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I'm going to refactor the layout a bit a here so it's easier to keep track of the suggestions and discussion. Voceditenore ( talk) 17:24, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Please suggest:
Selected article suggestions and comments:
1. Otello - first performed on February 5, 1887 (but.. not photo!)
2. Mazeppa - premiered 15 February 1884 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
3. Don Quichotte - premiered 19 February 1910 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
4. Esclarmonde - US premiere February 10, 1893 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
5. Pelléas et Mélisande - OotM January - Jay ( talk) 09:27, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
Composer suggestions and comments:
1. Felix Mendelssohn - 200th birthday
2. George Frideric Handel - born 23 February 1685 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
3. Gian Carlo Menotti - died February 1, 2007 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:23, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Singer suggestions and comments:
1. Renée Fleming or Renata Tebaldi - Born February but both articles have no photo, any suggestion?
2. Leontyne Price has public domain photo, born February 10, 1927 Voceditenore ( talk) 17:24, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
3. Adelina Patti has public domain photo, born February 10, 1927 Voceditenore ( talk) 17:24, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Selected picture suggestions and comments:
1. File:Giulio Cesare opera.PNG - from Giulio Cesare, premiere on February 20, 1724
2. File:Venedig Theater La Fenice.jpg - nothing to do with February per se but gorgeous photo. However, many operas had their premieres there in February or March, e.g. Semiramide Il crociato in Egitto, and Rigoletto (the latter a tie-in with the featured audio Voceditenore ( talk) 18:23, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Selected audios suggestions and comments: << Shoemaker's Holiday to fill this up>>
N.B. A round of applause to User:Dendodge for È scherzo!
Feel free to suggest and let me know before or on 29th Jan. Thanks - Jay ( talk) 10:55, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
For the article, would it be too indulgent of a subprject without a portal of its own to suggest W. S. Gilbert? Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 04:13, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
Re W. S. Gilbert. It's a brilliant article and can certainly go on an opera portal. If not used this time, we could always use it for April-May portal (died 29 May 1911). Having said that, I don't think we need to stick slavishly to month tie-ins. It's more important to have good articles out there. Voceditenore ( talk) 18:29, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
I've put up two suggestions for Verdi, I'll do some more. I suppose we have to include La donna e mobile? I don't have great recordings of it, but I can probably at least get something decent (after a similar amount of work as La fatal pietra took. Thank god my planned Otello work is much easier!) Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 13:14, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
If you have any more suggestions (or disagree with the list), please discuss about it before the 29th. I also need help from project members to expand "Opera news" section in the portal. User:Nrswanson has done a good job with DYK section, he updates it from time to time. - Jay ( talk) 14:43, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
[Unindent]I made eight audios because it's hard to evaluate something you've been working on for several hours. I can compare it to the original, see it's improved, but because I've listened to it so many times, I'm unlikely to be able to judge how bad any remaining flaws are, at least not until some time has passed. I fully support cutting them down to six; but I'd rather not drop to three while we're only updating once a month, simply because, with only one change every two months, and so many composers undone, it's going to be a long before we could use Verdi again, and, when we do, I'll be more encouraged to do work if I can't slack off by just grabbing three from the remaining five. Please do comment on the restorations: I'm not going to get better without criticism, and want to do this as well as I can.
P.S. Arthur Sullivan is fine with me, though I have worked extensively on it, so I'm hardly an unbiased source. =) It's probably Almost-FA, but we want to check a few more sources. Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 16:24, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Why is it that phrases like "I'm not sure I can do this objectively, maybe someone else should select" has repeatedly turned back into "Shoe, can you choose the things for us"? =P Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 01:06, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
Well, fair enough. It's just that I feel a bit uncomfortable judging my own work.
Set 1:
Set 2
On relistening, I think I can do better with the two I cut off if I come back in a while - they're just a bit tinned and over-cleaned to my ear. These ones are probably about as good as I can get, at least, given the quality of the originals.
I've tried to mix it up to keep a big concerted number in each, and also to make sure that each had a Caruso-free recording. Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 01:21, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
In the OP article titling guidelines under Operas: avoiding ambiguity. It says:
This has been taken to mean that the subsequent articles on operas of the same name have the composer added to remove the ambiguity. ( Otello was created in 2002 and Otello (Rossini) in 2005.)
Yesterday without any prior discussion here or on the article talk page, and contrary to the current guidelines, an editor summarily moved Zaira (opera) (so named to distinguish it from the stub article on Zaira as a given name) to Zaira (Bellini) stating only in the edit summary: "There exist different operas titled Zaira" This of course messed up the Bellini template, which the editor later changed, but she/he failed to refresh the Zaira (Bellini) page so it was producing a double re-direct. Likewise, the template in all the other Bellini opera articles was linking to the redirect. I've now gone through and refreshed them, so at least that problem is solved.
1. Are members happy with the new title? There do exist other Zaira operas by Peter Winter, Saverio Mercadante and Antonio Caldara, but apart from the Mercadante, there is very little information about them and none of them have articles. I am personally inclined to reverse the page move, but am reluctant do so without consensus.
2. Should we revise the guidelines to make them a little clearer? e.g. change:
3. Should we also include in the guidelines something to the effect that articles should not be moved to new titles without prior discussion on their talk page and that if in doubt about the desirability/feasibility of re-naming an article, the issue should be raised here?
Opinions please... Voceditenore ( talk) 10:14, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
I don’t think Nicholas Lens is an opera composer as much as I don’t think his works as opera. What do you guys think?
Thanks - Jay ( talk) 16:06, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
User talk:Robert.Allen wrote me a message, The booklet which comes with the Merlin recording says that the opera was finished on 25 April 1902. [p. 16, "Isaac Albéniz's elusive Grail" by Jacinto Torres. (Torres has cataloged Albéniz's works for musical theater.)] Further on p. 18 he states that Launcelot remains in unfinished form, while Guenevere was never written. You may want to modify the list to reflect this information. I think it should probably show "(1902)" as the date for Merlin and "(unfinished)" for Launcelot. I do not want to edit the template just yet because that is not what is written in Merlin. I asked User talk:Robert.Allen to join the discussion here or edit the article first, only then I will edit the template - Jay ( talk) 11:42, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
Is it just me, or is it now all oddly aligned with great swathes of purple? I think the problem may come from the images in the new Selected Article, and Featured Singer and Composer, especially the image in Pelleas. Would making them a bit smaller help? Voceditenore ( talk) 13:56, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 75 | ← | Archive 77 | Archive 78 | Archive 79 | Archive 80 | Archive 81 | → | Archive 85 |
I'm going to refactor the layout a bit a here so it's easier to keep track of the suggestions and discussion. Voceditenore ( talk) 17:24, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Please suggest:
Selected article suggestions and comments:
1. Otello - first performed on February 5, 1887 (but.. not photo!)
2. Mazeppa - premiered 15 February 1884 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
3. Don Quichotte - premiered 19 February 1910 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
4. Esclarmonde - US premiere February 10, 1893 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
5. Pelléas et Mélisande - OotM January - Jay ( talk) 09:27, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
Composer suggestions and comments:
1. Felix Mendelssohn - 200th birthday
2. George Frideric Handel - born 23 February 1685 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:00, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
3. Gian Carlo Menotti - died February 1, 2007 Voceditenore ( talk) 18:23, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Singer suggestions and comments:
1. Renée Fleming or Renata Tebaldi - Born February but both articles have no photo, any suggestion?
2. Leontyne Price has public domain photo, born February 10, 1927 Voceditenore ( talk) 17:24, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
3. Adelina Patti has public domain photo, born February 10, 1927 Voceditenore ( talk) 17:24, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Selected picture suggestions and comments:
1. File:Giulio Cesare opera.PNG - from Giulio Cesare, premiere on February 20, 1724
2. File:Venedig Theater La Fenice.jpg - nothing to do with February per se but gorgeous photo. However, many operas had their premieres there in February or March, e.g. Semiramide Il crociato in Egitto, and Rigoletto (the latter a tie-in with the featured audio Voceditenore ( talk) 18:23, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
Selected audios suggestions and comments: << Shoemaker's Holiday to fill this up>>
N.B. A round of applause to User:Dendodge for È scherzo!
Feel free to suggest and let me know before or on 29th Jan. Thanks - Jay ( talk) 10:55, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
For the article, would it be too indulgent of a subprject without a portal of its own to suggest W. S. Gilbert? Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 04:13, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
Re W. S. Gilbert. It's a brilliant article and can certainly go on an opera portal. If not used this time, we could always use it for April-May portal (died 29 May 1911). Having said that, I don't think we need to stick slavishly to month tie-ins. It's more important to have good articles out there. Voceditenore ( talk) 18:29, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
I've put up two suggestions for Verdi, I'll do some more. I suppose we have to include La donna e mobile? I don't have great recordings of it, but I can probably at least get something decent (after a similar amount of work as La fatal pietra took. Thank god my planned Otello work is much easier!) Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 13:14, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
If you have any more suggestions (or disagree with the list), please discuss about it before the 29th. I also need help from project members to expand "Opera news" section in the portal. User:Nrswanson has done a good job with DYK section, he updates it from time to time. - Jay ( talk) 14:43, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
[Unindent]I made eight audios because it's hard to evaluate something you've been working on for several hours. I can compare it to the original, see it's improved, but because I've listened to it so many times, I'm unlikely to be able to judge how bad any remaining flaws are, at least not until some time has passed. I fully support cutting them down to six; but I'd rather not drop to three while we're only updating once a month, simply because, with only one change every two months, and so many composers undone, it's going to be a long before we could use Verdi again, and, when we do, I'll be more encouraged to do work if I can't slack off by just grabbing three from the remaining five. Please do comment on the restorations: I'm not going to get better without criticism, and want to do this as well as I can.
P.S. Arthur Sullivan is fine with me, though I have worked extensively on it, so I'm hardly an unbiased source. =) It's probably Almost-FA, but we want to check a few more sources. Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 16:24, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
Why is it that phrases like "I'm not sure I can do this objectively, maybe someone else should select" has repeatedly turned back into "Shoe, can you choose the things for us"? =P Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 01:06, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
Well, fair enough. It's just that I feel a bit uncomfortable judging my own work.
Set 1:
Set 2
On relistening, I think I can do better with the two I cut off if I come back in a while - they're just a bit tinned and over-cleaned to my ear. These ones are probably about as good as I can get, at least, given the quality of the originals.
I've tried to mix it up to keep a big concerted number in each, and also to make sure that each had a Caruso-free recording. Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 01:21, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
In the OP article titling guidelines under Operas: avoiding ambiguity. It says:
This has been taken to mean that the subsequent articles on operas of the same name have the composer added to remove the ambiguity. ( Otello was created in 2002 and Otello (Rossini) in 2005.)
Yesterday without any prior discussion here or on the article talk page, and contrary to the current guidelines, an editor summarily moved Zaira (opera) (so named to distinguish it from the stub article on Zaira as a given name) to Zaira (Bellini) stating only in the edit summary: "There exist different operas titled Zaira" This of course messed up the Bellini template, which the editor later changed, but she/he failed to refresh the Zaira (Bellini) page so it was producing a double re-direct. Likewise, the template in all the other Bellini opera articles was linking to the redirect. I've now gone through and refreshed them, so at least that problem is solved.
1. Are members happy with the new title? There do exist other Zaira operas by Peter Winter, Saverio Mercadante and Antonio Caldara, but apart from the Mercadante, there is very little information about them and none of them have articles. I am personally inclined to reverse the page move, but am reluctant do so without consensus.
2. Should we revise the guidelines to make them a little clearer? e.g. change:
3. Should we also include in the guidelines something to the effect that articles should not be moved to new titles without prior discussion on their talk page and that if in doubt about the desirability/feasibility of re-naming an article, the issue should be raised here?
Opinions please... Voceditenore ( talk) 10:14, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
I don’t think Nicholas Lens is an opera composer as much as I don’t think his works as opera. What do you guys think?
Thanks - Jay ( talk) 16:06, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
User talk:Robert.Allen wrote me a message, The booklet which comes with the Merlin recording says that the opera was finished on 25 April 1902. [p. 16, "Isaac Albéniz's elusive Grail" by Jacinto Torres. (Torres has cataloged Albéniz's works for musical theater.)] Further on p. 18 he states that Launcelot remains in unfinished form, while Guenevere was never written. You may want to modify the list to reflect this information. I think it should probably show "(1902)" as the date for Merlin and "(unfinished)" for Launcelot. I do not want to edit the template just yet because that is not what is written in Merlin. I asked User talk:Robert.Allen to join the discussion here or edit the article first, only then I will edit the template - Jay ( talk) 11:42, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
Is it just me, or is it now all oddly aligned with great swathes of purple? I think the problem may come from the images in the new Selected Article, and Featured Singer and Composer, especially the image in Pelleas. Would making them a bit smaller help? Voceditenore ( talk) 13:56, 29 January 2009 (UTC)