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I have read through almost all of the real heavy sections of this talk page and have come to a conclusion, WTF is wrong with Wikipedia?
1. WWE Vengeance has been noted on every ocasion as the night of champions and that all the titles will be defended. Why can't we include all the champions and TBA? Its gonna happen. Some say, What if someone gets injured, well my answer based on WWE would be that injured wrestlers get stripped of their title. So at Vengeance, if Santino gets injured, fired, or dies then the title will be put up for a match to determine a new champion. It is not crystal ballig when something is annouced. It is however a double standard to put on Boxing articles that card is subject to change but when it comes to a WWE event we can't say that. WTF?
2. Separating articles like Vince and Mr. McMahon is wrong but mentioning his death as a major event is wrong too. WTF?
3. Annouced matches in articles is wrong but leaving out matches like Cena vs HHH at WM 22 is ok. That match was the main event of the biggest show in WWE and it is not notable that is not fair. WTF?
4. Wikipedia talks a heavy game about the rules and stuff people can't do but the tag line of wikipedia is that any one can edit an article. But that seems that guys like TJ Spke, bulletproof and Deep Shadow want to own wikipedia so that everything they say is right. WTF?
5. WWE, is it or is it not a reliable source for information? It adhears to kayfabe but it does not adhere to kayfabe. Case in point McMahons death and Sherri Martel's death. Some articles state that Jericho and Benoit have won the WWE Championship numerous times but WWE strkie them from the record so we can't add them. But when it comes to Ric Flair, on the NWA Championship list, they have him in there for four extra reigns but NWA does not recognize them and we put them in there anyway. WTF?
6. A wikipedia policy is that annouced matches can't be added to articles until they have happened and if they are notable. That means that we can't add the Royal Fucking Rumble to the Royal Fucking Rumble's page. That makes no fucking sense.
In the end Wikipedia has to many transparent rules that vets seem to take advantage of. They only adhere to the rules that they agree with and if they don't agree with something they try to get it changed to their liking. The people who are allowed to put blocks on pages are the main ones that make the rules and get others banned. They give people strikes and revert things to what they want them. We need better rules, and if we need to vote on some then we will have to.
Something has to be done about all these problems. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.247.21.121 ( talk • contribs)
OK, as one who seems to be on the other side of the WTF debate.
1. This is not WP:Boxing, boxing (to my knowledge) is not worked, and when they announce a card it is legit, when WWE announces "all titles are on the line" this does not mean it is so, the whole Punjabi Prison match nonsense shows that. Also the poster for Vengeance shows Bobby Lashley holding an ECW title, which he now does not have.
2. Vince's "death" has brought up a problem which has existed but not on this level, did he really have an affair with Trish? No, but Mr McMahon did. Does this require a separation of his article? Probably not, because his off screen activities can be summed up in a couple of sentences.
3. I have no idea what is going on with the WM22 article, but if there is a match missing then just add it, if you can find a source, and stop WTF-ing this talk page.
4. Read the about Wikipedia page, it explains that although anyone can edit there are rules, if you want try editing Jimbo's user page and count the seconds before your edit is reverted. And if you want look at the front page of this project, without sources the project as a whole gets reamed, look at Rico's page as an example.
5. I have a book which list champions of the WWE, Jericho and Benoit have been champion once each, the whole HHH/Y2J Earl Hebner wipe it from the records angle is why this is not a project about boxing.
6. And you are right, you can't add the Royal Rumble to the RR08 article because we are in fucking June, and WWE might go out of business in December. As for Vengeance the PPV is in 14 days, on RAW I expect the IC and Tag titles will be announcec and then ECW and SD is taped and they will announce the Tag and ECW titles, just be patient.
And if you feel this is such a big problem then get a username and join the project, it is a lot easier to change something from the inside than sit on the outside complaining. On top of that you have already asked a whole bunch of questions at [1], to which you did not respond. Darrenhusted 12:47, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I just now decided to read this talk section and was very surprised to see my name mentioned. Why do you think I want to own Wikipedia? If it's because you're referring to the whole "Good faith vandal" debate, I feel you may have been manipulated by that user's phrasing. They removed a very large chunk of information from the article and tried to turn it into something it's not. I reverted it because that user didn't have consensus to make a change so drastic. It's one of the fundamental rules of Wikipedia.
“ | Wikipedia works by building consensus. Consensus is an inherent part of the wiki process. The basic process works like this: someone makes an edit to a page, and then everyone who reads the page makes a decision to either leave the page as it is or change it. Over time, every edit that remains on a page, in a sense, has the unanimous approval of the community (or at least everyone who has looked at the page). "Silence equals consent" is the ultimate measure of consensus — somebody makes an edit and nobody objects or changes it. Most of the time consensus is reached as a natural product of the editing process. | ” |
Those are the rules I follow, not create. I honestly believe no major changes should be undertaken unless the matter has been thoroughly discussed and has reached a decision that makes everybody happy.
To addess a few of your other points:
Alright I need the input from editors more experienced than myself, I recently AFD'ed the article for Chris Knight (Professional Wrestler) as seen In his AFD but now less than a day after it was deleted the article has been recreated again without doing anything to address the issues brought up in the AFD. It's also been speedy deleted in late April/Early May as evident by his user talk page. I'd put it up for speedy deletion once againbut this guy'll recreate it once more since that seems to be his only contribution to wikipedia. Is there a way to stop this guy from Cruftying up Wikipedia with his own little pet vanity project? MPJ-DK 15:29, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
It has now been discovered that La Parka Your Car is a sockpuppet of JB196. Does this mean we have to go over all the edits they made? Because they made thousands of edits and deleted a lot of content.
On a separate note, I highly suspect Candicesfan is a sockpuppet of Rawfannation due to this edit, this edit and this edit (I say "suspect" because I don't want to accuse) on Candice Michelle's talk page. Rawfannation101 is a banned editor according to this. - Deep Shadow 15:32, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
The UCW-Zero Tag Team Champions and the other 3 UCW-Zero titles have been put up for joint deletion since the "owner" of the article removed the prods without addressing the issues. I'll neutrally invite everyone to look over the AFD and vote however you're compelled to vote, heck I implore everyone to spend 10 minutes and check out ALL the AFDs listed at the top and vote to ensure that the process is done right. Thanks MPJ-DK 15:59, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I want to source up the gimmick match page, but I keep coming back to WWE.com. That could, conceivably, be construed as primary sourcing for some of the stuff and lead to someone tagging it down the line as being sourced from too few sources. I've tried using things like DDT Digest and Online World of Wrestling and finding examples of matches where they explain the rules during them, but it's not going well to this point. Any ideas?«» bd( talk stalk) 17:07, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
Be on the look out for User:Jordan brice (See his Contribs) This user continues to add "Real Height"s to Wrestlers' profiles without also adding a source. -- bulletproof 3:16 17:33, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
[2] Looks like he's back, certainly the same MO, alot of the same wrestlers, Edge, Hogan et cetera. Darrenhusted 16:18, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Could some of the PW guys make adding to and sourcing the Thomas Couch article (Tommy Rogers of the Fantastics) a priority? I rescued the article after a speedy deletion due to a BLP-related blanking, but it may not survive another PROD or Speedy because of the BLP-Blanking (which I am NOT going to undo). Be much appreciated. SirFozzie 17:58, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I hate to be begging for votes, but I was wondering if a couple people would mind checking out the page and if they think it is worthy of FL status, voting in the page's FLC. It has been a candidate for 10 days and only has one vote. As well, MarcK, Oakster and myself are very close to getting the Active WWE Championship histories to being of Featured Topic quality - we just have 3 more pages to get promoted (World tag Team, Womens and ECW). -- Scorpion 0422 00:50, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Greetings. (I'm not a member of the project, but I've been a fan since I got hooked on Portland Wrestling as a kid in the late '70s) I'm looking for a bit of advice. User:Kevin Hotfury has been wanting to create a page on the tag team of Billy Kidman and Rey Mysterio, Jr. When he created the first version, I prod-tagged it because these two are better known as singles, as per the precedents I've seen before. After some discussion he blanked it and it was G7-speedied, but he wants to try again and recreate the article. If I was right the first time, can I get some help in dissuading him from wasting his time on an article that will only get deleted? If I was wrong, then where do y'all draw the line on such "temporary" tag teams? -- Finngall talk 01:16, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
This fits in with the issue discussed here [3], the Rey and Billy stuff can be covered within the Filthy Animals article, much like the Radicalz and Horsemen articles covered Benoit tagging with Malenko and Guerrero. There is no need for the re-creation of an already deleted article. Darrenhusted 02:09, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I realize that some tags are necessary for certain articles. However, this one I found funny:
AND STOP CHANGING THE DRAFT TABLE PLEASE!!!
Seriously folks, that screams elitism. This should only be used for enforcing normal guidlines, and not for enforcing your own personal beliefs as rules. Mshake3 01:50, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
The hidden tag on Mark yes that is how his name is spelt Calaway is particularly helpful. Darrenhusted 00:36, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
For the past couple of months a troll has been making socks and adding nonsense about all things relating to WWE and a brand of dolls called Bratz. This user has been adding outlandish statements that all revolve around World Wrestling Entertainment having some sort of partnership or involvement with the brand of dolls. See his sock cases at Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/216.83.121.194 and Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/216.83.121.194 (2nd). Oakster and I have been hunting down these socks in articles relating to Bratz. Recently however, one of his socks added something about WWE producing a movie based on the brand of dolls called Bratz the Movie. Well apparently some wrestling news sites saw this little bit of info...('cause they all know how reliable Wikipedia is)... and apparently thought this was true, so check out their update on WWE Films' news projects... [4]-- bulletproof 3:16 05:07, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Could somebody help move Talk:Mike 'The Miz' Mizanin to Talk:Mike Mizanin. A user moved the main article twice a while ago and only that was reverted back, not the talk page. I am not familiar with the moving procedure. - Deep Shadow 07:27, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
As some of you know, I and a few other PWians have been working on bringing all current WWE title history lists to featured list status, with the ultimate goal of making the whole group a featured topic. The one problem I see with this is that the subject presently has no lead article, which the criteria say, in no uncertain terms, an FTC needs to pass (current FTs with no lead article will be demoted on January 1 if the problem isn't rectified by then). So, does anyone have any idea what a good lead article for this subject would be? -- MarcK 09:49, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I like it. I have suggested notes on the talk page. Darrenhusted 23:15, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
This article is up for deletion. I have reviewed what is on the page and what could be added, I have added references and some links so far. But I know this article can be saved and can be a very good article. Certainly requires a lot more work. The first few people who voted for deletion of the article Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Martha_Hart I don't think has done enough research, scanning google of the results for her. There is so much room for improvement it should be an easy task. I hope some of you can help out, as I feel that Martha has more than enough notability to be on wikipedia. 14:54, 18 June 2007 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by govvy ( talk • contribs)
It was explained on TV that Angle just kind of "left with the title" after Sacrifice and came out with the title on Impact, causing Cornette to vacated the title. This could've happened with Sting as well, he could've just "left with the title". Plenty of wrestlers left with a championship but never declared an actual champion. IMO, this means this reign shouldn't be counted and it should be "Vacated" after Christian's reign. The World Heavyweight Championship (WWE) was vacated after a similar finish with Benoit-Edge-Triple H. BBoy
Getting a wisdom tooth pulled, so if you catch any JB socks in the act, could you either let User:One Night In Hackney know, or raise the issue on AN/I? Thanks, I'll try to check in, but usually they give you the good stuff when they pull teeth, so I may or may not CARE, even about JB ;) SirFozzie 06:12, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
I figured I should inform the members of this project of my latest personal project in case they have input, comments, ideas or may actually want to contribute to it themselves. I've had the Fozz'meister undelete the Heart of America Sports Attractions, also known as "Central States Wrestling" up until some time in the 1980s. The article was prodded and deleted a while ago but I think it deserves an article and I'm going to do my damndest to provide sources and establish notability.
There is a second "Central States Wrestling" promotion that's piggybacking on the page, a promotion that has nothing but the name in common with the original organization. I'm going to remove that content because I personally don't think it's notable and even if it IS notable it doesn't belong on an article under the name "Heart of America Sports Attractions".
Anyone who'd like to help with some sources on the classic Central States promotion or information to add feel free to drop by and add it. Thanks in advance MPJ-DK 07:04, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
How do you source a TV announcement? If all you've got to go with is an announcement on TV? can you "cite Monday Night Raw Eps. XX on June 18 or whatever? Just curious because the citation templates don't seem to be very "TV Friendly" MPJ-DK 14:07, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
If someone could make a small list of articles that Burntsauce has blanked due to BLP violations, I can try to go through it and source them. And by blanking by BLP, I mean like What he recently did to the Nick Dinsmore article. Either you can list them here or send them via my talk page. Thanks! — Moe ε 16:04, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
I went through his conrtibs and listed anything I recognised as a wrestler bio, but that was 24 hours ago and he blanked 100 a day so I may take another look. And he hasn't marked up the stubbed articles with PW Bio Stub templates when stubbing has taken place, so how are we meant to know? Darrenhusted 01:29, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I just sourced Stacy Keibler, so if he were to blank it again it would be vandalism, and he can be reported.
I will try to work on Jerry Lawler tomorrow or the next day, unless anybody else would like to do so. Kris 01:59, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
This was just posted on the talk page at Professional wrestling aerial techniques: Anything not sourced within one week will be removed, in line with non-negotiable Wikipedia policies. Thanks. One Night In Hackney303 18:03, 19 June 2007 (UTC). What policy is he talking about? I've been sourcing, but it is a slow process...and I don't want to lose the majority of the article. Nikki311 22:13, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
The article has beaten 2 AfDs, the last one of which Hack kept saying "add sources", so now that you are (and the page looks better than it did at the last AfD) I don't think he can impose a deadline, worst he can do is PROD, we remove, and we're off on another AfD. The good point being that is has improved since the last AfD so I don't think it could lose. Darrenhusted 01:37, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Movie plots are not sourced. Maybe we could do the same things with these moves, and use the shows and PPVs they are on as sources? Also, I don't think he has the authority to blank any pages, let alone set guidlines. He is threatening to vandalize the page, breaking Wikipedia IAR. Someone report him to an admin for vandalism. Kris 02:01, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
(unindent) The question is not one of WP:V, surely it's the application of a time limit which is the problem, ONIH was giving the project a week to source on article before he stubs it, and I don't think it's a small coincidence that he nominated the article for AfD the second time. Personally I think ONIH should recuse himself from this article because in some editors eyes the AfD loss could be seen as his reason for wanting to stub the article. If he feels that the article doesn't come up to scratch then he should AfD it again, but to put an artificial deadline on the project is not really fair and could be seen as sour grapes from the last AfD. Darrenhusted 21:51, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
You're right, I voted keep, but what I have done this week is round up thirty articles for an AfD you said you were too busy to do [8] [9]. Darrenhusted 22:19, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Was planning on doing some work on Full Impact Pro when I can across Chasyn Rance’s terrifically done article. Since then I have been going through Category:American professional wrestlers and have come up with a (rather long) list that I want others to look at before I do anything with the articles.
Basically non notable wrestler (delete)
Feel they aren’t notable, but will let others decide (also, some of them I just wanted to point out)
That’s all for now. Nenog 05:34, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Prod them all, unless notability noted by someone in the discussion. Most, if not all, seem un-important to me. Nikki311 01:41, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Have another to add, don't know how I missed it earlier: Caprice Coleman – worked for NWA Wildside, wrestled five easily forgettable matches in ROH (winning only one at Do or Die II), and wrestled a few squash matches in WWE. Another one I am extremely tempted to add is Shane Hagadorn as he hasn't really done anything notable yet. He was trained by CM Punk and is a former student of the ROH wrestling school (not notable), held the ROH Top of the Class Trophy (a non notable title), and is the "manservant" of Adam Pearce (not notable). Nenog 03:47, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Starting tomorrow, I will begin Prod-ing the articles. So far, the only ones that have been objected to (and thus I will not Prod) are: Alan Funk, Cody Michaels, Jeff Warner, Karl Moffat, Larry Sharpe, Malia Hosaka, Maxx Muscle, Metal Maniac, Ray Gunkel, Reggie Bennett, Ric Converse, Steve Rizzono, Ultramantis Black, William Jones (wrestler), and Youth Suicide. If anyone has any more objections, please list them under here. Nenog 04:39, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
The thing I want to point out, is that some titles get one article despite how many promotions it's travelled through, and some titles get a different article, per promotion it was in at the time.
Examples:
The
WWE United States Championship has been though, NWA, WCW, & now WWE. It only has one page.
While the
NWA World Tag Team Championship (Mid Atlantic version) and the
WCW World Tag Team Championship are the exact same title, but were in different promotions at different times.
So which way are we doing this? --- Silent RAGE! 10:29, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Actually, TJ, that's a poor example. Let's just say for a second for the sake of argument, that the WCW and NWA Tag titles are different. That specific NWA Tag title did NOT continue after WCW and NWA parted ways. Where as in your example, the NWA world title did continue after parting ways with TNA. But I'm just nit-picking here. :P Anyways, I'm almost 100% sure that the NWA (Mid Atlantic) Tag titles did become, and are the WCW Tag titles. Just as what happened with the US Title, just as what happened with the WCW TV title. --- Silent RAGE! 14:17, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Alright I did it. It's kinda sloppy, but done. Now somebody just has to do the WCW Television Championship, I think. --- Silent RAGE! 18:21, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Looking at an article like Hell in a Cell, I noticed that the whole thing was just match summaries with no references, and having seen episodes discussed as a reference for TV shows I have decided to try PPVs as references for this article. Under Season I have gone with years as seasons (so The Wrestling Classic and WrestleMania in 1985 are season 1 of the WWF/WWE PPVs). If this is acceptable then we may have a way to reference Bios and Match types (Elimination Chamber springs to mind, but there are others), other than WWE.com. Darrenhusted 12:33, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
As many know, the WWF/WWE Light Heavyweight Title has been around for a lot longer than the WWE's claim of 1997. The early title reigns were recognized by the Universal Wrestling Association and the title was defended in both Japan and Mexico before becoming part of the J-Crown in 1996. The titles article, as well as the list of champions for this title all recognize the earlier reigns, and acknowledge the WWE's lack of recognition...even still, a couple of editors (one anonymous one) are wanting to go through and remove the title reign from certain wrestlers bios because the WWE doesn't recognize it. I would agree that it should be listed under a UWA title reign and now a WWF/WWE title reign, but I don't believe the history should be blanked because the WWE doesn't recognize it. We aren't talking about a disputed title change...we are talking about the entire history of the title over a 16+ year time period. - T-75| talk| contribs 15:58, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I gotta say Odin the consensus is one of silence on this matter, if no other editors are taking the reigns out then you have to assume that they are fine being left in the articles. If you want we can put this to a vote because I don't want you and Theo edit warring over twenty different articles. Darrenhusted 23:17, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Why is it REQUIRED that on PPV articles, the matches are listed in order of announcement? It should be in order of deemed importance in anyone's opinion. Mshake3 16:42, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
They are listed in the order they happen after the PPV has happened, this is a non-issue. Darrenhusted 17:50, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
To me it looks like a situation where we have, logically, just listed matches as they were announced, and then after the PPV airs sorted them in to the order the matches have taken place. And again Mshake3 wants to do it differently, personally until the PPV airs I don't care how they are listed, but once the PPV has aired then they naturally get sorted in to order, so for the sake of three weeks of each month, I don't care. List them how they are announced, list them alphabetically, list them by title, list them randomly, it doesn't matter so long as post-PPV they are in card order. Darrenhusted 21:44, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Since my followup in the previous thread apparently got lost in the shuffle: The same user ( Kevin Hotfury) has now created Edge and Rey Mysterio, which seems even more dubious than the previously-reported Billy Kidman and Rey Mysterio, Jr. article.
Seems to me like this is another classic case of an enthusiastic new editor who needs some guidance on The Way Things Work Around HereTM. I've probably badgered this guy enough on my own--can someone else here please take a moment to send a few more clues his way? Thanks again. -- Finngall talk 19:46, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Someone's created an article on the "federal agent" involved in the Vince McMahon storyline. I haven't a clue how to handle this as there's no sources to determine fact from fiction (at this point I'm presuming he's a hired actor like Thea Vidale as there's nothing reported about any developmental talent used). Shall I just prod this or what? -- Oakster Talk 20:27, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I've been going through some of the wrestling articles lately and came upon the History of World Championship Wrestling earlier today. Is it ready to be put forth as a good article candidate? It's very well sourced. Nikki311 20:40, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Are there no thoughts on this? I want there to be some sort of consensus before I nominate it. That way if someone thinks they can improve it first, they'll have a chance. Nikki311 19:30, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
A new IP has made another batch of changes to wrestlers' height data. Some have already been reverted; I'm going after the rest. -- Finngall talk 02:36, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Report it as a possible sock puppet of Jordan Brice [11]. Darrenhusted 12:53, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
There is an unregistered user on the Shark Boy page trying to keep all unreferenced moves off the page. I commend his efforts in referencing moves, but he is deleting anything without an internet reference, including the description for a move that he could only find a reference for the name. Now, is he in the right here? Or is him doing a move several times on a television program enough of a reference? I'm confused as to how this should be resolved on that particular page. Sevenzeroone says: Poopy is not fun! 02:51, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Would it be an idea to have a championship box for the current active WWE titles wherein a holder can be listed in a box, with the preceding and following holders listed, I give you an example from the Billboard 100 [12]. And then if people have multiple reigns they can be combined in to one big box such as here [13], scroll down to the bottom of the page. Any thoughts? Darrenhusted 12:51, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
No. For some ungodly reason, the WCW Cruiserweight and the WCW Light-Heavyweight titles are considered one in the same. I know that WWE considers it as such, but why do WE have to? WCW never considered them to be the same title, and neither does Wrestling-Titles.com. I'm also pretty sure that Wikipedia used to have separate articles per title. --- Silent RAGE! 14:25, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Can someone do me a favor and AfD Chad Patton for me? I prod'ed it (it would have been deleted today) but the prod was removed without improvement. The article is about a non-notable ref anyway. I'm just not sure how to AfD, and I don't want to do it wrong. Maybe we should look into protecting the page from recreation. According to its log, the article has already been deleted four times. Chad Patton ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
Thanks. Nikki311 19:21, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Some anon IP address [14], most likely JB (he has done this before) has called Burntsauce's attention to Iron Sheik and Warrior pages, so don't be surprised if the usual stubbing and protecting act happens to them. Darrenhusted 21:18, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
If I was "banned," I probably wouldn't have been able to remove mass (unsourced) content from more than one wrestling articles earlier today, now would I? 222.237.5.171 00:42, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
I sourced Sheiky, I will try to get Warrior and Lawler tomorrow. Kris 22:56, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Having searched the terms ”Wrestling wrestler” to get a list of wrestling related articles on Wikipedia I’ve found the following I think doesn’t quite fulfill WP:N
AFD’ed
Phoenix Championship Wrestling & title pages
Prod’d
Krysta Lynn Scott,
Mike Tatum,
Mario Galvan Jaramillo,
Tony Salantri,
Shag Thomas,
Chet Jablonski,
Tommy Jammer,
Mike Hughes,
Barry Houston,
Vanessa Kraven,
Eddie Osbourne,
Rick Fuller,
Ken Jugan,
Cousin Elmer,
Marc Blondin,
Andy Baker,
Justin White,
Taylor Matheny,
Flyin Ryan Mitchell,
Steve Madison,
Mad Man Manson,
The Flatliner
If you think there is something notable about them feel free to provide sources to prove it, improve the articles or whatever. MPJ-DK 08:16, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
Why exactly should they stay or go? I'm in reference to any tagline: the PPV event ones, and the match ones. In my opinion (as I've stated before): either all stay, or all go. Frankly, it doesn't matter to me. But it should be consistent. To always list the event tagline, and not allow the match taglines: is a bit hypocritical. Both serve the same purpose: to promote. A small number of editors always remove the match taglines with no good reason. The only reason they usually give is "non-notable" or they simply don't even give a reason. Just because you hate it, doesn't mean you should be removing it with no discussion or no consensus whatsoever. Hopefully this ends this debate already. RobJ1981 21:25, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
Right, so WMXV was "The Ragin' Climax", that is evident from the poster, and thus the poster is the source, but for match taglines where is the source would be my question? If the information can be sourced then it should be kept, if it can't be sourced, and an editor keeps adding it without a source then it is vandalism. I don't think a vote is needed, just follow policy. Darrenhusted 13:09, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
The bundle was causing problems at Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Shane_Hagadorn, so now feast your eyes on these Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kevin Northcutt, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Krysta Lynn Scott, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Glen Osbourne, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tony Rumble, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Short Sleeve Sampson, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jake Milliman, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ron Hutchinson, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steve Madison, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steve Bradley, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chet Jablonski, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Rick Fuller, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mario Galvan Jaramillo, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vanessa Kraven, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tamie Sheffield, and look in to your heart and vote/comment where needed. Darrenhusted 01:05, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
I can't help but wonder if this guy is a sock of that Jason Barber guy, because he came out of nowhere and started citing all sorts of policy, which most new users know nothing about. -- Scorpion 0422 22:02, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
Ummm, has anyone else noticed this? I see it is mentioned here too. - Deep Shadow 13:33, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
Just to let you know (as well as reminder for a watch on the article) that Chris Benoit and his family have passed away. I don't know what to say about this right now. :( -- Oakster Talk 22:55, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
Guys, Benoit's death (and yes, it's confirmed) is a major freakin story. the PW folks should be vigilant on his article. It's already semi-protected, but if the edit war continues, it's gonna be full protected. Can you guys lead the way with insisting on RELIABLY SOURCED information (you guys should know that the Torch/1wrestling etcetera are NOT RS).. and making sure the information is correct? I'll work it as long as I can, but I'm already starting to wipe out (today was my first day at a new position at work).. so I won't be able to shepherd the article for very long. SirFozzie 23:34, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
We should also keep an eye on Nancy Daus, as there has been some vandalism there too. I am off to watch Raw, so if a couple of people could watch it, it would be much appreciated. -- Scorpion 0422 23:56, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
TSN.ca is now reporting on Benoit's death. [17] -- Scorpion 0422 00:15, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
Instead of starting a new topic in here about the Benoit tragedies, I will post it here: what articles should and should it not be included in? Specifically, I am talk about CM Punk (and his scheduled match against Benoit this past Sunday). After Nitro replaced Benoit, it was reported in the article (as it should have been). It was later added that this change was for an " unexplained reason", then it was changed to Benoit missed the show " due to a family emergency" (which the WWE said), then changed to " a family emergency (killing his family)". The "(killing his family)" part was then removed, followed next by the removal of the family emergency excess. Not long after, the murder/suicide information was again put back in. Now then, the information of about the Benoit murder/suicide was also put in Nitro's article, and then later removed. Now then, my question is exactly how important do other people feel it is to report the murder/suicide in these two articles? I'll be honest, I was fine with just "Benoit was later replaced by Nitro", but thats just me. I don't want to remove the stuff if I'm the only one who doesn't think it is absolutely 100% necessary while everyone else feels it is. Nenog 08:04, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
I was reading an [ article on Foxnews associated with the Benoit incident] about deaths of pro wrestlers and it listed some sources. I thought they might be useful for various articles, here is a list:
[source: USA Today: Wrestling deaths and steroids; 3/12/04; http://www.usatoday.com/sports/2004-03-12-wrestling-list_x.htm;]
[source: Official Site of the Von Erich Family // http://www.vonerich.com/Bios.html]
[source: Despite the deaths of five of her six sons, the matriarch of the Von Erich wrestling family finds hope in living and faith in God // 18 April 1993 // The Dallas Morning News]
[source: LOCKER ROOM MYSTERY THERE'S STILL UNCERTAINTY OVER THE STABBING DEATH OF BRUISER BRODY // 15 December 2000 // Orlando Sentinel]
[source: THE MIGHTY HAVE FALLEN ALONG ROAD TO FAME, FORTUNE // 28 January 2000 // Orlando Sentinel]
[source: brian pillman memorial; Linebacker/wrestler is remembered // 30 May 2000 // The Cincinnati Post]
[source: WRESTLERS LURED TO RISKY DRUGS Ring fan doc prescribed illegally, says complaint // 3 March 2000 // New York Daily News]
[source: Wrestler on Steroid Therapy/The Droz fractured Neck During Match //
Houston Chronicle // 10/8/99]
[source: Girlfriend Gurgling, Wrestler Told 911 // Atlanta Journal Constitution // 5/8/03]
[source: Lugar Charged with Felony Drug Possession // The Post Standard // 5/12/03]
[source: Guerrero was heart Disease Victim // Star Tribune // 12/9/05]
[source: WWF Wrestler Owen Hart dies in Fall // Orlando Sentinel // 5/24/96]
I don't know where this came from, but do we need it? It's nothing but superscripting a link to the kayfabe article. I personally think it looks bad superscripted and just pulled it out of the Johnny Nitro article a few times, more because it was placed in the wrong place (after things, instead of before them).«» bd( talk stalk) 16:42, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
An image or media file that you uploaded or altered, Image:Wwelogo.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Images and media for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Hornetman 16 05:42, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Why are we now including who's on a DVD cover in PPV articles? Mshake3 20:03, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
What is to be done about this article? A user came along and just removed the prod tag, and its the only one from that recent prod batch that didn't get dealt with (basically all of them were deleted, except one which was considered notable). I've taken a look at the article and i deem it should go down with the rest..... -- SteelersFan UK06 02:36, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Harold Hoag is up for deletion, and joins Tony Stetson, Tony Jones, Mike Hughes, Alex Porteau, Chasyn Rance, Ultramantis Black and Chuck Taylor some of whom were de-PROD-ed during the last five days, and Ron Forest who seems like a hoax. Darrenhusted 11:03, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
(unindent) Articles are being deleted because in the main they should never have been created in the first place. This is an encyclopedia, not a fansite. Darrenhusted 16:16, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Why not create a Infobox for the championships containing information like:
What ya think?-- Hornetman16 18:30, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
(to get the code go to: User:Hornetman16/Sandbox/Infobox championship)
I like both the idea, and the design of the box. Peace, The Hybrid 01:02, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Lets get some made up and placed in the relevant pages. Darrenhusted 01:05, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I like them, too. The only thing I would change is "when won", "when created", and "when aired" to "date won", "date created", and "date aired". Nikki311 02:06, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I think the original format is more consistent with the existing project templates and I don't believe that it is too big either (they are not really any bigger than other info boxes. That being said, I like the tables that MarcK did, and think it would look good incorporating some of the info in those tables into the info box. I think we can probably come up with a good compromise here. - T-75| talk| contribs 22:04, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
LETS TAKE A VOTE: vote a or b for the one you like NOTE:the fields would be the same on both
a)
template:Infobox championship
b)
User:Hornetman16/Sandbox/Infobox championship
A section was started on the main project page to list articles that need references so people can try to focus on them when they have the time. Obviously, there are a lot of them, and the list dares to get out of hand and soon. Is there somewhere else we can list them? Possibly create a template like the bio-stub template to make it easier?«» bd( talk stalk) 19:43, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Ladies and gentlemen of the Pro Wrestling project, if I may draw your attention to the Main Page specifically the ”Did you know” box you will see the following.
”...that the professional wrestling promotion International Championship Wrestling was owned and operated by Angelo Poffo, father of wrestling legend Randy Savage, and starred Randy Savage and his brother Lanny Poffo?”
Referring to the International Championship Wrestling Article I created recently *victory lap* How often do wrestling articles get exposure on the front page? :) MPJ-DK 23:09, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I have nominated IWS for deletion, along with Manny Elefthriou, The Arsenal and El Generico, all of whom seem to form a small garden. The IWS article in particular lists well known wrestlers but their appearance or association with IWS is not mentioned (eg...run by the Former Backstreet Boyz Johnny Kashmere and Michael Verde aka Trent Acid... and yet Trent Acid's page does not mention IWS). And every wrestler is listed as WRESTLER aka REAL NAME or vice versa. I don't know what to make of it and it's only defenders are its creator, DanZero (who wants to save all AfDs) and Callelinea (who has been posting keep to be pointy). Can someone give these the once over? Darrenhusted 14:30, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
So, a bio in German does not count? And why not? Kris 02:52, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 20 | ← | Archive 22 | Archive 23 | Archive 24 | Archive 25 | Archive 26 | → | Archive 30 |
I have read through almost all of the real heavy sections of this talk page and have come to a conclusion, WTF is wrong with Wikipedia?
1. WWE Vengeance has been noted on every ocasion as the night of champions and that all the titles will be defended. Why can't we include all the champions and TBA? Its gonna happen. Some say, What if someone gets injured, well my answer based on WWE would be that injured wrestlers get stripped of their title. So at Vengeance, if Santino gets injured, fired, or dies then the title will be put up for a match to determine a new champion. It is not crystal ballig when something is annouced. It is however a double standard to put on Boxing articles that card is subject to change but when it comes to a WWE event we can't say that. WTF?
2. Separating articles like Vince and Mr. McMahon is wrong but mentioning his death as a major event is wrong too. WTF?
3. Annouced matches in articles is wrong but leaving out matches like Cena vs HHH at WM 22 is ok. That match was the main event of the biggest show in WWE and it is not notable that is not fair. WTF?
4. Wikipedia talks a heavy game about the rules and stuff people can't do but the tag line of wikipedia is that any one can edit an article. But that seems that guys like TJ Spke, bulletproof and Deep Shadow want to own wikipedia so that everything they say is right. WTF?
5. WWE, is it or is it not a reliable source for information? It adhears to kayfabe but it does not adhere to kayfabe. Case in point McMahons death and Sherri Martel's death. Some articles state that Jericho and Benoit have won the WWE Championship numerous times but WWE strkie them from the record so we can't add them. But when it comes to Ric Flair, on the NWA Championship list, they have him in there for four extra reigns but NWA does not recognize them and we put them in there anyway. WTF?
6. A wikipedia policy is that annouced matches can't be added to articles until they have happened and if they are notable. That means that we can't add the Royal Fucking Rumble to the Royal Fucking Rumble's page. That makes no fucking sense.
In the end Wikipedia has to many transparent rules that vets seem to take advantage of. They only adhere to the rules that they agree with and if they don't agree with something they try to get it changed to their liking. The people who are allowed to put blocks on pages are the main ones that make the rules and get others banned. They give people strikes and revert things to what they want them. We need better rules, and if we need to vote on some then we will have to.
Something has to be done about all these problems. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.247.21.121 ( talk • contribs)
OK, as one who seems to be on the other side of the WTF debate.
1. This is not WP:Boxing, boxing (to my knowledge) is not worked, and when they announce a card it is legit, when WWE announces "all titles are on the line" this does not mean it is so, the whole Punjabi Prison match nonsense shows that. Also the poster for Vengeance shows Bobby Lashley holding an ECW title, which he now does not have.
2. Vince's "death" has brought up a problem which has existed but not on this level, did he really have an affair with Trish? No, but Mr McMahon did. Does this require a separation of his article? Probably not, because his off screen activities can be summed up in a couple of sentences.
3. I have no idea what is going on with the WM22 article, but if there is a match missing then just add it, if you can find a source, and stop WTF-ing this talk page.
4. Read the about Wikipedia page, it explains that although anyone can edit there are rules, if you want try editing Jimbo's user page and count the seconds before your edit is reverted. And if you want look at the front page of this project, without sources the project as a whole gets reamed, look at Rico's page as an example.
5. I have a book which list champions of the WWE, Jericho and Benoit have been champion once each, the whole HHH/Y2J Earl Hebner wipe it from the records angle is why this is not a project about boxing.
6. And you are right, you can't add the Royal Rumble to the RR08 article because we are in fucking June, and WWE might go out of business in December. As for Vengeance the PPV is in 14 days, on RAW I expect the IC and Tag titles will be announcec and then ECW and SD is taped and they will announce the Tag and ECW titles, just be patient.
And if you feel this is such a big problem then get a username and join the project, it is a lot easier to change something from the inside than sit on the outside complaining. On top of that you have already asked a whole bunch of questions at [1], to which you did not respond. Darrenhusted 12:47, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I just now decided to read this talk section and was very surprised to see my name mentioned. Why do you think I want to own Wikipedia? If it's because you're referring to the whole "Good faith vandal" debate, I feel you may have been manipulated by that user's phrasing. They removed a very large chunk of information from the article and tried to turn it into something it's not. I reverted it because that user didn't have consensus to make a change so drastic. It's one of the fundamental rules of Wikipedia.
“ | Wikipedia works by building consensus. Consensus is an inherent part of the wiki process. The basic process works like this: someone makes an edit to a page, and then everyone who reads the page makes a decision to either leave the page as it is or change it. Over time, every edit that remains on a page, in a sense, has the unanimous approval of the community (or at least everyone who has looked at the page). "Silence equals consent" is the ultimate measure of consensus — somebody makes an edit and nobody objects or changes it. Most of the time consensus is reached as a natural product of the editing process. | ” |
Those are the rules I follow, not create. I honestly believe no major changes should be undertaken unless the matter has been thoroughly discussed and has reached a decision that makes everybody happy.
To addess a few of your other points:
Alright I need the input from editors more experienced than myself, I recently AFD'ed the article for Chris Knight (Professional Wrestler) as seen In his AFD but now less than a day after it was deleted the article has been recreated again without doing anything to address the issues brought up in the AFD. It's also been speedy deleted in late April/Early May as evident by his user talk page. I'd put it up for speedy deletion once againbut this guy'll recreate it once more since that seems to be his only contribution to wikipedia. Is there a way to stop this guy from Cruftying up Wikipedia with his own little pet vanity project? MPJ-DK 15:29, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
It has now been discovered that La Parka Your Car is a sockpuppet of JB196. Does this mean we have to go over all the edits they made? Because they made thousands of edits and deleted a lot of content.
On a separate note, I highly suspect Candicesfan is a sockpuppet of Rawfannation due to this edit, this edit and this edit (I say "suspect" because I don't want to accuse) on Candice Michelle's talk page. Rawfannation101 is a banned editor according to this. - Deep Shadow 15:32, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
The UCW-Zero Tag Team Champions and the other 3 UCW-Zero titles have been put up for joint deletion since the "owner" of the article removed the prods without addressing the issues. I'll neutrally invite everyone to look over the AFD and vote however you're compelled to vote, heck I implore everyone to spend 10 minutes and check out ALL the AFDs listed at the top and vote to ensure that the process is done right. Thanks MPJ-DK 15:59, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I want to source up the gimmick match page, but I keep coming back to WWE.com. That could, conceivably, be construed as primary sourcing for some of the stuff and lead to someone tagging it down the line as being sourced from too few sources. I've tried using things like DDT Digest and Online World of Wrestling and finding examples of matches where they explain the rules during them, but it's not going well to this point. Any ideas?«» bd( talk stalk) 17:07, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
Be on the look out for User:Jordan brice (See his Contribs) This user continues to add "Real Height"s to Wrestlers' profiles without also adding a source. -- bulletproof 3:16 17:33, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
[2] Looks like he's back, certainly the same MO, alot of the same wrestlers, Edge, Hogan et cetera. Darrenhusted 16:18, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Could some of the PW guys make adding to and sourcing the Thomas Couch article (Tommy Rogers of the Fantastics) a priority? I rescued the article after a speedy deletion due to a BLP-related blanking, but it may not survive another PROD or Speedy because of the BLP-Blanking (which I am NOT going to undo). Be much appreciated. SirFozzie 17:58, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
I hate to be begging for votes, but I was wondering if a couple people would mind checking out the page and if they think it is worthy of FL status, voting in the page's FLC. It has been a candidate for 10 days and only has one vote. As well, MarcK, Oakster and myself are very close to getting the Active WWE Championship histories to being of Featured Topic quality - we just have 3 more pages to get promoted (World tag Team, Womens and ECW). -- Scorpion 0422 00:50, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Greetings. (I'm not a member of the project, but I've been a fan since I got hooked on Portland Wrestling as a kid in the late '70s) I'm looking for a bit of advice. User:Kevin Hotfury has been wanting to create a page on the tag team of Billy Kidman and Rey Mysterio, Jr. When he created the first version, I prod-tagged it because these two are better known as singles, as per the precedents I've seen before. After some discussion he blanked it and it was G7-speedied, but he wants to try again and recreate the article. If I was right the first time, can I get some help in dissuading him from wasting his time on an article that will only get deleted? If I was wrong, then where do y'all draw the line on such "temporary" tag teams? -- Finngall talk 01:16, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
This fits in with the issue discussed here [3], the Rey and Billy stuff can be covered within the Filthy Animals article, much like the Radicalz and Horsemen articles covered Benoit tagging with Malenko and Guerrero. There is no need for the re-creation of an already deleted article. Darrenhusted 02:09, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I realize that some tags are necessary for certain articles. However, this one I found funny:
AND STOP CHANGING THE DRAFT TABLE PLEASE!!!
Seriously folks, that screams elitism. This should only be used for enforcing normal guidlines, and not for enforcing your own personal beliefs as rules. Mshake3 01:50, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
The hidden tag on Mark yes that is how his name is spelt Calaway is particularly helpful. Darrenhusted 00:36, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
For the past couple of months a troll has been making socks and adding nonsense about all things relating to WWE and a brand of dolls called Bratz. This user has been adding outlandish statements that all revolve around World Wrestling Entertainment having some sort of partnership or involvement with the brand of dolls. See his sock cases at Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/216.83.121.194 and Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/216.83.121.194 (2nd). Oakster and I have been hunting down these socks in articles relating to Bratz. Recently however, one of his socks added something about WWE producing a movie based on the brand of dolls called Bratz the Movie. Well apparently some wrestling news sites saw this little bit of info...('cause they all know how reliable Wikipedia is)... and apparently thought this was true, so check out their update on WWE Films' news projects... [4]-- bulletproof 3:16 05:07, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Could somebody help move Talk:Mike 'The Miz' Mizanin to Talk:Mike Mizanin. A user moved the main article twice a while ago and only that was reverted back, not the talk page. I am not familiar with the moving procedure. - Deep Shadow 07:27, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
As some of you know, I and a few other PWians have been working on bringing all current WWE title history lists to featured list status, with the ultimate goal of making the whole group a featured topic. The one problem I see with this is that the subject presently has no lead article, which the criteria say, in no uncertain terms, an FTC needs to pass (current FTs with no lead article will be demoted on January 1 if the problem isn't rectified by then). So, does anyone have any idea what a good lead article for this subject would be? -- MarcK 09:49, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I like it. I have suggested notes on the talk page. Darrenhusted 23:15, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
This article is up for deletion. I have reviewed what is on the page and what could be added, I have added references and some links so far. But I know this article can be saved and can be a very good article. Certainly requires a lot more work. The first few people who voted for deletion of the article Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Martha_Hart I don't think has done enough research, scanning google of the results for her. There is so much room for improvement it should be an easy task. I hope some of you can help out, as I feel that Martha has more than enough notability to be on wikipedia. 14:54, 18 June 2007 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by govvy ( talk • contribs)
It was explained on TV that Angle just kind of "left with the title" after Sacrifice and came out with the title on Impact, causing Cornette to vacated the title. This could've happened with Sting as well, he could've just "left with the title". Plenty of wrestlers left with a championship but never declared an actual champion. IMO, this means this reign shouldn't be counted and it should be "Vacated" after Christian's reign. The World Heavyweight Championship (WWE) was vacated after a similar finish with Benoit-Edge-Triple H. BBoy
Getting a wisdom tooth pulled, so if you catch any JB socks in the act, could you either let User:One Night In Hackney know, or raise the issue on AN/I? Thanks, I'll try to check in, but usually they give you the good stuff when they pull teeth, so I may or may not CARE, even about JB ;) SirFozzie 06:12, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
I figured I should inform the members of this project of my latest personal project in case they have input, comments, ideas or may actually want to contribute to it themselves. I've had the Fozz'meister undelete the Heart of America Sports Attractions, also known as "Central States Wrestling" up until some time in the 1980s. The article was prodded and deleted a while ago but I think it deserves an article and I'm going to do my damndest to provide sources and establish notability.
There is a second "Central States Wrestling" promotion that's piggybacking on the page, a promotion that has nothing but the name in common with the original organization. I'm going to remove that content because I personally don't think it's notable and even if it IS notable it doesn't belong on an article under the name "Heart of America Sports Attractions".
Anyone who'd like to help with some sources on the classic Central States promotion or information to add feel free to drop by and add it. Thanks in advance MPJ-DK 07:04, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
How do you source a TV announcement? If all you've got to go with is an announcement on TV? can you "cite Monday Night Raw Eps. XX on June 18 or whatever? Just curious because the citation templates don't seem to be very "TV Friendly" MPJ-DK 14:07, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
If someone could make a small list of articles that Burntsauce has blanked due to BLP violations, I can try to go through it and source them. And by blanking by BLP, I mean like What he recently did to the Nick Dinsmore article. Either you can list them here or send them via my talk page. Thanks! — Moe ε 16:04, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
I went through his conrtibs and listed anything I recognised as a wrestler bio, but that was 24 hours ago and he blanked 100 a day so I may take another look. And he hasn't marked up the stubbed articles with PW Bio Stub templates when stubbing has taken place, so how are we meant to know? Darrenhusted 01:29, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I just sourced Stacy Keibler, so if he were to blank it again it would be vandalism, and he can be reported.
I will try to work on Jerry Lawler tomorrow or the next day, unless anybody else would like to do so. Kris 01:59, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
This was just posted on the talk page at Professional wrestling aerial techniques: Anything not sourced within one week will be removed, in line with non-negotiable Wikipedia policies. Thanks. One Night In Hackney303 18:03, 19 June 2007 (UTC). What policy is he talking about? I've been sourcing, but it is a slow process...and I don't want to lose the majority of the article. Nikki311 22:13, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
The article has beaten 2 AfDs, the last one of which Hack kept saying "add sources", so now that you are (and the page looks better than it did at the last AfD) I don't think he can impose a deadline, worst he can do is PROD, we remove, and we're off on another AfD. The good point being that is has improved since the last AfD so I don't think it could lose. Darrenhusted 01:37, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Movie plots are not sourced. Maybe we could do the same things with these moves, and use the shows and PPVs they are on as sources? Also, I don't think he has the authority to blank any pages, let alone set guidlines. He is threatening to vandalize the page, breaking Wikipedia IAR. Someone report him to an admin for vandalism. Kris 02:01, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
(unindent) The question is not one of WP:V, surely it's the application of a time limit which is the problem, ONIH was giving the project a week to source on article before he stubs it, and I don't think it's a small coincidence that he nominated the article for AfD the second time. Personally I think ONIH should recuse himself from this article because in some editors eyes the AfD loss could be seen as his reason for wanting to stub the article. If he feels that the article doesn't come up to scratch then he should AfD it again, but to put an artificial deadline on the project is not really fair and could be seen as sour grapes from the last AfD. Darrenhusted 21:51, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
You're right, I voted keep, but what I have done this week is round up thirty articles for an AfD you said you were too busy to do [8] [9]. Darrenhusted 22:19, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Was planning on doing some work on Full Impact Pro when I can across Chasyn Rance’s terrifically done article. Since then I have been going through Category:American professional wrestlers and have come up with a (rather long) list that I want others to look at before I do anything with the articles.
Basically non notable wrestler (delete)
Feel they aren’t notable, but will let others decide (also, some of them I just wanted to point out)
That’s all for now. Nenog 05:34, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Prod them all, unless notability noted by someone in the discussion. Most, if not all, seem un-important to me. Nikki311 01:41, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Have another to add, don't know how I missed it earlier: Caprice Coleman – worked for NWA Wildside, wrestled five easily forgettable matches in ROH (winning only one at Do or Die II), and wrestled a few squash matches in WWE. Another one I am extremely tempted to add is Shane Hagadorn as he hasn't really done anything notable yet. He was trained by CM Punk and is a former student of the ROH wrestling school (not notable), held the ROH Top of the Class Trophy (a non notable title), and is the "manservant" of Adam Pearce (not notable). Nenog 03:47, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Starting tomorrow, I will begin Prod-ing the articles. So far, the only ones that have been objected to (and thus I will not Prod) are: Alan Funk, Cody Michaels, Jeff Warner, Karl Moffat, Larry Sharpe, Malia Hosaka, Maxx Muscle, Metal Maniac, Ray Gunkel, Reggie Bennett, Ric Converse, Steve Rizzono, Ultramantis Black, William Jones (wrestler), and Youth Suicide. If anyone has any more objections, please list them under here. Nenog 04:39, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
The thing I want to point out, is that some titles get one article despite how many promotions it's travelled through, and some titles get a different article, per promotion it was in at the time.
Examples:
The
WWE United States Championship has been though, NWA, WCW, & now WWE. It only has one page.
While the
NWA World Tag Team Championship (Mid Atlantic version) and the
WCW World Tag Team Championship are the exact same title, but were in different promotions at different times.
So which way are we doing this? --- Silent RAGE! 10:29, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Actually, TJ, that's a poor example. Let's just say for a second for the sake of argument, that the WCW and NWA Tag titles are different. That specific NWA Tag title did NOT continue after WCW and NWA parted ways. Where as in your example, the NWA world title did continue after parting ways with TNA. But I'm just nit-picking here. :P Anyways, I'm almost 100% sure that the NWA (Mid Atlantic) Tag titles did become, and are the WCW Tag titles. Just as what happened with the US Title, just as what happened with the WCW TV title. --- Silent RAGE! 14:17, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Alright I did it. It's kinda sloppy, but done. Now somebody just has to do the WCW Television Championship, I think. --- Silent RAGE! 18:21, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Looking at an article like Hell in a Cell, I noticed that the whole thing was just match summaries with no references, and having seen episodes discussed as a reference for TV shows I have decided to try PPVs as references for this article. Under Season I have gone with years as seasons (so The Wrestling Classic and WrestleMania in 1985 are season 1 of the WWF/WWE PPVs). If this is acceptable then we may have a way to reference Bios and Match types (Elimination Chamber springs to mind, but there are others), other than WWE.com. Darrenhusted 12:33, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
As many know, the WWF/WWE Light Heavyweight Title has been around for a lot longer than the WWE's claim of 1997. The early title reigns were recognized by the Universal Wrestling Association and the title was defended in both Japan and Mexico before becoming part of the J-Crown in 1996. The titles article, as well as the list of champions for this title all recognize the earlier reigns, and acknowledge the WWE's lack of recognition...even still, a couple of editors (one anonymous one) are wanting to go through and remove the title reign from certain wrestlers bios because the WWE doesn't recognize it. I would agree that it should be listed under a UWA title reign and now a WWF/WWE title reign, but I don't believe the history should be blanked because the WWE doesn't recognize it. We aren't talking about a disputed title change...we are talking about the entire history of the title over a 16+ year time period. - T-75| talk| contribs 15:58, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I gotta say Odin the consensus is one of silence on this matter, if no other editors are taking the reigns out then you have to assume that they are fine being left in the articles. If you want we can put this to a vote because I don't want you and Theo edit warring over twenty different articles. Darrenhusted 23:17, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Why is it REQUIRED that on PPV articles, the matches are listed in order of announcement? It should be in order of deemed importance in anyone's opinion. Mshake3 16:42, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
They are listed in the order they happen after the PPV has happened, this is a non-issue. Darrenhusted 17:50, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
To me it looks like a situation where we have, logically, just listed matches as they were announced, and then after the PPV airs sorted them in to the order the matches have taken place. And again Mshake3 wants to do it differently, personally until the PPV airs I don't care how they are listed, but once the PPV has aired then they naturally get sorted in to order, so for the sake of three weeks of each month, I don't care. List them how they are announced, list them alphabetically, list them by title, list them randomly, it doesn't matter so long as post-PPV they are in card order. Darrenhusted 21:44, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Since my followup in the previous thread apparently got lost in the shuffle: The same user ( Kevin Hotfury) has now created Edge and Rey Mysterio, which seems even more dubious than the previously-reported Billy Kidman and Rey Mysterio, Jr. article.
Seems to me like this is another classic case of an enthusiastic new editor who needs some guidance on The Way Things Work Around HereTM. I've probably badgered this guy enough on my own--can someone else here please take a moment to send a few more clues his way? Thanks again. -- Finngall talk 19:46, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Someone's created an article on the "federal agent" involved in the Vince McMahon storyline. I haven't a clue how to handle this as there's no sources to determine fact from fiction (at this point I'm presuming he's a hired actor like Thea Vidale as there's nothing reported about any developmental talent used). Shall I just prod this or what? -- Oakster Talk 20:27, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I've been going through some of the wrestling articles lately and came upon the History of World Championship Wrestling earlier today. Is it ready to be put forth as a good article candidate? It's very well sourced. Nikki311 20:40, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Are there no thoughts on this? I want there to be some sort of consensus before I nominate it. That way if someone thinks they can improve it first, they'll have a chance. Nikki311 19:30, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
A new IP has made another batch of changes to wrestlers' height data. Some have already been reverted; I'm going after the rest. -- Finngall talk 02:36, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Report it as a possible sock puppet of Jordan Brice [11]. Darrenhusted 12:53, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
There is an unregistered user on the Shark Boy page trying to keep all unreferenced moves off the page. I commend his efforts in referencing moves, but he is deleting anything without an internet reference, including the description for a move that he could only find a reference for the name. Now, is he in the right here? Or is him doing a move several times on a television program enough of a reference? I'm confused as to how this should be resolved on that particular page. Sevenzeroone says: Poopy is not fun! 02:51, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Would it be an idea to have a championship box for the current active WWE titles wherein a holder can be listed in a box, with the preceding and following holders listed, I give you an example from the Billboard 100 [12]. And then if people have multiple reigns they can be combined in to one big box such as here [13], scroll down to the bottom of the page. Any thoughts? Darrenhusted 12:51, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
No. For some ungodly reason, the WCW Cruiserweight and the WCW Light-Heavyweight titles are considered one in the same. I know that WWE considers it as such, but why do WE have to? WCW never considered them to be the same title, and neither does Wrestling-Titles.com. I'm also pretty sure that Wikipedia used to have separate articles per title. --- Silent RAGE! 14:25, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Can someone do me a favor and AfD Chad Patton for me? I prod'ed it (it would have been deleted today) but the prod was removed without improvement. The article is about a non-notable ref anyway. I'm just not sure how to AfD, and I don't want to do it wrong. Maybe we should look into protecting the page from recreation. According to its log, the article has already been deleted four times. Chad Patton ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
Thanks. Nikki311 19:21, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Some anon IP address [14], most likely JB (he has done this before) has called Burntsauce's attention to Iron Sheik and Warrior pages, so don't be surprised if the usual stubbing and protecting act happens to them. Darrenhusted 21:18, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
If I was "banned," I probably wouldn't have been able to remove mass (unsourced) content from more than one wrestling articles earlier today, now would I? 222.237.5.171 00:42, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
I sourced Sheiky, I will try to get Warrior and Lawler tomorrow. Kris 22:56, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Having searched the terms ”Wrestling wrestler” to get a list of wrestling related articles on Wikipedia I’ve found the following I think doesn’t quite fulfill WP:N
AFD’ed
Phoenix Championship Wrestling & title pages
Prod’d
Krysta Lynn Scott,
Mike Tatum,
Mario Galvan Jaramillo,
Tony Salantri,
Shag Thomas,
Chet Jablonski,
Tommy Jammer,
Mike Hughes,
Barry Houston,
Vanessa Kraven,
Eddie Osbourne,
Rick Fuller,
Ken Jugan,
Cousin Elmer,
Marc Blondin,
Andy Baker,
Justin White,
Taylor Matheny,
Flyin Ryan Mitchell,
Steve Madison,
Mad Man Manson,
The Flatliner
If you think there is something notable about them feel free to provide sources to prove it, improve the articles or whatever. MPJ-DK 08:16, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
Why exactly should they stay or go? I'm in reference to any tagline: the PPV event ones, and the match ones. In my opinion (as I've stated before): either all stay, or all go. Frankly, it doesn't matter to me. But it should be consistent. To always list the event tagline, and not allow the match taglines: is a bit hypocritical. Both serve the same purpose: to promote. A small number of editors always remove the match taglines with no good reason. The only reason they usually give is "non-notable" or they simply don't even give a reason. Just because you hate it, doesn't mean you should be removing it with no discussion or no consensus whatsoever. Hopefully this ends this debate already. RobJ1981 21:25, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
Right, so WMXV was "The Ragin' Climax", that is evident from the poster, and thus the poster is the source, but for match taglines where is the source would be my question? If the information can be sourced then it should be kept, if it can't be sourced, and an editor keeps adding it without a source then it is vandalism. I don't think a vote is needed, just follow policy. Darrenhusted 13:09, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
The bundle was causing problems at Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Shane_Hagadorn, so now feast your eyes on these Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kevin Northcutt, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Krysta Lynn Scott, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Glen Osbourne, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tony Rumble, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Short Sleeve Sampson, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jake Milliman, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ron Hutchinson, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steve Madison, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steve Bradley, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chet Jablonski, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Rick Fuller, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mario Galvan Jaramillo, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vanessa Kraven, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tamie Sheffield, and look in to your heart and vote/comment where needed. Darrenhusted 01:05, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
I can't help but wonder if this guy is a sock of that Jason Barber guy, because he came out of nowhere and started citing all sorts of policy, which most new users know nothing about. -- Scorpion 0422 22:02, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
Ummm, has anyone else noticed this? I see it is mentioned here too. - Deep Shadow 13:33, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
Just to let you know (as well as reminder for a watch on the article) that Chris Benoit and his family have passed away. I don't know what to say about this right now. :( -- Oakster Talk 22:55, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
Guys, Benoit's death (and yes, it's confirmed) is a major freakin story. the PW folks should be vigilant on his article. It's already semi-protected, but if the edit war continues, it's gonna be full protected. Can you guys lead the way with insisting on RELIABLY SOURCED information (you guys should know that the Torch/1wrestling etcetera are NOT RS).. and making sure the information is correct? I'll work it as long as I can, but I'm already starting to wipe out (today was my first day at a new position at work).. so I won't be able to shepherd the article for very long. SirFozzie 23:34, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
We should also keep an eye on Nancy Daus, as there has been some vandalism there too. I am off to watch Raw, so if a couple of people could watch it, it would be much appreciated. -- Scorpion 0422 23:56, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
TSN.ca is now reporting on Benoit's death. [17] -- Scorpion 0422 00:15, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
Instead of starting a new topic in here about the Benoit tragedies, I will post it here: what articles should and should it not be included in? Specifically, I am talk about CM Punk (and his scheduled match against Benoit this past Sunday). After Nitro replaced Benoit, it was reported in the article (as it should have been). It was later added that this change was for an " unexplained reason", then it was changed to Benoit missed the show " due to a family emergency" (which the WWE said), then changed to " a family emergency (killing his family)". The "(killing his family)" part was then removed, followed next by the removal of the family emergency excess. Not long after, the murder/suicide information was again put back in. Now then, the information of about the Benoit murder/suicide was also put in Nitro's article, and then later removed. Now then, my question is exactly how important do other people feel it is to report the murder/suicide in these two articles? I'll be honest, I was fine with just "Benoit was later replaced by Nitro", but thats just me. I don't want to remove the stuff if I'm the only one who doesn't think it is absolutely 100% necessary while everyone else feels it is. Nenog 08:04, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
I was reading an [ article on Foxnews associated with the Benoit incident] about deaths of pro wrestlers and it listed some sources. I thought they might be useful for various articles, here is a list:
[source: USA Today: Wrestling deaths and steroids; 3/12/04; http://www.usatoday.com/sports/2004-03-12-wrestling-list_x.htm;]
[source: Official Site of the Von Erich Family // http://www.vonerich.com/Bios.html]
[source: Despite the deaths of five of her six sons, the matriarch of the Von Erich wrestling family finds hope in living and faith in God // 18 April 1993 // The Dallas Morning News]
[source: LOCKER ROOM MYSTERY THERE'S STILL UNCERTAINTY OVER THE STABBING DEATH OF BRUISER BRODY // 15 December 2000 // Orlando Sentinel]
[source: THE MIGHTY HAVE FALLEN ALONG ROAD TO FAME, FORTUNE // 28 January 2000 // Orlando Sentinel]
[source: brian pillman memorial; Linebacker/wrestler is remembered // 30 May 2000 // The Cincinnati Post]
[source: WRESTLERS LURED TO RISKY DRUGS Ring fan doc prescribed illegally, says complaint // 3 March 2000 // New York Daily News]
[source: Wrestler on Steroid Therapy/The Droz fractured Neck During Match //
Houston Chronicle // 10/8/99]
[source: Girlfriend Gurgling, Wrestler Told 911 // Atlanta Journal Constitution // 5/8/03]
[source: Lugar Charged with Felony Drug Possession // The Post Standard // 5/12/03]
[source: Guerrero was heart Disease Victim // Star Tribune // 12/9/05]
[source: WWF Wrestler Owen Hart dies in Fall // Orlando Sentinel // 5/24/96]
I don't know where this came from, but do we need it? It's nothing but superscripting a link to the kayfabe article. I personally think it looks bad superscripted and just pulled it out of the Johnny Nitro article a few times, more because it was placed in the wrong place (after things, instead of before them).«» bd( talk stalk) 16:42, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
An image or media file that you uploaded or altered, Image:Wwelogo.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Images and media for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Hornetman 16 05:42, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
Why are we now including who's on a DVD cover in PPV articles? Mshake3 20:03, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
What is to be done about this article? A user came along and just removed the prod tag, and its the only one from that recent prod batch that didn't get dealt with (basically all of them were deleted, except one which was considered notable). I've taken a look at the article and i deem it should go down with the rest..... -- SteelersFan UK06 02:36, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Harold Hoag is up for deletion, and joins Tony Stetson, Tony Jones, Mike Hughes, Alex Porteau, Chasyn Rance, Ultramantis Black and Chuck Taylor some of whom were de-PROD-ed during the last five days, and Ron Forest who seems like a hoax. Darrenhusted 11:03, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
(unindent) Articles are being deleted because in the main they should never have been created in the first place. This is an encyclopedia, not a fansite. Darrenhusted 16:16, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Why not create a Infobox for the championships containing information like:
What ya think?-- Hornetman16 18:30, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
(to get the code go to: User:Hornetman16/Sandbox/Infobox championship)
I like both the idea, and the design of the box. Peace, The Hybrid 01:02, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Lets get some made up and placed in the relevant pages. Darrenhusted 01:05, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I like them, too. The only thing I would change is "when won", "when created", and "when aired" to "date won", "date created", and "date aired". Nikki311 02:06, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I think the original format is more consistent with the existing project templates and I don't believe that it is too big either (they are not really any bigger than other info boxes. That being said, I like the tables that MarcK did, and think it would look good incorporating some of the info in those tables into the info box. I think we can probably come up with a good compromise here. - T-75| talk| contribs 22:04, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
LETS TAKE A VOTE: vote a or b for the one you like NOTE:the fields would be the same on both
a)
template:Infobox championship
b)
User:Hornetman16/Sandbox/Infobox championship
A section was started on the main project page to list articles that need references so people can try to focus on them when they have the time. Obviously, there are a lot of them, and the list dares to get out of hand and soon. Is there somewhere else we can list them? Possibly create a template like the bio-stub template to make it easier?«» bd( talk stalk) 19:43, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Ladies and gentlemen of the Pro Wrestling project, if I may draw your attention to the Main Page specifically the ”Did you know” box you will see the following.
”...that the professional wrestling promotion International Championship Wrestling was owned and operated by Angelo Poffo, father of wrestling legend Randy Savage, and starred Randy Savage and his brother Lanny Poffo?”
Referring to the International Championship Wrestling Article I created recently *victory lap* How often do wrestling articles get exposure on the front page? :) MPJ-DK 23:09, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I have nominated IWS for deletion, along with Manny Elefthriou, The Arsenal and El Generico, all of whom seem to form a small garden. The IWS article in particular lists well known wrestlers but their appearance or association with IWS is not mentioned (eg...run by the Former Backstreet Boyz Johnny Kashmere and Michael Verde aka Trent Acid... and yet Trent Acid's page does not mention IWS). And every wrestler is listed as WRESTLER aka REAL NAME or vice versa. I don't know what to make of it and it's only defenders are its creator, DanZero (who wants to save all AfDs) and Callelinea (who has been posting keep to be pointy). Can someone give these the once over? Darrenhusted 14:30, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
So, a bio in German does not count? And why not? Kris 02:52, 2 July 2007 (UTC)