This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result of the debate was transwiki these three articles to Wikibooks. I see a lot of delete votes here, but from reading the comments made by them, many of them say this belongs in Wikibooks. Therefore, I will submit these articles to the transwiki queue. Sjakkalle (Check!) 08:15, 22 July 2005 (UTC) reply
Up for deletion are Events_with_Muhammad:_1, Events_with_Muhammad:_2, and Events_with_Muhammad:_3. ArmadniGeneral 7 July 2005 20:51 (UTC)
-- Striver 02:01, 15 July 2005 (UTC) reply
So, done!
Now, It clearly says
I really fail to see how it can be deleted or transwikied with all that said.
-- Striver, upset with Zora. 02:09, 15 July 2005 (UTC) reply
It can not be included in a biograpy, it would clog the biograpy and make it unrideable. And what about everybody else that are involved, are whe supposed to clog upp their biograpy as well?
Just take a look att the Battle of Bassorah, its obvious that it can be included in a biography, not to say in the biography of every single one included in it.
Its the same with this series, all the event Muhammad (as) did can not fitt in his biography, that is long enough as it is. And yes, they do have a relevance. If ti was me doing stuff nobody would care, but we are talking about the person that over one billion people are trying to imitate. What more could be relevant than report on actions that over a billion are imitating?
Marjas dedicate THEIR ENTIRE LIFE to read stuff like that so they can tell people if is allowed to listen to music or if its allowed to have an abortion: THIS IS THE MAIN SOURCE OF EVERYDAY ISLAM, the day-to-day practices of Muhammad!
Of course this would not fitt in a bok, but this is not a book, its a electronic encyclopedia and of course it does use other ways than books. I does not have everything on pages, it has one event per article so and all relevant persons can link to that event. This event tells a lot about how the Sahaba acted in their private life as well. It is the farthes thing from uninportant and it is set upp in best way possible: NOT everything in one long meaningless article that nobody care to read, rather, on event at a time so it can be linked to it whenever it becomes relevant..
Remeber this is not a book, information is not costly to keep and it has a value. Its not trash, its the preserved day-to-day life of the peoble that over one billion are imitating.
-- Striver 7 July 2005 22:22 (UTC)
Your analogi with Jesus (peace be upon him) does not work for several resons:
I repeat, this material can not be found in the Quran, in can not be found in a ordered manner in any book, its spread over volumes of books in a non-cronological order, and not even in one pice, its it often takes 4 hadithes in diffrent volumes to make sense one event! People dedicate their live to this, its not a small matter, its not easly available and it is definitly worth to represent in a encyclopedia that aimes to collect "all human knowledge"! Think about it, it may sound as every-day event to you, but remeber that it shapes the life of over on billion people that strive to mimic Muhammad's smalest action, including how to greet eachother! Its not godnight-tales!
I mean, if Rich Bagger can have a articel, i dont get why events that shape 1/6 of the world cant have an article! Take a look at hadith and sunnah and you will see that what im saying is correct!
It is WAY do much matterial to fitt in a biography, not even 1/10 000 would fitt in a biograpy, and even if it did, is it supposed to be repeted in every biograpy that of those whom partake in the event? This is the best solution, to have an article series, and link all involved to that article!
I mean, c'mon, this is not something i make money on, and its nothing WP looses money on, i just want to have Muhammads Sunnah represented on Wikipedia!
-- Striver 8 July 2005 00:13 (UTC)
Well, i see what you mean, but tell me, is the Hitler article coming from one single book?
Its like this:
Ther are several hadith that explain one given event. Scholar that have more knowledge than me have gone throughe the chain of narrations of them and authenticated them. The authentic hadithes can be found in diffrent collections, here for example. In one of those collections one can say x whent to home and ate a burger. the next hadith in the other part of the collection says that after x ate his burger, he whent to work.
Now, is it original research if i make a article that claims x whent home, ate a burger and then when to work?
In manny cases even puting the hadithes together is done in diffrent biograhis of the sahaba. Manny of this event simply would not fitt in a article biography of muhammad, since everything he did is recorded.
However, they are relvant, specialy while doing the biography of the sahab, in those cases it can be benefitial to link to those events instead of repeting them in every single biography.
Take for example Events with Muhammad: 1. in whose biography should it be included?
This cant be included in Muhammad, that article is to long as it is, however, it can not be included in any of the other biographies eather, since it is Muhammad that is the main character!
Oh, by the way, i found that event in a web site, but al of them dont come from the same website, that what makes it "not a book".
-- Striver 8 July 2005 18:39 (UTC)
hmm.. on second tough, i disagree... i ... i mean, i source says.... a event took place at 1, 5 and 7 am, a second source says what happened at 2, 6 an 9 am, and a third source gives the names, and i combine that in a article that says the events of "1,2,5,6,7 and 9 am + names" is that a book? no. is it original research? no. Its a legitimate article. Thats my view. Im sure they did not find everything in
Dog poop girl in one and only source, and that is not transwikied to Wikibooks... conclusion:
-- Striver
Further, whe are not talking about "10,000 pages of every detail of a man's life", rather "THE man" 1'200'000'000 people try to imitate.
-- Striver 23:22, 15 July 2005 (UTC) reply
This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result of the debate was transwiki these three articles to Wikibooks. I see a lot of delete votes here, but from reading the comments made by them, many of them say this belongs in Wikibooks. Therefore, I will submit these articles to the transwiki queue. Sjakkalle (Check!) 08:15, 22 July 2005 (UTC) reply
Up for deletion are Events_with_Muhammad:_1, Events_with_Muhammad:_2, and Events_with_Muhammad:_3. ArmadniGeneral 7 July 2005 20:51 (UTC)
-- Striver 02:01, 15 July 2005 (UTC) reply
So, done!
Now, It clearly says
I really fail to see how it can be deleted or transwikied with all that said.
-- Striver, upset with Zora. 02:09, 15 July 2005 (UTC) reply
It can not be included in a biograpy, it would clog the biograpy and make it unrideable. And what about everybody else that are involved, are whe supposed to clog upp their biograpy as well?
Just take a look att the Battle of Bassorah, its obvious that it can be included in a biography, not to say in the biography of every single one included in it.
Its the same with this series, all the event Muhammad (as) did can not fitt in his biography, that is long enough as it is. And yes, they do have a relevance. If ti was me doing stuff nobody would care, but we are talking about the person that over one billion people are trying to imitate. What more could be relevant than report on actions that over a billion are imitating?
Marjas dedicate THEIR ENTIRE LIFE to read stuff like that so they can tell people if is allowed to listen to music or if its allowed to have an abortion: THIS IS THE MAIN SOURCE OF EVERYDAY ISLAM, the day-to-day practices of Muhammad!
Of course this would not fitt in a bok, but this is not a book, its a electronic encyclopedia and of course it does use other ways than books. I does not have everything on pages, it has one event per article so and all relevant persons can link to that event. This event tells a lot about how the Sahaba acted in their private life as well. It is the farthes thing from uninportant and it is set upp in best way possible: NOT everything in one long meaningless article that nobody care to read, rather, on event at a time so it can be linked to it whenever it becomes relevant..
Remeber this is not a book, information is not costly to keep and it has a value. Its not trash, its the preserved day-to-day life of the peoble that over one billion are imitating.
-- Striver 7 July 2005 22:22 (UTC)
Your analogi with Jesus (peace be upon him) does not work for several resons:
I repeat, this material can not be found in the Quran, in can not be found in a ordered manner in any book, its spread over volumes of books in a non-cronological order, and not even in one pice, its it often takes 4 hadithes in diffrent volumes to make sense one event! People dedicate their live to this, its not a small matter, its not easly available and it is definitly worth to represent in a encyclopedia that aimes to collect "all human knowledge"! Think about it, it may sound as every-day event to you, but remeber that it shapes the life of over on billion people that strive to mimic Muhammad's smalest action, including how to greet eachother! Its not godnight-tales!
I mean, if Rich Bagger can have a articel, i dont get why events that shape 1/6 of the world cant have an article! Take a look at hadith and sunnah and you will see that what im saying is correct!
It is WAY do much matterial to fitt in a biography, not even 1/10 000 would fitt in a biograpy, and even if it did, is it supposed to be repeted in every biograpy that of those whom partake in the event? This is the best solution, to have an article series, and link all involved to that article!
I mean, c'mon, this is not something i make money on, and its nothing WP looses money on, i just want to have Muhammads Sunnah represented on Wikipedia!
-- Striver 8 July 2005 00:13 (UTC)
Well, i see what you mean, but tell me, is the Hitler article coming from one single book?
Its like this:
Ther are several hadith that explain one given event. Scholar that have more knowledge than me have gone throughe the chain of narrations of them and authenticated them. The authentic hadithes can be found in diffrent collections, here for example. In one of those collections one can say x whent to home and ate a burger. the next hadith in the other part of the collection says that after x ate his burger, he whent to work.
Now, is it original research if i make a article that claims x whent home, ate a burger and then when to work?
In manny cases even puting the hadithes together is done in diffrent biograhis of the sahaba. Manny of this event simply would not fitt in a article biography of muhammad, since everything he did is recorded.
However, they are relvant, specialy while doing the biography of the sahab, in those cases it can be benefitial to link to those events instead of repeting them in every single biography.
Take for example Events with Muhammad: 1. in whose biography should it be included?
This cant be included in Muhammad, that article is to long as it is, however, it can not be included in any of the other biographies eather, since it is Muhammad that is the main character!
Oh, by the way, i found that event in a web site, but al of them dont come from the same website, that what makes it "not a book".
-- Striver 8 July 2005 18:39 (UTC)
hmm.. on second tough, i disagree... i ... i mean, i source says.... a event took place at 1, 5 and 7 am, a second source says what happened at 2, 6 an 9 am, and a third source gives the names, and i combine that in a article that says the events of "1,2,5,6,7 and 9 am + names" is that a book? no. is it original research? no. Its a legitimate article. Thats my view. Im sure they did not find everything in
Dog poop girl in one and only source, and that is not transwikied to Wikibooks... conclusion:
-- Striver
Further, whe are not talking about "10,000 pages of every detail of a man's life", rather "THE man" 1'200'000'000 people try to imitate.
-- Striver 23:22, 15 July 2005 (UTC) reply