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There is a silly debate on the talk page of " TNA iMPACT!", with one editor saying that TV shows/movies/video games/etc. shouldn't have stuff like exclamation points and question marks in their titles (so he would want "Who Wants to Be a Millionare?" moved to "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire" for example). Not only do I think he's wrong, but think it would affect a lot of articles. Thoughts? TJ Spyke 07:04, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
I think we should expand the section on he use of a colon beyond just "space usage." This would include when to use and when not to use a colon in lists, especially with verb complements. While reading through the various policies (which I'm sure have been proofread numerous times), I have come across several errors involving colon usage. I double-checked my corrections with my grammar textbook (yes, I own one) and I was correct. Then when I check WP:MoS, I noticed it mentions next to nothing regarding proper usage, so I am assuming this is the problem. Are there any comments or suggestions as to the way it should be worded?-- Vox Rationis ( Talk | contribs) 15:28, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
Sorry if this the wrong place for this, but I couldn't find somewhere better.
If an article refers to an actual book (the book is not a reference), does ISBN information need to be included? From Download This Song:
Is this the proper way to handle book references? I've got a reference for this statement that would go at the end of the sentence, but would the book get its own footnote with ISBN info, etc.? Please advise, thanks! — Daniel Vandersluis( talk) 15:32, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
I would like if it said something about adding excessive HTML for style reasons. Like bolding text to make headings instead of using the correct sub-heading markup, putting <big> tags around math markup to make it look the right size in your own browser, etc. Idiosyncratic markups that aren't carried between articles. I just want it to say something like
Ideas? — Omegatron 16:33, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed a tendency among some wikipedians to add "general interest" illustrations to articles, that is to say images of objects not refered to in the text. This [[ http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Gothic_Revival_architecture&oldid=113077320 version]] of the article on the Gothic Revival is a case in point. I would maintain that pictures without context don't have any explanatory value, and so there is a need for a policy on this subject. Namely: illustrations must illustrate the text and that generic images should be confined to commons categories or gallery setions. Twospoonfuls 15:09, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
Should the word the precede a universities name like the university of Blah or should it be just university of blah? If the word the should be there should it be capitalized? (as in say... At The University of Blah). Some 3rd party input to this would be appreciated, as this question is currently being debated at Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal/Cases/2007-03-11 Ohio State University. Feel free to give input here in this section or at the medcab page. Thanks. —— Eagle101 Need help? 21:30, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
The expressions B.C. and A.D. are biased, and should, in fairness to all world religions and to atheists, be replaced with:
Thanks for your well-detailed help. Much appreciated. Prof.rick 03:04, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
Well, I for one am concerned about the capital letter A, which is originally derived from an image of the head of an ox. I know that people don't think of it that way any more than people think of AD dates being "in the year of our Lord," but it represents an obvious cattle-enslavement bias that I'm sure all right-thinking Wikipedians will agree should result in total avoidance of the capital A. I apologize for using it here for illustration. -- Tysto 17:52, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
There is a discussion going on over here on whether an article should be at YUI (singer) or Yui (singer). Any input from additional people would be helpful. ··· 日本穣 ? · Talk to Nihon joe 19:59, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
Hi. As someone in the southern hemisphere, I was wondering if there was any style guide to the use of northern hemisphere seasons for upcoming movie, game, etc release dates. I don't find it offensive, as such, but it seems rather biased that just because a majority of the "civilized" world is northern hemisphere based, that those seasons will be widely recognized as the seasons in question. WookMuff 11:12, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
What is the main focus of the Wikipedia Manual of Style, reading or writing?
If it is the reader I cannot understand most guidances that allow multiple options (e.g. of spelling or “UK”/“U.S.”), because consistency is king, and some other rules seem to be author-centred, too (e.g. typewriter quotes).
In my opinion any featured, good and probably A-Class article should fully conform to the preferred style described in the MoS as a prerequisite. Christoph Päper 14:19, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
I’m a little sad this issue doesn’t raise more comments. Anyhow, let’s have a look at the introduction:
This Manual of Style has the simple purpose of making the encyclopedia easy to read, by establishing agreed principles for its format. (…) if everyone does things the same way, Wikipedia will be easier to read and use, and easier to write and edit. These are not rigid laws: they are principles that many editors have found to work well in most circumstances (…). In this vein, editors should strive to have their articles follow these guidelines.
— (Emphasis mine.)
The first sentence clearly prioritises the readership. (How could I have missed that before?) I think we would agree on this again anytime. The second one explains that standards are a benefit to readers and editors alike. The rest says that no single author is forced to comply, but articles should conform in the end.
In the light of this I contest once again the
rules for
quotation marks. (Other guidelines may follow.) The typographic glyphs (“…”
, ‘…’
and ’
) are more professional and look better in the eyes of many, probably most. They pose no technical problem anymore, except for input with traditional keyboard layouts. Therefore I think the MoS should clearly state that “…”
are the standard (or preferred) quotation marks in the English Wikipedia, and ’
is the
apostrophe. Bots should be run to update the characters accordingly, as has been done in other language editions of WP. Authors may safely rely on
copyeditors.
Christoph Päper
23:40, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
There is no mention of the use of exclamation points in the punctuation section! My feeling is that their use is not scholarly and they have no place in formal writing! I would like to reference the relevant MoS section in my comments as justification to others when I remove them, but currently there is nothing to reference! (If my gratuitous use of exclamation points here hasn't motivated you to add them to the punctuation section, I don't know what will!) -- 67.188.0.96 09:17, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
I don't believe there is ever a cause to place a space in front of a question mark or an exclamation point, is there? But I see that done in informal writing all the time, and it drives me nuts! I notice that there is an explicit policy against placing a space in front of a colon. I believe there should be a similar policy for question marks and exclamation points. Alas, I don't feel bold enough to insert that policy myself. Any takers? Joe 18:18, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia has no guidelines on protocols for writing cost or prices. I ask because over at the PS3 article, someone mentioned that in the price chart US price is pre-tax but all the European prices are post-VAT. Except the US conversions have the VAT stripped out. The whole thing is highly inconsistent. And Wikipedia doesn't seem to have any policy for writing prices or converting cost. If I'm asking the wrong place or there is a policy, let me know. Thanks. Chevinki 20:22, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
When a product is discontinued by the manufacturer, like the Nikon D50 camera, should the opening paragraph be changed from "The D50 is an entry-level digital single-lens reflex camera..." to "The D50 was an entry-level digital single-lens reflex camera..."? There are probably hundreds of thousands of D50s that are still in existence and used daily. Other camera articles like the Nikon F3 and Nikon F5 say "was". I noticed automobiles like the Infiniti Q45 say "was", even though many are still on the road. I have seen this argument come up in aircraft articles; the Cessna 150 hasn't been built since 1977, but it says "is" rather than "was", as does the B-17 Flying Fortress which hasn't been built since 1945. However, the B-29 Superfortress (also last built in 1945) says "was". I think we need to have an MoS entry discussing this. I looked, but could not find anything related to this, but perhaps I missed it. -- rogerd 04:52, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
It would be good if authors avoided the use of summer/spring/winter/fall to refer to periods of the year (as distinct from the climatic sense)
For example "In August 2006, there were widespread rumours of an election to be held in the fall..." (ref http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_general_election%2C_2007). There are two problems with this: 1. "Fall" is not used much outside North America - mostly people use "autumn" 2. More importantly, the seasons are reversed in the southern hemisphere - when it is winter in the northern hemisphere, it is summer in the southern hemisphere. Thus is someone says "The presidential election will be held in the fall of 2007..." I - as a southern hemisphere resident - think of the March-May period, not towards the end of the year. Using "late 2007" in this case would be much clearer. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.170.90.2 ( talk • contribs).
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 65 | ← | Archive 68 | Archive 69 | Archive 70 | Archive 71 | Archive 72 | → | Archive 75 |
There is a silly debate on the talk page of " TNA iMPACT!", with one editor saying that TV shows/movies/video games/etc. shouldn't have stuff like exclamation points and question marks in their titles (so he would want "Who Wants to Be a Millionare?" moved to "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire" for example). Not only do I think he's wrong, but think it would affect a lot of articles. Thoughts? TJ Spyke 07:04, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
I think we should expand the section on he use of a colon beyond just "space usage." This would include when to use and when not to use a colon in lists, especially with verb complements. While reading through the various policies (which I'm sure have been proofread numerous times), I have come across several errors involving colon usage. I double-checked my corrections with my grammar textbook (yes, I own one) and I was correct. Then when I check WP:MoS, I noticed it mentions next to nothing regarding proper usage, so I am assuming this is the problem. Are there any comments or suggestions as to the way it should be worded?-- Vox Rationis ( Talk | contribs) 15:28, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
Sorry if this the wrong place for this, but I couldn't find somewhere better.
If an article refers to an actual book (the book is not a reference), does ISBN information need to be included? From Download This Song:
Is this the proper way to handle book references? I've got a reference for this statement that would go at the end of the sentence, but would the book get its own footnote with ISBN info, etc.? Please advise, thanks! — Daniel Vandersluis( talk) 15:32, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
I would like if it said something about adding excessive HTML for style reasons. Like bolding text to make headings instead of using the correct sub-heading markup, putting <big> tags around math markup to make it look the right size in your own browser, etc. Idiosyncratic markups that aren't carried between articles. I just want it to say something like
Ideas? — Omegatron 16:33, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed a tendency among some wikipedians to add "general interest" illustrations to articles, that is to say images of objects not refered to in the text. This [[ http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Gothic_Revival_architecture&oldid=113077320 version]] of the article on the Gothic Revival is a case in point. I would maintain that pictures without context don't have any explanatory value, and so there is a need for a policy on this subject. Namely: illustrations must illustrate the text and that generic images should be confined to commons categories or gallery setions. Twospoonfuls 15:09, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
Should the word the precede a universities name like the university of Blah or should it be just university of blah? If the word the should be there should it be capitalized? (as in say... At The University of Blah). Some 3rd party input to this would be appreciated, as this question is currently being debated at Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal/Cases/2007-03-11 Ohio State University. Feel free to give input here in this section or at the medcab page. Thanks. —— Eagle101 Need help? 21:30, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
The expressions B.C. and A.D. are biased, and should, in fairness to all world religions and to atheists, be replaced with:
Thanks for your well-detailed help. Much appreciated. Prof.rick 03:04, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
Well, I for one am concerned about the capital letter A, which is originally derived from an image of the head of an ox. I know that people don't think of it that way any more than people think of AD dates being "in the year of our Lord," but it represents an obvious cattle-enslavement bias that I'm sure all right-thinking Wikipedians will agree should result in total avoidance of the capital A. I apologize for using it here for illustration. -- Tysto 17:52, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
There is a discussion going on over here on whether an article should be at YUI (singer) or Yui (singer). Any input from additional people would be helpful. ··· 日本穣 ? · Talk to Nihon joe 19:59, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
Hi. As someone in the southern hemisphere, I was wondering if there was any style guide to the use of northern hemisphere seasons for upcoming movie, game, etc release dates. I don't find it offensive, as such, but it seems rather biased that just because a majority of the "civilized" world is northern hemisphere based, that those seasons will be widely recognized as the seasons in question. WookMuff 11:12, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
What is the main focus of the Wikipedia Manual of Style, reading or writing?
If it is the reader I cannot understand most guidances that allow multiple options (e.g. of spelling or “UK”/“U.S.”), because consistency is king, and some other rules seem to be author-centred, too (e.g. typewriter quotes).
In my opinion any featured, good and probably A-Class article should fully conform to the preferred style described in the MoS as a prerequisite. Christoph Päper 14:19, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
I’m a little sad this issue doesn’t raise more comments. Anyhow, let’s have a look at the introduction:
This Manual of Style has the simple purpose of making the encyclopedia easy to read, by establishing agreed principles for its format. (…) if everyone does things the same way, Wikipedia will be easier to read and use, and easier to write and edit. These are not rigid laws: they are principles that many editors have found to work well in most circumstances (…). In this vein, editors should strive to have their articles follow these guidelines.
— (Emphasis mine.)
The first sentence clearly prioritises the readership. (How could I have missed that before?) I think we would agree on this again anytime. The second one explains that standards are a benefit to readers and editors alike. The rest says that no single author is forced to comply, but articles should conform in the end.
In the light of this I contest once again the
rules for
quotation marks. (Other guidelines may follow.) The typographic glyphs (“…”
, ‘…’
and ’
) are more professional and look better in the eyes of many, probably most. They pose no technical problem anymore, except for input with traditional keyboard layouts. Therefore I think the MoS should clearly state that “…”
are the standard (or preferred) quotation marks in the English Wikipedia, and ’
is the
apostrophe. Bots should be run to update the characters accordingly, as has been done in other language editions of WP. Authors may safely rely on
copyeditors.
Christoph Päper
23:40, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
There is no mention of the use of exclamation points in the punctuation section! My feeling is that their use is not scholarly and they have no place in formal writing! I would like to reference the relevant MoS section in my comments as justification to others when I remove them, but currently there is nothing to reference! (If my gratuitous use of exclamation points here hasn't motivated you to add them to the punctuation section, I don't know what will!) -- 67.188.0.96 09:17, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
I don't believe there is ever a cause to place a space in front of a question mark or an exclamation point, is there? But I see that done in informal writing all the time, and it drives me nuts! I notice that there is an explicit policy against placing a space in front of a colon. I believe there should be a similar policy for question marks and exclamation points. Alas, I don't feel bold enough to insert that policy myself. Any takers? Joe 18:18, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia has no guidelines on protocols for writing cost or prices. I ask because over at the PS3 article, someone mentioned that in the price chart US price is pre-tax but all the European prices are post-VAT. Except the US conversions have the VAT stripped out. The whole thing is highly inconsistent. And Wikipedia doesn't seem to have any policy for writing prices or converting cost. If I'm asking the wrong place or there is a policy, let me know. Thanks. Chevinki 20:22, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
When a product is discontinued by the manufacturer, like the Nikon D50 camera, should the opening paragraph be changed from "The D50 is an entry-level digital single-lens reflex camera..." to "The D50 was an entry-level digital single-lens reflex camera..."? There are probably hundreds of thousands of D50s that are still in existence and used daily. Other camera articles like the Nikon F3 and Nikon F5 say "was". I noticed automobiles like the Infiniti Q45 say "was", even though many are still on the road. I have seen this argument come up in aircraft articles; the Cessna 150 hasn't been built since 1977, but it says "is" rather than "was", as does the B-17 Flying Fortress which hasn't been built since 1945. However, the B-29 Superfortress (also last built in 1945) says "was". I think we need to have an MoS entry discussing this. I looked, but could not find anything related to this, but perhaps I missed it. -- rogerd 04:52, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
It would be good if authors avoided the use of summer/spring/winter/fall to refer to periods of the year (as distinct from the climatic sense)
For example "In August 2006, there were widespread rumours of an election to be held in the fall..." (ref http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_general_election%2C_2007). There are two problems with this: 1. "Fall" is not used much outside North America - mostly people use "autumn" 2. More importantly, the seasons are reversed in the southern hemisphere - when it is winter in the northern hemisphere, it is summer in the southern hemisphere. Thus is someone says "The presidential election will be held in the fall of 2007..." I - as a southern hemisphere resident - think of the March-May period, not towards the end of the year. Using "late 2007" in this case would be much clearer. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.170.90.2 ( talk • contribs).