I archived the talk page, which was 75 KB. I also copied code from my other project's talk page (talkheader and tocleft templates). TTV ( MyTV| PolygonZ| Green Valley) 21:00, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
One question for all of you guys and gals: can the " Prime Time Entertainment Network", which was the blanket title for mid-1990s syndicated shows such as Kung Fu: The Legend Continues and They Came From Outer Space, be considered a "network" along the lines of UPN/WB/CW?
I say no. It was a syndication service in which the aforementioned programs (and a few others that may be best forgotten) were branded under. A new user, Spshu, believes that PTEN was a network, and has been adding this "fact" to the Chris-Craft Industries page and adding an affiliate listing (consisting of the Chris-Craft/United station group only) on the PTEN page, which I have deleted (with valid reason) several times. Let's settle this once and for all, if you care to. Rollosmokes 06:05, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
Since WP:TVS doesn't presently deal with this, a couple of questions about ownership info within Template:Infobox Broadcast:
I've always considered the identity of the specific licensee to be important - perhaps not of any direct use to the average reader, but potentially useful for legal or research purposes, and at least as useful as, say, transmitter power. The licensee need only be named in the Infobox, not the main text. But of course, as I am apt to forget myself at times, Wikipedia is not written for broadcast professionals but for the average person, and the average person couldn't care less about, say, WAGA License Inc. when all they need to know is that the parent company is News Corp.
If we agree on that, as to format... Habitually I've listed both the licensee and ultimate parent in the following format: (example would apply to WCBS-TV)
The licensee can be easily verified via the FCC's TV Query. I would put CBS Broadcasting first because it is the company that directly owns the station. This is followed by a short-hand reference to the ultimate parent company, e.g. Disney or NewsCorp (or perhaps NewsCorp/ FTSG ?).
The most common alternative format I've seen is this, which gives priority to the parent company:
Again, this might be slightly less confusing to the average reader. Another potential alternative is separate "Owner / Parent company" lines, although in my view this would just cause more confusion.
Any thoughts? — stickguy (:^›)— || talk || 04:52, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
In station articles I've edited, I've been using the above format of Parent Owner/(Licensee). I think that format has worked for the most part, and would like to see it continue. Rollosmokes 20:15, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
Do we have any good articles around here? WP:PCP has about 15 plus two FAs. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 01:36, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
Beginning cross-post.
End cross-post. Please do not comment more in this section.
There appear to be many issues with our Wikipedia article on WHYY-TV. The history related in the article does not closely resemble that of external links such as this or this. For example, our article states the station was founded in 1957. The external links say 1949-early 1950. Our article says the station was originally WYBE channel 35; the external links say it was originally WDEL channel 7/12. Our article makes no mention of commercial affiliations, while the external links do. Our article makes no mention of former call-signs WDEL, WPFH, or WVUE. This is rather confusing, and either our article needs a re-write, or there were two seperate stations in Delaware with the same call sign. Any ideas? Firsfron of Ronchester 21:26, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
In one month, TV-Ark will relaunch, and I'm thinking that links will change. We will have to get this done when it comes back online on Christmas Day. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 23:55, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
I asked for a SuggestBot list yesterday, and I just got it today. I've trimmed it down to our project:
|
I was surprised at the results in the stub section: all of the stubbed station articles are from the same market; Jacksonville, Florida. I was stunned when I saw this. WTEV is the only one missing. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 22:53, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
I plan to send DuMont Television Network to Featured Article Candidacy soon. Before I do, I'd like to run it past the friendly folks here for improvements. Without getting too TV-station crufty, I wonder if more can't be added to this article to make it better. Suggestions? Edits? Ideas? Firsfron of Ronchester 03:54, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
I am beginning to feel that my time with Wikipedia may be coming to an end soon, because I don't find it fun anymore.
First, there was A Man in Black's anti-fair use image gallery purging campaign. Then, there is this newfound "notion" (courtesy of Spshu) that Prime Time Entertainment Network was a full-fledged "network". Now, David Levy and I are battling over proper use of grammar. On top of that, Marckd continues to use various IP addresses to make his point with WWOR-TV and WTXX. This is enough for me, and there's but only so much a person can take.
I began editing Wikipedia because I believed I could use my writing talents and knowledge of television and radio history to work in a welcome environment, though I stayed away from being a full-fleged part of the WP:TVS project. Now, it seems as though the "inmates" have taken control of the asylum. Where's the real consensus? Where's the real teamwork? Instead, I only see battles on editing style, article format, content, and those with an agenda they want to push trying to get their way.
Personally, I disagree with AMiB on the fair use gallery issue, as I believed the images were beneficial to articles if we don't get excessive with them. I disagree with Spshu that PTEN was a network because they (despite the name) they never labelled themselves as anything more than just a blanket title for syndicated programming, like Operation Prime Time. Now, months after I introduced the proper practice of substituting single-digit numerals with their written forms ("one" instead of "1"), David Levy tells me that the proper way is the wrong way here, as per Wikipedia's Manual of Style.
So, with this, does it mean us professional writers have been wrong all along? If you believe Wikipedia and Mr. Levy, then I guess we have been. I called Mr. Levy a "kid" who knew nothing about how to write, and someone willing to throw out all reasoning in order to enforce his own will -- and I stick to those statements. He called my comments uncivil; to me they aren't as I refrained from vulgar language and stronger personal attacks. He again proved himself to be arrogant and pompous, and someone not worthy to be an administrator.
As far as Marckd goes, we have been battling for months over the content of WWOR-TV and WTXX. He insisted on adding redundant and trivial information, and on making unnecessary style changes. Now, he insists on adding a few words instead, but it still is redundant to me. I have tried to reason with him, but to no avail. And he is further able to make changes and escape credit for them by using various IP addresses (the most recent being "65.41.244.121") instead of his screenname.
I am trying to be a team player. At the same time, I wish to bring a level of credibility and a certain form of style to Wikipedia's television articles. But if my work isn't appreciated, there's no point in me staying. I will decide my future with Wikipedia within the next few days. Rollosmokes 06:22, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Bottom line is this...the site administrators have to do a better job policing these articles, and I know that each of them are doing the best they can in that regard. However, a lot of these edit wars and constant griping by us here in this community will not change unless Wiki can do a better job in policing this site. This is no means an attack towards the site, I'm just simply saying.
As far as my idea on what the TV articles SHOULD be presented, here it is...
No newscast schedules, no listing of station personalities, and other useless irrelevant garbage that doesn't belong. If you want to know what time that station's newscast airs, and when other shows that they air...go to their web site or visit one of the TV listing sites. ShawnHill 00:30, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Then, there is this newfound "notion" (courtesy of Spshu) that Prime Time Entertainment Network was a full-fledged "network".
I began editing Wikipedia because I believed I could use my writing talents and knowledge of television and radio history to work in a welcome environment, though I stayed away from being a full-fleged part of the WP:TVS project. Now, it seems as though the "inmates" have taken control of the asylum.
Where's the real consensus?
Instead, I only see battles on editing style, article format, content, and those with an agenda they want to push trying to get their way.
Now, months after I introduced the proper practice of substituting single-digit numerals with their written forms ("one" instead of "1"), David Levy tells me that the proper way is the wrong way here, as per Wikipedia's Manual of Style.
So, with this, does it mean us professional writers have been wrong all along?
I called Mr. Levy a "kid" who knew nothing about how to write, and someone willing to throw out all reasoning in order to enforce his own will -- and I stick to those statements. He called my comments uncivil; to me they aren't as I refrained from vulgar language and stronger personal attacks. He again proved himself to be arrogant and pompous, and someone not worthy to be an administrator.
I am trying to be a team player.
At the same time, I wish to bring a level of credibility and a certain form of style to Wikipedia's television articles.
Bluestone Television sold a bunch of outlets to one Bonten Media Group. We need changes in the articles listed (WCYB is already done), plus an article on Bonten Media. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 17:07, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Just thought the community should know about this: administrator A Man In Black ( talk · contribs) has been removing logo galleries containing (what he sites as) fair-use images from several station articles.
A list of cable network articles he's already handled: Disney Channel. Ronald20 05:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
(Edit - Also handled: Spike TV, Fox Sports Net, ABC Family, ESPN on ABC, Toon Disney, CNN Headline News, CBC Newsworld, and Réseau de l'information. Ronald20 05:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC) )
(Edit - I have archived the removed content here. Ronald20 02:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
As I understood it, the upshot was that nobody likes this but there was grudging acceptance that this is something that needs to happen. - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 09:07, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Seeing as we are at an impasse on this issue, I have just submitted an RFC about the use of historical logos in galleries at Wikipedia:Fair use/Historical logos in galleries. Please contribute to this discussion and help determine a consensus. Despite the assertions of User:A Man In Black, this issue is not as clear cut as he would like it to be and consensus needs to be determined. DHowell 04:56, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Disavian has created an article describing the in-house cable television network used at Georgia Tech, which was originally tagged as a station needing an infobox. Problem is, our broadcast infobox template doesn't seem to apply well to the article. Does anyone know of an infobox that would be a better match? Thanks in advance. dhett 08:14, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
I ran into a problem on KGUN-TV. There was a translator for the station with query calls DK02BW. I didn't know what it was (I thought it meant Digital K02BW), and then Radio-Info pointed out that KTFL (query calls DKTFL) was defunct. A ton of D-call stations show up, but the one that sealed the deal was LA's channel sixty-eight, KEEF-TV, "DKEEF-TV", which I knew was defunct by all means. Thus, if you catch a D in YOUR FCC queries, the station's not broadcasting. Remember: D Means Defunct. TTV| talk| contribs| email 19:09, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Just a question for you all since I'm still a bit too nOOb to really get into the meat of editing stuff (but I'm getting there)...
I've noticed that the pages for some of our local stations here in Yuma, AZ, including KSWT and KYMA, refer to the article as a stub about a California-based TV station. What is the basis for which state is used there? Both of those, as well as KECY, have their actual studios in Yuma, AZ, but their transmitters are 15-20 mi NNW of town, in California (to serve the other and smaller half of the DMA, the Imperial Valley in CA). Since we're the larger half of the split market, and the stations have their physical operations in Arizona, it seems like the stub link should be for AZ instead... but I'm the nOOb here... :) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by TVGenius ( talk • contribs) 05:35, 11 December 2006 (UTC).
I realized as soon as I had hit Save Page that I forgot the tildes, but then something happened with my internet connection and I couldn't get back to the article to add it. As far as KECY goes, I'd almost vote for them to be considered Yuma as well, since about five years ago, they moved their entire operation from El Centro to Yuma (to the tune of being off the air for about two weeks) but I guess that if the FCC still shows it that way, then that way it shall be. I'll go ahead and change the stub tags... maybe see what everyone else thinks about KSWT's stub status and maybe lose it later. I'll try to go in and do some more historical background (prior ownership etc) over the coming weeks/month or two, as I have time. (I worked there for over five years) I'll also update the CW fiasco whenever it's taken care of (which reminds me, I need to tweak what's there a bit now...) TVGenius 17:36, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
The whole fight that KSWT and their parent company Pappas had with Time Warner Cable over whether or not it would be carried on analog cable or not. After about four months of bickering (and only being able to get it OTA on 13.2) they finally reached some sort of agreement that got it on analog 6. KECY didn't seem to have any problems getting their cable/sub-channel only ABC affiliate on channel 5 to replace KNXV from Phoenix, though. TVGenius 17:37, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
Take a look at KODE-TV. What's wrong with the first paragraph? It looks like a partial copyvio. I saw it on KLBK-TV/ KAMC in Lubbock, too. And it looked eerily similar. Weed out all the Nexstar and Mission stations' copyvio paragraphs (which are easily identifiable by "(station) provides a digital and analog signal to viewers" and items on Shared Services Agreements). At this rate, just like Nexstar treats its stations, it will become a dump. TTV| talk| contribs| email 03:53, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
http://www.nexstar.tv/nexstar/stations/kode.asp shows the truth:
KODE, an ABC affiliate in Joplin, was acquired by Mission Broadcasting in 2002. Subsequently KODE entered into a Shared Services Agreement with Nexstar Broadcasting station KSNF. The operating efficiencies have greatly improved both stations’ revenue share and viewership. KODE and KSNF entered into a Joint Sales Agreement in October of 2004 which will provide for more effective marketing of advertising time for both stations. KODE’s syndicated programming includes Oprah, Jeopardy, Seinfeld, and Spin City. The station provides a digital and analog signal to viewers.
KODE was acquired by Mission Broadcasting in 2002. Subsequently KODE entered into a Shared Services Agreement with Nexstar Broadcasting station KSNF. The operating efficiencies have greatly improved both stations’ revenue share and viewership. KODE and KSNF entered into a Joint Sales Agreement in October of 2004 which will provide for more effective marketing of advertising time for both stations. KODE’s syndicated programming includes Oprah, Jeopardy, Seinfeld, and Spin City. The station provides a digital and analog signal to viewers.
We are dealing with mass copyvio, folks...and it ain't pretty. TTV| talk| contribs| email 03:59, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Special:Contributions/70.242.36.188. That's the contribs of the IP that added the copyvio material. TTV| talk| contribs| email 04:02, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
I notice many TV station pages include the names of current news anchors. I believe this is *mostly* inappropriate for Wikipedia for the following reasons:
Disscussion? -- Bill Huston (talk) 09:09, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
Station lists: Keep notable anchors, delete the rest immediately from article. TTV| talk| contribs| email 22:15, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
Today, I was going through CAT:CSD. Well, it went well until I saw KPDF-CA, an article I created under an anon IP, in the bin. I ran to the article. Turns out User:Alan.ca (a Canadian user) had put a G11 tag on it. I removed it, as the article was not G11-worthy. I run to get User:Dhett, also from Chandler and my major partner in maintaining the Arizona TV articles, on the line, and he replies, pointing to issues that happened with KUNP. Well, we need to watch out: our LPTVs in low-power places need a little help. « TTV»( talk| contribs| email) 04:18, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
DuMont Television Network has just been sent to Featured Article Candidacy. As far as I know, it is the only WP:TVS-related article to have ever been sent to FAC. Please take a moment to read the article and comment on its candidacy. If you can't support, please provide a reason on why, or a suggestion on how it might be improved. This only takes a few minutes of your time, and would be deeply appreciated. Thanks, Firsfron of Ronchester 02:59, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 16:28, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Every month for more than a year now, I have published television updates to the Phoenix Television page of Radio Info for stations whose signal serves Arizona cities. I have been asked to publish that information here also.
New licenses
New programming
Returned to air
Gone silent
Sales
New construction permits
Expired construction permits
License renewals granted
Additional note
Comments, questions and suggestions are always welcome. dhett 09:41, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
I think we have another BenH sockpuppet here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/24.159.38.231
I've seen this person's article style, and it reeks of BenH. -- azumanga 01:19, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
Hey, y'all... I think we should have a definitive consensus on local television anchor/reporter articles on WP.
Articles for local anchors are popping up everywhere ( Susan Peters, Jancey Sheats, Tucker Jankosky to name a few) -- none of which are, IMHO, notable for a global audience. Are they good anchors? Sure. Award-winning? Absolutely. Do they deserve an entire article about them? I think that's pushing it a little bit.
On top of that -- it opens the floodgates for every television anchor from New York City to Glendive, MT to have their own article... and that can get out of hand if not kept in check.
I think that if WP is going to include articles on local television anchors at all, we need to establish some sort of criteria for it. Ideally, it should take market size into account primarily, and awards / accomplishments / etc. second.
Thoughts? Amnewsboy 09:17, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
I'm in my namespace, working on a slightly updated version of the Infobox design, that is based off the "old design", but carries the extended information of the other design. I'm even thinking about making it so that we use the colors of the station's logo or news graphics as the colors on the headings on it (I'll be changing my test page to only have infoboxes on it soon, stay tuned...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:ViperSnake151/WNBC
ViperSnake151 16:35, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
Quick! Copyvio at more Nexstar stuff! KTAB-TV! TRKtv t c e 01:53, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
The KTVX translator subarticle has been nominated both for merge into the main article and deletion. I have presented my defense, but if anyone could help out, I would certainly appreciate it. dhett ( talk • contribs) 06:02, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
I've seen multiple articles with long lists of schedule and/or personality information. This stuff is simply non-encyclopedic. Wikipedia is not a tv guide. I've cleaned up a few articles from Template:Oklahoma City TV and others, but I'm sure there are more. I just wanted to bring this to your attention, since this is the relevant wikiproject. Thank you for your efforts, Fang Aili talk 01:48, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
List of United States over-the-air television networks is in really bad shape. It currently lists "networks" with only one affiliate (How is a network with only one station a network?), And many columns are filled in with "?" or "unknown" (The information is not unknown; someone obviously knows it; the fact the person editing the page doesn't know it is not the same thing). I've reverted these additions many times, but it just keeps getting added back in. Perhaps we can come to a consensus here about the material included in this list? Firsfron of Ronchester 04:16, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
It seems that not being content at simply deleting logo galleries, A Man In Black is now deleting historical TV station logos anywhere he sees them. Citing WP:V, WP:OR, WP:FU, and probably other policies as well, he now finds any excuse he can to remove this historical (and often difficult to find) information from the encyclopedia. See the latest at the WUSA (TV) edit history (or just look at his recent contributions) and at WP:AN#A Man in Black and WP:AN#Continued Problem. DHowell 23:26, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
Posted as per request. New licenses, construction permits, applications and license renewal sections are compiled from FCC documents. New programming, returned to air and silent station sections are original research and are included for information only.
New licenses
New programming
Returned to air
Silent station
New construction permits
Applications for digital television licenses to cover
License renewals granted
The Phoenix template got a bunch of out-of-metro-area translators. Should these be split off? TRKtv ( da aaa ah!) 00:04, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
For those of you who, like me, have spent some time and effort in the past defending TV station articles against deletion, I have found a precedent that we can cite in our defense arguments. Appropriately, it comes from a subarticle to Articles for deletion, from the Entertainment paragraph in Precedents.
Some have made the argument that all television stations are inherently notable, but I cannot fully agree. I believe that most would agree that mere translators are not notable. However, this precedent does allow for inherent notability of most full-service television stations, as most originate programming. Those that don't, such as statewide PBS networks, and groups of stations in Montana and North Dakota, are mostly already in common articles. Class A is even more cut-and-dried, as the very Class A license is contingent upon the station broadcasting a minimum of three hours of locally-produced original programming per week. Of course, there could be a few exceptions where either the local programming requirement is waived (although I cannot cite such a case) or where a group of Class A stations with adjacent coverage area are allowed to broadcast common programming, in which case there would be one article for the originating station and redirects from the others.
As for the rest of the low-power television stations, we have a precedent. While it is not as strong as a guideline or a policy, it is a start, and can be used to determine whether or not the station deserves a standalone article. There are some articles that we probably need to eventually revisit, mostly affiliates of satellite-delivered services such as HSN, Jewelry Television, Shop at Home, TBN, Daystar, MTV2, MTV Tr3s, Univision, Telemundo, Telefutura, Azteca América, and The CW, especially stations that are part of The CW Plus group.
If possible, I'd like to see this precedent expanded upon - enough to at least merit inclusion in WP:ORG#Alternate criteria for specific types of organizations. It's ironic that coverage on a television station can be used to establish notability, but the station itself not be considered by some to be notable. dhett ( talk • contribs) 06:05, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
I would like to point out that the AFD precedents page is old and out of date and mostly frowned upon. Precedents are more useful for effective arguments. I don't think any of the articles I've seen particularly need to be deleted, but if it's a significant issue, it'd be best to tighten up the arguments against deletion. In service of this goal...
Why does original programming matter? We don't consider self-produced, self-distributed work in other areas (books, internet) sufficient to establish notability. Why should this be different for television stations? - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 07:21, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
Just for the record, I haven't seen any indication that the AFD precedents page is frowned upon (frowned upon by who? Certainly not by the people who edit it, which includes several active admins.), and as Dhett says, the page doesn't seem truly inactive, as there were edits from just over a month ago. I'll add the the talk page is active as of today.
Firsfron of Ronchester 20:24, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
According to the front page of 100000watts.com, KMAS has flipped to PBS from Telemundo. KMAS (and sister KDEN) are owned by NBC Telemundo. Now, normally 100000watts.com is pretty reliable source, but I am unsure on this one. I have made a KMAS page (it is pretty bare) but if someone out Denver way could confirm this cause I have never heard of an O&O flipping a station to PBS before. Thanks. - SVRTVDude ( Yell - Work) 05:58, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
...same as the first:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/67.77.209.207 -- azumanga 04:15, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
What about Chris Coleman? Taylorsville
Got a bit of a problem and I know this is WP:TVS, but figure someone might know the answer. There are some of Clear Channel radio stations that are now under "BT Triple Crown Merger Co." (a private company that is pretty much still Clear Channel), should I put the merger company name in small italics under Clear Channel or just put Clear Channel and leave it at that? - SVRTVDude ( Yell - Toil) 20:49, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
If anyone wishes to save the American Broadcasting Company logos, Arrow 4 logo, Circle 7 logo and GMA Network logos articles, you had better act quickly. The articles have been nominated for deletion ( American Broadcasting Company logos, Arrow 4 logo, Circle 7 logo and GMA Network logos). The noms expire Friday and the nominator states that the articles violate WP:NOR, WP:V and WP:N. The BBC One logos and Logos of Viacom articles have already been lost. dhett ( talk • contribs) 05:23, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
Add RCTV logos, PBS idents and NBC logos to the AfD parade, these expiring on Saturday. The same user has nominated all seven articles, citing violations of WP:NOR, WP:V and WP:N for each. AfD noms: RCTV logos, PBS idents and NBC logos. dhett ( talk • contribs) 05:36, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
Again, here is a summary of updates of television stations viewable in Arizona cities. I have removed original research from the summary, which can be seen in full at my Radio-Info Phoenix TV post. I have also added references to this summary.
New license
New construction permit
Applications not yet granted
Applications dismissed
License renewal granted
Expiring construction permits
dhett ( talk • contribs) 08:41, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/67.77.211.227
And while you're at it -- meet his twin, "Mmbabies":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Suspected_Wikipedia_sockpuppets_of_Mmbabies
-- azumanga 04:39, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
I just cleaned up a bunch of New York City station articles vandalized by one of the aforementioned suspected BenH sockpuppets. Rollosmokes 05:22, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
Several users are reverting each other on Metromedia. I've protected the page for now (protection is not an endorsement of the current version) to keep the article free of being the subject of a long-lasting edit war. Comments are appreciated on the talk page, as always. Firsfron of Ronchester 17:24, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
The continuing removal of logo galleries by User:A Man In Black has prompted me to submit a proposal to change policy wording, at Wikipedia:Fair use/Amendment/Historical images. Please contribute to this discussion. DHowell 05:15, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
A user named "JD2635" has started putting US flags besides the cities in the infoboxes of TV stations. For an example, see KTRK-TV, which has a US flag next to "Houston, Texas" in the infobox.
Personally, I think it's unnecessary, as it's nothing but clutter. How about you? -- azumanga 03:37, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
Where does it end? If national flags are okay, are state flags also okay? I don't really care about flags (although I'll revert station logos on sight, due to fair-use issues), but do consider the implications and limits of any standard that is ratified. - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 00:17, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Do what you want, I don't have the strength to fight you on this. -
SVRTVDude (
Yell -
Toil) 02:49, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Ack no not what I meant. I'm removing the little CBS/ABC/NBC/etc. logos on sight. The one station logo in the infobox is okay. I mean I'd remove NETWORK logos on sight from station infoboxes. - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 21:15, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
I was looking at the pages for WIBW-TV, KTKA-TV, and KSNT-TV in Topeka, and noticed that some folks have been adding alumni lists... I know that they're nothing new, and appear on many TV pages, but for these particular pages, they're so comprehensive that, in many cases, they're longer than the station articles themselves. Have the lists moved from historical value to pure ListCruft? Amnewsboy 23:35, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
I just proposed a community ban for BenH at WP:CN. That may be the only way we can stop him and his sockpuppets. I've had to fix at least two of his screwups (thank God WJZY was the only Charlotte station he messed up), and this may be the only way to head him off for good. Blueboy96 01:52, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
My bad, here's the proposal at WP:CN. Blueboy96 22:15, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
Question. The Category:Television logos is currently swamped with TV station logos. But in between are also a slew of other logos. I was wondering if people would be interested in helping to sort the actual station logos into a Category:Television station logos. Because at the moment these images are just a nightmare to naviage. -- TheDJ ( talk • contribs • WikiProject Television) 21:00, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Took the liberty of running most of the IPs of BenH's suspected socks. Most of them trace to Winter Park, Florida; hosted by Embarq. Embarq seems to have a pretty tough AUP, which friend Benny has violated several times over. So now we've got an additional measure once the [[ community ban carries--first edit one of his socks or someone that looks like one of his socks makes, fire an email off to Embarq. I'd post the email addy here, but I'm not sure if that's allowed--could someone clarify. Blueboy96 03:41, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
I orioginally dropped a hint here before, but he's since became a royal pain in the a** --"Mmbabies", who has used about 35 IPs to cause literal destruction of various articles (including those of Houston TV stations, which explains its relevancy here), by deliberately adding falsehoods, as well as taunting and even threatening those who oppose his views. For more on his trail of destruction see User talk:Mmbabies. Personally, I think he's in dire need of a Community Ban, too.-- azumanga 02:17, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
The community ban on BenH has carried--whoopee! I take it this means there are no restrictions whatsoever on reverting his edits. --15:32, 28 March 2007 (UTC) Blueboy96
A Man in Black ( contributions), the leader of the crusade against fair-use images, was given a block for violating 3RR with another article. And, it may have been the final straw for him. He sounds like he's done with Wikipedia. Rollosmokes 08:32, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
Only verifiable information is published. Please consult Radio-Info for the full update with original research.
New licenses
Sales
New construction permits
Special Temporary Authority
Applications not yet granted
License renewals granted
Expiring construction permits
dhett ( talk • contribs) 04:14, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
I took photographs of 4 newsvans from television stations in Green Bay, Wisconsin and 2 newsvans from Milwaukee, Wisconsin at a recent trial of statewide to national interest. Does this WikiProject want images of newsvans added to articles for the TV stations? I made the mistake of taking photographs of notable locations on state highways without asking the U.S. Highways WikiProject if they want photographs. I ended up wasting several hundreds edits and tens of hours moving them to Wikimedia Commons. So here's my question: Should I upload them at all, and, if so, upload them to the English Wikipedia, or to Commons? I won't waste time uploading them without the consent of this WikiProject. Royalbroil 03:07, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
There is an IP who has been replacing logos for several stations with different logos. The IP in question is 151.203.115.197 ( talk · contribs · WHOIS), and it also made a copy-and-paste move of WTXF-TV to WTXF, changed KFMB-TV's owner to CBS, gave the Fox Television Stations Group ownership of KTVU, and added an ABC 7 logo (the WVII-TV version of the circle 7 logo, to be exact) below WCVB-TV's real logo (WCVB actually broadcasts on channel 5). I reverted most of the edits in question (someone else reverted the WTXF-TV side of the move). Just a reminder for future reference, in case (s)he strikes again. -- WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 15:42, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
I was thinking earlier today of creating a template along the lines of the network templates for stations that have substantial viewership in Canada. Was originally gonna do one just for the PBS stations with substantial viewership there (like WNED, Prairie Public Television, VPT, WTVS, KCTS, KSPS) but then I figured, "Why stop at PBS?" Thoughts? Blueboy96 18:11, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
Lots of articles about TV shows have a long list at the beginning of which networks air them in different countries. Shouldn't we have an template to arrange them into a table? Squidfryerchef 21:35, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
http://broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6435890.html
KKIC and WHMM are Telemundo affiliates in Boise and New Orleans. The latter will launch in mid-May: KKIC is already on air. TRKtv ( da aaa ah!) 02:55, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
Am I the only one who doesn't like this? I thought the format we used before was fine. -- CFIF ☎ ⋐ 19:02, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
Gridlock Joe and I have been trying to swat another Mmbabies sock here. I wonder if he's editing from someone else's house ... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Blueboy96 ( talk • contribs) 02:04, 29 April 2007 (UTC).
I don't want to freak anyone out too much, but it now seems that with the non-free content policy (that's the new name for the fair use policy) becoming ever stronger every day, it becomes clear that more and more of our images are at risk for potential deletion. The latest instance is that Iamunknown ( talk · contribs) is disputing how logos for networks such as HSN, Univision, Telemundo, ION, RTN, and pretty much all of the other smaller networks, qualify as being fair use (you know, if their fair use rationales apply to all their uses -- of course, most of them don't have any rationales, which is probably yet more worrying). The problem seems to be the usage of the network logos in the infoboxes as the "station logo". Since I don't want to get into hot water about non-free content (that's why I stopped adding to logo galleries months ago), I felt I needed to warn you. I also now feel that we should just excise network logos from station articles (excepting network logos within station logos, obviously, as seen in articles like WABC-TV, WQEX, and pretty much all MNTV affiliate articles, among others), as seen in the articles for WMFP and WSAH (they don't contain the Shop at Home or Jewelry Television logos, although they make up the vast majority of those stations' program schedules). Does anyone else agree? (I apologize in advance if this causes anyone to leave; I'm just assuming good faith here.) -- WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 13:28, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
One other note to those who have undertaken to remove network logos from television stations: many of these TV stations are O&O's, so the network logo also identifies the owner of the station. These logos should not need to be removed. dhett ( talk • contribs) 04:30, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
The saga continues with the copyright police. I just noticed that a large number of station logos have been listed as missing a fair use rationale, specifically the ones uploaded by Thistheman. As that editor doesn't seem to be particularly active these days, I thought that I should alert the project that these images were being targeted. ESkog issued these notifications, check his/her contributions to see which images are being targeted.
This copyright paranoia is getting out of hand. Just to be on the safe side, I think that we'll need to check all of our images and verify that our fair-use BS is in order. If we don'tdo this, we run the risk of having all of our images deleted by over-zealous admins. -- AlexDW 14:04, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
At least for the Azteca América logo, the other shoe has dropped: it has been deleted by ESkog ( talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA). Other images are probably gone too (or will soon vanish), but its removal from WFXZ-CA is the only edit to show up in my watchlist about this matter. I'd say this is worrying news for most of our images. (Luckily, all the logos I've uploaded in the past few months have rationales, and have no problems as a result.) -- WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 20:26, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
One thing I also noticed that even the stopgap "no logo" logo is gone -- they were automatically used when no logo, for the station or the network, is available. However, even though it was an original composition, someone here didn't like it. -- azumanga 01:52, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
We also need to keep an eye out on individual current station logos like that of KNTV; I just had to readd and appropriately license it after it was taken off twice in the last 30 days ( [8] & [9]) under fair use and unknown source. Nate 10:04, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
I'm in the midst of adding fair use rationales for all of the major Charlotte stations ... hopefully I can get to the other major North Carolina and South Carolina stations before the copyright police nail it. But anyone else willing to help (especially if you're in the Carolinas--I wonder if I'm teh only one from the Carolinas here), it would be much appreciated.
Fortunately, one of our comrades ( User:Firsfron) is an admin--hopefully he can keep them at bay. Blueboy 96 15:18, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
America One has also had its logo (which was also default for most articles for its affiliates) deleted from all articles if someone wants to try to recover that one; that was another Eskog deletion. Nate 08:03, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
I just put up a fair-use rationale for Image:The CW.svg because it was threatened with deletion; if someone could look it over for me please. Also, fair uses need to be added for MyNetworkTV. Nate 06:54, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
I have restored the Azteca América logo and have created a fair use rationale for each article in which the logo is used. If anyone adds the logo to an article, please be sure to add a fair use rationale for that article. dhett ( talk • contribs) 07:23, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
I have restored the America One logo and have create a fair use rationale for the network only. Currently, the logo is only used in the network article, but I will be adding stations (and station rationales) in time. I thought I had the list of stations using the image before, but I was wrong. The stations can be found at List_of_America_One_affiliates, which, by the way, needs cleanup. dhett ( talk • contribs) 04:50, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
http://broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6441181.html
New Azteca affil in Sacramento set to launch July 1, owned by same company as four local radio stations.
70.176.127.235 ( User:TrackerTV) 14:20, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
Template:Birmingham TV contains a link to GEB. Somehow I don't think there's much of a TV market for Godel, Escher, Bach (alas). I suspect it that the link should be to Golden Eagle Broadcasting. Hopefully someone in this project can confirm that and correct the template. -- J Clear 02:20, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
Why is Image:TBN-Crest_Blockletters.jpg (which needs its resolution reduced, if someone's up for that task) needed in over 50 articles, when we can use Image:NBC logo.svg (which needs some rationales, but those oughtn't be too hard) in only 2? The boilerplate claim that "Use of the logo visually identifies the stations' programming in a manner that mere prose cannot" is simply false - the TBN logo doesn't identify programming, it merely identifies a network. Is it that important that every station, including those who are too subnotable for a unique logo to even be findable, have some picture at the top? ( ESkog)( Talk) 01:18, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
I cannot find it anywhere, and I know there are more than 6 listed on this website.
70.119.101.141 13:24, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
I just wanted to get a second opinion on whether we allow pirate television stations within lists of local television stations. I just changed the San Francisco template because someone inserted a channel called Pirate Cat TV within the template [10]. I know there's also a Star Ray TV in the Toronto area that also operates as unlicensed, but I haven't changed that because I'm not living in that area and feel it's more appropriate for a Canadian editor to make that decision. However, my opinion is that only FCC-licensed stations and cable networks should be placed within local templates, though I remain neutral on the concept of pirate broadcasting since I'm in an area where it's never happened (although my local radio dial shows a pirate would be a breath of fresh air, but another argument for another day). I especially don't want to see templates bogged down with PTV stations that maybe only broadcast a couple hours a day at most, because it would be like clogging the templates with disperate local Internet TV efforts. Nate 22:36, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
I archived the talk page, which was 75 KB. I also copied code from my other project's talk page (talkheader and tocleft templates). TTV ( MyTV| PolygonZ| Green Valley) 21:00, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
One question for all of you guys and gals: can the " Prime Time Entertainment Network", which was the blanket title for mid-1990s syndicated shows such as Kung Fu: The Legend Continues and They Came From Outer Space, be considered a "network" along the lines of UPN/WB/CW?
I say no. It was a syndication service in which the aforementioned programs (and a few others that may be best forgotten) were branded under. A new user, Spshu, believes that PTEN was a network, and has been adding this "fact" to the Chris-Craft Industries page and adding an affiliate listing (consisting of the Chris-Craft/United station group only) on the PTEN page, which I have deleted (with valid reason) several times. Let's settle this once and for all, if you care to. Rollosmokes 06:05, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
Since WP:TVS doesn't presently deal with this, a couple of questions about ownership info within Template:Infobox Broadcast:
I've always considered the identity of the specific licensee to be important - perhaps not of any direct use to the average reader, but potentially useful for legal or research purposes, and at least as useful as, say, transmitter power. The licensee need only be named in the Infobox, not the main text. But of course, as I am apt to forget myself at times, Wikipedia is not written for broadcast professionals but for the average person, and the average person couldn't care less about, say, WAGA License Inc. when all they need to know is that the parent company is News Corp.
If we agree on that, as to format... Habitually I've listed both the licensee and ultimate parent in the following format: (example would apply to WCBS-TV)
The licensee can be easily verified via the FCC's TV Query. I would put CBS Broadcasting first because it is the company that directly owns the station. This is followed by a short-hand reference to the ultimate parent company, e.g. Disney or NewsCorp (or perhaps NewsCorp/ FTSG ?).
The most common alternative format I've seen is this, which gives priority to the parent company:
Again, this might be slightly less confusing to the average reader. Another potential alternative is separate "Owner / Parent company" lines, although in my view this would just cause more confusion.
Any thoughts? — stickguy (:^›)— || talk || 04:52, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
In station articles I've edited, I've been using the above format of Parent Owner/(Licensee). I think that format has worked for the most part, and would like to see it continue. Rollosmokes 20:15, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
Do we have any good articles around here? WP:PCP has about 15 plus two FAs. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 01:36, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
Beginning cross-post.
End cross-post. Please do not comment more in this section.
There appear to be many issues with our Wikipedia article on WHYY-TV. The history related in the article does not closely resemble that of external links such as this or this. For example, our article states the station was founded in 1957. The external links say 1949-early 1950. Our article says the station was originally WYBE channel 35; the external links say it was originally WDEL channel 7/12. Our article makes no mention of commercial affiliations, while the external links do. Our article makes no mention of former call-signs WDEL, WPFH, or WVUE. This is rather confusing, and either our article needs a re-write, or there were two seperate stations in Delaware with the same call sign. Any ideas? Firsfron of Ronchester 21:26, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
In one month, TV-Ark will relaunch, and I'm thinking that links will change. We will have to get this done when it comes back online on Christmas Day. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 23:55, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
I asked for a SuggestBot list yesterday, and I just got it today. I've trimmed it down to our project:
|
I was surprised at the results in the stub section: all of the stubbed station articles are from the same market; Jacksonville, Florida. I was stunned when I saw this. WTEV is the only one missing. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 22:53, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
I plan to send DuMont Television Network to Featured Article Candidacy soon. Before I do, I'd like to run it past the friendly folks here for improvements. Without getting too TV-station crufty, I wonder if more can't be added to this article to make it better. Suggestions? Edits? Ideas? Firsfron of Ronchester 03:54, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
I am beginning to feel that my time with Wikipedia may be coming to an end soon, because I don't find it fun anymore.
First, there was A Man in Black's anti-fair use image gallery purging campaign. Then, there is this newfound "notion" (courtesy of Spshu) that Prime Time Entertainment Network was a full-fledged "network". Now, David Levy and I are battling over proper use of grammar. On top of that, Marckd continues to use various IP addresses to make his point with WWOR-TV and WTXX. This is enough for me, and there's but only so much a person can take.
I began editing Wikipedia because I believed I could use my writing talents and knowledge of television and radio history to work in a welcome environment, though I stayed away from being a full-fleged part of the WP:TVS project. Now, it seems as though the "inmates" have taken control of the asylum. Where's the real consensus? Where's the real teamwork? Instead, I only see battles on editing style, article format, content, and those with an agenda they want to push trying to get their way.
Personally, I disagree with AMiB on the fair use gallery issue, as I believed the images were beneficial to articles if we don't get excessive with them. I disagree with Spshu that PTEN was a network because they (despite the name) they never labelled themselves as anything more than just a blanket title for syndicated programming, like Operation Prime Time. Now, months after I introduced the proper practice of substituting single-digit numerals with their written forms ("one" instead of "1"), David Levy tells me that the proper way is the wrong way here, as per Wikipedia's Manual of Style.
So, with this, does it mean us professional writers have been wrong all along? If you believe Wikipedia and Mr. Levy, then I guess we have been. I called Mr. Levy a "kid" who knew nothing about how to write, and someone willing to throw out all reasoning in order to enforce his own will -- and I stick to those statements. He called my comments uncivil; to me they aren't as I refrained from vulgar language and stronger personal attacks. He again proved himself to be arrogant and pompous, and someone not worthy to be an administrator.
As far as Marckd goes, we have been battling for months over the content of WWOR-TV and WTXX. He insisted on adding redundant and trivial information, and on making unnecessary style changes. Now, he insists on adding a few words instead, but it still is redundant to me. I have tried to reason with him, but to no avail. And he is further able to make changes and escape credit for them by using various IP addresses (the most recent being "65.41.244.121") instead of his screenname.
I am trying to be a team player. At the same time, I wish to bring a level of credibility and a certain form of style to Wikipedia's television articles. But if my work isn't appreciated, there's no point in me staying. I will decide my future with Wikipedia within the next few days. Rollosmokes 06:22, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Bottom line is this...the site administrators have to do a better job policing these articles, and I know that each of them are doing the best they can in that regard. However, a lot of these edit wars and constant griping by us here in this community will not change unless Wiki can do a better job in policing this site. This is no means an attack towards the site, I'm just simply saying.
As far as my idea on what the TV articles SHOULD be presented, here it is...
No newscast schedules, no listing of station personalities, and other useless irrelevant garbage that doesn't belong. If you want to know what time that station's newscast airs, and when other shows that they air...go to their web site or visit one of the TV listing sites. ShawnHill 00:30, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Then, there is this newfound "notion" (courtesy of Spshu) that Prime Time Entertainment Network was a full-fledged "network".
I began editing Wikipedia because I believed I could use my writing talents and knowledge of television and radio history to work in a welcome environment, though I stayed away from being a full-fleged part of the WP:TVS project. Now, it seems as though the "inmates" have taken control of the asylum.
Where's the real consensus?
Instead, I only see battles on editing style, article format, content, and those with an agenda they want to push trying to get their way.
Now, months after I introduced the proper practice of substituting single-digit numerals with their written forms ("one" instead of "1"), David Levy tells me that the proper way is the wrong way here, as per Wikipedia's Manual of Style.
So, with this, does it mean us professional writers have been wrong all along?
I called Mr. Levy a "kid" who knew nothing about how to write, and someone willing to throw out all reasoning in order to enforce his own will -- and I stick to those statements. He called my comments uncivil; to me they aren't as I refrained from vulgar language and stronger personal attacks. He again proved himself to be arrogant and pompous, and someone not worthy to be an administrator.
I am trying to be a team player.
At the same time, I wish to bring a level of credibility and a certain form of style to Wikipedia's television articles.
Bluestone Television sold a bunch of outlets to one Bonten Media Group. We need changes in the articles listed (WCYB is already done), plus an article on Bonten Media. Shin'ou's TTV ( Futaba| Masago| Kotobuki) 17:07, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
Just thought the community should know about this: administrator A Man In Black ( talk · contribs) has been removing logo galleries containing (what he sites as) fair-use images from several station articles.
A list of cable network articles he's already handled: Disney Channel. Ronald20 05:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
(Edit - Also handled: Spike TV, Fox Sports Net, ABC Family, ESPN on ABC, Toon Disney, CNN Headline News, CBC Newsworld, and Réseau de l'information. Ronald20 05:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC) )
(Edit - I have archived the removed content here. Ronald20 02:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
As I understood it, the upshot was that nobody likes this but there was grudging acceptance that this is something that needs to happen. - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 09:07, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Seeing as we are at an impasse on this issue, I have just submitted an RFC about the use of historical logos in galleries at Wikipedia:Fair use/Historical logos in galleries. Please contribute to this discussion and help determine a consensus. Despite the assertions of User:A Man In Black, this issue is not as clear cut as he would like it to be and consensus needs to be determined. DHowell 04:56, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Disavian has created an article describing the in-house cable television network used at Georgia Tech, which was originally tagged as a station needing an infobox. Problem is, our broadcast infobox template doesn't seem to apply well to the article. Does anyone know of an infobox that would be a better match? Thanks in advance. dhett 08:14, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
I ran into a problem on KGUN-TV. There was a translator for the station with query calls DK02BW. I didn't know what it was (I thought it meant Digital K02BW), and then Radio-Info pointed out that KTFL (query calls DKTFL) was defunct. A ton of D-call stations show up, but the one that sealed the deal was LA's channel sixty-eight, KEEF-TV, "DKEEF-TV", which I knew was defunct by all means. Thus, if you catch a D in YOUR FCC queries, the station's not broadcasting. Remember: D Means Defunct. TTV| talk| contribs| email 19:09, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Just a question for you all since I'm still a bit too nOOb to really get into the meat of editing stuff (but I'm getting there)...
I've noticed that the pages for some of our local stations here in Yuma, AZ, including KSWT and KYMA, refer to the article as a stub about a California-based TV station. What is the basis for which state is used there? Both of those, as well as KECY, have their actual studios in Yuma, AZ, but their transmitters are 15-20 mi NNW of town, in California (to serve the other and smaller half of the DMA, the Imperial Valley in CA). Since we're the larger half of the split market, and the stations have their physical operations in Arizona, it seems like the stub link should be for AZ instead... but I'm the nOOb here... :) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by TVGenius ( talk • contribs) 05:35, 11 December 2006 (UTC).
I realized as soon as I had hit Save Page that I forgot the tildes, but then something happened with my internet connection and I couldn't get back to the article to add it. As far as KECY goes, I'd almost vote for them to be considered Yuma as well, since about five years ago, they moved their entire operation from El Centro to Yuma (to the tune of being off the air for about two weeks) but I guess that if the FCC still shows it that way, then that way it shall be. I'll go ahead and change the stub tags... maybe see what everyone else thinks about KSWT's stub status and maybe lose it later. I'll try to go in and do some more historical background (prior ownership etc) over the coming weeks/month or two, as I have time. (I worked there for over five years) I'll also update the CW fiasco whenever it's taken care of (which reminds me, I need to tweak what's there a bit now...) TVGenius 17:36, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
The whole fight that KSWT and their parent company Pappas had with Time Warner Cable over whether or not it would be carried on analog cable or not. After about four months of bickering (and only being able to get it OTA on 13.2) they finally reached some sort of agreement that got it on analog 6. KECY didn't seem to have any problems getting their cable/sub-channel only ABC affiliate on channel 5 to replace KNXV from Phoenix, though. TVGenius 17:37, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
Take a look at KODE-TV. What's wrong with the first paragraph? It looks like a partial copyvio. I saw it on KLBK-TV/ KAMC in Lubbock, too. And it looked eerily similar. Weed out all the Nexstar and Mission stations' copyvio paragraphs (which are easily identifiable by "(station) provides a digital and analog signal to viewers" and items on Shared Services Agreements). At this rate, just like Nexstar treats its stations, it will become a dump. TTV| talk| contribs| email 03:53, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
http://www.nexstar.tv/nexstar/stations/kode.asp shows the truth:
KODE, an ABC affiliate in Joplin, was acquired by Mission Broadcasting in 2002. Subsequently KODE entered into a Shared Services Agreement with Nexstar Broadcasting station KSNF. The operating efficiencies have greatly improved both stations’ revenue share and viewership. KODE and KSNF entered into a Joint Sales Agreement in October of 2004 which will provide for more effective marketing of advertising time for both stations. KODE’s syndicated programming includes Oprah, Jeopardy, Seinfeld, and Spin City. The station provides a digital and analog signal to viewers.
KODE was acquired by Mission Broadcasting in 2002. Subsequently KODE entered into a Shared Services Agreement with Nexstar Broadcasting station KSNF. The operating efficiencies have greatly improved both stations’ revenue share and viewership. KODE and KSNF entered into a Joint Sales Agreement in October of 2004 which will provide for more effective marketing of advertising time for both stations. KODE’s syndicated programming includes Oprah, Jeopardy, Seinfeld, and Spin City. The station provides a digital and analog signal to viewers.
We are dealing with mass copyvio, folks...and it ain't pretty. TTV| talk| contribs| email 03:59, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Special:Contributions/70.242.36.188. That's the contribs of the IP that added the copyvio material. TTV| talk| contribs| email 04:02, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
I notice many TV station pages include the names of current news anchors. I believe this is *mostly* inappropriate for Wikipedia for the following reasons:
Disscussion? -- Bill Huston (talk) 09:09, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
Station lists: Keep notable anchors, delete the rest immediately from article. TTV| talk| contribs| email 22:15, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
Today, I was going through CAT:CSD. Well, it went well until I saw KPDF-CA, an article I created under an anon IP, in the bin. I ran to the article. Turns out User:Alan.ca (a Canadian user) had put a G11 tag on it. I removed it, as the article was not G11-worthy. I run to get User:Dhett, also from Chandler and my major partner in maintaining the Arizona TV articles, on the line, and he replies, pointing to issues that happened with KUNP. Well, we need to watch out: our LPTVs in low-power places need a little help. « TTV»( talk| contribs| email) 04:18, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
DuMont Television Network has just been sent to Featured Article Candidacy. As far as I know, it is the only WP:TVS-related article to have ever been sent to FAC. Please take a moment to read the article and comment on its candidacy. If you can't support, please provide a reason on why, or a suggestion on how it might be improved. This only takes a few minutes of your time, and would be deeply appreciated. Thanks, Firsfron of Ronchester 02:59, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 16:28, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
Every month for more than a year now, I have published television updates to the Phoenix Television page of Radio Info for stations whose signal serves Arizona cities. I have been asked to publish that information here also.
New licenses
New programming
Returned to air
Gone silent
Sales
New construction permits
Expired construction permits
License renewals granted
Additional note
Comments, questions and suggestions are always welcome. dhett 09:41, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
I think we have another BenH sockpuppet here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/24.159.38.231
I've seen this person's article style, and it reeks of BenH. -- azumanga 01:19, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
Hey, y'all... I think we should have a definitive consensus on local television anchor/reporter articles on WP.
Articles for local anchors are popping up everywhere ( Susan Peters, Jancey Sheats, Tucker Jankosky to name a few) -- none of which are, IMHO, notable for a global audience. Are they good anchors? Sure. Award-winning? Absolutely. Do they deserve an entire article about them? I think that's pushing it a little bit.
On top of that -- it opens the floodgates for every television anchor from New York City to Glendive, MT to have their own article... and that can get out of hand if not kept in check.
I think that if WP is going to include articles on local television anchors at all, we need to establish some sort of criteria for it. Ideally, it should take market size into account primarily, and awards / accomplishments / etc. second.
Thoughts? Amnewsboy 09:17, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
I'm in my namespace, working on a slightly updated version of the Infobox design, that is based off the "old design", but carries the extended information of the other design. I'm even thinking about making it so that we use the colors of the station's logo or news graphics as the colors on the headings on it (I'll be changing my test page to only have infoboxes on it soon, stay tuned...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:ViperSnake151/WNBC
ViperSnake151 16:35, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
Quick! Copyvio at more Nexstar stuff! KTAB-TV! TRKtv t c e 01:53, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
The KTVX translator subarticle has been nominated both for merge into the main article and deletion. I have presented my defense, but if anyone could help out, I would certainly appreciate it. dhett ( talk • contribs) 06:02, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
I've seen multiple articles with long lists of schedule and/or personality information. This stuff is simply non-encyclopedic. Wikipedia is not a tv guide. I've cleaned up a few articles from Template:Oklahoma City TV and others, but I'm sure there are more. I just wanted to bring this to your attention, since this is the relevant wikiproject. Thank you for your efforts, Fang Aili talk 01:48, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
List of United States over-the-air television networks is in really bad shape. It currently lists "networks" with only one affiliate (How is a network with only one station a network?), And many columns are filled in with "?" or "unknown" (The information is not unknown; someone obviously knows it; the fact the person editing the page doesn't know it is not the same thing). I've reverted these additions many times, but it just keeps getting added back in. Perhaps we can come to a consensus here about the material included in this list? Firsfron of Ronchester 04:16, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
It seems that not being content at simply deleting logo galleries, A Man In Black is now deleting historical TV station logos anywhere he sees them. Citing WP:V, WP:OR, WP:FU, and probably other policies as well, he now finds any excuse he can to remove this historical (and often difficult to find) information from the encyclopedia. See the latest at the WUSA (TV) edit history (or just look at his recent contributions) and at WP:AN#A Man in Black and WP:AN#Continued Problem. DHowell 23:26, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
Posted as per request. New licenses, construction permits, applications and license renewal sections are compiled from FCC documents. New programming, returned to air and silent station sections are original research and are included for information only.
New licenses
New programming
Returned to air
Silent station
New construction permits
Applications for digital television licenses to cover
License renewals granted
The Phoenix template got a bunch of out-of-metro-area translators. Should these be split off? TRKtv ( da aaa ah!) 00:04, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
For those of you who, like me, have spent some time and effort in the past defending TV station articles against deletion, I have found a precedent that we can cite in our defense arguments. Appropriately, it comes from a subarticle to Articles for deletion, from the Entertainment paragraph in Precedents.
Some have made the argument that all television stations are inherently notable, but I cannot fully agree. I believe that most would agree that mere translators are not notable. However, this precedent does allow for inherent notability of most full-service television stations, as most originate programming. Those that don't, such as statewide PBS networks, and groups of stations in Montana and North Dakota, are mostly already in common articles. Class A is even more cut-and-dried, as the very Class A license is contingent upon the station broadcasting a minimum of three hours of locally-produced original programming per week. Of course, there could be a few exceptions where either the local programming requirement is waived (although I cannot cite such a case) or where a group of Class A stations with adjacent coverage area are allowed to broadcast common programming, in which case there would be one article for the originating station and redirects from the others.
As for the rest of the low-power television stations, we have a precedent. While it is not as strong as a guideline or a policy, it is a start, and can be used to determine whether or not the station deserves a standalone article. There are some articles that we probably need to eventually revisit, mostly affiliates of satellite-delivered services such as HSN, Jewelry Television, Shop at Home, TBN, Daystar, MTV2, MTV Tr3s, Univision, Telemundo, Telefutura, Azteca América, and The CW, especially stations that are part of The CW Plus group.
If possible, I'd like to see this precedent expanded upon - enough to at least merit inclusion in WP:ORG#Alternate criteria for specific types of organizations. It's ironic that coverage on a television station can be used to establish notability, but the station itself not be considered by some to be notable. dhett ( talk • contribs) 06:05, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
I would like to point out that the AFD precedents page is old and out of date and mostly frowned upon. Precedents are more useful for effective arguments. I don't think any of the articles I've seen particularly need to be deleted, but if it's a significant issue, it'd be best to tighten up the arguments against deletion. In service of this goal...
Why does original programming matter? We don't consider self-produced, self-distributed work in other areas (books, internet) sufficient to establish notability. Why should this be different for television stations? - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 07:21, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
Just for the record, I haven't seen any indication that the AFD precedents page is frowned upon (frowned upon by who? Certainly not by the people who edit it, which includes several active admins.), and as Dhett says, the page doesn't seem truly inactive, as there were edits from just over a month ago. I'll add the the talk page is active as of today.
Firsfron of Ronchester 20:24, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
According to the front page of 100000watts.com, KMAS has flipped to PBS from Telemundo. KMAS (and sister KDEN) are owned by NBC Telemundo. Now, normally 100000watts.com is pretty reliable source, but I am unsure on this one. I have made a KMAS page (it is pretty bare) but if someone out Denver way could confirm this cause I have never heard of an O&O flipping a station to PBS before. Thanks. - SVRTVDude ( Yell - Work) 05:58, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
...same as the first:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/67.77.209.207 -- azumanga 04:15, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
What about Chris Coleman? Taylorsville
Got a bit of a problem and I know this is WP:TVS, but figure someone might know the answer. There are some of Clear Channel radio stations that are now under "BT Triple Crown Merger Co." (a private company that is pretty much still Clear Channel), should I put the merger company name in small italics under Clear Channel or just put Clear Channel and leave it at that? - SVRTVDude ( Yell - Toil) 20:49, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
If anyone wishes to save the American Broadcasting Company logos, Arrow 4 logo, Circle 7 logo and GMA Network logos articles, you had better act quickly. The articles have been nominated for deletion ( American Broadcasting Company logos, Arrow 4 logo, Circle 7 logo and GMA Network logos). The noms expire Friday and the nominator states that the articles violate WP:NOR, WP:V and WP:N. The BBC One logos and Logos of Viacom articles have already been lost. dhett ( talk • contribs) 05:23, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
Add RCTV logos, PBS idents and NBC logos to the AfD parade, these expiring on Saturday. The same user has nominated all seven articles, citing violations of WP:NOR, WP:V and WP:N for each. AfD noms: RCTV logos, PBS idents and NBC logos. dhett ( talk • contribs) 05:36, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
Again, here is a summary of updates of television stations viewable in Arizona cities. I have removed original research from the summary, which can be seen in full at my Radio-Info Phoenix TV post. I have also added references to this summary.
New license
New construction permit
Applications not yet granted
Applications dismissed
License renewal granted
Expiring construction permits
dhett ( talk • contribs) 08:41, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/67.77.211.227
And while you're at it -- meet his twin, "Mmbabies":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Suspected_Wikipedia_sockpuppets_of_Mmbabies
-- azumanga 04:39, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
I just cleaned up a bunch of New York City station articles vandalized by one of the aforementioned suspected BenH sockpuppets. Rollosmokes 05:22, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
Several users are reverting each other on Metromedia. I've protected the page for now (protection is not an endorsement of the current version) to keep the article free of being the subject of a long-lasting edit war. Comments are appreciated on the talk page, as always. Firsfron of Ronchester 17:24, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
The continuing removal of logo galleries by User:A Man In Black has prompted me to submit a proposal to change policy wording, at Wikipedia:Fair use/Amendment/Historical images. Please contribute to this discussion. DHowell 05:15, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
A user named "JD2635" has started putting US flags besides the cities in the infoboxes of TV stations. For an example, see KTRK-TV, which has a US flag next to "Houston, Texas" in the infobox.
Personally, I think it's unnecessary, as it's nothing but clutter. How about you? -- azumanga 03:37, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
Where does it end? If national flags are okay, are state flags also okay? I don't really care about flags (although I'll revert station logos on sight, due to fair-use issues), but do consider the implications and limits of any standard that is ratified. - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 00:17, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Do what you want, I don't have the strength to fight you on this. -
SVRTVDude (
Yell -
Toil) 02:49, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Ack no not what I meant. I'm removing the little CBS/ABC/NBC/etc. logos on sight. The one station logo in the infobox is okay. I mean I'd remove NETWORK logos on sight from station infoboxes. - A Man In Bl♟ck ( conspire | past ops) 21:15, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
I was looking at the pages for WIBW-TV, KTKA-TV, and KSNT-TV in Topeka, and noticed that some folks have been adding alumni lists... I know that they're nothing new, and appear on many TV pages, but for these particular pages, they're so comprehensive that, in many cases, they're longer than the station articles themselves. Have the lists moved from historical value to pure ListCruft? Amnewsboy 23:35, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
I just proposed a community ban for BenH at WP:CN. That may be the only way we can stop him and his sockpuppets. I've had to fix at least two of his screwups (thank God WJZY was the only Charlotte station he messed up), and this may be the only way to head him off for good. Blueboy96 01:52, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
My bad, here's the proposal at WP:CN. Blueboy96 22:15, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
Question. The Category:Television logos is currently swamped with TV station logos. But in between are also a slew of other logos. I was wondering if people would be interested in helping to sort the actual station logos into a Category:Television station logos. Because at the moment these images are just a nightmare to naviage. -- TheDJ ( talk • contribs • WikiProject Television) 21:00, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
Took the liberty of running most of the IPs of BenH's suspected socks. Most of them trace to Winter Park, Florida; hosted by Embarq. Embarq seems to have a pretty tough AUP, which friend Benny has violated several times over. So now we've got an additional measure once the [[ community ban carries--first edit one of his socks or someone that looks like one of his socks makes, fire an email off to Embarq. I'd post the email addy here, but I'm not sure if that's allowed--could someone clarify. Blueboy96 03:41, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
I orioginally dropped a hint here before, but he's since became a royal pain in the a** --"Mmbabies", who has used about 35 IPs to cause literal destruction of various articles (including those of Houston TV stations, which explains its relevancy here), by deliberately adding falsehoods, as well as taunting and even threatening those who oppose his views. For more on his trail of destruction see User talk:Mmbabies. Personally, I think he's in dire need of a Community Ban, too.-- azumanga 02:17, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
The community ban on BenH has carried--whoopee! I take it this means there are no restrictions whatsoever on reverting his edits. --15:32, 28 March 2007 (UTC) Blueboy96
A Man in Black ( contributions), the leader of the crusade against fair-use images, was given a block for violating 3RR with another article. And, it may have been the final straw for him. He sounds like he's done with Wikipedia. Rollosmokes 08:32, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
Only verifiable information is published. Please consult Radio-Info for the full update with original research.
New licenses
Sales
New construction permits
Special Temporary Authority
Applications not yet granted
License renewals granted
Expiring construction permits
dhett ( talk • contribs) 04:14, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
I took photographs of 4 newsvans from television stations in Green Bay, Wisconsin and 2 newsvans from Milwaukee, Wisconsin at a recent trial of statewide to national interest. Does this WikiProject want images of newsvans added to articles for the TV stations? I made the mistake of taking photographs of notable locations on state highways without asking the U.S. Highways WikiProject if they want photographs. I ended up wasting several hundreds edits and tens of hours moving them to Wikimedia Commons. So here's my question: Should I upload them at all, and, if so, upload them to the English Wikipedia, or to Commons? I won't waste time uploading them without the consent of this WikiProject. Royalbroil 03:07, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
There is an IP who has been replacing logos for several stations with different logos. The IP in question is 151.203.115.197 ( talk · contribs · WHOIS), and it also made a copy-and-paste move of WTXF-TV to WTXF, changed KFMB-TV's owner to CBS, gave the Fox Television Stations Group ownership of KTVU, and added an ABC 7 logo (the WVII-TV version of the circle 7 logo, to be exact) below WCVB-TV's real logo (WCVB actually broadcasts on channel 5). I reverted most of the edits in question (someone else reverted the WTXF-TV side of the move). Just a reminder for future reference, in case (s)he strikes again. -- WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 15:42, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
I was thinking earlier today of creating a template along the lines of the network templates for stations that have substantial viewership in Canada. Was originally gonna do one just for the PBS stations with substantial viewership there (like WNED, Prairie Public Television, VPT, WTVS, KCTS, KSPS) but then I figured, "Why stop at PBS?" Thoughts? Blueboy96 18:11, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
Lots of articles about TV shows have a long list at the beginning of which networks air them in different countries. Shouldn't we have an template to arrange them into a table? Squidfryerchef 21:35, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
http://broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6435890.html
KKIC and WHMM are Telemundo affiliates in Boise and New Orleans. The latter will launch in mid-May: KKIC is already on air. TRKtv ( da aaa ah!) 02:55, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
Am I the only one who doesn't like this? I thought the format we used before was fine. -- CFIF ☎ ⋐ 19:02, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
Gridlock Joe and I have been trying to swat another Mmbabies sock here. I wonder if he's editing from someone else's house ... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Blueboy96 ( talk • contribs) 02:04, 29 April 2007 (UTC).
I don't want to freak anyone out too much, but it now seems that with the non-free content policy (that's the new name for the fair use policy) becoming ever stronger every day, it becomes clear that more and more of our images are at risk for potential deletion. The latest instance is that Iamunknown ( talk · contribs) is disputing how logos for networks such as HSN, Univision, Telemundo, ION, RTN, and pretty much all of the other smaller networks, qualify as being fair use (you know, if their fair use rationales apply to all their uses -- of course, most of them don't have any rationales, which is probably yet more worrying). The problem seems to be the usage of the network logos in the infoboxes as the "station logo". Since I don't want to get into hot water about non-free content (that's why I stopped adding to logo galleries months ago), I felt I needed to warn you. I also now feel that we should just excise network logos from station articles (excepting network logos within station logos, obviously, as seen in articles like WABC-TV, WQEX, and pretty much all MNTV affiliate articles, among others), as seen in the articles for WMFP and WSAH (they don't contain the Shop at Home or Jewelry Television logos, although they make up the vast majority of those stations' program schedules). Does anyone else agree? (I apologize in advance if this causes anyone to leave; I'm just assuming good faith here.) -- WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 13:28, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
One other note to those who have undertaken to remove network logos from television stations: many of these TV stations are O&O's, so the network logo also identifies the owner of the station. These logos should not need to be removed. dhett ( talk • contribs) 04:30, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
The saga continues with the copyright police. I just noticed that a large number of station logos have been listed as missing a fair use rationale, specifically the ones uploaded by Thistheman. As that editor doesn't seem to be particularly active these days, I thought that I should alert the project that these images were being targeted. ESkog issued these notifications, check his/her contributions to see which images are being targeted.
This copyright paranoia is getting out of hand. Just to be on the safe side, I think that we'll need to check all of our images and verify that our fair-use BS is in order. If we don'tdo this, we run the risk of having all of our images deleted by over-zealous admins. -- AlexDW 14:04, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
At least for the Azteca América logo, the other shoe has dropped: it has been deleted by ESkog ( talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA). Other images are probably gone too (or will soon vanish), but its removal from WFXZ-CA is the only edit to show up in my watchlist about this matter. I'd say this is worrying news for most of our images. (Luckily, all the logos I've uploaded in the past few months have rationales, and have no problems as a result.) -- WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 20:26, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
One thing I also noticed that even the stopgap "no logo" logo is gone -- they were automatically used when no logo, for the station or the network, is available. However, even though it was an original composition, someone here didn't like it. -- azumanga 01:52, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
We also need to keep an eye out on individual current station logos like that of KNTV; I just had to readd and appropriately license it after it was taken off twice in the last 30 days ( [8] & [9]) under fair use and unknown source. Nate 10:04, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
I'm in the midst of adding fair use rationales for all of the major Charlotte stations ... hopefully I can get to the other major North Carolina and South Carolina stations before the copyright police nail it. But anyone else willing to help (especially if you're in the Carolinas--I wonder if I'm teh only one from the Carolinas here), it would be much appreciated.
Fortunately, one of our comrades ( User:Firsfron) is an admin--hopefully he can keep them at bay. Blueboy 96 15:18, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
America One has also had its logo (which was also default for most articles for its affiliates) deleted from all articles if someone wants to try to recover that one; that was another Eskog deletion. Nate 08:03, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
I just put up a fair-use rationale for Image:The CW.svg because it was threatened with deletion; if someone could look it over for me please. Also, fair uses need to be added for MyNetworkTV. Nate 06:54, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
I have restored the Azteca América logo and have created a fair use rationale for each article in which the logo is used. If anyone adds the logo to an article, please be sure to add a fair use rationale for that article. dhett ( talk • contribs) 07:23, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
I have restored the America One logo and have create a fair use rationale for the network only. Currently, the logo is only used in the network article, but I will be adding stations (and station rationales) in time. I thought I had the list of stations using the image before, but I was wrong. The stations can be found at List_of_America_One_affiliates, which, by the way, needs cleanup. dhett ( talk • contribs) 04:50, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
http://broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6441181.html
New Azteca affil in Sacramento set to launch July 1, owned by same company as four local radio stations.
70.176.127.235 ( User:TrackerTV) 14:20, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
Template:Birmingham TV contains a link to GEB. Somehow I don't think there's much of a TV market for Godel, Escher, Bach (alas). I suspect it that the link should be to Golden Eagle Broadcasting. Hopefully someone in this project can confirm that and correct the template. -- J Clear 02:20, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
Why is Image:TBN-Crest_Blockletters.jpg (which needs its resolution reduced, if someone's up for that task) needed in over 50 articles, when we can use Image:NBC logo.svg (which needs some rationales, but those oughtn't be too hard) in only 2? The boilerplate claim that "Use of the logo visually identifies the stations' programming in a manner that mere prose cannot" is simply false - the TBN logo doesn't identify programming, it merely identifies a network. Is it that important that every station, including those who are too subnotable for a unique logo to even be findable, have some picture at the top? ( ESkog)( Talk) 01:18, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
I cannot find it anywhere, and I know there are more than 6 listed on this website.
70.119.101.141 13:24, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
I just wanted to get a second opinion on whether we allow pirate television stations within lists of local television stations. I just changed the San Francisco template because someone inserted a channel called Pirate Cat TV within the template [10]. I know there's also a Star Ray TV in the Toronto area that also operates as unlicensed, but I haven't changed that because I'm not living in that area and feel it's more appropriate for a Canadian editor to make that decision. However, my opinion is that only FCC-licensed stations and cable networks should be placed within local templates, though I remain neutral on the concept of pirate broadcasting since I'm in an area where it's never happened (although my local radio dial shows a pirate would be a breath of fresh air, but another argument for another day). I especially don't want to see templates bogged down with PTV stations that maybe only broadcast a couple hours a day at most, because it would be like clogging the templates with disperate local Internet TV efforts. Nate 22:36, 19 May 2007 (UTC)