- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Vézina. Any useful content may be merged as desired. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 02:32, 5 March 2019 (UTC)
Vezina
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An online source search brings up seven unreliable sources and two sources ( 1, 2) whose reliability I am unfamiliar with. However, they don't seem to cover Vezina as the primary topic of writing. An offline source search reveals only two passing mentions ( p226, p66). Therefore, I propose this article be deleted as it fails biographical notability and general notability guidelines. SITH (talk) 12:34, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Religion-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 13:06, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Europe-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 13:06, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. Icewhiz ( talk) 13:42, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Comment a google books search for Vezina Tapae brings up a whole bunch of hits (seems he was second in command in the battle per some of these, and pretended to be dead) - however most of the hits are in snippet view (and many aren't in English) and I'm unable to see how much depth there is there. in this book which seems like a RS, he appears in 3 pages per the index (however the book itself isn't available in those page ranges). Icewhiz ( talk) 16:38, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Page 176 from Grumeza, Ion. Dacia: Land of Transylvania, Cornerstone of Ancient Eastern Europe. University Press of America, 2009. which you referenced, is available to me, here [1]. That page suggests Vezina can be seen on Trajan's column, but isn't too clear on this point (and even Decebalus' visage on the column isn't certain, I think). Some sources online claim that Vezina is called a priest on the (likely forged) Sinaia lead plates. To me, any fact which is sourced to a source that used these plates should be flagged in the text as being based in a likely forgery. His being second in command to Decebalus is attested in Cassius Dio here [2], which is the reference used on page 70 here [3]. If it were a clear that he is depicted on the column, then these three primary sources (one forged) and their discussions in RS (where found) could be cobbled together into an encyclopedia article, I think. Without something more, though, I wouldn't support keep in this case. Smmurphy( Talk) 02:11, 25 February 2019 (UTC)
- Redirect somewhere -- The nom's first potentially reliable source seems to support the article text: "Vezina was the Dacian high priest during the reign of Decebalus, the most important man in the Kingdom after Decebalus. He took part in the Battle of Tapae in 88 AD". The second explains the name as meaning "leader", which might mean that the word refers to an office or title. I suspect that we only know about pre-Roman Dacia from Greek and Latin sources, so that it may well be that we only have a passing reference in the odd ancient author to him. This means that (as with many people in the ancient world) we know almost nothing of him, except his bare existence. This is not a basis for a worthwhile article. It would have to be tagged as a stub, but doing so would invite WP:OR. Battle of Tapae (88) might be an appropriate target. Most of the articles on the Dacians wars seem very brief and would merit expansion, if classical sources exist to make this possible. Peterkingiron ( talk) 17:45, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Merge into Second Battle of Tapae. This title should redirect to Vézina. – Srnec ( talk) 01:54, 26 February 2019 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Vézina. Any useful content may be merged as desired. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 02:32, 5 March 2019 (UTC)
Vezina
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Vezina ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
An online source search brings up seven unreliable sources and two sources ( 1, 2) whose reliability I am unfamiliar with. However, they don't seem to cover Vezina as the primary topic of writing. An offline source search reveals only two passing mentions ( p226, p66). Therefore, I propose this article be deleted as it fails biographical notability and general notability guidelines. SITH (talk) 12:34, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Religion-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 13:06, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Europe-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 13:06, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. Icewhiz ( talk) 13:42, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Comment a google books search for Vezina Tapae brings up a whole bunch of hits (seems he was second in command in the battle per some of these, and pretended to be dead) - however most of the hits are in snippet view (and many aren't in English) and I'm unable to see how much depth there is there. in this book which seems like a RS, he appears in 3 pages per the index (however the book itself isn't available in those page ranges). Icewhiz ( talk) 16:38, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Page 176 from Grumeza, Ion. Dacia: Land of Transylvania, Cornerstone of Ancient Eastern Europe. University Press of America, 2009. which you referenced, is available to me, here [1]. That page suggests Vezina can be seen on Trajan's column, but isn't too clear on this point (and even Decebalus' visage on the column isn't certain, I think). Some sources online claim that Vezina is called a priest on the (likely forged) Sinaia lead plates. To me, any fact which is sourced to a source that used these plates should be flagged in the text as being based in a likely forgery. His being second in command to Decebalus is attested in Cassius Dio here [2], which is the reference used on page 70 here [3]. If it were a clear that he is depicted on the column, then these three primary sources (one forged) and their discussions in RS (where found) could be cobbled together into an encyclopedia article, I think. Without something more, though, I wouldn't support keep in this case. Smmurphy( Talk) 02:11, 25 February 2019 (UTC)
- Redirect somewhere -- The nom's first potentially reliable source seems to support the article text: "Vezina was the Dacian high priest during the reign of Decebalus, the most important man in the Kingdom after Decebalus. He took part in the Battle of Tapae in 88 AD". The second explains the name as meaning "leader", which might mean that the word refers to an office or title. I suspect that we only know about pre-Roman Dacia from Greek and Latin sources, so that it may well be that we only have a passing reference in the odd ancient author to him. This means that (as with many people in the ancient world) we know almost nothing of him, except his bare existence. This is not a basis for a worthwhile article. It would have to be tagged as a stub, but doing so would invite WP:OR. Battle of Tapae (88) might be an appropriate target. Most of the articles on the Dacians wars seem very brief and would merit expansion, if classical sources exist to make this possible. Peterkingiron ( talk) 17:45, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
- Merge into Second Battle of Tapae. This title should redirect to Vézina. – Srnec ( talk) 01:54, 26 February 2019 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.