This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Editor assistance/list page. |
|
I have been concerned for some time about a problem with this list. A large number of accounts on this list have not edited for quite a while, which means that there is a likelihood that users wanting help will post to one of these accounts and never get an answer. For example, the account Wikipedian2 last edited on 15 September 2009. During the following 12 months there were 13 requests for help to this account's talk page, all from editors with no previous history of contact with Wikipedian2, and it seems likely that most if not all of them came because Wikipedian2 was listed here. Three of those editors never edited again, presumably having given up after waiting in vain for the help which the system had promised them. It is likely that there will be others in the same situation with requests to other accounts on this list. In addition, the list includes editors who do not seem to have completely left Wikipedia, but are now editing so infrequently that perhaps their inclusion on the list is not helpful. It seems that anyone posting a request for help should be able to expect a response within a few days at the most, so perhaps we should regard any account which does not edit at least once a week as too irregular to be helpful. How big a problem is this? Well, when I checked about a week ago, I found the following situation:
There were 110 entries on the list. Of these 110, 31 had not edited in the last year, including some who had not edited for over three years. 61 had not edited in the last month. 3 accounts on the list had been indefinitely blocked for eighteen months or longer, one of them since August 2008. Several (I did not count) had actually announced that they were retiring from Wikipedia, or were away indefinitely. In fact of the 110, only 22 had, during the past month, been editing as frequently as at least once in every seven consecutive days.
It seems to me that this is a very unsatisfactory situation: only 1 in five of the accounts listed is actually editing regularly. So what is to be done? For the moment, as a first step, I have decided to be bold and remove all accounts which have not edited for at least two months, and also move any account which has recent editing gaps of two weeks or more into a separate section, indicating that the account is not editing regularly. Naturally I shall tell the users in question what I have done on their talk pages, so that they can revert my change if they like. I regard this as a minimal start: some of the accounts I have left alone should probably be moved as well, but I thought I would let others express opinions before doing anything bolder. I also think of this as only a stop-gap. If we leave it like that and forget about it then the same situation will develop again. I have two suggestions for a longer-term solution:
I will be interested to read any comments, either on the above suggestions or on any other relevant ideas. JamesBWatson ( talk) 11:01, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
I get requests for assistance from this list though I don't do patrolling. I feel that the way the list is currently arranged is not helpful to those looking for help. Asking people to confirm they are still willing to help is the way to proceed, though before we do that, it would be appropriate to discuss how we want the new list to appear so that when people resign up, they can do so on the new list. Example:
Editor | Status | Joined Wikipedia | Joined Editor Assistance | Date confirmed | Comments |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
SilkTork ( talk · contribs) | Admin | Jan 2006 | April 2007 | Feb 2011 | Willing to help on a range of issues |
This might be an easier table to use:
Member | Additional comments (optional) |
---|---|
Kudpung ( talk · contribs) | I don't promise to know all the answers but will help with questions from the new and not so new, especially on geography (settlements), schools, biographies, style, referencing, policy. and some dispute resolution. See my user page for what else I can help with. |
Foo1 ( talk · contribs) | |
Foo2 ( talk · contribs) |
I don't think we need to go OTT with the self promotion, length of service, etc; it's doesn't help the ones on the bottom of the list either, who may be quite experienced and willing to help. In fact it might even drive them off the project. Kudpung( talk) 15:16, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
I am in favor of a quarterly request to confirm participation. Personally, I tend to edit in cycles of higher activity interspersed by periods of nearly dormant participation, but I still regard myself as active since I am reading articles and looking at my Talk page even when I am not editing on a regular basis. Hiberniantears ( talk) 23:47, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
Comment (sorry if this has already been discussed above, I've simply been prompted by the message on my User talk) I don't object reformatting the page, although the page as it currently looks is fine. Just let editors come and add themselves back on when they see your message and decide to join back. Actually I was slightly surprised that I didn't get moved to the "inactive" list! -- Der yck C. 23:38, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
I think that a checkpage with a list of users would be a good idea, and I am willing to create a bot to update the participant table whenever these users stop editing for 21 days, or have <2 edits in 30 days, or whatever the cutoff consensus is. Nobody would need to be removed from the checkpage, since the users coming for editor assistance would look at the bot-updated table when looking for the list of users. We could ask users who want to provide editor assistance to sign up on the checkpage, and the bot would add them to the table. Reaper Eternal ( talk) 15:46, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
Well, that's it then - over 8 days and not a single cry for help in the dark. Just imagining that if I had had one request, that would be an average of less than 50 a year emanating from this page. IMO we've already got too many overlapping pages offering broadly related help, and many of our replies here at EAR are simply to send people to a more appropriate desk or noticeboard. Whilst I agree with James in principle, I see no reason to scrap the list completely - it's not taking up masses of server space. Let's just let it slumber and if anyone gets a question, they can answer it. In the meantime, I'm putting my name back where it was. -- Kudpung กุดผึ้ง ( talk) 05:55, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Editor assistance/list page. |
|
I have been concerned for some time about a problem with this list. A large number of accounts on this list have not edited for quite a while, which means that there is a likelihood that users wanting help will post to one of these accounts and never get an answer. For example, the account Wikipedian2 last edited on 15 September 2009. During the following 12 months there were 13 requests for help to this account's talk page, all from editors with no previous history of contact with Wikipedian2, and it seems likely that most if not all of them came because Wikipedian2 was listed here. Three of those editors never edited again, presumably having given up after waiting in vain for the help which the system had promised them. It is likely that there will be others in the same situation with requests to other accounts on this list. In addition, the list includes editors who do not seem to have completely left Wikipedia, but are now editing so infrequently that perhaps their inclusion on the list is not helpful. It seems that anyone posting a request for help should be able to expect a response within a few days at the most, so perhaps we should regard any account which does not edit at least once a week as too irregular to be helpful. How big a problem is this? Well, when I checked about a week ago, I found the following situation:
There were 110 entries on the list. Of these 110, 31 had not edited in the last year, including some who had not edited for over three years. 61 had not edited in the last month. 3 accounts on the list had been indefinitely blocked for eighteen months or longer, one of them since August 2008. Several (I did not count) had actually announced that they were retiring from Wikipedia, or were away indefinitely. In fact of the 110, only 22 had, during the past month, been editing as frequently as at least once in every seven consecutive days.
It seems to me that this is a very unsatisfactory situation: only 1 in five of the accounts listed is actually editing regularly. So what is to be done? For the moment, as a first step, I have decided to be bold and remove all accounts which have not edited for at least two months, and also move any account which has recent editing gaps of two weeks or more into a separate section, indicating that the account is not editing regularly. Naturally I shall tell the users in question what I have done on their talk pages, so that they can revert my change if they like. I regard this as a minimal start: some of the accounts I have left alone should probably be moved as well, but I thought I would let others express opinions before doing anything bolder. I also think of this as only a stop-gap. If we leave it like that and forget about it then the same situation will develop again. I have two suggestions for a longer-term solution:
I will be interested to read any comments, either on the above suggestions or on any other relevant ideas. JamesBWatson ( talk) 11:01, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
I get requests for assistance from this list though I don't do patrolling. I feel that the way the list is currently arranged is not helpful to those looking for help. Asking people to confirm they are still willing to help is the way to proceed, though before we do that, it would be appropriate to discuss how we want the new list to appear so that when people resign up, they can do so on the new list. Example:
Editor | Status | Joined Wikipedia | Joined Editor Assistance | Date confirmed | Comments |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
SilkTork ( talk · contribs) | Admin | Jan 2006 | April 2007 | Feb 2011 | Willing to help on a range of issues |
This might be an easier table to use:
Member | Additional comments (optional) |
---|---|
Kudpung ( talk · contribs) | I don't promise to know all the answers but will help with questions from the new and not so new, especially on geography (settlements), schools, biographies, style, referencing, policy. and some dispute resolution. See my user page for what else I can help with. |
Foo1 ( talk · contribs) | |
Foo2 ( talk · contribs) |
I don't think we need to go OTT with the self promotion, length of service, etc; it's doesn't help the ones on the bottom of the list either, who may be quite experienced and willing to help. In fact it might even drive them off the project. Kudpung( talk) 15:16, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
I am in favor of a quarterly request to confirm participation. Personally, I tend to edit in cycles of higher activity interspersed by periods of nearly dormant participation, but I still regard myself as active since I am reading articles and looking at my Talk page even when I am not editing on a regular basis. Hiberniantears ( talk) 23:47, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
Comment (sorry if this has already been discussed above, I've simply been prompted by the message on my User talk) I don't object reformatting the page, although the page as it currently looks is fine. Just let editors come and add themselves back on when they see your message and decide to join back. Actually I was slightly surprised that I didn't get moved to the "inactive" list! -- Der yck C. 23:38, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
I think that a checkpage with a list of users would be a good idea, and I am willing to create a bot to update the participant table whenever these users stop editing for 21 days, or have <2 edits in 30 days, or whatever the cutoff consensus is. Nobody would need to be removed from the checkpage, since the users coming for editor assistance would look at the bot-updated table when looking for the list of users. We could ask users who want to provide editor assistance to sign up on the checkpage, and the bot would add them to the table. Reaper Eternal ( talk) 15:46, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
Well, that's it then - over 8 days and not a single cry for help in the dark. Just imagining that if I had had one request, that would be an average of less than 50 a year emanating from this page. IMO we've already got too many overlapping pages offering broadly related help, and many of our replies here at EAR are simply to send people to a more appropriate desk or noticeboard. Whilst I agree with James in principle, I see no reason to scrap the list completely - it's not taking up masses of server space. Let's just let it slumber and if anyone gets a question, they can answer it. In the meantime, I'm putting my name back where it was. -- Kudpung กุดผึ้ง ( talk) 05:55, 7 May 2011 (UTC)