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June 21 Information
In the history of the big North American sports leagues, what are the examples of a season's MVP coming from a team that missed the playoffs that particular season? I could look up our lists of MVPs, but that would take a bit of digging, so could at least some examples be listed here? Narutolovehinata5 t c csd new 03:25, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- Not a professional MVP, but Paul Hornung is the sole winner of the Heisman Trophy from a losing team; Notre Dame went 2-8 in 1956, making him by far the Heisman winner from the worst team. Many contend that Jim Brown should have won the award that year, but racism kept him from doing so. Hornung was a great player who went on to an illustrious pro career as well, but his Heisman win was one of the most controversial in history. -- Jayron 32 03:31, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- More on pro athletes. In pro baseball and pro football, very few teams made the postseason for most of their history. Major League Baseball only had the World Series with no pre-World Series playoffs until 1969, so many of the early league winners of the
Major League Baseball Most Valuable Player Award likely did not play in that season's post-season. Likewise, the NFL only had the NFL Championship Game until 1967 (the year of Super Bowl II; the first four Super Bowls were contested between two different leagues which merged in 1970 to form the modern NFL). Also, the NFL itself does not sanction an "official" MVP award; any of the various press-awarded
National Football League Most Valuable Player Awards from before 1969 were likely to come from non-Championship playing teams. Basketball and Hockey are much less likely to have had such a player, as for most of their history, more than 50% of the NBA and NHL have made the postseason playoff tournaments. You can research such players who may have played for non-playoff teams at
NBA Most Valuable Player Award and
Hart Memorial Trophy (NHL), if there are any. --
Jayron
32 03:39, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- Most recent baseball MVP to miss the playoffs: Albert Pujols, 2008. The Cardinals did not make the playoffs for the 2008 Major League Baseball season. I didn't check further back than that. -- Jayron 32 03:46, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- By the AP list of NFL MVPs, every single one of them has made the post season the year they won it, even among those from before 1967 (I checked them all). A near make was Jim Brown in 1958: the NFL had a special play-off game that year for the Eastern Conference, as the Giants and Browns were tied for the Conference lead; the Browns lost that game, but technically the Browns did play a (special) postseason game that year. Other than that, the rest are all clear post-season players. -- Jayron 32 03:55, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- I haven't checked every NBA winner, but I spot checked those from teams I don't remember playing in championship games in various years; all of them made the playoffs, so I am fairly certain no NBA MVP winner has ever missed the playoffs. -- Jayron 32 04:00, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- Checking the NHL, I found two winners of the Hart Trophy I can find who didn't make the Stanley Cup Playoffs: Tommy Anderson of the Brooklyn Americans in the 1941–42 NHL season; an amazing feat given that six of the seven teams made the playoffs. This was the last pre- Original Six NHL year; after that the league was six teams, four of which made the playoffs. In the 1953–54 NHL season, Al Rollins for the Blackhawks missed the playoffs that year. I kinda ran out of energy after finding those two; there may have been others more recently than that, but there's at least two of them. -- Jayron 32 04:09, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- More recently, in the 1987–88 NHL season, Mario Lemieux won the Hart Trophy despite the Penguins failing to reach the playoffs. And, only just after Rollins, Andy Bathgate won for the New York Rangers, but they finished fifth of six teams and did not qualify. Harrias talk 23:56, 25 June 2013 (UTC)
- As you suggest, it's not uncommon in baseball. Two that come to mind are Ernie Banks with the 1950s Cubs, twice yet; and Andre Dawson with the Cubs in 1987 or so. In the 1950s, the Cubs and Phils were in a perennial battle for last place, and it was said that "without Banks, the Cubs would finish in Albuquerque." ←
Baseball Bugs
What's up, Doc?
carrots→ 04:25, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- You can add Hank Sauer to the list of MVPs from bad Cubs teams, in 1952. Some other recent ones in MLB: Ryan Howard, for the Phillies in 2006; Barry Bonds for the Giants in 1993, 2001 and 2004; Alex Rodriguez (Rangers, 2003); Larry Walker (Rockies, 1997); Cal Ripken (Orioles, 1991); Robin Yount (Brewers, 1989); George Bell (Blue Jays, 1987, which is also the year Dawson won the award for the Cubs). And many others before that, as there were ever fewer playoff teams. Also both 1994 winners ( Frank Thomas and Jeff Bagwell) but because there was no postseason that year. -- Xuxl ( talk) 12:08, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- As you suggest, it's not uncommon in baseball. Two that come to mind are Ernie Banks with the 1950s Cubs, twice yet; and Andre Dawson with the Cubs in 1987 or so. In the 1950s, the Cubs and Phils were in a perennial battle for last place, and it was said that "without Banks, the Cubs would finish in Albuquerque." ←
Baseball Bugs
What's up, Doc?
carrots→ 04:25, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
Last April, I asked a question about teams that won a championship one season but missed the playoffs the following season. Now, I was wondering: what about the reverse? Has there ever been cases in the NFL, MLB, NBA, NHL, MLS and CFL, or any major or prominent sports league where a team missed the playoffs one season but won the championship the following season? If there are any examples from the MLB, as there were no playoffs prior to 1969, only post-1969 teams should be listed. Again, I could just simply look at our articles, but that would take a bit of digging and effort. Narutolovehinata5 t c csd new 12:24, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- It's extremely common in MLB, given how few playoff teams there are, even today. More interesting in MLB is going from "worst-to-first" which happened to both teams in the
1991 World Series; the Atlanta Braves and the Minnesota Twins had both finished last in their respective divisions in 1990. The Tampa Bay Rays reached the
2008 World Series after not only finishing last in the AL East in 2007, but never coming close to a winning record in their 10 previous years of existence. The Mets were 9th out of 10 teams in the National League in 1968 before winning the World Series in
1969; like the Rays, they had never had a prior winning season. The Florida Marlins also won their first World Series, in
1997, in their first-ever winning season. None of those last three teams had ever made the postseason before, as no team in major league history has ever made the postseason with a losing record (although it could have happened in 1994 if the postseason had not been cancelled). The Los Angeles Dodgers won the
1959 World Series after finishing 7th out of 8 teams in 1958. There were other teams who had huge turnarounds like that. --
Xuxl (
talk) 12:39, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The '04 Chicago White Sox came in second in their division and then went on to win the World Series in 2005.
Dismas|
(talk) 12:48, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- It has happened frequently in the NFL as well, most recently in 2009: The New Orleans Saints had finished last in the NFC South in 2008 (though a respectable 8-8 for a last place team), and won the 2009 Super Bowl. In 1999, the 8-8 Baltimore Ravens missed the playoffs, and won the Super Bowl the next year. There's likely more as you count back further, again very likely as before 1967, there was no Playoffs, just a Championship Game. -- Jayron 32 20:58, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The '04 Chicago White Sox came in second in their division and then went on to win the World Series in 2005.
Dismas|
(talk) 12:48, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The 1969–70 Montreal Canadiens missed the playoffs based on goal difference, the first time they missed since 1947-48, and in 1970-71 won the 1971 Stanley Cup Finals. (read the regular season account of the 1969-70 season) The 1989–90 Pittsburgh Penguins missed the playoffs by one point. In 1990-91 they won the 1991 Stanley Cup Finals. Their first ever win.
- Apart from the listed examples, situations have happened in English football, which could be compared to a sports franchise in an American sports league not qualifying for the playoffs sections of a specific season. However these situations in English football/soccer are, in my opinion, more satisfying and compelling to club members and supporters alike, due to their rare nature. I am of course referring to when a team spends a season in a league that is not the top-flight (Modern-day nPower Championship), which in this case is going to be the 1904-05 English Second Division, in which Liverpool were in the second division, won it, were promoted, and subsequently won the First Division the next season, a feat which I would consider more impressive than simply missing out on a playoffs, considering we are talking about a team who spent the previous season not even in the same division. Nicholasprado ( talk) 07:33, 22 June 2013 (UTC)
Hello, I was just wondering why the movies The Omega Man and The Last Man On Earth are not linked some how with each other? They indivdually are both linked to I Am Legend. Thank you for your time — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pittsb02 ( talk • contribs) 16:54, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The article for each of the films makes mention of the other two adaptations and the original source novel by Richard Matheson. What other linking were you expecting? Astronaut ( talk) 17:50, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
| Entertainment desk | ||
|---|---|---|
| < June 20 | << May | June | Jul >> | June 22 > |
| Welcome to the Wikipedia Entertainment Reference Desk Archives |
|---|
| The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current reference desk pages. |
June 21 Information
In the history of the big North American sports leagues, what are the examples of a season's MVP coming from a team that missed the playoffs that particular season? I could look up our lists of MVPs, but that would take a bit of digging, so could at least some examples be listed here? Narutolovehinata5 t c csd new 03:25, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- Not a professional MVP, but Paul Hornung is the sole winner of the Heisman Trophy from a losing team; Notre Dame went 2-8 in 1956, making him by far the Heisman winner from the worst team. Many contend that Jim Brown should have won the award that year, but racism kept him from doing so. Hornung was a great player who went on to an illustrious pro career as well, but his Heisman win was one of the most controversial in history. -- Jayron 32 03:31, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- More on pro athletes. In pro baseball and pro football, very few teams made the postseason for most of their history. Major League Baseball only had the World Series with no pre-World Series playoffs until 1969, so many of the early league winners of the
Major League Baseball Most Valuable Player Award likely did not play in that season's post-season. Likewise, the NFL only had the NFL Championship Game until 1967 (the year of Super Bowl II; the first four Super Bowls were contested between two different leagues which merged in 1970 to form the modern NFL). Also, the NFL itself does not sanction an "official" MVP award; any of the various press-awarded
National Football League Most Valuable Player Awards from before 1969 were likely to come from non-Championship playing teams. Basketball and Hockey are much less likely to have had such a player, as for most of their history, more than 50% of the NBA and NHL have made the postseason playoff tournaments. You can research such players who may have played for non-playoff teams at
NBA Most Valuable Player Award and
Hart Memorial Trophy (NHL), if there are any. --
Jayron
32 03:39, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- Most recent baseball MVP to miss the playoffs: Albert Pujols, 2008. The Cardinals did not make the playoffs for the 2008 Major League Baseball season. I didn't check further back than that. -- Jayron 32 03:46, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- By the AP list of NFL MVPs, every single one of them has made the post season the year they won it, even among those from before 1967 (I checked them all). A near make was Jim Brown in 1958: the NFL had a special play-off game that year for the Eastern Conference, as the Giants and Browns were tied for the Conference lead; the Browns lost that game, but technically the Browns did play a (special) postseason game that year. Other than that, the rest are all clear post-season players. -- Jayron 32 03:55, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- I haven't checked every NBA winner, but I spot checked those from teams I don't remember playing in championship games in various years; all of them made the playoffs, so I am fairly certain no NBA MVP winner has ever missed the playoffs. -- Jayron 32 04:00, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- Checking the NHL, I found two winners of the Hart Trophy I can find who didn't make the Stanley Cup Playoffs: Tommy Anderson of the Brooklyn Americans in the 1941–42 NHL season; an amazing feat given that six of the seven teams made the playoffs. This was the last pre- Original Six NHL year; after that the league was six teams, four of which made the playoffs. In the 1953–54 NHL season, Al Rollins for the Blackhawks missed the playoffs that year. I kinda ran out of energy after finding those two; there may have been others more recently than that, but there's at least two of them. -- Jayron 32 04:09, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- More recently, in the 1987–88 NHL season, Mario Lemieux won the Hart Trophy despite the Penguins failing to reach the playoffs. And, only just after Rollins, Andy Bathgate won for the New York Rangers, but they finished fifth of six teams and did not qualify. Harrias talk 23:56, 25 June 2013 (UTC)
- As you suggest, it's not uncommon in baseball. Two that come to mind are Ernie Banks with the 1950s Cubs, twice yet; and Andre Dawson with the Cubs in 1987 or so. In the 1950s, the Cubs and Phils were in a perennial battle for last place, and it was said that "without Banks, the Cubs would finish in Albuquerque." ←
Baseball Bugs
What's up, Doc?
carrots→ 04:25, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- You can add Hank Sauer to the list of MVPs from bad Cubs teams, in 1952. Some other recent ones in MLB: Ryan Howard, for the Phillies in 2006; Barry Bonds for the Giants in 1993, 2001 and 2004; Alex Rodriguez (Rangers, 2003); Larry Walker (Rockies, 1997); Cal Ripken (Orioles, 1991); Robin Yount (Brewers, 1989); George Bell (Blue Jays, 1987, which is also the year Dawson won the award for the Cubs). And many others before that, as there were ever fewer playoff teams. Also both 1994 winners ( Frank Thomas and Jeff Bagwell) but because there was no postseason that year. -- Xuxl ( talk) 12:08, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- As you suggest, it's not uncommon in baseball. Two that come to mind are Ernie Banks with the 1950s Cubs, twice yet; and Andre Dawson with the Cubs in 1987 or so. In the 1950s, the Cubs and Phils were in a perennial battle for last place, and it was said that "without Banks, the Cubs would finish in Albuquerque." ←
Baseball Bugs
What's up, Doc?
carrots→ 04:25, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
Last April, I asked a question about teams that won a championship one season but missed the playoffs the following season. Now, I was wondering: what about the reverse? Has there ever been cases in the NFL, MLB, NBA, NHL, MLS and CFL, or any major or prominent sports league where a team missed the playoffs one season but won the championship the following season? If there are any examples from the MLB, as there were no playoffs prior to 1969, only post-1969 teams should be listed. Again, I could just simply look at our articles, but that would take a bit of digging and effort. Narutolovehinata5 t c csd new 12:24, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- It's extremely common in MLB, given how few playoff teams there are, even today. More interesting in MLB is going from "worst-to-first" which happened to both teams in the
1991 World Series; the Atlanta Braves and the Minnesota Twins had both finished last in their respective divisions in 1990. The Tampa Bay Rays reached the
2008 World Series after not only finishing last in the AL East in 2007, but never coming close to a winning record in their 10 previous years of existence. The Mets were 9th out of 10 teams in the National League in 1968 before winning the World Series in
1969; like the Rays, they had never had a prior winning season. The Florida Marlins also won their first World Series, in
1997, in their first-ever winning season. None of those last three teams had ever made the postseason before, as no team in major league history has ever made the postseason with a losing record (although it could have happened in 1994 if the postseason had not been cancelled). The Los Angeles Dodgers won the
1959 World Series after finishing 7th out of 8 teams in 1958. There were other teams who had huge turnarounds like that. --
Xuxl (
talk) 12:39, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The '04 Chicago White Sox came in second in their division and then went on to win the World Series in 2005.
Dismas|
(talk) 12:48, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- It has happened frequently in the NFL as well, most recently in 2009: The New Orleans Saints had finished last in the NFC South in 2008 (though a respectable 8-8 for a last place team), and won the 2009 Super Bowl. In 1999, the 8-8 Baltimore Ravens missed the playoffs, and won the Super Bowl the next year. There's likely more as you count back further, again very likely as before 1967, there was no Playoffs, just a Championship Game. -- Jayron 32 20:58, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The '04 Chicago White Sox came in second in their division and then went on to win the World Series in 2005.
Dismas|
(talk) 12:48, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The 1969–70 Montreal Canadiens missed the playoffs based on goal difference, the first time they missed since 1947-48, and in 1970-71 won the 1971 Stanley Cup Finals. (read the regular season account of the 1969-70 season) The 1989–90 Pittsburgh Penguins missed the playoffs by one point. In 1990-91 they won the 1991 Stanley Cup Finals. Their first ever win.
- Apart from the listed examples, situations have happened in English football, which could be compared to a sports franchise in an American sports league not qualifying for the playoffs sections of a specific season. However these situations in English football/soccer are, in my opinion, more satisfying and compelling to club members and supporters alike, due to their rare nature. I am of course referring to when a team spends a season in a league that is not the top-flight (Modern-day nPower Championship), which in this case is going to be the 1904-05 English Second Division, in which Liverpool were in the second division, won it, were promoted, and subsequently won the First Division the next season, a feat which I would consider more impressive than simply missing out on a playoffs, considering we are talking about a team who spent the previous season not even in the same division. Nicholasprado ( talk) 07:33, 22 June 2013 (UTC)
Hello, I was just wondering why the movies The Omega Man and The Last Man On Earth are not linked some how with each other? They indivdually are both linked to I Am Legend. Thank you for your time — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pittsb02 ( talk • contribs) 16:54, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
- The article for each of the films makes mention of the other two adaptations and the original source novel by Richard Matheson. What other linking were you expecting? Astronaut ( talk) 17:50, 21 June 2013 (UTC)