The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
It seems inaccurate to say that the 24th "division was consequently alone" given that it had air support and was (I think) fighting alongside South Korean units at times.
Comments Is the statement in the lead about "untrained" troops accurate? Inexperienced might be a better word choice, as the soldiers would have gone through basic training. Bit of a nitpick, I know, but there is a difference between untrained and inexperienced.
When you jump from unit to unit, especially in the last couple of sections, it can be difficult to tell if you're talking about a US or NKPA unit. You might clear that up by changing the "Withdrawal" section title to "American Withdrawal."
A2: Was there nothing in Chae, Han Kook; Chung, Suk Kyun; Yang, Yong Cho (2001), Yang, Hee Wan; Lim, Won Hyok; Sims, Thomas Lee et al., eds., The Korean War, Volume I, Lincoln, NE: University of Nebraska Press,
ISBN0803277946?
Writing: "preregistered" is a term of art for military science relating to artillery bombardments, explain what walking into a preregistered ambush means suffering a horrible artillery bombardment, and wiki link the technical term
The beligerants section mentions South Korea, but I see no mention of South Korean forces directly involved in the action anywhere else in the article
Well, the police force which was fighting in the town was what I was referring to there but they weren't directly related to the ambush. I can always take it out. —
Ed!(talk)00:54, 14 October 2010 (UTC)reply
North Korean forces were able to separate the American unit's elements from one another and kill most of its leadership, further disorganizing them. - the wording of this sentence is somewhat awkward. Can it be fixed in any way?
When you mention "3rd Battalion, 29th Infantry", I immediately assume we're talking divisions here. Are 29th Division and 29th Regiment different? If so you should probably specify Regiment in the worded link itself
Traditionally, "29th Infantry" refers just to the regiment. If it was any other unit it would be referred to as such. I've clarified this though. —
Ed!(talk)01:07, 14 October 2010 (UTC)reply
Ok. That's my confusion. North of the 49th we only use numerical designations for units with multiple battalions (3rd Battalion, Royal Canadian Regiment) or brigade/division forces. Our regiments use names rather than numerical deisgnations, so that's where my confusion comes from...
Cam(
Chat)(
Prof)20:09, 14 October 2010 (UTC)reply
Outbreak of War
However, US forces in the Far East had been steadily decreasing since the end of World War II, five years earlier, and at the time..., could the middle bit maybe be reworded to "steadily decreasing since the end of World War II in 1945, and at the time..." just to make it less choppy?
By that time, the Eighth Army's force of combat troops were roughly equal to North Korean forces attacking the region, with new UN units arriving every day.[8] - do we know what the rough strength of these units was at the time? It would help for comparison's sake so the reader can appreciate how fast the buildup happened.
By July 22 the units were on the front lines with new equipment that was not prepared for combat, despite promises from several commanders that they would be given time to do so.[11][14][15] - which wasn't ready for combat, the troops or the equipment? I'm guessing troops, but the wording makes it a bit unclear.
NK 6th Division commander General Pang Ho San ordered his forces to aggressively scout to Chinju as quickly as possible.[19] - I'm thinking "scout to Chinju" is probably using the wrong verb. Maybe "scout Chinju" or "advance to Chinju"?
During this trip, shortly before dawn, the troops encountered a truck of 15 South Korean militia who claimed they were the remains of a 400-man unit that had been wiped out by North Korean forces in the area.[21] - the "during this trip" is unecessary
The North Koreans immediately ducked for cover in the ditches on the side of the road, and L Company opened up on them.[20][23] - "opened up on them" sounds a bit too informal for my tastes.
The 3rd Battalion had walked into a preregistered North Korean ambush, and almost its entire command ground was eliminated within a minute of the first shot being fired. - what exactly is "command ground"?
They also had to cross a 20 feet (6.1 m)-wide stream in the retreat, and some drowned in the process. - "20 feet-wide stream" just doesn't sound right. Try some of the other conversion template options. It may just be an adj=on issue.
Over 30 vehicles and practically all of the crew-served and individual weapons used by 3rd Battalion were lost.[31] - the "crew-served and individual weapons" part is a bit convoluted and confusing.
The first sentence of the lead is a little problematic IMO. Perhaps it could be reworded to: "The Hadong Ambush was an engagement between United States and North Korean forces that occurred on July 27, 1950 in the village of Hadong in southern South Korea, early in the Korean War."?
Grammar seems problematic here: "leaving lower-ranking soldiers mounting a disorganized struggle against North Korean troops on higher ground and in prepared positions." Could it be reworded: "leaving lower-ranking soldiers to mount a disorganized struggle against North Korean troops occupying the high ground in prepared positions."
This sentence is a little repetative: "He had few soldiers of his own, and accompanied the battalion with only a few of his aides", maybe reword one of the instances of the word 'few'?
Anotherclown (
talk)06:50, 19 October 2010 (UTC)reply
I have made a couple more minor changes so please check them out Ed. Overall though this is another fine article and I happy to support. Well done.
Anotherclown (
talk)
20:45, 19 October 2010 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page, such as the current discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
It seems inaccurate to say that the 24th "division was consequently alone" given that it had air support and was (I think) fighting alongside South Korean units at times.
Comments Is the statement in the lead about "untrained" troops accurate? Inexperienced might be a better word choice, as the soldiers would have gone through basic training. Bit of a nitpick, I know, but there is a difference between untrained and inexperienced.
When you jump from unit to unit, especially in the last couple of sections, it can be difficult to tell if you're talking about a US or NKPA unit. You might clear that up by changing the "Withdrawal" section title to "American Withdrawal."
A2: Was there nothing in Chae, Han Kook; Chung, Suk Kyun; Yang, Yong Cho (2001), Yang, Hee Wan; Lim, Won Hyok; Sims, Thomas Lee et al., eds., The Korean War, Volume I, Lincoln, NE: University of Nebraska Press,
ISBN0803277946?
Writing: "preregistered" is a term of art for military science relating to artillery bombardments, explain what walking into a preregistered ambush means suffering a horrible artillery bombardment, and wiki link the technical term
The beligerants section mentions South Korea, but I see no mention of South Korean forces directly involved in the action anywhere else in the article
Well, the police force which was fighting in the town was what I was referring to there but they weren't directly related to the ambush. I can always take it out. —
Ed!(talk)00:54, 14 October 2010 (UTC)reply
North Korean forces were able to separate the American unit's elements from one another and kill most of its leadership, further disorganizing them. - the wording of this sentence is somewhat awkward. Can it be fixed in any way?
When you mention "3rd Battalion, 29th Infantry", I immediately assume we're talking divisions here. Are 29th Division and 29th Regiment different? If so you should probably specify Regiment in the worded link itself
Traditionally, "29th Infantry" refers just to the regiment. If it was any other unit it would be referred to as such. I've clarified this though. —
Ed!(talk)01:07, 14 October 2010 (UTC)reply
Ok. That's my confusion. North of the 49th we only use numerical designations for units with multiple battalions (3rd Battalion, Royal Canadian Regiment) or brigade/division forces. Our regiments use names rather than numerical deisgnations, so that's where my confusion comes from...
Cam(
Chat)(
Prof)20:09, 14 October 2010 (UTC)reply
Outbreak of War
However, US forces in the Far East had been steadily decreasing since the end of World War II, five years earlier, and at the time..., could the middle bit maybe be reworded to "steadily decreasing since the end of World War II in 1945, and at the time..." just to make it less choppy?
By that time, the Eighth Army's force of combat troops were roughly equal to North Korean forces attacking the region, with new UN units arriving every day.[8] - do we know what the rough strength of these units was at the time? It would help for comparison's sake so the reader can appreciate how fast the buildup happened.
By July 22 the units were on the front lines with new equipment that was not prepared for combat, despite promises from several commanders that they would be given time to do so.[11][14][15] - which wasn't ready for combat, the troops or the equipment? I'm guessing troops, but the wording makes it a bit unclear.
NK 6th Division commander General Pang Ho San ordered his forces to aggressively scout to Chinju as quickly as possible.[19] - I'm thinking "scout to Chinju" is probably using the wrong verb. Maybe "scout Chinju" or "advance to Chinju"?
During this trip, shortly before dawn, the troops encountered a truck of 15 South Korean militia who claimed they were the remains of a 400-man unit that had been wiped out by North Korean forces in the area.[21] - the "during this trip" is unecessary
The North Koreans immediately ducked for cover in the ditches on the side of the road, and L Company opened up on them.[20][23] - "opened up on them" sounds a bit too informal for my tastes.
The 3rd Battalion had walked into a preregistered North Korean ambush, and almost its entire command ground was eliminated within a minute of the first shot being fired. - what exactly is "command ground"?
They also had to cross a 20 feet (6.1 m)-wide stream in the retreat, and some drowned in the process. - "20 feet-wide stream" just doesn't sound right. Try some of the other conversion template options. It may just be an adj=on issue.
Over 30 vehicles and practically all of the crew-served and individual weapons used by 3rd Battalion were lost.[31] - the "crew-served and individual weapons" part is a bit convoluted and confusing.
The first sentence of the lead is a little problematic IMO. Perhaps it could be reworded to: "The Hadong Ambush was an engagement between United States and North Korean forces that occurred on July 27, 1950 in the village of Hadong in southern South Korea, early in the Korean War."?
Grammar seems problematic here: "leaving lower-ranking soldiers mounting a disorganized struggle against North Korean troops on higher ground and in prepared positions." Could it be reworded: "leaving lower-ranking soldiers to mount a disorganized struggle against North Korean troops occupying the high ground in prepared positions."
This sentence is a little repetative: "He had few soldiers of his own, and accompanied the battalion with only a few of his aides", maybe reword one of the instances of the word 'few'?
Anotherclown (
talk)06:50, 19 October 2010 (UTC)reply
I have made a couple more minor changes so please check them out Ed. Overall though this is another fine article and I happy to support. Well done.
Anotherclown (
talk)
20:45, 19 October 2010 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page, such as the current discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.