The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
REname per nom. The present category, would properly include old boys of Stourbridge Grammar School, and numerous other schools founded (or refounded) under Edward VI.
Peterkingiron (
talk)
22:35, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
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Category:Novels by character
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Or that - I thought my variant easier to understand - we seem to be getting longer & more complex category titles these days. I would support renaming the parent too (... you know, not "Old series"). The lack of a distinct plural for "series" doesn't help.
Johnbod (
talk)
23:07, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
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Category:North Carolina Sports Hall of Fame
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Keep Actually is not a minor sports award, it's a relatively major sports institution. In the US, it just isn't feasible to have a single generalized hall of fame.
North Carolina State Highway Patrol and
Governor of North Carolina have individual articles; why not a category for the Hall of Fame? Not sure how much the nominator knows about sports. And of course, as per
WP:Lists, categories and lists are supposed to be synergistic. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
02:13, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
In general, it's usually wise not to impugn the knowledge of other editors when you know little about their background, interests, expertise, etc. But in WP, only the recipients of the most prestigious awards are categorized; lists are the preferred method for these: see
WP:OCAT#Award recipients.
Good Ol’factory(talk)03:59, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Stanford Athletic Hall of Fame
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
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Category:Italian American Sports Hall of Fame
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
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Delete per nom. OCAT and unnecessary race/ethnic category for inclusion; also BLP issues - saying that someone is in a hall of fame that intentionally discriminates against people on the basis of race/ethnicity is a tarnished honor at best.
Carlossuarez46 (
talk)
00:51, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Keep Undercategorization is as undesirable as overcategorization. What is "BLP"? As for "tarnished honor" - not very civic; and "minor sporting award", one doesn't seem to know much about the topic. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
02:21, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
In general, it's usually wise not to impugn the knowledge of other editors when you know little about their background, interests, expertise, etc. But as long as we're doing it, maybe you "don't know much about" how awards are approached in WP. In short, only the recipients of the most prestigious awards are categorized; lists are the preferred method for these: see
WP:OCAT#Award recipients.
Good Ol’factory(talk)03:57, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Halls of Fame are more than awards, there is a sense that the inductee is "in" the hall of fame;
American Book Award winners and
Nobel laureates are not really "in" anything, they're very unrelated people who are just on a list. Halls of Fame have associated physical facilities and entertainment and hospitality complexes, and are important to the tourist industry; there are many newsworthy events associated with Halls of Fame, starting with voting and induction; the National Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown is probably the best example. The
Italian American Sports Hall of Fame lists Budweiser, Pepsi and American Airlines, among others, as sponsors. It goes to notability. This organization, group or company has a list of very notable members, 15 of whom have last names starting with "L", including:
Vince Lombardi,
Jake LaMotta,
Tony LaRussa,
Tommy Lasorda... as an award, it is quite prestigious! Taking a look at
WP:OCAT#Award recipients, one sees that there are exceptions; looking at the
Category:Award winners, we see literally 100s of categories and subcategories all told. Let the exception be. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
04:30, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Thinking about sports and the people in this Hall of Fame, there are so many important figures included, as listed in the comment above, it creates a very worthy list or category of people; and forgot to mention, the guidelines at
WP:Categories, lists, and navigation templates and
WP:Lists set a definite trend towards inclusion of lists and categories. Nom bucks that trend. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
04:40, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
No, my point is that there have been dozens of similar "hall of fame" categories deleted, some of them very recently, but all of them quite consistently over 4 years+. Thus the nomination is entirely in line with recent and traditional precedent on this manner, and is not "bucking" any supposed trend.
Good Ol’factory(talk)07:55, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Sports lore and subcategories
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Comment: While I support the general thrust of this nomination, I noticed after looking at a few that there are problems with the tagging. For example,
Category:Professional wrestling lore is tagged for renaming instead of merging. And the links for this CFD aren't properly anchored to this section heading -- they all need a piped parameter at the end for "Category:Sports lore and subcategories". So I'm withholding my endorsement until all such problems are taken care of. Also, it would be a good idea to provide a link to the CFD for NBA lore.
Cgingold (
talk)
19:56, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Keep all What guidline(s) in
WP:POV are being referred to? After looking at WP:POV, this nom looks like yet a another case of an important set of Wiki guidelines being cited flagrantly, superficially and perhaps antithetically.... The second item in the nom,
Category:American football lore, has over 140 items in all. Nominations make as much sense as deleting popular tv shows or best-selling record albums; in other words, they make no sense at all. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
02:27, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
'Assuming the obvious' and 'local bias' (ie. personal bias). What makes one event from the history of an item 'sports lore' and not another? One's opinion. And just because a lot of people agree that a certain item should belong or that a particular page listed has a lot of items does not remove the POV nature of these lists.
Mayumashu (
talk)
17:25, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The problem is the word 'lore' and its connotation of 'legendary'. Folklore is different because events and people there may or may not have existed (and therefore the word 'legend' assumes its primary meaning. Here, attributing legendary status on an actual event or person is simply to give one's opinion. Perhaps there should be a
Category:Sport(s) history to collect notable occurrences in the history of sport(s)?
Mayumashu (
talk)
17:48, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
I wasn t sure if, say, 'history of boxing' and 'boxing history' are the same thing, but they are, arent they. I would support a merger into the 'History of (sport)' pages.
Mayumashu (
talk)
21:49, 19 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Redirects to auto-assessment categories
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Propose to delete all of the above categories. Each of these is an empty category that contains a redirect template pointing to an auto-assessment category. Auto-assessment categories are auto-populated by WikiProject templates (for example,
Category:Unknown-importance Xbox articles is populated by {{Xboxp}})—there is no reason that any user should ever have to (or should ever) put a page into one of these categories by typing the name of the category manually. Likewise, there is no reason any user should ever be searching for these category names, since they are generally listed on and linked from the WikiProject's own page. Accordingly, I don't think these redirects (generally left over from when older category naming schemes were changed) serve any useful purpose. --
R'n'B (
call me Russ)
14:06, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Delete: At least the Unassessed-Class need deleting as when both Unassessed-Class & Unassessed versions of the categories exist, {{cat class}} links to the wrong one, so they need deleting. As for the others, I'm not fussed either way. --
WOSlinker (
talk)
18:42, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Comment - This sounds like a good idea. Mostly I just want to say I'm glad to see these redirect cats dealt with in a more focused way, a decided improvement over the original mass nomination proposal.
Cgingold (
talk)
20:15, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Comment. Have the relevant WikiProjects been notified? These redirects may serve some other purpose, e.g. because {{cat class}} would not otherwise link to the category. That's what the film category was being used for, but it is no longer needed and can be deleted. No opinion on the rest.
PC78 (
talk)
00:13, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Note that {{cat class}} contains a series of conditional statements similar to the following (with white space added for readability):
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
REname per nom. The present category, would properly include old boys of Stourbridge Grammar School, and numerous other schools founded (or refounded) under Edward VI.
Peterkingiron (
talk)
22:35, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Novels by character
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Or that - I thought my variant easier to understand - we seem to be getting longer & more complex category titles these days. I would support renaming the parent too (... you know, not "Old series"). The lack of a distinct plural for "series" doesn't help.
Johnbod (
talk)
23:07, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:North Carolina Sports Hall of Fame
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Keep Actually is not a minor sports award, it's a relatively major sports institution. In the US, it just isn't feasible to have a single generalized hall of fame.
North Carolina State Highway Patrol and
Governor of North Carolina have individual articles; why not a category for the Hall of Fame? Not sure how much the nominator knows about sports. And of course, as per
WP:Lists, categories and lists are supposed to be synergistic. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
02:13, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
In general, it's usually wise not to impugn the knowledge of other editors when you know little about their background, interests, expertise, etc. But in WP, only the recipients of the most prestigious awards are categorized; lists are the preferred method for these: see
WP:OCAT#Award recipients.
Good Ol’factory(talk)03:59, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Stanford Athletic Hall of Fame
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Italian American Sports Hall of Fame
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Delete per nom. OCAT and unnecessary race/ethnic category for inclusion; also BLP issues - saying that someone is in a hall of fame that intentionally discriminates against people on the basis of race/ethnicity is a tarnished honor at best.
Carlossuarez46 (
talk)
00:51, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Keep Undercategorization is as undesirable as overcategorization. What is "BLP"? As for "tarnished honor" - not very civic; and "minor sporting award", one doesn't seem to know much about the topic. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
02:21, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
In general, it's usually wise not to impugn the knowledge of other editors when you know little about their background, interests, expertise, etc. But as long as we're doing it, maybe you "don't know much about" how awards are approached in WP. In short, only the recipients of the most prestigious awards are categorized; lists are the preferred method for these: see
WP:OCAT#Award recipients.
Good Ol’factory(talk)03:57, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Halls of Fame are more than awards, there is a sense that the inductee is "in" the hall of fame;
American Book Award winners and
Nobel laureates are not really "in" anything, they're very unrelated people who are just on a list. Halls of Fame have associated physical facilities and entertainment and hospitality complexes, and are important to the tourist industry; there are many newsworthy events associated with Halls of Fame, starting with voting and induction; the National Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown is probably the best example. The
Italian American Sports Hall of Fame lists Budweiser, Pepsi and American Airlines, among others, as sponsors. It goes to notability. This organization, group or company has a list of very notable members, 15 of whom have last names starting with "L", including:
Vince Lombardi,
Jake LaMotta,
Tony LaRussa,
Tommy Lasorda... as an award, it is quite prestigious! Taking a look at
WP:OCAT#Award recipients, one sees that there are exceptions; looking at the
Category:Award winners, we see literally 100s of categories and subcategories all told. Let the exception be. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
04:30, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Thinking about sports and the people in this Hall of Fame, there are so many important figures included, as listed in the comment above, it creates a very worthy list or category of people; and forgot to mention, the guidelines at
WP:Categories, lists, and navigation templates and
WP:Lists set a definite trend towards inclusion of lists and categories. Nom bucks that trend. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
04:40, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
No, my point is that there have been dozens of similar "hall of fame" categories deleted, some of them very recently, but all of them quite consistently over 4 years+. Thus the nomination is entirely in line with recent and traditional precedent on this manner, and is not "bucking" any supposed trend.
Good Ol’factory(talk)07:55, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Category:Sports lore and subcategories
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Comment: While I support the general thrust of this nomination, I noticed after looking at a few that there are problems with the tagging. For example,
Category:Professional wrestling lore is tagged for renaming instead of merging. And the links for this CFD aren't properly anchored to this section heading -- they all need a piped parameter at the end for "Category:Sports lore and subcategories". So I'm withholding my endorsement until all such problems are taken care of. Also, it would be a good idea to provide a link to the CFD for NBA lore.
Cgingold (
talk)
19:56, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Keep all What guidline(s) in
WP:POV are being referred to? After looking at WP:POV, this nom looks like yet a another case of an important set of Wiki guidelines being cited flagrantly, superficially and perhaps antithetically.... The second item in the nom,
Category:American football lore, has over 140 items in all. Nominations make as much sense as deleting popular tv shows or best-selling record albums; in other words, they make no sense at all. --
Mr Accountable (
talk)
02:27, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
'Assuming the obvious' and 'local bias' (ie. personal bias). What makes one event from the history of an item 'sports lore' and not another? One's opinion. And just because a lot of people agree that a certain item should belong or that a particular page listed has a lot of items does not remove the POV nature of these lists.
Mayumashu (
talk)
17:25, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The problem is the word 'lore' and its connotation of 'legendary'. Folklore is different because events and people there may or may not have existed (and therefore the word 'legend' assumes its primary meaning. Here, attributing legendary status on an actual event or person is simply to give one's opinion. Perhaps there should be a
Category:Sport(s) history to collect notable occurrences in the history of sport(s)?
Mayumashu (
talk)
17:48, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
I wasn t sure if, say, 'history of boxing' and 'boxing history' are the same thing, but they are, arent they. I would support a merger into the 'History of (sport)' pages.
Mayumashu (
talk)
21:49, 19 February 2009 (UTC)reply
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Redirects to auto-assessment categories
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
Propose to delete all of the above categories. Each of these is an empty category that contains a redirect template pointing to an auto-assessment category. Auto-assessment categories are auto-populated by WikiProject templates (for example,
Category:Unknown-importance Xbox articles is populated by {{Xboxp}})—there is no reason that any user should ever have to (or should ever) put a page into one of these categories by typing the name of the category manually. Likewise, there is no reason any user should ever be searching for these category names, since they are generally listed on and linked from the WikiProject's own page. Accordingly, I don't think these redirects (generally left over from when older category naming schemes were changed) serve any useful purpose. --
R'n'B (
call me Russ)
14:06, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Delete: At least the Unassessed-Class need deleting as when both Unassessed-Class & Unassessed versions of the categories exist, {{cat class}} links to the wrong one, so they need deleting. As for the others, I'm not fussed either way. --
WOSlinker (
talk)
18:42, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Comment - This sounds like a good idea. Mostly I just want to say I'm glad to see these redirect cats dealt with in a more focused way, a decided improvement over the original mass nomination proposal.
Cgingold (
talk)
20:15, 17 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Comment. Have the relevant WikiProjects been notified? These redirects may serve some other purpose, e.g. because {{cat class}} would not otherwise link to the category. That's what the film category was being used for, but it is no longer needed and can be deleted. No opinion on the rest.
PC78 (
talk)
00:13, 18 February 2009 (UTC)reply
Note that {{cat class}} contains a series of conditional statements similar to the following (with white space added for readability):
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.