Boroka ( talk| | history| logs| links| watch) ( XfD| restore)

No policy-based keep votes, just variations on "she's notable"/ILIKEIT, which should have been given little or no weight. Article did not include a genuine assertion of notability and was sourced virtually entirely from a promotional press release. The argument that the subject failed the applicable SNG as well as the GNG was never countered, let alone refuted. Closing admin has waived discussion. Overturn and delete. Hullaballoo Wolfowitz ( talk) 03:37, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

• Endorse Stifle's no consensus close. I'm not seeing ILIKEIT in the keep rationales, but a bunch of "eh" votes on each side, with no clear consensus, just like Stifle closed it. Jclemens ( talk) 05:45, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• Endorse own closure, per Jclemens. Arguments were weak on both sides. Stifle ( talk) 10:00, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• I've have !voted "delete", but I can't fault the close.— S Marshall T/ C 10:28, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• Endorse as there is clearly no consensus and overturn argument is incoherent. -- 82.41.20.82 ( talk) 10:42, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• Overturn and delete - Ideally, but as that is not very likely, just re-file a 2nd AfD (since it closed as an NC) and hopefully get more participation. Those are some of the most witless, knee-jerk !keeps I have ever seen in an AfD. BabbaQ's "the sources provides notability" when they (adultfilmdatbase.com and an avn blurb?) actually do no such thing, while "Regent of the Seatopians" is just a WP:ITSNOTABLE (which the two "per..." calls inherit. Tarc ( talk) 14:26, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• Overturn and delete The keep arguments were clearly much weaker than the delete ones. Epbr123 ( talk) 15:12, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• weak endorse There is no real evidence that the sources meet any of our inclusion guidelines. The delete !votes are basically as strong as they can be (the nom at least indicates he's looked for sources and came up with nothing) and the keep !votes provide no basis for their !votes. That said while I might close this as a delete, NC is certainly within discretion as A) the article does have a reliable source (well two actually) B) I see no BLP issues, C) the !vote certainly leaned toward keep. Hobit ( talk) 16:23, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
  • struck weak, it is a reasonable close even if not my first choice. Hobit ( talk) 16:43, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• Relist for a 2nd AfD. . The discussion was contaminated by the probably sockpuppet--and I'd try to deal with that first, before the relisting. The best way to deal with a discussion like that, is to do it over, not discuss the notability here. I suspect it will end in a delete, but the 2nd AfD is the simpler way to do it. I rarely see the point of bring a no-consensus close here to change it to delete, since a 2nd AfD is easier DGG ( talk ) 16:26, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Giridharilal Kedia ( talk| | history| logs| links| watch) ( XfD| restore)

The article was deleted due to the lack of information for Giridharilal, in internet. So administrators marked it as not-notable. But it is Notable according to Wikipedia:Notability, as Giridharilal was an Indian politician, he was known as the father of common people, Co-operative movements and business society in India. He was associated with many social organizations like Lions Clubs International, Kala vikash Kendra, Little Theatre Movement, Navakalika, Maruti Mandap, Ramayan Prachar Samiti, Bhagbat Prachar Samiti, Ramacharit Manas Path Samiti, Divine Life Society, Shyam Sundar Math, Sankirtan Bhawan Dharmik, Akhil Bharat Jagannath Consciousness Sansad, Marwari High School, Utkal Sahitya Samaj and many more as a trustee, governor, District Governor, Deputy District Governor, President, Sectary. So i request to restore/undelete the page Giridharilal Kedia

There are some books, "Utsharg to Giridharilal Kedia" published by JBD Press India Ltd, ISBN:9788184099836. & There are some online sources you can view this at 1. Website on him 2. published by IITM 3. Lions club International, Biodata 4. Foundation day of Kala Vikash Kendra 5. google books Odisha1 ( talk) 05:59, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

there are also many offline sources, like magazines, articles on many languages, Awards, News in News Paper. He is also the founder of Lions Eye Hospital, Cuttack; Image Institute of Technology & Management, Utkalion Foundation Trust trust deed Odisha1 ( talk) 06:23, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

• This deletion was over a year ago. You're welcome to recreate the article if you can overcome the reasons for the article being deleted. However, the closure at the time cannot be faulted, and I endorse it. Stifle ( talk) 10:03, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
  • Ah, I see this was recently recreated and deleted as a copyvio and subsequently as a recreated article. Recommend userfying the non-violating elements for further work. Stifle ( talk) 14:55, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• There was a deletion in January of 2010. I didn't look into that. I deleted the article on 21 February, but the rationale had nothing to do with "lack of information for Giridharilal:, it was a clear copyright violation. However, while I thought it was clear, if there are extenuating circumstances (for example, you've made arrangement for permission), these can be addressed. Steps were outlined on your talk page, which you've removed. If you need them again let me know. If you think I was in error in concluding that the material was in violation of copyright, please let me know, and I'll review. However I confess to be puzzled at the User_talk:Ronhjones#please_go_through_Talk:Giridharilal_Kedia. I just assumed that Ronhjones was deleting an attempted recreation of a copyvio, but the comment makes no references to copyvio issues, and talks about the 12 Jan 2010 version. Am I missing something? -- SPhilbrick T 15:13, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Looking in the history of the talk page, there is a confirmation of an OTRS ticket (number 2011022110011361, for those who can't view the deleted history). We'll probably need someone to look into it. Cheers. lifebaka ++ 15:20, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Yes, I see that; it came in after my deletion. That may explain why subsequent discussions focused on other issues. -- SPhilbrick T 15:44, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

there is no meter of copyvio. The metter is that the article is notable as Giridharilal was an Indian politician, so i request administrators to restore/undelete it. Odisha1 ( talk) 16:24, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

The OTRS ticket is good. Stifle ( talk) 20:20, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

• As I said on my talk page - The article was tagged as a WP:CSD#G4 by User:WWGB - the question of copy violation was not raised at this time - and would not have been appropriate as there was an OTRS ticket. The CSD linked back to Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Giridharilal_Kedia. User:WWGB Also added on a slightly later edits "tag, no evidence that book exists" and "reference states nothing about these titles, it just states he had a funeral". I viewed the current page and the deleted one from the AfD - the current one was similar to the old page, and in fact was less comprehensive. I checked the quoted book ISBN (9788184099836) and totally failed to find any hits to that number - thus it seems that User:WWGB was correct. I deleted the article as G4: Recreation of a page that was deleted per a deletion discussion. User:Odisha1 asked me to look at the talk page - that seemed mainly to be devoted to the copy violation (which as I said was not an issue), and the possible book ISBN - which I knew was not verifiable. As a compromise I offered to userfy the whole article (including the earlier versions), so that User:Odisha1, could extract all the useful data available, and then add enough extra data to make a good page. User:Odisha1 has decided not to go down that path but to come here instead. User:WWGB has not been notified about this discussion, I think he should be, and I will do that now.  Ronhjones   ^(Talk) 20:25, 24 February 2011 (UTC) reply

I would also add that the "Google Books" link posted above, open with a page of some obscure Performing Arts Journal, with the comment of 1 page matching "Giridharilal Kedia" in this book.  Ronhjones   ^(Talk) 14:03, 25 February 2011 (UTC) reply

• Comment: The AfD discussion page is fully protected. Would an admin tag the page with <noinclude>{{Delrevafd|date=2011 February 24}}</noinclude>? Thanks, Cunard ( talk) 00:27, 25 February 2011 (UTC) reply

•  Done  Ronhjones   ^(Talk) 20:57, 25 February 2011 (UTC) reply

• Thank you. Deletion review notices are placed at the top of the AfD so that they are more visible to a viewer (see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Boroka for an example). Would you move the Delrevafd notice to the top of the AfD? Cunard ( talk) 02:33, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

• You learn something every day...  Ronhjones   ^(Talk) 16:27, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

• Endorse deletion. Thanks for alerting me to this discussion. As a contributor to the original deletion discussion I did not consider that the latest version demonstrated significantly more notability. On that basis I made the db-repost nomination. I was not concerned by the earlier copyvio or the OTRS ticket as they were not about notability. I believe that the latest version of the article still failed to demonstrate the notability of the subject. Yes, he was an active member of a Lions Club and the head of a college. Reliable independent sources were very scarce and, even then, the relevance to the subject was quite superficial. As for the book, and despite extensive searches, I could find no references to the book or its ISBN. The author is clearly passionate about the subject, but IMO the article fails notability and the closing admin acted quite reasonably. WWGB ( talk) 06:40, 25 February 2011 (UTC) reply
• Restore to userspace as stifle said. The deleted article possibly showed sufficient notability as it stood to overcome the G4. Being head of a college with a Wikipedia article is sufficient, and the source was adequate--the college's web site. Added information given here makes the notability clearer. I would normally say just restore, but it would be much better to rewrite in user space first, because the article is excessively spammy and peacock, the usual result of copying from a website--even with permission. FWIW, the college article shows similar problems, and I am about to do some editing at Image Institute of Technology & Management. Presumably the OTRS license covers this also, but the material there is equally unusable. DGG ( talk ) 22:22, 25 February 2011 (UTC) reply

I'm not convinced. a former chairman does not sound like a notable academic to me, and certainly does not seem to fit with Criterion 6 of WP:ACADEMIC, also I checked out He had worked successful as a Presedent[sic] of Kala Vikash Kendra, Cuttack - that comes up as a secondary school.  Ronhjones   ^(Talk) 00:01, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Comment The OTRS ticket 2011022110011361 just covers the biography at this page from which the article text was copied. Other texts are not included in this ticket. -- AFBorchert ( talk) 08:50, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Ronhjones, a former chairman means a past chairman. He was the chairman, but now some one new has come into a chair so the new ones become the current chairman & Giridharilal become the past/former chairman. & Kala Vlkash kendra is not a secondary institute as you can search in google books & webpages. Giridharilal is notable as he is the founder of Melvin Jones Lions Eye Hospital, were eye operations & checkups are done free of cost. He was elected District Governor, by the members of Lions Club International. Odisha1 ( talk) 11:18, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

I have rechecked the ISBN of the book Utsharg to Giridharilal Kedia, it is correct. And i request you to please restore the article as i will try to improve the page. Odisha1 ( talk) 11:24, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

The ISBN may be correct, and it number validates mathematically as a correctly formatted ISBN. But anyone can write a book and get a ISBN - there are even plenty of such books for sale on big sites like Amazon.com, but it does not confer nobility. As for a close - it's not up to me to decide, that will be done by the a closing admin, when seven days has elapsed from the start of this review.  Ronhjones   ^(Talk) 16:27, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Please see the first paragraph written by me that Giridharilal was a trustee, governor, District Governor, Deputy District Governor, President, Sectary,chairman of many social organization & institutions which i have listed above ,& this shows notability according to Wikipedia:Notability Odisha1 ( talk) 18:11, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Image Institute of Technology & Management is unmistakably a post-sedondary college, giving Bachelors and Master's degrees. If his office is the head of the college it does not matter what the title is if he is indeed the chief officer, and whether an official is the present official or a past one is equally notable or non-notable. On the other hand, the various provincial governorships are of a fraternal organization, and would not normally be notable. If he were the national head it might be another matter, but he wasn't. As for the ISBN , there is no wayI know of to search comprehensively for library holdings in India. DGG ( talk ) 21:31, 26 February 2011 (UTC) reply

If his office is the head of the college - possibly - can I add that the only current reference on http://www.iitmctc.org/ is a tiny obituary under "Latest News" (because no one has updated the site for 2 years!) on the front page that says Chairman & Founder Trustee - which in my part of the world would suggest a accountant type person and not a proper professor as would be required by WP:ACADEMIC. I have also found the page on that site that User:Odisha1 keeps citing, has in fact been totally orphaned, and there is no possible route from the main page to that page (I just run a full link checker over the whole site, that page is not listed).  Ronhjones   ^(Talk) 01:02, 27 February 2011 (UTC) reply

Sorry for late reply, the "Latest News" has not been updated, that i know. I also agree with you, that accountant type person and not a proper professor as would be required by WP:ACADEMIC. & you can see that link in http://iitmctc.org/aboutiitm.aspx . And i m not citing... Odisha1 ( talk) 14:04, 3 March 2011 (UTC) reply

And you can give the reference of the book, which you have found in Google Books, that is given above, Performing Arts Journal. This book is about Kala Vikash Kendra, Which was headed by Giridharilal. Odisha1 ( talk) 14:10, 3 March 2011 (UTC) reply

You can also give the reference of http://books.google.com/books?id=Eov3dibs-F8C, just got while searching in Google Books Odisha1 ( talk) 08:29, 4 March 2011 (UTC) reply