The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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Category:Members of Propaganda Due
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Nominator's rationale: "Members of Propaganda Due" is already grammatically incorrect, it's "Members of the Propaganda Due." Regardless, it's probably better to have it be consistent with other set categories for groups of individuals involved in politics- I'm pretty sure there is a relevant MOS entry for category naming but I can't seem to find it.
HadesTTW (he/him •
talk) 19:51, 14 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Delete, not a defining characteristic.
Marcocapelle (
talk) 22:36, 15 February 2023 (UTC)reply
It was an important part of the background to the
Years of Lead, fortunately less fatal than much of the other stuff.
JASpencer (
talk) 09:12, 20 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Maybe, but the category is populated with biographies for which it is not defining.
Marcocapelle (
talk) 07:16, 22 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Support Originally created category and fine with proposed renaming.
JASpencer (
talk) 09:12, 20 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Strong Delete — suffix "members" is usually for WikiProjects. "Members of" for organizations. The organization is
Propaganda Due, not The Propaganda Due. Propaganda Due is never mentioned in
Years of Lead. Moreover, we don't usually categorize members of criminal and terrorist organizations (
WP:BLPCRIMINAL). There is a list of supposed members in the Propaganda Due article, where they should be verified by citations. But the only article I've checked,
Silvio Berlusconi, has absolutely no reference for membership. If the most prominent fails
WP:V, then better to drop the whole lot. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 05:15, 22 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Berlusconi's article not having much on his P2 membership is moreso a flaw of the English Wikipedia rather than it not being notable- the Italian Wikipedia has an entire section of his article on his controversial association with
P2. All of the articles in the category contain at least a line about their membership in P2 and about half have a mention of it in their lede. The main
Propaganda Due article itself has references for every single person mentioned.
HadesTTW (he/him •
talk) 01:12, 25 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Annoying to have folks add to the old discussion after relisting, so we don't tend to notice. We don't read the main article to look for references. If the reference isn't in the Biography itself, then the category cannot be attached to the biography itself. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 05:25, 11 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
Qwerfjkltalk 18:59, 23 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
Qwerfjkltalk 21:04, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Comment - Although there's clearly no consensus for deleting the category (and to be fair that wasn't the original proposal) there doesn't seem to be any objection to renaming it. Instead of relisting it, could we rename it and close it?
JASpencer (
talk) 20:57, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Nearly every word of my response is opposed to renaming. Each part of the renaming rationale. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 00:45, 5 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Delete Clicking through the articles, this is clearly
WP:OCASSOC. Neutral on rename if kept. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 20:59, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Keep --
P2 was involved in great controversy and regularly mentioned in the news a couple of decades ago, which means that membership may well be defining. Note that "due" is not that English word but the Italian for two. The main article starts by referring to "the Propaganda Due lodge", so that the cat-name is probably correct. Neutral on rename.
Peterkingiron (
talk) 17:45, 5 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Delete, not defining. —
Qwerfjkltalk 16:46, 12 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Sporting goods manufacturers of Lithuania
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Merge for Now With no objection to recreation if any ever get to 5+ articles. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 21:02, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
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Category:Swedish sport websites
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Funerals by country
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Category:Candidates for speedy deletion as empty categories
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Keep They are two different categories.
Category:Empty categories awaiting deletion is for empty categories during the 7 day period where they sit in case they have been emptied out of process or they are just temporarily empty. After the week waiting period is over, they should appear in
Category:Candidates for speedy deletion as empty categories. It's a regular CSD category, not a holding category. This move of categories after 7 days doesn't happen as smoothly as it should as the bot that moves empty categories isn't functioning as well as it used to in the past but deleting a standard CSD category requires more than a sparsely attended CFD discussion to decide to delete. I think this nomination should be withdrawn. LizRead!Talk! 17:59, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Just thought I'd mention that the problem with filling categories when they should is an ongoing problem that comes up on VPT fairly regularly. There is a delay, sometimes of hours, sometimes of days or longer, for pages to get moved into maintenance categories when they should be. It also happens with CSD R2, G6 and G8. LizRead!Talk! 18:04, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Keep per Liz. There could potentially be a valid argument to restructure how CSD-related categories like this are organized, but it would have to be done very carefully — there have been a lot of cases in the past where project maintenance categories that got casually deleted at CFD broke important maintenance tasks and ended up having to be reverted (like the time CFD deleted a seemingly-redundant tracking category for uncategorized articles, except that it was the very category that our tools for locating uncategorized articles in the first place were depending upon, so the deletion broke the tools' ability to properly detect uncategorized articles at all until it was reversed). So something like this would need to be handled by a WikiProject discussion that could review and account for all the technical considerations that may apply, and should not be casually debated at CFD like a content category.
Bearcat (
talk) 15:12, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
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Category:21st century in Foxborough, Massachusetts
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Nominator's rationale: Nearly every article in this category relates to sports competitions or sports seasons held in the town. The few which are not about competitions can easily be manually removed.
User:Namiba 16:48, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Category:Cemeteries in Dedham, Massachusetts
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
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Nominator's rationale: Per
WP:SMALLCAT, this category is small (4 entries) and unlikely to be expanded due to the small town nature of the subject.
User:Namiba 16:30, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Oppose A cemetery is neither a building nor a structure. --
Slugger O'Toole (
talk) 17:51, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Merge Fails smallcat and, given the population density of the area, new cemeteries are unlikely. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 21:07, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Category:Folk dance in Finland
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
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Support per nom. Meanwhile there are two entries, but for the discussion that does not really matter.
Marcocapelle (
talk) 22:17, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Merge for Now with no objection to recreating if anyone can drum up 3 more articles. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 21:09, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Support — but require 17 more articles. I was an avid folk dancer, spent a decade helping with
NEFFA back in the day, and did a fair amount of scandi over the years, but we don't need this overcategorization. Broader categorization helps find related groups. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 05:57, 11 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Members of Propaganda Due
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Nominator's rationale: "Members of Propaganda Due" is already grammatically incorrect, it's "Members of the Propaganda Due." Regardless, it's probably better to have it be consistent with other set categories for groups of individuals involved in politics- I'm pretty sure there is a relevant MOS entry for category naming but I can't seem to find it.
HadesTTW (he/him •
talk) 19:51, 14 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Delete, not a defining characteristic.
Marcocapelle (
talk) 22:36, 15 February 2023 (UTC)reply
It was an important part of the background to the
Years of Lead, fortunately less fatal than much of the other stuff.
JASpencer (
talk) 09:12, 20 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Maybe, but the category is populated with biographies for which it is not defining.
Marcocapelle (
talk) 07:16, 22 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Support Originally created category and fine with proposed renaming.
JASpencer (
talk) 09:12, 20 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Strong Delete — suffix "members" is usually for WikiProjects. "Members of" for organizations. The organization is
Propaganda Due, not The Propaganda Due. Propaganda Due is never mentioned in
Years of Lead. Moreover, we don't usually categorize members of criminal and terrorist organizations (
WP:BLPCRIMINAL). There is a list of supposed members in the Propaganda Due article, where they should be verified by citations. But the only article I've checked,
Silvio Berlusconi, has absolutely no reference for membership. If the most prominent fails
WP:V, then better to drop the whole lot. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 05:15, 22 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Berlusconi's article not having much on his P2 membership is moreso a flaw of the English Wikipedia rather than it not being notable- the Italian Wikipedia has an entire section of his article on his controversial association with
P2. All of the articles in the category contain at least a line about their membership in P2 and about half have a mention of it in their lede. The main
Propaganda Due article itself has references for every single person mentioned.
HadesTTW (he/him •
talk) 01:12, 25 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Annoying to have folks add to the old discussion after relisting, so we don't tend to notice. We don't read the main article to look for references. If the reference isn't in the Biography itself, then the category cannot be attached to the biography itself. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 05:25, 11 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
Qwerfjkltalk 18:59, 23 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
Qwerfjkltalk 21:04, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Comment - Although there's clearly no consensus for deleting the category (and to be fair that wasn't the original proposal) there doesn't seem to be any objection to renaming it. Instead of relisting it, could we rename it and close it?
JASpencer (
talk) 20:57, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Nearly every word of my response is opposed to renaming. Each part of the renaming rationale. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 00:45, 5 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Delete Clicking through the articles, this is clearly
WP:OCASSOC. Neutral on rename if kept. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 20:59, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Keep --
P2 was involved in great controversy and regularly mentioned in the news a couple of decades ago, which means that membership may well be defining. Note that "due" is not that English word but the Italian for two. The main article starts by referring to "the Propaganda Due lodge", so that the cat-name is probably correct. Neutral on rename.
Peterkingiron (
talk) 17:45, 5 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Delete, not defining. —
Qwerfjkltalk 16:46, 12 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Sporting goods manufacturers of Lithuania
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Merge for Now With no objection to recreation if any ever get to 5+ articles. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 21:02, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Swedish sport websites
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
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Funerals by country
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
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Category:Candidates for speedy deletion as empty categories
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Keep They are two different categories.
Category:Empty categories awaiting deletion is for empty categories during the 7 day period where they sit in case they have been emptied out of process or they are just temporarily empty. After the week waiting period is over, they should appear in
Category:Candidates for speedy deletion as empty categories. It's a regular CSD category, not a holding category. This move of categories after 7 days doesn't happen as smoothly as it should as the bot that moves empty categories isn't functioning as well as it used to in the past but deleting a standard CSD category requires more than a sparsely attended CFD discussion to decide to delete. I think this nomination should be withdrawn. LizRead!Talk! 17:59, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Just thought I'd mention that the problem with filling categories when they should is an ongoing problem that comes up on VPT fairly regularly. There is a delay, sometimes of hours, sometimes of days or longer, for pages to get moved into maintenance categories when they should be. It also happens with CSD R2, G6 and G8. LizRead!Talk! 18:04, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Keep per Liz. There could potentially be a valid argument to restructure how CSD-related categories like this are organized, but it would have to be done very carefully — there have been a lot of cases in the past where project maintenance categories that got casually deleted at CFD broke important maintenance tasks and ended up having to be reverted (like the time CFD deleted a seemingly-redundant tracking category for uncategorized articles, except that it was the very category that our tools for locating uncategorized articles in the first place were depending upon, so the deletion broke the tools' ability to properly detect uncategorized articles at all until it was reversed). So something like this would need to be handled by a WikiProject discussion that could review and account for all the technical considerations that may apply, and should not be casually debated at CFD like a content category.
Bearcat (
talk) 15:12, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:21st century in Foxborough, Massachusetts
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Nominator's rationale: Nearly every article in this category relates to sports competitions or sports seasons held in the town. The few which are not about competitions can easily be manually removed.
User:Namiba 16:48, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
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Category:Cemeteries in Dedham, Massachusetts
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Nominator's rationale: Per
WP:SMALLCAT, this category is small (4 entries) and unlikely to be expanded due to the small town nature of the subject.
User:Namiba 16:30, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Oppose A cemetery is neither a building nor a structure. --
Slugger O'Toole (
talk) 17:51, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Merge Fails smallcat and, given the population density of the area, new cemeteries are unlikely. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 21:07, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Folk dance in Finland
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Support per nom. Meanwhile there are two entries, but for the discussion that does not really matter.
Marcocapelle (
talk) 22:17, 3 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Merge for Now with no objection to recreating if anyone can drum up 3 more articles. -
RevelationDirect (
talk) 21:09, 4 March 2023 (UTC)reply
Support — but require 17 more articles. I was an avid folk dancer, spent a decade helping with
NEFFA back in the day, and did a fair amount of scandi over the years, but we don't need this overcategorization. Broader categorization helps find related groups. William Allen Simpson (
talk) 05:57, 11 March 2023 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.