![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 115 | ← | Archive 118 | Archive 119 | Archive 120 | Archive 121 | Archive 122 | → | Archive 125 |
I would like to see templates created for the following famous opera composer/librettist duos (along the lines of these musical-theatre composer/lyricist duo templates: Template:Kander and Ebb, Template:Lloyd Webber and Rice, Template:Rodgers and Hart, Template:Rodgers and Hammerstein).
Please do not add or include items not directly related to the duo or their operas -- i.e., please do not include items which happen to have or include the same or a similar title as an opera, or are only tangentially related, or articles which happen to have an opera mentioned in the article. Please only include works that are direct and complete official adaptations of the original work(s). Thank you.
If anyone wants to add other notable opera composer/librettist duos, who wrote at least three operas together (hopefully most of them notable), please do so. These are all that I can think of.
PS: Categories can also be created for these duos (trio in the case of Puccini/Illica/Giacosa). Along the lines of Category:Musicals by Rodgers and Hammerstein, Category:Musicals by Rodgers and Hart. Softlavender ( talk) 03:48, 26 January 2015 (UTC)
Dear opera enthusiasts: I have tagged the above article for deletion because it was copied from a web site, http://www.cairoopera.org/companies.php?lan=En . Someone who is knowledgeable about opera may wish to recreate it with new text. — Anne Delong ( talk) 11:18, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
Articles in WP on opera singers are written generally as if the singer was wholly responsible for their career. That is usually not true: there are many people always involved in an individual's career, beginning with their teachers (if not their parents). Currently at work I'm working on materials from Edgar Vincent a promoter, who apparently worked for Hurok before leaving and founding his own promotional firm, Edgar Vincent Associates. Vincent was responsible for many singers's careers, at least as far back as Lily Pons and Risë Stevens up to his death in 1990 (he played a significant part in Cecilia Bartoli's career).
This is just an entreaty to others in the project to not forget including agents or promoters in articles who are often instrumental in singers' and organizations' career. kosboot ( talk) 15:24, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
This was reported in the past but a bunch of IPs are at it again, spamming classicistranieri.com into multiple articles. Helpsome ( talk) 19:39, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
Dear opera enthusiasts: Here's an old AfC draft that needs references. I see quite a few news reports, but they are not in English. Is this a notable topic, and should the page be kept and improved? — Anne Delong ( talk) 15:48, 15 April 2015 (UTC)
Recently discovered this completely unreferenced article about an Olympic gold medalist who apparently later became a successful vocal coach of several famous opera singers. I just put an opera project banner on it. References would be a nice addition. 4meter4 ( talk) 02:46, 21 April 2015 (UTC)
Unreferenced article that is full of WP:PEACOCK and reads like a commercial promotion. Some of it apparently a translation from the German of her own website. I doubt she is really WP:NOTABLE - any views? -- Smerus ( talk) 08:43, 28 April 2015 (UTC)
Anyone want to collaborate on creating an article for this opera whose first performance since 1928 will probably receive a lot of attention in the New York press: Long-Unheard Harlem Renaissance Opera Coming in June - kosboot ( talk) 00:52, 3 May 2015 (UTC)
Back in March, I came across the navbox template for {{ Opera companies in Canada}} open on a page, and felt impelled to add one missing company, remove a dead one, change two out-dated company names (one from 2008), and do some minor copy-editing, before sweeping through all of the Canadian company articles, checking and correcting external links, staff changes, company names...
It was the combination of the list of companies being (a) inside the article body itself, (b) open and visible, and (c) being about companies (which are, ummm.... more interchangeable or of-a-piece than most things you come across in a navbox) that made the list dangerously close to useful.
I'd be happy to do the same for other countries, but I would want that the navboxes were complete lists -- ie, that the List of opera companies in Denmark, say, was a list of opera companies in Denmark, not a list of WP articles. That potentially means a navbox with red-links. It will be a lot of work to put this together, and it would be rather discouraging to discard up to half of the work because of the vagaries and accidents of enWP's selection of articles.
If this project would agree to navboxes with redlinks, the lists of opera companies in Europe (etc), could be replaced by collections of templates {{ Opera companies in Denmark}}, {{ Opera companies in Sweden}}, etc. Articles about Danish opera companies would include the template in-article, greatly increasing the chances/ frequency of updates. Any continental/ regional lists would just then include the same templates. By re-using a single list, we can halve the maintenance overhead and generally keep both national and continental lists better up-to-date.
Does anyone have any feelings about this, positive, negative, strong or otherwise? Scarabocchio ( talk) 12:49, 12 May 2015 (UTC)
To help crystallise thought and reactions, here are the two first rough lists for France and for Italy. These initial lists are taken from the professional opera companies which are members of the Réunion des Opéras de France, the Associazione Nazionale Fondazioni Lirico Sinfoniche (the former Enti Lirici + Bari), and the Associazione Teatri Italiani di Tradizione (with a few producing festivals added). The labels will need a tweak, and both lists will need a few cuts and a few further additions but these are the sorts of numbers of companies (and of red links) that might result. Scarabocchio ( talk) 06:19, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
Discussion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/A Scholar Under Siege.– Voceditenore ( talk) 08:58, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride!
Or, view or update the current list of Tasks. This campaign is supported by the Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group, an officially recognized affiliate of the Wikimedia Foundation. Visit the group's page at Meta-Wiki for more information, or follow Wikimedia LGBT+ on Facebook. Remember, Wiki Loves Pride is about creating and improving LGBT-related content at Wikimedia projects, and content should have a neutral point of view. One does not need to identify as LGBT or any other gender or sexual minority to participate. This campaign is about adding accurate, reliable information to Wikipedia, plain and simple, and all are welcome!
If you have any questions, please leave a message on the campaign's main talk page.
Thanks, and happy editing!
User:Another Believer and User:OR drohowa
Approaching anniversaries of an operatic nature:
I've queued the Giuditta Pasta and Tristan und Isolde anniversaries to appear on the Main page On This Day...
Scarabocchio ( talk) 10:13, 24 March 2015 (UTC)
Hi all. This article on conductor Stephen Simon was just created by an inexperienced editor. Some help with reference formatting, categories, copy editing etc. is needed if any of you have time. 4meter4 ( talk) 22:24, 5 May 2015 (UTC)
This article is one of the recent creations of the new user User:Forgottenoperasingerslover. Some of us have tried to be kind in mentoring this user. This article cites one source, one time. But if you go to the source, it's just a list of roles with no biographical or evaluative information. Someone else had already bannered the article saying it needs help. Today user 188.123.230.227 removed those banners but I put them back. I know one of the issues facing WP Is not discouraging new users, but this person does not appear to be reading our entreaties on how to improve one's editing. Does anyone have some suggestions? - kosboot ( talk) 19:55, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
voceditenore kosboot I would like to notify you that there are NO biographical or any other errors in the article on Adalgisa Giana, as I have been researching into the lives and recordings of these singers for a pretty long period of my life and it is connected with my professional activities. Very little is known about these enigmatic performers, and most are actually forgotten, and I would like more people to know about them. And NO information is copied from forgottenoperasingers.blogspot.com! The texts are all made by me, I only use different pieces of information (including chronologies) to make the whole thing look complete using my own phrases. And, importantly, chronologies are virtually the only sources of information about these singers (owing to Roberto Marcocci, creator of La Voce Antica) and, judging by them, we can even make up a short biography (and this is exactly what I am doing). I'm sorry for not citing references - I'm a novice in here and sometimes I do not know how to insert a link. I am on my way to self-improvement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Forgottenoperasingerslover ( talk • contribs) 10:27, 19 June 2015
An unregistered user put in a death date for Gedda (May 16). Swedish Wikipedia does not report this, nor can I find any other verification. Has anyone heard anything? - kosboot ( talk) 17:26, 17 May 2015 (UTC)
Looking at the Norma discography page for recordings of Norma (opera) I noticed a format in the Label column that I have never seen before, anywhere at all, e.g.
with a clumsy-looking note at the bottom of the table saying
To my mind this was obviously a formatting error, and I thought to look at the history, where I found that another user had recently made the exact same edits that I thought were needed. However those edits had been immediately reverted by User:Viva-Verdi, with the edit summary
So at least I wasn't alone in thinking this was strange, and redundant. Following this link, I find that, to the best of my knowledge, adding Cat: to a catalogue number appears to be a format unique not only to Wikipedia, but unique to the opera project as opposed to other classical music or other types of music, and within the opera project, unique to Recordings (table style) but not Recordings (short style).
Frankly, this does not make the slightest bit of sense to me. It's not just a question of making a distinction between "short" style" versus any other style; it's superfluous, and looks very odd, as well as taking up extra space. Surely there must have been some discussion of this proposed format, but having no idea how to find it in the project's gazillions of archives I asked User:Voceditenore if he could recall any such discussion and decision. He responded, in part
So there appears never to have been any such discussion. Looking back through the edit history of the style and format guidelines, I find Viva-Verdi's edit of 18 January 2010, changing
to read
His edit summary reads "clarify aspects of what has become "standard" layout". Of course if any format has become a de facto "standard", then it's entirely appropriate to specify that standard in the guidelines. My question then becomes, was the inclusion of Cat: ever truly a de facto standard used by the majority of opera discography editors. My own suspicion is that this format was more likely a relatively idiosyncratic usage, begun by perhaps one or two editors. It's certainly not "standard" in anything else I've ever seen.
Nor, for that matter, is the redundant (in this context) "Audio CD". Any music - including opera - is by definition "audio". What needs to be distinguished is between its formats, e.g., 78, cassette, LP, CD, etc. If it's a filmed opera, then it will almost always be issued on DVD or some similar format to accommodate the video.
Personally, I would have written the 1952 Callas Norma as "EMI Classics CD 562 668" (also omitting the final "-2", which is not part of the catalogue number, but simply identifies the medium as being a CD).
Thus I propose the article styles and formats guidelines should be amended, to remove the Cat: instruction for Recordings (table style), and also to remove the redundant Audio. Viva-Verdi objected in his revert that many other table discographies have now been formatted in this style, but this "standard" style itself is not really standard at all except as used in Wikipedia's opera project alone; it's redundant, and looks very odd. It shouldn't be necessary for anyone to have to suddenly undertake a big project of changing all of the extant tables; this could be done gradually, as they may be encountered. Some discographies of classical music that I've seen do include older formats, so perhaps the guidelines should allow for these by suggesting 78, LP, cassette, etc., as well as CD.
I should note that Vociditenore's reply to me also addresses other important issues, not copied here, but which are worthy of further discussion by this project. (Also see his link to the 2010 discussion.) Milkunderwood ( talk) 02:41, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
The template {{ Voice type}} exists. User:Zkidwiki has recently added Alto to the list of possible voice types, while other editors have reverted those attempts. What do the rest of us think, is Alto considered an actual voice type? If you believe so, then it should be listed in the Voice type template and the Alto article should include the template. If you believe not, then it should be left out of the Voice type template and the Alto article should not include the template. Pinging User:4meter4, User:Discospinster, User:Michael Bednarek who have recently contributed to the template. Cheers, all. Prhartcom ( talk) 19:08, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
It's good to get these points of view in this discussion and I welcome new ones. As this is Wikipedia, however, what matters is what is published in reliable sources. I would like to read the book sources referenced by the Voice type article and others, such as A Manual for Teachers of Singing and for Choir Directors. An Internet search brings up various online sources that so far each list only the seven voice types appearing in the {{ Voice type}} template and Voice type article. One of them says, "A common misconception would be to use the term 'Alto' instead of 'Contralto' to refer to female voices ... 'Alto' more commonly refers to the range or notes to be sung and is not exactly a voice type." I'm guessing some editors may be more familiar with choral music (perhaps they sing in a church choir) and may be less familiar with the life of a soloist trained in a conservatory; knowing the famous SATB designations but may not know that choir members are slotted into the range of notes their group is to sing according to each member's voice type. I think we need reliable sources to back up any statements to the contrary, but the discussion is lively and appreciated. Cheers, all. Prhartcom ( talk) 13:25, 24 May 2015 (UTC)
I went ahead and created the template at Template:Choral Voice Classification. Please let me know if you like it or if changes need to be made. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 02:20, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
I occasionally trawl the
category:Unassessed Opera articles. Today, I found that
an edit by
User:Dimadick added {{
WikiProject Opera}}
to the article
Bohemian Rhapsody. I can see that the term "operatic" is widely used that article, but I'm not sure that that is enough reason to apply this banner. Aside: if it is, what should be its assessment class? "C" like the rating for that article's other projects?
The same question applies to the jazz album Carmen (Barney Kessel album). -- Michael Bednarek ( talk) 13:04, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
I don't remember if Marga Schiml appeared in the section of new articles, anyway, she's pictured on the Main page, and - thanks to Tim riley who made the compilation (and achieved Falstaff FA for Viva-Verdi today!) - has an elaborate discography. Comments to the templated listing welcome at {{ classical discography row}}, under construction, -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 13:42, 27 May 2015 (UTC)
Hi all, I just did a major cleanup of the article on tenor James King. It was in really bad shape, and now is passable. It could use a little fleshing out though, as the article is heavily focused on his early training and his career at the Met. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 03:59, 9 June 2015 (UTC)
Hi all, I just wanted to point out that their is an article on Karl Mantzius who created the role of Jeronimus in Carl Nielsen's Maskarade, our opera of the month. However, there is no mention of Mantzius' work as an opera singer in his article, only his work as an actor. This might be a good time to update accordingly. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 00:02, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
Hi all. Some more comments and eyes would be helpful on this page. I am not really wanting to participate any more than what I have at this point. I have no interest in contributing my own pen to this article, but support any of you who choose to. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 05:47, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
Does anyone object to my putting "catalogue number" in front of what's obviously (for you) a catalogue number? I'm not looking to do that in article text, I'm just aiming at a broad readership at TFA. - Dank ( push to talk) 16:23, 17 June 2015 (UTC)
User:Inwind recently moved the page on Emmerich Kálmán's Marinka from Marinka to Marinka (operetta) in order to create a DAB page. Unfortunately he did not change the majority of the articles that are supposed to link to the operetta, and therefore there are multiple articles (including the opera corpus) that are now wikilinked to the wrong article. 4meter4 ( talk) 00:17, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 115 | ← | Archive 118 | Archive 119 | Archive 120 | Archive 121 | Archive 122 | → | Archive 125 |
I would like to see templates created for the following famous opera composer/librettist duos (along the lines of these musical-theatre composer/lyricist duo templates: Template:Kander and Ebb, Template:Lloyd Webber and Rice, Template:Rodgers and Hart, Template:Rodgers and Hammerstein).
Please do not add or include items not directly related to the duo or their operas -- i.e., please do not include items which happen to have or include the same or a similar title as an opera, or are only tangentially related, or articles which happen to have an opera mentioned in the article. Please only include works that are direct and complete official adaptations of the original work(s). Thank you.
If anyone wants to add other notable opera composer/librettist duos, who wrote at least three operas together (hopefully most of them notable), please do so. These are all that I can think of.
PS: Categories can also be created for these duos (trio in the case of Puccini/Illica/Giacosa). Along the lines of Category:Musicals by Rodgers and Hammerstein, Category:Musicals by Rodgers and Hart. Softlavender ( talk) 03:48, 26 January 2015 (UTC)
Dear opera enthusiasts: I have tagged the above article for deletion because it was copied from a web site, http://www.cairoopera.org/companies.php?lan=En . Someone who is knowledgeable about opera may wish to recreate it with new text. — Anne Delong ( talk) 11:18, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
Articles in WP on opera singers are written generally as if the singer was wholly responsible for their career. That is usually not true: there are many people always involved in an individual's career, beginning with their teachers (if not their parents). Currently at work I'm working on materials from Edgar Vincent a promoter, who apparently worked for Hurok before leaving and founding his own promotional firm, Edgar Vincent Associates. Vincent was responsible for many singers's careers, at least as far back as Lily Pons and Risë Stevens up to his death in 1990 (he played a significant part in Cecilia Bartoli's career).
This is just an entreaty to others in the project to not forget including agents or promoters in articles who are often instrumental in singers' and organizations' career. kosboot ( talk) 15:24, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
This was reported in the past but a bunch of IPs are at it again, spamming classicistranieri.com into multiple articles. Helpsome ( talk) 19:39, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
Dear opera enthusiasts: Here's an old AfC draft that needs references. I see quite a few news reports, but they are not in English. Is this a notable topic, and should the page be kept and improved? — Anne Delong ( talk) 15:48, 15 April 2015 (UTC)
Recently discovered this completely unreferenced article about an Olympic gold medalist who apparently later became a successful vocal coach of several famous opera singers. I just put an opera project banner on it. References would be a nice addition. 4meter4 ( talk) 02:46, 21 April 2015 (UTC)
Unreferenced article that is full of WP:PEACOCK and reads like a commercial promotion. Some of it apparently a translation from the German of her own website. I doubt she is really WP:NOTABLE - any views? -- Smerus ( talk) 08:43, 28 April 2015 (UTC)
Anyone want to collaborate on creating an article for this opera whose first performance since 1928 will probably receive a lot of attention in the New York press: Long-Unheard Harlem Renaissance Opera Coming in June - kosboot ( talk) 00:52, 3 May 2015 (UTC)
Back in March, I came across the navbox template for {{ Opera companies in Canada}} open on a page, and felt impelled to add one missing company, remove a dead one, change two out-dated company names (one from 2008), and do some minor copy-editing, before sweeping through all of the Canadian company articles, checking and correcting external links, staff changes, company names...
It was the combination of the list of companies being (a) inside the article body itself, (b) open and visible, and (c) being about companies (which are, ummm.... more interchangeable or of-a-piece than most things you come across in a navbox) that made the list dangerously close to useful.
I'd be happy to do the same for other countries, but I would want that the navboxes were complete lists -- ie, that the List of opera companies in Denmark, say, was a list of opera companies in Denmark, not a list of WP articles. That potentially means a navbox with red-links. It will be a lot of work to put this together, and it would be rather discouraging to discard up to half of the work because of the vagaries and accidents of enWP's selection of articles.
If this project would agree to navboxes with redlinks, the lists of opera companies in Europe (etc), could be replaced by collections of templates {{ Opera companies in Denmark}}, {{ Opera companies in Sweden}}, etc. Articles about Danish opera companies would include the template in-article, greatly increasing the chances/ frequency of updates. Any continental/ regional lists would just then include the same templates. By re-using a single list, we can halve the maintenance overhead and generally keep both national and continental lists better up-to-date.
Does anyone have any feelings about this, positive, negative, strong or otherwise? Scarabocchio ( talk) 12:49, 12 May 2015 (UTC)
To help crystallise thought and reactions, here are the two first rough lists for France and for Italy. These initial lists are taken from the professional opera companies which are members of the Réunion des Opéras de France, the Associazione Nazionale Fondazioni Lirico Sinfoniche (the former Enti Lirici + Bari), and the Associazione Teatri Italiani di Tradizione (with a few producing festivals added). The labels will need a tweak, and both lists will need a few cuts and a few further additions but these are the sorts of numbers of companies (and of red links) that might result. Scarabocchio ( talk) 06:19, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
Discussion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/A Scholar Under Siege.– Voceditenore ( talk) 08:58, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride!
Or, view or update the current list of Tasks. This campaign is supported by the Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group, an officially recognized affiliate of the Wikimedia Foundation. Visit the group's page at Meta-Wiki for more information, or follow Wikimedia LGBT+ on Facebook. Remember, Wiki Loves Pride is about creating and improving LGBT-related content at Wikimedia projects, and content should have a neutral point of view. One does not need to identify as LGBT or any other gender or sexual minority to participate. This campaign is about adding accurate, reliable information to Wikipedia, plain and simple, and all are welcome!
If you have any questions, please leave a message on the campaign's main talk page.
Thanks, and happy editing!
User:Another Believer and User:OR drohowa
Approaching anniversaries of an operatic nature:
I've queued the Giuditta Pasta and Tristan und Isolde anniversaries to appear on the Main page On This Day...
Scarabocchio ( talk) 10:13, 24 March 2015 (UTC)
Hi all. This article on conductor Stephen Simon was just created by an inexperienced editor. Some help with reference formatting, categories, copy editing etc. is needed if any of you have time. 4meter4 ( talk) 22:24, 5 May 2015 (UTC)
This article is one of the recent creations of the new user User:Forgottenoperasingerslover. Some of us have tried to be kind in mentoring this user. This article cites one source, one time. But if you go to the source, it's just a list of roles with no biographical or evaluative information. Someone else had already bannered the article saying it needs help. Today user 188.123.230.227 removed those banners but I put them back. I know one of the issues facing WP Is not discouraging new users, but this person does not appear to be reading our entreaties on how to improve one's editing. Does anyone have some suggestions? - kosboot ( talk) 19:55, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
voceditenore kosboot I would like to notify you that there are NO biographical or any other errors in the article on Adalgisa Giana, as I have been researching into the lives and recordings of these singers for a pretty long period of my life and it is connected with my professional activities. Very little is known about these enigmatic performers, and most are actually forgotten, and I would like more people to know about them. And NO information is copied from forgottenoperasingers.blogspot.com! The texts are all made by me, I only use different pieces of information (including chronologies) to make the whole thing look complete using my own phrases. And, importantly, chronologies are virtually the only sources of information about these singers (owing to Roberto Marcocci, creator of La Voce Antica) and, judging by them, we can even make up a short biography (and this is exactly what I am doing). I'm sorry for not citing references - I'm a novice in here and sometimes I do not know how to insert a link. I am on my way to self-improvement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Forgottenoperasingerslover ( talk • contribs) 10:27, 19 June 2015
An unregistered user put in a death date for Gedda (May 16). Swedish Wikipedia does not report this, nor can I find any other verification. Has anyone heard anything? - kosboot ( talk) 17:26, 17 May 2015 (UTC)
Looking at the Norma discography page for recordings of Norma (opera) I noticed a format in the Label column that I have never seen before, anywhere at all, e.g.
with a clumsy-looking note at the bottom of the table saying
To my mind this was obviously a formatting error, and I thought to look at the history, where I found that another user had recently made the exact same edits that I thought were needed. However those edits had been immediately reverted by User:Viva-Verdi, with the edit summary
So at least I wasn't alone in thinking this was strange, and redundant. Following this link, I find that, to the best of my knowledge, adding Cat: to a catalogue number appears to be a format unique not only to Wikipedia, but unique to the opera project as opposed to other classical music or other types of music, and within the opera project, unique to Recordings (table style) but not Recordings (short style).
Frankly, this does not make the slightest bit of sense to me. It's not just a question of making a distinction between "short" style" versus any other style; it's superfluous, and looks very odd, as well as taking up extra space. Surely there must have been some discussion of this proposed format, but having no idea how to find it in the project's gazillions of archives I asked User:Voceditenore if he could recall any such discussion and decision. He responded, in part
So there appears never to have been any such discussion. Looking back through the edit history of the style and format guidelines, I find Viva-Verdi's edit of 18 January 2010, changing
to read
His edit summary reads "clarify aspects of what has become "standard" layout". Of course if any format has become a de facto "standard", then it's entirely appropriate to specify that standard in the guidelines. My question then becomes, was the inclusion of Cat: ever truly a de facto standard used by the majority of opera discography editors. My own suspicion is that this format was more likely a relatively idiosyncratic usage, begun by perhaps one or two editors. It's certainly not "standard" in anything else I've ever seen.
Nor, for that matter, is the redundant (in this context) "Audio CD". Any music - including opera - is by definition "audio". What needs to be distinguished is between its formats, e.g., 78, cassette, LP, CD, etc. If it's a filmed opera, then it will almost always be issued on DVD or some similar format to accommodate the video.
Personally, I would have written the 1952 Callas Norma as "EMI Classics CD 562 668" (also omitting the final "-2", which is not part of the catalogue number, but simply identifies the medium as being a CD).
Thus I propose the article styles and formats guidelines should be amended, to remove the Cat: instruction for Recordings (table style), and also to remove the redundant Audio. Viva-Verdi objected in his revert that many other table discographies have now been formatted in this style, but this "standard" style itself is not really standard at all except as used in Wikipedia's opera project alone; it's redundant, and looks very odd. It shouldn't be necessary for anyone to have to suddenly undertake a big project of changing all of the extant tables; this could be done gradually, as they may be encountered. Some discographies of classical music that I've seen do include older formats, so perhaps the guidelines should allow for these by suggesting 78, LP, cassette, etc., as well as CD.
I should note that Vociditenore's reply to me also addresses other important issues, not copied here, but which are worthy of further discussion by this project. (Also see his link to the 2010 discussion.) Milkunderwood ( talk) 02:41, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
The template {{ Voice type}} exists. User:Zkidwiki has recently added Alto to the list of possible voice types, while other editors have reverted those attempts. What do the rest of us think, is Alto considered an actual voice type? If you believe so, then it should be listed in the Voice type template and the Alto article should include the template. If you believe not, then it should be left out of the Voice type template and the Alto article should not include the template. Pinging User:4meter4, User:Discospinster, User:Michael Bednarek who have recently contributed to the template. Cheers, all. Prhartcom ( talk) 19:08, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
It's good to get these points of view in this discussion and I welcome new ones. As this is Wikipedia, however, what matters is what is published in reliable sources. I would like to read the book sources referenced by the Voice type article and others, such as A Manual for Teachers of Singing and for Choir Directors. An Internet search brings up various online sources that so far each list only the seven voice types appearing in the {{ Voice type}} template and Voice type article. One of them says, "A common misconception would be to use the term 'Alto' instead of 'Contralto' to refer to female voices ... 'Alto' more commonly refers to the range or notes to be sung and is not exactly a voice type." I'm guessing some editors may be more familiar with choral music (perhaps they sing in a church choir) and may be less familiar with the life of a soloist trained in a conservatory; knowing the famous SATB designations but may not know that choir members are slotted into the range of notes their group is to sing according to each member's voice type. I think we need reliable sources to back up any statements to the contrary, but the discussion is lively and appreciated. Cheers, all. Prhartcom ( talk) 13:25, 24 May 2015 (UTC)
I went ahead and created the template at Template:Choral Voice Classification. Please let me know if you like it or if changes need to be made. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 02:20, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
I occasionally trawl the
category:Unassessed Opera articles. Today, I found that
an edit by
User:Dimadick added {{
WikiProject Opera}}
to the article
Bohemian Rhapsody. I can see that the term "operatic" is widely used that article, but I'm not sure that that is enough reason to apply this banner. Aside: if it is, what should be its assessment class? "C" like the rating for that article's other projects?
The same question applies to the jazz album Carmen (Barney Kessel album). -- Michael Bednarek ( talk) 13:04, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
I don't remember if Marga Schiml appeared in the section of new articles, anyway, she's pictured on the Main page, and - thanks to Tim riley who made the compilation (and achieved Falstaff FA for Viva-Verdi today!) - has an elaborate discography. Comments to the templated listing welcome at {{ classical discography row}}, under construction, -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 13:42, 27 May 2015 (UTC)
Hi all, I just did a major cleanup of the article on tenor James King. It was in really bad shape, and now is passable. It could use a little fleshing out though, as the article is heavily focused on his early training and his career at the Met. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 03:59, 9 June 2015 (UTC)
Hi all, I just wanted to point out that their is an article on Karl Mantzius who created the role of Jeronimus in Carl Nielsen's Maskarade, our opera of the month. However, there is no mention of Mantzius' work as an opera singer in his article, only his work as an actor. This might be a good time to update accordingly. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 00:02, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
Hi all. Some more comments and eyes would be helpful on this page. I am not really wanting to participate any more than what I have at this point. I have no interest in contributing my own pen to this article, but support any of you who choose to. Best. 4meter4 ( talk) 05:47, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
Does anyone object to my putting "catalogue number" in front of what's obviously (for you) a catalogue number? I'm not looking to do that in article text, I'm just aiming at a broad readership at TFA. - Dank ( push to talk) 16:23, 17 June 2015 (UTC)
User:Inwind recently moved the page on Emmerich Kálmán's Marinka from Marinka to Marinka (operetta) in order to create a DAB page. Unfortunately he did not change the majority of the articles that are supposed to link to the operetta, and therefore there are multiple articles (including the opera corpus) that are now wikilinked to the wrong article. 4meter4 ( talk) 00:17, 20 June 2015 (UTC)