Away/inactive:
Sorry if this is the wrong place, but I can't figure out what "Capabilities given only to administrators, such as page deletion, are not to be used for trivial, novel, experimental, or unexpected purposes" means.
This would seem to preclude a lot of uses of deletion... certainly I delete many trivial articles, I delete many articles for reasons I never have before (novel reasons), and how I would delete an article for an "unexpected purpose" is totally incomprehensible to me, I can't figure out what that last point in the slightest. I thought deletions were only bad if they got rid of worthwhile content, or interfered with the useful operation of Wikipedia in some way. I think this is what the wording is aiming for, but as people tend to cite arbcom cases, and the current wording is pretty dense, it might be best to revise it before people start trying to say ArbCom ruled against deleting trivially short articles or some such nonsense. -- W.marsh 22:56, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
I'm really sorry to do this, but I feel obliged to speak up about Jeffrey O. Gustafson getting desysopped. I strongly believe that there are better remedies than Jeffrey losing his bit. I'll be honest from the start, I think Jeffrey can be one hell of a jerk sometimes, but his service to wikipedia and use of his tools are second to none. He really does great work with his buttons, and taking them away would be a real loss to the community. I think Jeffrey now realises his mistakes and I have to say I've been very impressed with his constructive attitude and his attempts to work through his civility problems. I can see that you guys are worried that without this remedy, we're going to be back here in a couple of months, but it's a risk that I believe we have to take, it would be a real loss to the community if Jeffrey lost his admin tools. IMHO, a strong admonishment or caution with a firm understanding that if he appears before the committee in the future he'll lose his admin status is what is required here. If you look at the workshop page, I don't think anyone really wants to see him desysopped and there seems to be strong support for an admonishment. I hope you can consider a less severe remedy. Ryan Postlethwaite 17:38, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
I feel that desysopping by the Arbcom shouldn't be too much of an issue. The Arbcom doubts whether Jeffrey still has the trust of the community. If the community still trusts Jeffrey with the bit, he can reapply for adminship. Mel sa ran (formerly Salaskаn) 12:20, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
I noticed JOG's name while I was passing through the RfA page and it rang a bell. My only contact with him came during the pet food scare where, shortly after I looked at the page which is now
2007 pet food recalls he replaced the existing page with a redirect to a new page which he had constructed from scratch, without any warning on the existing talk page since - so he claimed - he had been unaware of the existance of any Wikipedia content on the pet food recalls. Given that his action took place several weeks into a major media story it beggared belief that he could possibly think the story had gone unmentioned on Wikipedia. Now, on the whole his article was better than the existing one and I would have been inclined merely to grumble a bit about his uncollegial attitude had he admitted what he had done. But instead he responded to my disbelief by instructing me to be WP:CIVIL and WP:AGF. Somehow all of my edits on the pet food and associated talk pages from that period have disappeared from my contribution list (lost in title changes?) but I still have this comment:
...and from the same page:
[1] Andyvphil 01:46, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
There is currently no FoF on his inappropriate deletion summaries, but there is a principle on it. That seems a little weird, so I proposed this. Mel sa ran (formerly Salaskаn) 12:20, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
Right now, two people are opposing the "adminship suspended for a period of 30 days", apparently because they'd prefer desysopping. This isn't going to result in no sanction at all because Arbcom can't agree on how strict to make it, right? - Amarkov moo! 04:50, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Is courtesy blanking really appropriate here? Given that part of the reason for the RFA was JOG's blanking of pages, it seems a little odd. Unless it is unfair to JOG, I think that every effort should be made to keep his past transparent to other users. Jfwambaugh 17:07, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
In all but one instance in the past, it was considered legitimate to leave arbitration decisions easily readable to casual users. This overwhelming precedent was not, as far as I know, considered to be "shaming". Since this case was based upon preventing users from easily learning JOG's history of interactions (via his talk page, contribs, etc.) it seems especially appropriate to treat him normally and not grant an exception to WP:CBLANK. Jfwambaugh 16:48, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Away/inactive:
Sorry if this is the wrong place, but I can't figure out what "Capabilities given only to administrators, such as page deletion, are not to be used for trivial, novel, experimental, or unexpected purposes" means.
This would seem to preclude a lot of uses of deletion... certainly I delete many trivial articles, I delete many articles for reasons I never have before (novel reasons), and how I would delete an article for an "unexpected purpose" is totally incomprehensible to me, I can't figure out what that last point in the slightest. I thought deletions were only bad if they got rid of worthwhile content, or interfered with the useful operation of Wikipedia in some way. I think this is what the wording is aiming for, but as people tend to cite arbcom cases, and the current wording is pretty dense, it might be best to revise it before people start trying to say ArbCom ruled against deleting trivially short articles or some such nonsense. -- W.marsh 22:56, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
I'm really sorry to do this, but I feel obliged to speak up about Jeffrey O. Gustafson getting desysopped. I strongly believe that there are better remedies than Jeffrey losing his bit. I'll be honest from the start, I think Jeffrey can be one hell of a jerk sometimes, but his service to wikipedia and use of his tools are second to none. He really does great work with his buttons, and taking them away would be a real loss to the community. I think Jeffrey now realises his mistakes and I have to say I've been very impressed with his constructive attitude and his attempts to work through his civility problems. I can see that you guys are worried that without this remedy, we're going to be back here in a couple of months, but it's a risk that I believe we have to take, it would be a real loss to the community if Jeffrey lost his admin tools. IMHO, a strong admonishment or caution with a firm understanding that if he appears before the committee in the future he'll lose his admin status is what is required here. If you look at the workshop page, I don't think anyone really wants to see him desysopped and there seems to be strong support for an admonishment. I hope you can consider a less severe remedy. Ryan Postlethwaite 17:38, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
I feel that desysopping by the Arbcom shouldn't be too much of an issue. The Arbcom doubts whether Jeffrey still has the trust of the community. If the community still trusts Jeffrey with the bit, he can reapply for adminship. Mel sa ran (formerly Salaskаn) 12:20, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
I noticed JOG's name while I was passing through the RfA page and it rang a bell. My only contact with him came during the pet food scare where, shortly after I looked at the page which is now
2007 pet food recalls he replaced the existing page with a redirect to a new page which he had constructed from scratch, without any warning on the existing talk page since - so he claimed - he had been unaware of the existance of any Wikipedia content on the pet food recalls. Given that his action took place several weeks into a major media story it beggared belief that he could possibly think the story had gone unmentioned on Wikipedia. Now, on the whole his article was better than the existing one and I would have been inclined merely to grumble a bit about his uncollegial attitude had he admitted what he had done. But instead he responded to my disbelief by instructing me to be WP:CIVIL and WP:AGF. Somehow all of my edits on the pet food and associated talk pages from that period have disappeared from my contribution list (lost in title changes?) but I still have this comment:
...and from the same page:
[1] Andyvphil 01:46, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
There is currently no FoF on his inappropriate deletion summaries, but there is a principle on it. That seems a little weird, so I proposed this. Mel sa ran (formerly Salaskаn) 12:20, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
Right now, two people are opposing the "adminship suspended for a period of 30 days", apparently because they'd prefer desysopping. This isn't going to result in no sanction at all because Arbcom can't agree on how strict to make it, right? - Amarkov moo! 04:50, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Is courtesy blanking really appropriate here? Given that part of the reason for the RFA was JOG's blanking of pages, it seems a little odd. Unless it is unfair to JOG, I think that every effort should be made to keep his past transparent to other users. Jfwambaugh 17:07, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
In all but one instance in the past, it was considered legitimate to leave arbitration decisions easily readable to casual users. This overwhelming precedent was not, as far as I know, considered to be "shaming". Since this case was based upon preventing users from easily learning JOG's history of interactions (via his talk page, contribs, etc.) it seems especially appropriate to treat him normally and not grant an exception to WP:CBLANK. Jfwambaugh 16:48, 5 September 2007 (UTC)