In order to remain listed at Wikipedia:Requests for comment, at least two people need to show that they tried to resolve a dispute with this user and have failed. This must involve the same dispute with a single user, not different disputes or multiple users. The persons complaining must provide evidence of their efforts, and each of them must certify it by signing this page with ~~~~. If this does not happen within 48 hours of the creation of this dispute page (which was: ~~~~), the page will be deleted. The current date and time is: 18:34, 25 May 2024 (UTC).
Users should only edit one summary or view, other than to endorse.
This is a summary written by users who dispute this user's conduct. Users signing other sections ("Response" or "Outside views") should not edit the "Statement of the dispute" section.
Francespeabody has disrupted the Condoleezza Rice article and its Talk page with multiple personal attacks and uncivility with rampant accusations of racism and censorship. He alleges that the viewpoint of the African American community is not only underpresented in the article but that there are multiple editors actively censoring the article to prevent those viewpoints from being expressed and documented. The article is currently protected to allow for discussion of this issue and reign in an edit-war centered on this issue. Despite many requests to cease making personal attacks from multiple editors on both the Rice article's Talk page and his own Talk page, Francespeabody continues to make repeated and unsubstantiated allegations of racism and censorship.
{Users who tried and failed to resolve the dispute}
This is a summary written by the user whose conduct is disputed, or by other users who think that the dispute is unjustified and that the above summary is biased or incomplete. Users signing other sections ("Statement of the dispute" and "Outside Views") should not edit the "Response" section.
Wow, having the integrity to boldly state my position in what I am offering to the "discussion" is viewed as unthinkable by the looks of it. Each one of you offering a critical remark here lacks the courage of the conviction it would take to simply say what you are. Hiding like children behind the geneneral anonymity of the web. I simply said, lets act like adults and call a spade a spade! If every edit you make is "PRO CONDI" you are not Neutral. If you write purely form that POV, you clearly have an agenda and I have asked that in our "Discussion" we come clean about it so we can have a mature discourse.
Since most are happy to "pretend" to be scientfically disposed in all their dealings with Wikipedia I have limited my discussion and have just gone back to reverts, edits, and updates. No point in future conversations with folks who can't be honest with themselves let alone the larger goal of getting them to be honest in this public forum.
The scary truth about each party here is the articles they contribute to are generally right winged, conservative, America is Good the rest of the world is bad propaganda so to masquarade as anything but right-wingnut is just silly. Anyway, I will stop wasting my time in the discussion section and just go about neutralizing Wiki as a good citizen. -- Francespeabody 05:16, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
Users who endorse this summary:
Francespeabody alleges that the viewpoint of the African American community is underpresented in the article. He/she is correct. I've also tried to explain this on the talk page page of this article with little response. Though Francespeabody's responses have been extremely confrontational - and counterproductive in many ways - the issue of African American under-representation in the media and broader society is a very emotive and serious one. Frances has provided verifiable sources which he/she believes are being stifled and has reacted in a certain way. This could have been avoided if other users respected the inherent problems surrounding the lack of African American representation, and allowed for more discourse in the article concerning African American views of Dr Rice. At present this area of the page is unsatisfactory. "She has also been criticised by some members of the African American community" is not good enough.
I recommend that Frances take a step back from commenting on other editors as that is not helpful to the article or the case he/she is attempting to make - but I strongly recommend that other users take good look at this article and allow for more substantial African American viewpoints in the relevant area of the page. To undervalue this is wrong.
Users who endorse this summary:
I have closely monitored this dispute from the very beginning; while other editors have worked to constructively integrate both the criticism and response into the article, Francespeabody ( talk · contribs) has actively sought to quell any attempt to deviate from his/her accepted version of the article ( [1], [2], etc.), even committing a grievous violation of the three-revert rule. The user has insisted on maintaining a poorly formatted and very POV introductory paragraph whose citations do not support the assertions (see Talk:Condoleezza Rice#Introduction) while at the same time removing large sections of properly cited material from the "criticism" section.
It has been extremely difficult to work with Francespeabody ( talk · contribs), as the user has an admitted political agenda (see [3]). I can attest that several editors (myself included) have tried to placate the user by compromise, such as the retitling of the "criticism" section to "criticism and response". However, we have been met with ad hominem attacks that allege (among other things) blanket racism, conspiracy to silence the black community [4], questioning of the intelligence/race/motivation of other editors [5], and oddball suggestions referring to circles jerks and Steve-O. The various character attacks that I and other has been beset by produce a chilling effect on the article, where editors are intimidated or frightened by accusations of racism and become unwilling to edit. Policies such as no legal threats aim to prevent this suspension of free editing.
The filing of this RfC saddens me, as Francespeabody ( talk · contribs) is obviously a very well-read and intelligent contributor. I sincerely hope that as a result of this RfC the above user is able to work constructively with other editors, as I believe that he/she would make a fine Wikipedian once these few issues can be settled. Isopropyl 14:33, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
Other users who endorse this summary:
Francespeabody ( talk · contribs) has been an editor for about a month, during which time he has contributed substantially to about five articles. His initial editing history appears relatively civil. He has (at least before his disruptive behavior took over) raised several noteworthy concerns and arguments over the Rice article's content and neutrality. After a series of edit wars though, the article was submitted to the RfC process [6] on 12 July to help resolve the content dispute. Frances' behavior though quickly worsened to the point that any possible discussion solicited by that RfC could not be properly conducted. His personal, racial, regligious, and political attacks and accusations made toward other editors are unfortunate and clearly indicate an unwillingness to be civil and to respect Wikipedia policy and guidelines. He has also attempted to intimidate and/or discredit other editors by performing "private investigations" into editors' real personas, private backgrounds and histories, and other activities unrelated to this article. In summary his behavior is very disruptive and no progress is being made on dispute resolution. His behavior is unacceptable and inexcusable.
Frances does have some history of adding disputed material to other articles, seemingly in an attempt to push a particular point of view. The problem I see is not that such references shouldn't be added or that he chooses only to add material that is agreeable to his viewpoint, but instead the manner in which they are mis-characterized in the text with not only disregard for accuracy or using reliable sources, but in a manner that blatently pushes a contriversial point of view or makes false claims which are never even mentioned by those cited references. For example, on the Laura Bush article he references an ABC News article [7], but in his corresponding prose [8] he writes Larua Bush has been long criticized as being "Completely Detached From Reality"...'. His statement is completely unsubstantiated by the referenced article; and furthermore the quoted portion of the sentence was in its entirety ficticiously fabricated. Note that this phrasing, "completely detached from reality", was also added by Frances to this Rice article, also disputed as being a fabrication.
However, on his behalf, during roughly the same time period while the dispute over this article continued, it does appear as if Frances was quite capable of carrying on a civil and useful discussion on the Hillary Rodham Clinton talk page [9]. Although he makes his own political views well known and at times makes claims of a right-wing Wikipedia editorial conspiracy, it seems he made a good faith attempt at an NPOV series of discussions and edits on the Clinton page [I am not endorsing his opinions or reasoning, but just that he appeared to do so civily and in good faith with other editors to reach consensus].
Taken as a whole though his edits to both Rice's and Clinton's articles, combined with his many direct statements he has made regarding his intent to use Wikipedia as a voice to push his particular point of view (racially and politically) and to use Wikipedia to affect a political outcome is disturbing. Furthermore there seems to be no end to his continued disruptions. It is my hope that Francespeabody realize that his behavior has not only been extremely offensive and disruptive as well as eroding his own honor and perceived editorial trustworthiness, but has also been counterproductive to addressing the deficiencies in the article's content that he initially raised or in fairly addressing the behavior of other editors also involved in the article's dispute. Dmeranda 19:52, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
Other users who endorse this summary:
While I have only observed the Condoleeza Rice dispute, I have been involved in a dispute with the editor on the Scholars for 9/11 Truth page, where Frances has been repeatedly replacing neutral descriptive content with the POV of the group founder. He does not understand WP:NPOV nor WP:AUTO in outlining the neutral language required of articles, and additionally does not engage in discussions on the article talk page. Mmx1 05:30, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
As of 9 August, Frances is continuing to unilaterally reinsert, en bloc, a piece written by Mr. Fetzer in this article, skirting 3rr (so far) [10] [11] [12]. Frances has repeadedly added these verbatim entries under the misleading edit summary of "citation", even when it has been pointed out on the talk page that copying extensive, multi-paragraph statements is not a "citation". Additionally, the user has engaged in personal attacks [13] and has claimed that as a Marine I have motives for perpetuating censorship:
You are not Neutral and clearly your commitment to "United States Marine Corps" (Articles I've created) colors your opinion and exposes your motives for censorship
While I am not in fact a Marine, I do take offense to this uncivil blanket accusation.
Other users who endorse this summary:
All signed comments and talk not related to an endorsement should be directed to this page's discussion page. Discussion should not be added below. Discussion should be posted on the talk page. Threaded replies to another user's vote, endorsement, evidence, response, or comment should be posted to the talk page.
In order to remain listed at Wikipedia:Requests for comment, at least two people need to show that they tried to resolve a dispute with this user and have failed. This must involve the same dispute with a single user, not different disputes or multiple users. The persons complaining must provide evidence of their efforts, and each of them must certify it by signing this page with ~~~~. If this does not happen within 48 hours of the creation of this dispute page (which was: ~~~~), the page will be deleted. The current date and time is: 18:34, 25 May 2024 (UTC).
Users should only edit one summary or view, other than to endorse.
This is a summary written by users who dispute this user's conduct. Users signing other sections ("Response" or "Outside views") should not edit the "Statement of the dispute" section.
Francespeabody has disrupted the Condoleezza Rice article and its Talk page with multiple personal attacks and uncivility with rampant accusations of racism and censorship. He alleges that the viewpoint of the African American community is not only underpresented in the article but that there are multiple editors actively censoring the article to prevent those viewpoints from being expressed and documented. The article is currently protected to allow for discussion of this issue and reign in an edit-war centered on this issue. Despite many requests to cease making personal attacks from multiple editors on both the Rice article's Talk page and his own Talk page, Francespeabody continues to make repeated and unsubstantiated allegations of racism and censorship.
{Users who tried and failed to resolve the dispute}
This is a summary written by the user whose conduct is disputed, or by other users who think that the dispute is unjustified and that the above summary is biased or incomplete. Users signing other sections ("Statement of the dispute" and "Outside Views") should not edit the "Response" section.
Wow, having the integrity to boldly state my position in what I am offering to the "discussion" is viewed as unthinkable by the looks of it. Each one of you offering a critical remark here lacks the courage of the conviction it would take to simply say what you are. Hiding like children behind the geneneral anonymity of the web. I simply said, lets act like adults and call a spade a spade! If every edit you make is "PRO CONDI" you are not Neutral. If you write purely form that POV, you clearly have an agenda and I have asked that in our "Discussion" we come clean about it so we can have a mature discourse.
Since most are happy to "pretend" to be scientfically disposed in all their dealings with Wikipedia I have limited my discussion and have just gone back to reverts, edits, and updates. No point in future conversations with folks who can't be honest with themselves let alone the larger goal of getting them to be honest in this public forum.
The scary truth about each party here is the articles they contribute to are generally right winged, conservative, America is Good the rest of the world is bad propaganda so to masquarade as anything but right-wingnut is just silly. Anyway, I will stop wasting my time in the discussion section and just go about neutralizing Wiki as a good citizen. -- Francespeabody 05:16, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
Users who endorse this summary:
Francespeabody alleges that the viewpoint of the African American community is underpresented in the article. He/she is correct. I've also tried to explain this on the talk page page of this article with little response. Though Francespeabody's responses have been extremely confrontational - and counterproductive in many ways - the issue of African American under-representation in the media and broader society is a very emotive and serious one. Frances has provided verifiable sources which he/she believes are being stifled and has reacted in a certain way. This could have been avoided if other users respected the inherent problems surrounding the lack of African American representation, and allowed for more discourse in the article concerning African American views of Dr Rice. At present this area of the page is unsatisfactory. "She has also been criticised by some members of the African American community" is not good enough.
I recommend that Frances take a step back from commenting on other editors as that is not helpful to the article or the case he/she is attempting to make - but I strongly recommend that other users take good look at this article and allow for more substantial African American viewpoints in the relevant area of the page. To undervalue this is wrong.
Users who endorse this summary:
I have closely monitored this dispute from the very beginning; while other editors have worked to constructively integrate both the criticism and response into the article, Francespeabody ( talk · contribs) has actively sought to quell any attempt to deviate from his/her accepted version of the article ( [1], [2], etc.), even committing a grievous violation of the three-revert rule. The user has insisted on maintaining a poorly formatted and very POV introductory paragraph whose citations do not support the assertions (see Talk:Condoleezza Rice#Introduction) while at the same time removing large sections of properly cited material from the "criticism" section.
It has been extremely difficult to work with Francespeabody ( talk · contribs), as the user has an admitted political agenda (see [3]). I can attest that several editors (myself included) have tried to placate the user by compromise, such as the retitling of the "criticism" section to "criticism and response". However, we have been met with ad hominem attacks that allege (among other things) blanket racism, conspiracy to silence the black community [4], questioning of the intelligence/race/motivation of other editors [5], and oddball suggestions referring to circles jerks and Steve-O. The various character attacks that I and other has been beset by produce a chilling effect on the article, where editors are intimidated or frightened by accusations of racism and become unwilling to edit. Policies such as no legal threats aim to prevent this suspension of free editing.
The filing of this RfC saddens me, as Francespeabody ( talk · contribs) is obviously a very well-read and intelligent contributor. I sincerely hope that as a result of this RfC the above user is able to work constructively with other editors, as I believe that he/she would make a fine Wikipedian once these few issues can be settled. Isopropyl 14:33, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
Other users who endorse this summary:
Francespeabody ( talk · contribs) has been an editor for about a month, during which time he has contributed substantially to about five articles. His initial editing history appears relatively civil. He has (at least before his disruptive behavior took over) raised several noteworthy concerns and arguments over the Rice article's content and neutrality. After a series of edit wars though, the article was submitted to the RfC process [6] on 12 July to help resolve the content dispute. Frances' behavior though quickly worsened to the point that any possible discussion solicited by that RfC could not be properly conducted. His personal, racial, regligious, and political attacks and accusations made toward other editors are unfortunate and clearly indicate an unwillingness to be civil and to respect Wikipedia policy and guidelines. He has also attempted to intimidate and/or discredit other editors by performing "private investigations" into editors' real personas, private backgrounds and histories, and other activities unrelated to this article. In summary his behavior is very disruptive and no progress is being made on dispute resolution. His behavior is unacceptable and inexcusable.
Frances does have some history of adding disputed material to other articles, seemingly in an attempt to push a particular point of view. The problem I see is not that such references shouldn't be added or that he chooses only to add material that is agreeable to his viewpoint, but instead the manner in which they are mis-characterized in the text with not only disregard for accuracy or using reliable sources, but in a manner that blatently pushes a contriversial point of view or makes false claims which are never even mentioned by those cited references. For example, on the Laura Bush article he references an ABC News article [7], but in his corresponding prose [8] he writes Larua Bush has been long criticized as being "Completely Detached From Reality"...'. His statement is completely unsubstantiated by the referenced article; and furthermore the quoted portion of the sentence was in its entirety ficticiously fabricated. Note that this phrasing, "completely detached from reality", was also added by Frances to this Rice article, also disputed as being a fabrication.
However, on his behalf, during roughly the same time period while the dispute over this article continued, it does appear as if Frances was quite capable of carrying on a civil and useful discussion on the Hillary Rodham Clinton talk page [9]. Although he makes his own political views well known and at times makes claims of a right-wing Wikipedia editorial conspiracy, it seems he made a good faith attempt at an NPOV series of discussions and edits on the Clinton page [I am not endorsing his opinions or reasoning, but just that he appeared to do so civily and in good faith with other editors to reach consensus].
Taken as a whole though his edits to both Rice's and Clinton's articles, combined with his many direct statements he has made regarding his intent to use Wikipedia as a voice to push his particular point of view (racially and politically) and to use Wikipedia to affect a political outcome is disturbing. Furthermore there seems to be no end to his continued disruptions. It is my hope that Francespeabody realize that his behavior has not only been extremely offensive and disruptive as well as eroding his own honor and perceived editorial trustworthiness, but has also been counterproductive to addressing the deficiencies in the article's content that he initially raised or in fairly addressing the behavior of other editors also involved in the article's dispute. Dmeranda 19:52, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
Other users who endorse this summary:
While I have only observed the Condoleeza Rice dispute, I have been involved in a dispute with the editor on the Scholars for 9/11 Truth page, where Frances has been repeatedly replacing neutral descriptive content with the POV of the group founder. He does not understand WP:NPOV nor WP:AUTO in outlining the neutral language required of articles, and additionally does not engage in discussions on the article talk page. Mmx1 05:30, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
As of 9 August, Frances is continuing to unilaterally reinsert, en bloc, a piece written by Mr. Fetzer in this article, skirting 3rr (so far) [10] [11] [12]. Frances has repeadedly added these verbatim entries under the misleading edit summary of "citation", even when it has been pointed out on the talk page that copying extensive, multi-paragraph statements is not a "citation". Additionally, the user has engaged in personal attacks [13] and has claimed that as a Marine I have motives for perpetuating censorship:
You are not Neutral and clearly your commitment to "United States Marine Corps" (Articles I've created) colors your opinion and exposes your motives for censorship
While I am not in fact a Marine, I do take offense to this uncivil blanket accusation.
Other users who endorse this summary:
All signed comments and talk not related to an endorsement should be directed to this page's discussion page. Discussion should not be added below. Discussion should be posted on the talk page. Threaded replies to another user's vote, endorsement, evidence, response, or comment should be posted to the talk page.