A script has been used to generate a semi-
automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and
house style; it can be found on the
automated peer review page for July 2008.
This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because I'm thinking about nominating it to be a Featured Article, but I would like to make sure that it is at that point...I don't want it to fail horribly. =) So basically I'm asking for people to read through the article and tell me A) What is wrong with it and B) If it has a chance at
WP:FAC.
You said you wanted to know what to work on before taking to FAC, so I looked at the sourcing and referencing with that in mind. I reviewed the article's sources as I would at FAC.
Per the MOS, you don't want to use the curly quotes, use block quotes instead.
Those are the ISBN's for the trade paperback edition and hardback edition: "In 1977, The Sword of Shannara was simultaneously released as a trade paperback[8] by Ballantine Books and hardback[9] by Random House.[10][11]" (8*9 are the ISBN's.) I think that's right..I didn't put those in there. (I think
DanDs did.) the_ed1718:53, 3 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Hope this helps. Please note that I don't watchlist Peer Reviews I've done. If you have a question about something, you'll have to drop a note on my talk page to get my attention. (My watchlist is already WAY too long, adding peer reviews would make things much worse.) 15:52, 2 August 2008 (UTC)
Holy cow, I thought you meant that quotes that are longer than four lines must be normal...and on my screen only two are less--one that is 2 lines, one that is 3; and I'm the 2 now...The three-line {{quote}} is needed, I think; the line directly following starts with Brooks has also commented......I think that the quote needs to be set apart. the_ed1702:22, 10 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Do you really need three references that the book was published in hardback??? ... hardback[9] by Random House.[10][11]
Done and 3 images illustrate the plot; 2 are two different covers; 1 illustrates all of the characters...I think it's alright... the_ed1700:55, 8 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Write the plot summary and article from an out of universe perspective - see
WP:IN-U. I also have read that plot sumamries are supposed to be no more than 900 words - this seems a bit long.
I'll try to rewrite it...may need some help...but as for the word count, this is a long (726 pgs.) book with a lot going on in many different settings...it would be far and beyond in-universe if it were any shorter! No one would understand a thing! the_ed1700:55, 8 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Provide context for the reader, I have not read this book and the character list tells me nothing about the characters (yes, many are linked, but a phrase or two here would help)
Shea Ohmsford, the protagonist, Flick's adopted brother and the decendant of Jerle Shannara. Shea must find an ancient magical sword, the Sword of Shannara, and use it to destroy the antagonist, the Warlock Lord.
I would try to use independent third party sources more - Major themes is all Brooks, what do others say about the themes? For a book that is as disparaged by some as this one is, only quoting the author is very POV.
I line in a town of maybe 5,000, and my local county library has no old magazines (they keep them for only a year due to a lack of space). My old high school's library has magazines from then--except they are magazines like People and National Geographic. -_- So for a book that came out in '77, I'll need help to change this... the_ed1702:22, 10 August 2008 (UTC)reply
I will preface my comments by saying that I do not generally weigh in on literature FACs, but I do not think this is ready. Model articles are useful and
The Lord of the Rings is a FA (from June 2006, so standards have only gotten tighter for FAs since). A more recent novel FA is
The General in His Labyrinth. A few points of comparison:
Neither has anywhere near as many fair use images as this does (LOTR has four - three are book covers, one is a Tolkien map, GIHL has the book cover)
The plot summaries of each book (counting LOTR as 3 books) are shorter, LOTR has no character section, GIHL has one but does not go into the level of detail, especially on minor characters
Both have many more references and cite many more idenpendent third party sources - compare the Themes in GIHL and the Themes here
added more.
Both have sections and information which this lacks.
Look at the parts of this article which are not Plot or Characters or the lead - it is quite short. Length is not an FA criterion, but comprehensiveness is.
Added quotes from Herbert.
PR is all suggestions, but in FAC requests are actionable (you must do them unless you can point to a valid reason why not).
Keeping the group portrait at a set pixel width will not pass FAC, it has to be thumb (infobox image is OK).
Done
NFCC concerns (too many fair use images used primarily for decoration) will be a problem at FAC.
Not enough outside sources / refs will be a problem.
Done added more
Block quotes that are less than four lines will be a problem (although that depends on screen resolution too). Only the quote that starts I would set my adventure story in an imaginary world, a vast, sprawling, mythical world like that of Tolkien ... is four lines on my computer, all the others are two lines (and the second line is not full)
But on my computer....they are longer...
Refs that are essectially duplicates will be a problem (current refs 19, 20 and 21 could all be combined into "Shippey, Tom (2000). J.R.R. Tolkien: Author of the Century. London: HarperCollins, 2001 paperback, 319-320."
Done
No ISBNs for books will be a problem.
What missing ISBNs?
This is not ready for FAC as I see it. A good thing to do is look at FAs that are models, read their FAC pages (linked from the talk) and read / follow some current FAC noms to get an idea of the issues that come up. This is a good article, but needs a lot of work to get to FA - can you get books via Inter Library Loan?
Ruhrfisch><>°°14:18, 14 August 2008 (UTC)reply
A script has been used to generate a semi-
automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and
house style; it can be found on the
automated peer review page for July 2008.
This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because I'm thinking about nominating it to be a Featured Article, but I would like to make sure that it is at that point...I don't want it to fail horribly. =) So basically I'm asking for people to read through the article and tell me A) What is wrong with it and B) If it has a chance at
WP:FAC.
You said you wanted to know what to work on before taking to FAC, so I looked at the sourcing and referencing with that in mind. I reviewed the article's sources as I would at FAC.
Per the MOS, you don't want to use the curly quotes, use block quotes instead.
Those are the ISBN's for the trade paperback edition and hardback edition: "In 1977, The Sword of Shannara was simultaneously released as a trade paperback[8] by Ballantine Books and hardback[9] by Random House.[10][11]" (8*9 are the ISBN's.) I think that's right..I didn't put those in there. (I think
DanDs did.) the_ed1718:53, 3 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Hope this helps. Please note that I don't watchlist Peer Reviews I've done. If you have a question about something, you'll have to drop a note on my talk page to get my attention. (My watchlist is already WAY too long, adding peer reviews would make things much worse.) 15:52, 2 August 2008 (UTC)
Holy cow, I thought you meant that quotes that are longer than four lines must be normal...and on my screen only two are less--one that is 2 lines, one that is 3; and I'm the 2 now...The three-line {{quote}} is needed, I think; the line directly following starts with Brooks has also commented......I think that the quote needs to be set apart. the_ed1702:22, 10 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Do you really need three references that the book was published in hardback??? ... hardback[9] by Random House.[10][11]
Done and 3 images illustrate the plot; 2 are two different covers; 1 illustrates all of the characters...I think it's alright... the_ed1700:55, 8 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Write the plot summary and article from an out of universe perspective - see
WP:IN-U. I also have read that plot sumamries are supposed to be no more than 900 words - this seems a bit long.
I'll try to rewrite it...may need some help...but as for the word count, this is a long (726 pgs.) book with a lot going on in many different settings...it would be far and beyond in-universe if it were any shorter! No one would understand a thing! the_ed1700:55, 8 August 2008 (UTC)reply
Provide context for the reader, I have not read this book and the character list tells me nothing about the characters (yes, many are linked, but a phrase or two here would help)
Shea Ohmsford, the protagonist, Flick's adopted brother and the decendant of Jerle Shannara. Shea must find an ancient magical sword, the Sword of Shannara, and use it to destroy the antagonist, the Warlock Lord.
I would try to use independent third party sources more - Major themes is all Brooks, what do others say about the themes? For a book that is as disparaged by some as this one is, only quoting the author is very POV.
I line in a town of maybe 5,000, and my local county library has no old magazines (they keep them for only a year due to a lack of space). My old high school's library has magazines from then--except they are magazines like People and National Geographic. -_- So for a book that came out in '77, I'll need help to change this... the_ed1702:22, 10 August 2008 (UTC)reply
I will preface my comments by saying that I do not generally weigh in on literature FACs, but I do not think this is ready. Model articles are useful and
The Lord of the Rings is a FA (from June 2006, so standards have only gotten tighter for FAs since). A more recent novel FA is
The General in His Labyrinth. A few points of comparison:
Neither has anywhere near as many fair use images as this does (LOTR has four - three are book covers, one is a Tolkien map, GIHL has the book cover)
The plot summaries of each book (counting LOTR as 3 books) are shorter, LOTR has no character section, GIHL has one but does not go into the level of detail, especially on minor characters
Both have many more references and cite many more idenpendent third party sources - compare the Themes in GIHL and the Themes here
added more.
Both have sections and information which this lacks.
Look at the parts of this article which are not Plot or Characters or the lead - it is quite short. Length is not an FA criterion, but comprehensiveness is.
Added quotes from Herbert.
PR is all suggestions, but in FAC requests are actionable (you must do them unless you can point to a valid reason why not).
Keeping the group portrait at a set pixel width will not pass FAC, it has to be thumb (infobox image is OK).
Done
NFCC concerns (too many fair use images used primarily for decoration) will be a problem at FAC.
Not enough outside sources / refs will be a problem.
Done added more
Block quotes that are less than four lines will be a problem (although that depends on screen resolution too). Only the quote that starts I would set my adventure story in an imaginary world, a vast, sprawling, mythical world like that of Tolkien ... is four lines on my computer, all the others are two lines (and the second line is not full)
But on my computer....they are longer...
Refs that are essectially duplicates will be a problem (current refs 19, 20 and 21 could all be combined into "Shippey, Tom (2000). J.R.R. Tolkien: Author of the Century. London: HarperCollins, 2001 paperback, 319-320."
Done
No ISBNs for books will be a problem.
What missing ISBNs?
This is not ready for FAC as I see it. A good thing to do is look at FAs that are models, read their FAC pages (linked from the talk) and read / follow some current FAC noms to get an idea of the issues that come up. This is a good article, but needs a lot of work to get to FA - can you get books via Inter Library Loan?
Ruhrfisch><>°°14:18, 14 August 2008 (UTC)reply