The article was not promoted 02:08, 1 June 2007.
100% sure
90% sure
80% sure
Kmarinas86 04:07, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
I'm not sure what the three recent failed GAs have to do with it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&oldid=108627105 http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&oldid=126448977 http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&oldid=127161806
They have changed signficantly. So it's not exactly the same article. However, I do admit that the prose is choppy. This has been due to my recent simplifying of the English. I'll have to turn some pairs of sentences into complex sentences, though I'm not sure how fast that can be resolved. I also admit some of the criticism concerning Raëlism is in the Clonaid and Raël articles. But I think having the same criticism in all three articles is a bit redundant. Some people may think the criticism of Clonaid should be in the Raëlian Church article, but I think that has already been somewhat addressed. Despite that, I believe some will see that as a deficiency preventing this article from FA status. If that becomes signficant enough, I will have to merge those articles (under what name?). The criticism section is reaching the point where it is getting larger than the rest of the article. If that's what is required for this article to get to FA status sometime in the future, then I will do it. I may decide to find 100 third-party sources. But if they all say about the same thing, then there isn't really much to add. I'll see if there are new criticisms, as I think the current ones have already been exhausted in the article. A Google News search indicates that the vast majority of the criticism is centered on the cloning claim ( Clonaid):
raelian critic OR controversy OR controversies OR questioned -clone -cloning (13 results) From looking at the previews, none of them appear to be relevant.
raelian critic OR controversy OR controversies OR questioned (168 results)
clonaid critic OR controversy OR controversies OR questioned (200 results)
There appears to be no scholar more serious than Susan J. Palmer when it comes to going into the Raëlian movement and doing research. It appears criticism from a scholarly angle has already been exhausted. On top of the immense repetition of the Clonaid subject by the media, I think there is little more than a 10% expansion possible on the Criticism section in Raëlian Church unless if material is merged from other articles. Kmarinas86 17:09, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Ok, so far, I made some attempts to improve the prose as well as adding a new "Controversy" section (a milder form of the "Criticism" section). I know that it is almost a law that some areas of the article will have better prose than others. However, what is the best and worst part of the Raëlian Church article when it comes to prose has not been addressed yet. I could better knowing these two facts. Some of the new text I added are as follows:
According to Amelia Thomas of the Middle East Times, Israeli Kobi Drori, a Raëlian Guide said that the Lebanese government contacted their organization to offer the right to build their interplanetery embassy in Lebanon. However, the offer would only be given on the condition that they did not display their logo on top of the building, because it mixed a swastika and a Star of David. According to Drori, Raëlians attempting to negotiate the matter have declined the offer, who wanted to keep the symbol as is.[33]
According to Soh Ji-young of the Korea Times, in August 2, 2003, Raël was denied entry into South Korea by immigration authories. This action was taken by authorities as a result of Raël's association with Clonaid, which claimed to have cloned a human being. The Korean Raelian Movement said it would stage protests near the center of Ministry of Health and Welfare which banned Raël from returning to their country.[34]
Arguments have also directly criticized the Raëlian Church for its cult status and threats against sanctity. Other arguments against the movement include child abuse by members, the use of condoms, and sexual intercourse at Raëlian gatherings. Lastly, those who point out the use of the swastika in their logo as well as their support for limitations on the right to vote have given called the group fascist and racist.... removed Kmarinas86 03:31, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
Check for unencylopedic tone and bad prose in these. My eyes are dry. Kmarinas86 19:31, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
I don't really know where to start in terms of the prose, as it is a long way from FA standard. One general thing you should watch out for is that you have a tendency to omit "the" from a lot of phrases.
Just looking at the "criticism" section:
Kmarinas86 02:01, 23 May 2007 (UTC) replythreats against the dignity of human life
Despite being born over two decades apart, many media people strongly associate the Raëlian Church with Clonaid, whose subsidiary, BioFusion Tech, said that they developed a cell fusion device in order to create human clone embryos.
Kmarinas86 02:01, 23 May 2007 (UTC) replyThe Vatican said that experimenters expressed "brutal mentality" by attemping to clone human beings.
Kmarinas86 02:01, 23 May 2007 (UTC) replyThis controversy is explained by the Raëlian idea that children should have a sensual education that includes masturbation, breathing excersize, and massage.
I don't have time to go on, but I think it makes it clear that the article needs a lot of work. MLilburne 22:04, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Hello MLilburne, Smee, and SandyGeorgia, there has been, what I believe to be, signficant changes to the prose in the article. I have read some featured articles in the past and have attempted to replicate their tone of speech:
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&diff=133115400&oldid=132619388
Kind regards, Kmarinas86 06:08, 24 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Update: http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&diff=133253066&oldid=132619388 Kmarinas86 20:35, 24 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Prose varies considerably depending on the purpose of the writing. As prose is often considered to be representative of the patterns of normal speech, many rhetorical devices are used in prose to emphasize points and enliven the writing. Prose which aims to be informative and accurate, such as history or journalism, usually strives to use the simplest language possible to express its points. Facts are often repeated and reiterated in various ways so that they are understood by a reader, but excessive use of this technique can make a serious piece of writing seem pedantic.
Anways, as you can see, quite a few sentences need work. Put your effort in eliminating any word that can be omitted, as they are just decorative. The prose just needs to sound more professional, though it's hard to give any specific advice for that, except read more FAs. SeleneFN 06:17, 26 May 2007 (UTC) reply
If the only problem with this article is the prose, I think the article must then be really close to FA. It would be nice if someone experienced in good prose could do a copyedit of this article. I never seemed to get an A in college English.
Kmarinas86
17:23, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
reply
Oppose ... I'll have to apply for GA. Kmarinas86 03:10, 29 May 2007 (UTC) reply
The article was not promoted 02:08, 1 June 2007.
100% sure
90% sure
80% sure
Kmarinas86 04:07, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
I'm not sure what the three recent failed GAs have to do with it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&oldid=108627105 http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&oldid=126448977 http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&oldid=127161806
They have changed signficantly. So it's not exactly the same article. However, I do admit that the prose is choppy. This has been due to my recent simplifying of the English. I'll have to turn some pairs of sentences into complex sentences, though I'm not sure how fast that can be resolved. I also admit some of the criticism concerning Raëlism is in the Clonaid and Raël articles. But I think having the same criticism in all three articles is a bit redundant. Some people may think the criticism of Clonaid should be in the Raëlian Church article, but I think that has already been somewhat addressed. Despite that, I believe some will see that as a deficiency preventing this article from FA status. If that becomes signficant enough, I will have to merge those articles (under what name?). The criticism section is reaching the point where it is getting larger than the rest of the article. If that's what is required for this article to get to FA status sometime in the future, then I will do it. I may decide to find 100 third-party sources. But if they all say about the same thing, then there isn't really much to add. I'll see if there are new criticisms, as I think the current ones have already been exhausted in the article. A Google News search indicates that the vast majority of the criticism is centered on the cloning claim ( Clonaid):
raelian critic OR controversy OR controversies OR questioned -clone -cloning (13 results) From looking at the previews, none of them appear to be relevant.
raelian critic OR controversy OR controversies OR questioned (168 results)
clonaid critic OR controversy OR controversies OR questioned (200 results)
There appears to be no scholar more serious than Susan J. Palmer when it comes to going into the Raëlian movement and doing research. It appears criticism from a scholarly angle has already been exhausted. On top of the immense repetition of the Clonaid subject by the media, I think there is little more than a 10% expansion possible on the Criticism section in Raëlian Church unless if material is merged from other articles. Kmarinas86 17:09, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Ok, so far, I made some attempts to improve the prose as well as adding a new "Controversy" section (a milder form of the "Criticism" section). I know that it is almost a law that some areas of the article will have better prose than others. However, what is the best and worst part of the Raëlian Church article when it comes to prose has not been addressed yet. I could better knowing these two facts. Some of the new text I added are as follows:
According to Amelia Thomas of the Middle East Times, Israeli Kobi Drori, a Raëlian Guide said that the Lebanese government contacted their organization to offer the right to build their interplanetery embassy in Lebanon. However, the offer would only be given on the condition that they did not display their logo on top of the building, because it mixed a swastika and a Star of David. According to Drori, Raëlians attempting to negotiate the matter have declined the offer, who wanted to keep the symbol as is.[33]
According to Soh Ji-young of the Korea Times, in August 2, 2003, Raël was denied entry into South Korea by immigration authories. This action was taken by authorities as a result of Raël's association with Clonaid, which claimed to have cloned a human being. The Korean Raelian Movement said it would stage protests near the center of Ministry of Health and Welfare which banned Raël from returning to their country.[34]
Arguments have also directly criticized the Raëlian Church for its cult status and threats against sanctity. Other arguments against the movement include child abuse by members, the use of condoms, and sexual intercourse at Raëlian gatherings. Lastly, those who point out the use of the swastika in their logo as well as their support for limitations on the right to vote have given called the group fascist and racist.... removed Kmarinas86 03:31, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
Check for unencylopedic tone and bad prose in these. My eyes are dry. Kmarinas86 19:31, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
I don't really know where to start in terms of the prose, as it is a long way from FA standard. One general thing you should watch out for is that you have a tendency to omit "the" from a lot of phrases.
Just looking at the "criticism" section:
Kmarinas86 02:01, 23 May 2007 (UTC) replythreats against the dignity of human life
Despite being born over two decades apart, many media people strongly associate the Raëlian Church with Clonaid, whose subsidiary, BioFusion Tech, said that they developed a cell fusion device in order to create human clone embryos.
Kmarinas86 02:01, 23 May 2007 (UTC) replyThe Vatican said that experimenters expressed "brutal mentality" by attemping to clone human beings.
Kmarinas86 02:01, 23 May 2007 (UTC) replyThis controversy is explained by the Raëlian idea that children should have a sensual education that includes masturbation, breathing excersize, and massage.
I don't have time to go on, but I think it makes it clear that the article needs a lot of work. MLilburne 22:04, 22 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Hello MLilburne, Smee, and SandyGeorgia, there has been, what I believe to be, signficant changes to the prose in the article. I have read some featured articles in the past and have attempted to replicate their tone of speech:
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&diff=133115400&oldid=132619388
Kind regards, Kmarinas86 06:08, 24 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Update: http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Ra%C3%ABlian_Church&diff=133253066&oldid=132619388 Kmarinas86 20:35, 24 May 2007 (UTC) reply
Prose varies considerably depending on the purpose of the writing. As prose is often considered to be representative of the patterns of normal speech, many rhetorical devices are used in prose to emphasize points and enliven the writing. Prose which aims to be informative and accurate, such as history or journalism, usually strives to use the simplest language possible to express its points. Facts are often repeated and reiterated in various ways so that they are understood by a reader, but excessive use of this technique can make a serious piece of writing seem pedantic.
Anways, as you can see, quite a few sentences need work. Put your effort in eliminating any word that can be omitted, as they are just decorative. The prose just needs to sound more professional, though it's hard to give any specific advice for that, except read more FAs. SeleneFN 06:17, 26 May 2007 (UTC) reply
If the only problem with this article is the prose, I think the article must then be really close to FA. It would be nice if someone experienced in good prose could do a copyedit of this article. I never seemed to get an A in college English.
Kmarinas86
17:23, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
reply
Oppose ... I'll have to apply for GA. Kmarinas86 03:10, 29 May 2007 (UTC) reply