorting page. See Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Australia for an example of how it works. It may be that the volume is too low to warrant it and an alternative could be to just have an section in the WP:CRIC project page or this talk page with same. I'm interested in others thoughts. -- I@n ≡ talk 09:16, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
I definitely think it is worth trying. Even if the volume is one article only, it is worth doing to keep it within the project and stop outside interference. -- Jack 09:27, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
In keeping with consensus in the recent categories discussion above, I've made changes to the history structure to relocate stray articles to specific categories and to relate the history sub-categories to the geographic ones.
For example, 1726 English cricket season is in category:English cricket in the 18th Century which is a specific sub-category of the sub-generic category:History of English cricket. That category is a child of two parents, one historic and one geographical — category:History of cricket and category:Cricket in England respectively.
You will note that category:History of cricket is a main category of the root category:Cricket itself and that it also contains category:History of Australian cricket and category:History of Test cricket.
category:Cricket in England is part of category:Cricket by country and this includes category:Cricket in Australia which follows a similar pattern in that it leads to category:History of Australian cricket which is being developed as per its English counterpart. At present it has one sub-cat category:Australian cricket in the Golden Age and this has some season stubs and a seasonal template as per the equivalent English category.
Obviously, the intention is to develop the other countries using the same structure.
I hope you can follow the above but it's best to navigate the hyperlinks and you'll see what's going on. Can anyone make any additional suggestions? -- Jack 10:20, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 15 | ← | Archive 18 | Archive 19 | Archive 20 | Archive 21 | Archive 22 | → | Archive 25 |
Someone just made this edit to change the Flag of South Africa to the one that was around in 1992. Many articles seem to be using the flag that was current at a point of time rather than a common one. I suppose it is unnecessary for us to do the same in cricket. Tintin ( talk) 08:59, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
Is it just me, or are some of his edits walking a fine line into POV and hagiography? I think that the George Giffen article is the prime example. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 04:16, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
It's done!!! *whoops*, *jumps*, *runs around shouting*, *sits down tired & resumes typing* Finally after nearly three months of work the ODI Bios list is finally complete. This means that Wikipedia now provides info on every player who has ever played international cricket! Wow, I gues that's a great achievement. I would like to thank all the members of the Cricket project for their support in reaching this goal. Anyway time to celebrate with cha-, no I don't think I have any so water will have to do!
Cheers
Srik e it( talk ¦ ✉) 00:52, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
Cheers!!!!! =Nichalp «Talk»= 10:03, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
I've noticed a trend recently to link to videos of cricketers from the See Also sections of their articles. The videos are usually a TV program uploaded to Google Video. I always remove these when I see them, because I'm convinced that they must be copyright violations. Am I correct to do this?
Stephen Turner ( Talk) 19:15, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
Indian cricket team has been Promoted to Good Article and is about to be promoted to Selected Article on the India Portal. So I've put it up for Peer Review at This location. Feel free to contribute with your comments. Thanks. Nobleeagle (Talk) 00:54, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
Is it just me, or do Cricket Team of the University of Göttingen, Lansing Cricket Club, Salesian Old Boys Cricket Club seem to be just random groups of cricket players who are non-notable. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 06:02, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
I have put these ones up also: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bessborough Cricket Club, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Brunswick Village (Hove) CC, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Micklehurst Cricket Club and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Heyside Cricket Club. Two are local cricket teams in a town of 20,000, one is in the third division of Middlesex county league, the other isn't even in a league. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 05:33, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
Cricket Team of the University of Göttingen is evolving into Cricket in German which probably is notable and probably needs some help from people who know more about cricket than I do. -- Bduke 09:19, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
The opening on Category:English cricket captains says: This is a list of the 76 cricketers who have captained England in at least one Test match. Are ODI only captains (eg. Adam Hollioake) excluded from this category? -- I@n ≡ talk 01:08, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
I have taken a rather bold move (for my standards) and unilaterally edited this article because I get a lot of TV and radio coverage of all Australian international games, so I felt confident in changing a lot of judgement calls which I think were obvious, but subtle POV.
Please review this extensive and possibly controversial changes. Thanks. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 02:05, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
Almost the first thing in the article is that Nehra is a Hindu and a Jat. Why is there such an undue prominence given to this. I think it should be removed. ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 07:59, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
BBC's Test Match Special commentator, (probably Jonathan Agnew, but I'm not quite sure on their names yet), just mentioned our article on the doosra (which I think focuses a bit too much on chucking at present) if people wanted help understanding what it is, as it "was going to be mentioned a lot during this series". (Admittedly it was on an email from the viewer, but still :)) Sam Vimes 11:21, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
I have just added a greatly expanded article on Charles Llewellyn, the South African test cricketer of the late 19th and early 20th centuries. I thought I should mention a few points about the article that could prove controversial.
1. Llewellyn was South Africa's first black test cricketer. In my research (see the References section of the Llewellyn article), it was clearly stated that Llewellyn was South Africa's first black test cricketer (his mother was a black woman from the island of St Helena). The current Wikipedia article on Makhaya Ntini states that Ntini is the first Black African test cricketer, which is distinct from Llewellyn, as St Helena is not Africa.
2. Llewellyn invented the Chinaman: Our article on Left-arm unorthodox spin states that Llewellyn claimed to have invented the delivery. In my research I found nothing to back that up and so haven't mentioned it in the Llewellyn article.
3. Llewellyn photo: I would like to add a Puiblic Domain image to the article. Cricinfo has a couple of images (such as this one [1]). I have added a lot of PD images to articles in the past, as the law, at least in Australia, states than images taken prior to 1955 fall into public domain. Does anyone know whether this is the case with images like this one? -- Roisterer 12:34, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
As I proposed a month ago, I have now created the above two stub templates, and the associated stub categories, and also populated them. All 10 Test-playing nations now have their own cricketbio-stub template, which should be used in preference to the plain {{ cricketbio-stub}}. The other countries don't yet have enough biographies to justify their own stub, according to the criteria at Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Proposals.
Stephen Turner ( Talk) 03:34, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Hey, some anon is going around sticking Parsi tags on a few of the Indian Test cricketers. Does the same apply as the Nehra case above? ßlηguγΣη | Have your say!!! - review me 01:52, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
Blnguyen | Have your say!!! 08:11, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
As the person who reverted some anons for removing the info that Sania Mirza is a Muslim, I may be least qualified to talk about why religion should not be mentioned in the article. However, I'll still talk! In the case of Sania, it is important because of the controversy about her wardrobe and obstacles she faced in playing with Shahar Peer of Israel. If someone from a religion is the first to represent something, that info can still come in the article, but preferably not in the cat. All religious info is probly best kept in the religion pages or the religion sub-articles. For example an article on Parsis can talk of the low % of population they form, but positions they hold in business and cricket. It can even be a sub-article on Parsis in cricket etc. - the trick is in keeping them NPOV. Religion cats are probably divisive in the same way as user boxes are and so, probly not a good idea as a cat. A mention may be made of the religion in the article if it is relevant. -- Gurubrahma 05:35, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
An anon has been cutting and pasting Cricinfo biographies - 82.36.60.174 ( talk · contribs). -- ALoan (Talk) 11:57, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
There are a couple of cricket-related lists on FLC at the moment - List of first-class cricket quadruple centuries and One-day International cricket hat-tricks. Futher comments would be welcome. -- ALoan (Talk) 13:20, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
An anon User:219.74.40.72 has added a number of records to the Rahul Dravid article after the first ODI against the West Indies which although probably authentic, are IMO quite unnecessary. We can derive endless such records if we consider every match Dravid has played against every country & soon we will have a massive records section filled with meaningless records. I think only significant records (like the ones already present) should be included. Please let me know your opinion.
Thanks
Srik e it( talk ¦ ✉) 15:41, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
The article contains this line : He is also the only cricketer to be selected to play for England while playing league cricket. Is it true ? Tintin ( talk) 16:33, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
Can't think of any others. But Barnes had played half a dozen first-class matches (for Warwickshire and Lancashire) before Maclaren picked him out of the League for the 1901-02 tour, so he wasn't a total unknown. And after 1903, when he gave up first-class county cricket, he continued to play Minor Counties cricket for Staffordshire until the 1930s, as well as playing in some first-class matches for scratch teams and representative sides, so league cricket wasn't his only outlet. It's relatively common, of course, for touring teams in England to co-opt players from the Leagues when beset by injuries or loss of form. Johnlp 11:23, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Australian cricket tour of South Africa 2006 -- I@n ≡ talk 09:51, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
Has anybody looked at the edits by this IP? I have removed his edits to Shoaib Malik, and then looked at the edits to Jonty Rhodes and Boeta Dippenaar, and I am not sure whether they are joke edits or simply badly constructed. Blnguyen | Have your say!!! - review me 01:41, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Can someone take a look at Lord Frederick Beauclerk - it reads like a hatchet job right now. I came across it while on random article patrol. Cheers. Megapixie 03:11, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
User:Nichalp has commented that this infobox looks jaded and dull. Is there anyone with more knowledge about tables and templates that can make it look a little better? Thanks. Nobleeagle (Talk) 03:07, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Persondata is special metadata which can be added to biographical articles. With about 4500 cricketer and related people biographical articles now setup in Wikipedia, we are in a wonderful position to leverage off that and so I wonder whether we should embark on a side project to embed persondata tags into all of our biographies. I can see lots of possibilities once this has been done, but the task would be immense. I've added a persondata block into Donald Bradman so you can see what I'm talking about.
I'm interested what others think and if supportive, is there a way to (at least partially) automate the task? -- I@n ≡ talk 14:18, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
I noticed that the flags used in cricketer's bios are all .png. Can we use cricketbot to make the switch to the superior .svg format? =Nichalp «Talk»= 16:43, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
A new contributor who is, I think, well-intentioned has made some strange edits to Rohan Kanhai. I reverted similar edits from an anonymous IP-addressed editor at the weekend, but there are evidently things that this new editor wants to say, and though they aren't being said very clearly there may be some value in some of them. I'm loath to go back in and revert again: perhaps someone else could take a look? Johnlp 20:17, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. Nice work. Johnlp 20:55, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I've just created Category:Cricketer-politicians as it seems to have some potential. Someone may want to populate relevant articles with the cat after looking at the description on the cat page and cat_talk page. -- Gurubrahma 05:16, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
I noticed this is on the project list. I've done quite a bit of work on this recently, dropping great chunks of repetition, some POV, getting things into a sensible order etc. I'll continue working on it... and welcome contributions from others! Dweller 08:18, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
How easy is it to create one of these? Would be nice for the WikiProject participants to have their very own. Dweller 11:31, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
This user is a
participant in WikiProject Cricket. |
This user is a
member of WikiProject Cricket. |
Hmmm... it does make more sense for the background to be green! Dweller 06:44, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Just saw this on cricinfo:
110.2 Mohammed to Dravid, OUT, gone! (caught) 110.3 Mohammed to Jaffer, 1 run
Does anyone know why Jaffer, after Dravid was out caught, took the strike instead of the incoming batsman?
Thanks - and please let me know if I should ask this elsewhere. Thank you. -- Dbk331 20:18, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
I have added various images onto Wikipedia over the last few months, mainly from the Benefit Matches we host at Upminster Cricket Club, the photos are on our website [4] and I have used those for Wikipedia. The problem is one by one these are being flagged for deletion as I have used the original photographers name not mine. They have happily donated the photos for my website why can't they donate to Wikipedia? First case in point is Image:Acook.JPG kroome111 12:39, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Kroome111, Ahh, the copyright police have found you! Every image has some form of copyright automatically assigned to it which is "owned" by the creator of the image. Generally, only the copyright owner can reassign or rescind copyright. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for more details.
I can suggest two options for you:
I hope this helps. If you need any more help, just ask on my talk page or here. -- I@n ≡ talk 13:40, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
I feel that recent addition of certain records to this article is quite unnecessary. First is the re-addition of the Minor Records section which I think should be removed (see WT:CRIC#Rahul_Dravid above) as it only contains Dravid's records against the West Indies. It also contained a statement "Every cricketer in his life accumulates a host of minor records to his name, as an encyclopedia Wikipedia has a list of them" which I removed as a WP:ASR violation. Also the record referring to Dravid's success under Ganguly, although interesting, seems a bit out of place. I would appreciate if some of our "regulars" can check it out. Thanks. Srik e it( talk ¦ ✉) 16:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Please take a minute to read this
I'd like to create a new page that is devoted to whites, explaining what they are made of, look like, history, scope for personal expression, advertising on them, numbers etc etc.
This came about during my editing of a new page devoted to David M Ward, a biffer I loved watching.
The problem is that "whites" and "Whites" are currently simple redirections to " White people". I suspect that if I nab one or both of those pages, create what I want and include a disambig line at the top, I'll be soundly stamped on by dozens of irate Wikipedians.
That's not necessarily enough to deter me <grins> but I recognise I'm still a bit of a noob, so I'm asking advice here.
I don't want to wimp out and go for whites (cricket) or some such. Why? Well, because the current pages are merely redirects to a "proper" article which is correctly and unambiguously titled. Similarly, whites are called whites, not "whites (cricket)". And I think "cricket whites" is even worse. But I'm not sure why.
Do you get the impression of a slightly-bolshy yet slightly reticent-to-kick-things-off person? Hmmm... I sound deranged.
Anyway, please can some experienced Wikipedians who love cricket advise me.
Dweller 12:05, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Not a regular participant in this project, I have nevertheless created a list of first-class cricket records at List of first-class cricket records (by analogy with List of Test cricket records). I think a cricket encyclopedia definitely ought to contain such a list. I'd welcome feedback: I recognise there's plenty that could be added (links to match scores at cricketarchive.com, for instance). My rationale for the career lists was to set the qualification so that it included roughly the top 15 in each category runs, wickets, w/k dismissals. Given the current set-up of the game it does not appear to me that these career records will ever need modifying again after Hick retires (which, by the way, I hope won't be 2010 at the earliest :-). -- RobertG ♬ talk 16:27, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Tintin has pointed out that I have inadvertantly mixed ACS/cricket archive figures with Wisden figures - I think the mix-up is because I thought Wisden Almanack and Wisden Cricinfo would show the same :-). Which should we use? Tintin and I agree that since the player articles all use cricinfo/cricket archive it would be the more logical choice. Anyone with a different view? Either way, I'll fix it in due course. -- RobertG ♬ talk 10:48, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
In case others are interested, Sam Vimes has confirmed that he would accept a WP:RFA nomination - see Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Sam Vimes2. -- ALoan (Talk) 10:05, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
...are a bit confused.
I think we should lose the capital letter, and suspect that we ought to have a hyphen, but could live without it. And then there is "teams" versus "clubs".
Comments? -- ALoan (Talk) 10:53, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
This really should be a featured list, like List of Test cricket grounds by date. Its failings are:
Please help! (I have deliberately left off the number of Tests at each ground, by the way, to avoid having to update incessantly.) -- ALoan (Talk) 14:37, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
Just noticed on the SIGNPOST that this is a featured picture. I didn't know about it previuosly, but I feel that there are a couple of errors at least. Long leg is shown as being finer than fine lege, which I thought was supposed to be the other way around. Also the "backward short leg" is not close in, as it is supposed to be. It is shown close to the edge of the ODI fielding restriction circle. Blnguyen | rant-line 03:00, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
'Straight' is used only infront of the wicket, so it may be removed from near longleg. The 'deep forward' and 'deep sweeper' midwicket may be replaced with a single 'deep midwicket'. Backward short leg should be closer (as mentioned above) and leg slip should be made finer. The 'square' near the boundary in line with these cannot go with any other term. Tintin ( talk) 05:22, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
FYI, I was the image promoter, and only promoted it as it appeared (according to the discussion) that these kinds of technical issues had been worked out already. Personally, I have no knowledge whatsoever of Cricket. If the errors are particularly egregious, we could delist the image as a featured picture and later nominate a corrected version. Alternatively, if the errors are easy to fix and are corrected quickly, I see no reason to delist it. -- moondigger 14:47, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
Could you mark of corrected positions on the png image, (using Paint, GIMP, or a similar program) and then upload for reference? I can make the changes. Regards, =Nichalp «Talk»= 17:13, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
Are these edits correct ? Tintin ( talk) 05:37, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
"(b) Bowling of high full pitched balls (i) Any delivery, other than a slow paced one, which passes or would have passed on the full above waist height of the striker standing upright at the crease is to be deemed dangerous and unfair, whether or not it is likely to inflict physical injury on the striker. (ii) A slow delivery which passes or would have passed on the full above shoulder height of the striker standing upright at the crease is to be deemed dangerous and unfair, whether or not it is likely to inflict physical injury on the striker."
Subsequent Laws require the Umpire to call "No-ball" for a beamer and warn the bowler, with further punitive measures imposed for repetition of the offence. If the umpire decides that the beamer was deliberate, the bowler cannot bowl again in that innings. -- Dweller 09:10, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
I notice User:BlackJack has removed several articles from this category:
They are all articles about historical events in cricket, so I don't see why they should be removed. Comments? - dmmaus 22:50, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
This has become something like Topsy that has "just growed".
It has been evident to me for some time that there is no structure to the categories; that there are stray articles all over the place; that categories that were designed for generic items and as "holding categories" for relevant sub-categories are simply being used as additional bases for specific articles; and that what we have here is another fine mess.
What makes it worse is that I have been trying to get other cricket people interested in using WP for cricket reference and their feedback has been critical to say the least.
We MUST have a top-down structure to categories and we must stop piling things ad hoc into useless lists. If we have a structured categorisation, the lists will be redundant (they are anyway) and readers will easily be able to navigate.
I have identified 28 categories under Cricket and there should only be 10! As a rule of thumb, I would say that the number of sub-cats in one category should be a cricket team (plus perhaps an umpire) and that an XI (or a dozen) is the limit.
Here are my proposed level 2 categories under the level 1 Cricket "root":
Apart from the two in bold, all the above are existing categories. Apart from the generic article Cricket, the portal and the WikiProject, there should be no articles or pages held under the root category.
Level 3 should be the main sub-categories. For example, under skills at level 2 the level 3 cats would be batting, bowling, umpiring, etc. as above. Generally, there should be no pages at level 2 except for the standalone categories like culture, images and stubs. A couple of the level 2 cats like country and people should not have pages on level 3 either as level 3 is where they split up into countries and occupations respectively.
The worst categories of all are history, teams and Tests which frankly need completely restructuring or demolishing. They are a disgrace and I am especially embarrassed by history as I started it and put most of the original effort into it. History is carrying surplus articles that should be reassigned or else have sufficient specific categories already and should not be in a generic category like history. History had eight sub-cats and six of them were cross-cats that were already adequately located elsewhere, especially under the country or competition headings. The other two history cats were small specific items that should both be elsewhere: Olympics under competitions and Years under first-class cricket.
I have already started sorting out much of this mess but I will not change the root category's sub-cats until members have had chance to read this and respond to it. Pending any feedback, I will change the root cat on Sat 1 July. -- Jack 05:29, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
IMO, I think Category:Women's cricket should hold a position under the "root" category, as it does now. – AlbinoMonkey ( Talk) 09:37, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
Some of them have a few that might be moved down a tier, but only a few. This proposal is a radical departure from the normal standards for similar categories, and I think that is a reason to stop and think. It seems to me that in some cases you would have to know quite a bit about cricket to know what might be where and as User:Calsicol has observed, in one or two even then you would probably be stumped. Images and stubs are not very useful categories to the reader and do not deserve to be at a higher level than things like test cricket, ODI cricket and cricketers. Jack seems to think that it is a problem if articles are in more than a couple of categories, but it isn't within reason. Extra categories mean there are more access routes; if there are only a couple on an article and they do not match a particular user's way of thinking he will not find the article through the categories. Chicheley 17:53, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
Strong support in principle. I say in principle because I favour a phased approach to this. I agree with George Williams re history and I think User:Calsicol has made a fair point about governance as a category. I think we need a category of that sort but it needs to be thought about, especially the name which is a bit cumbersome. On the other hand, the skills category should be introduced immediately. I like the idea of keeping the stubs, culture, glossary and images at the top as standalones - these are like appendices in a book and it is very sensible to keep them here to maintain their profile.-- AlbertMW 06:28, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
Progress Discussion going well and it seems there is a consensus to retain history as a generic category that provides an additional route to the country material so I'll start working on that. Also I agree with Albert that a phased approach is necessary for things like governance but that skills can be introduced now (i.e., on 1 July). Thank you to everyone for contributing. Can we have more, please? -- Jack 04:20, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
History progress. I'm sure GeorgeWilliams meant to say something about the history category when he added his piece about the "Test cricket" category below. I notice he has tidied up the remaining stray articles, largely using his new sub-cats in "Test cricket", and it's a good bit of work as the history category now has just its generic articles and one relevant sub-cat. Given the comments above, I think we should add more sub-cats to provide the extra route mentioned (e.g., to historical articles that exist in the country categories). -- Jack 05:51, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Lists category See below re how I have ruined my own case for reduced sub-cats! -- Jack 06:08, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Live date has arrived and so this discussion is closed. The things I had most concern about were stray articles, the history category and the Test category. The strays have been rounded up and allocated to suitable categories while the generic categories now contain only generic articles: that was easy enough to do. The Test category has already been sorted (see below) by introduction of new sub-cats to deal with specific articles and Test history has been linked to cricket history to broaden access. I've done some more work on the history category this morning which is explained in detail in a new topic below. I've introduced a cricket skills category as this idea has got support. For the rest, I will adopt the phased approach which was recommended by two or three members and will make proposals re the other categories and topics individually in due course. Thank you to all the project members who took part in the discussion or else sent me personal messages. Much appreciated. -- Jack 09:47, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
I really cannot see the point of maintaining huge and difficult to use lists like List of cricket topics and List of cricketers. There are probably hundreds of articles not in them and who can be bothered to look there when it's so much easier (and reliable) to use the search facility or the cricket categories anyway?
Pending any feedback, I'm going to propose both of those lists for deletion on Sat 1 July. -- Jack 11:04, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
Agree. Doesn't look like they have been maintained. Johnlp 13:48, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
I think those two lists in particular are literally a waste of space. Definitely delete them. -- GeorgeWilliams 17:27, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
As far as
List of cricket topics is concerened, I spent a lot of time (unsuccesfully) trying to reorganise it some time ago and I'm ashamed to say it was just too hard and I gave up. The one useful thing these two lists do is to provide a reference for the Related changes feature -
here. But other than that, categories are probably the better way to go, subject to being reorganised per Jack above. Change my mind - I say keep, but major housekeeping is needed. --
I@n ≡
talk 02:07, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
List of cricket topics
List of cricketers is generated automatically by
user:CricketBot from the various country lists. If Stephen is happy to continue to run the bot, I'd keep that one. --
I@n ≡
talk 01:56, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
Revised proposal I think Tintin has made the best suggestion. Unless there is strong opposition from project members I will recategorise both of these lists (on Sat 1 July) to Category:WikiProject Cricket for "safe storage" and they will be there if anyone can find the time and motivation to make good use of them. Owzat? -- Jack 04:31, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Revised proposal Good point by Stephen. I've provisionally created a "Lists" section in the to-do box at the top of this page and added these two lists to it. Other difficult lists can be added in due course. Would anyone like to do anything else with the two large lists? -- Jack 05:29, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Category It goes against the grain but I've found a category:Cricket lists which was outside the cricket structure and existed only as a sub-cat of a general sports folder. This clearly belongs in the cricket category and it would be useful there as a marshalling yard for all cricket lists including these two, so I've effectively demolished my own argument for less sub-cats in the cricket category!!!! Groan! Having said that, I think the lists section in the to-do box above should stay as it highlights the problem of maintenance and might encourage someone to take a fresh approach to the big lists. -- Jack 06:07, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
Someone has marked one of the lists for deletion: see my new notice below. -- Jack 07:02, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Please comment on the cricket categories included in Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Log/2006 June 24 Tintin ( talk) 18:28, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
The Cricket WikiProject now has scored a century with 100 participants. A fine innings... Nobleeagle (Talk) 05:55, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
I've nominated category:cricket dismissals for delete as it contains only four articles that are all in its own parent category:cricket terminology. This is pointless duplication especially as the parent cat is the one being developed (it has over 100 articles). -- GeorgeWilliams 20:07, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
One for delete. It has been under context request for ages and clearly no one can be bothered to develop it. Pointless list idea. -- GeorgeWilliams 21:00, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
This has been targeted by user:BlackJack for review and cleanup, mainly because of stray articles so I've made an attempt to do it. I've created a few new sub-categories such as history, grounds and competitions and moved the articles into it, leaving only three generic articles in the main category plus the one above that I've nominated for deletion. See what you think. -- GeorgeWilliams 21:16, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Good work but I agree "Famous Tests" is POV and will inevitably lead to a proliferation of recent Tests that do not warrant the inclusion. As there are only three of these at present, why not move them into the parent category and Cfd the famous Tests category? -- Jack 09:55, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
See this page and comment. I've requested further discussion given the project's topic above. -- Jack 07:04, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
I thought we'd had this debate before, but Jack has amended the Cricket Article Style Guide on WP:Cricket to say that seasons that cross years should now be referred to as 2005-2006, rather than 2005-06. I don't agree with this, but what do others think? Johnlp 08:13, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Apologies for an oversight here. For some reason I was sure that Wiki convention was as per Y2K which is to use all four digits in all years (probably confused with another site). I definitely prefer the Y2K convention but if consensus is to use 2005-06 then so be it. Can I be assured that we will not use 1899-00 and 1999-00, however? -- Jack 09:35, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Agreed! Johnlp 10:15, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Here as well. Sam Vimes 10:39, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Ditto -- I@n ≡ talk 11:33, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
With the recent spate of cricket related AfD nominations and the need to bring them to participants attention, I wonder what project members think of opening a page in Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting for cricket. Basically, AfD and CfD pages are transcluded to a separate page which you can then add to your watch list. A small notice is also placed in the AfD page indicating that the nomination has been included in associated deletion sorting page. See Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Australia for an example of how it works. It may be that the volume is too low to warrant it and an alternative could be to just have an section in the WP:CRIC project page or this talk page with same. I'm interested in others thoughts. -- I@n ≡ talk 09:16, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
I definitely think it is worth trying. Even if the volume is one article only, it is worth doing to keep it within the project and stop outside interference. -- Jack 09:27, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
In keeping with consensus in the recent categories discussion above, I've made changes to the history structure to relocate stray articles to specific categories and to relate the history sub-categories to the geographic ones.
For example, 1726 English cricket season is in category:English cricket in the 18th Century which is a specific sub-category of the sub-generic category:History of English cricket. That category is a child of two parents, one historic and one geographical — category:History of cricket and category:Cricket in England respectively.
You will note that category:History of cricket is a main category of the root category:Cricket itself and that it also contains category:History of Australian cricket and category:History of Test cricket.
category:Cricket in England is part of category:Cricket by country and this includes category:Cricket in Australia which follows a similar pattern in that it leads to category:History of Australian cricket which is being developed as per its English counterpart. At present it has one sub-cat category:Australian cricket in the Golden Age and this has some season stubs and a seasonal template as per the equivalent English category.
Obviously, the intention is to develop the other countries using the same structure.
I hope you can follow the above but it's best to navigate the hyperlinks and you'll see what's going on. Can anyone make any additional suggestions? -- Jack 10:20, 1 July 2006 (UTC)