The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. The delete views are solidly based on policy, which is particularly important for a BLP. The keep views, meanwhile, show little basis in P&G.
Owen×☎23:55, 31 January 2024 (UTC)reply
I have TNTed the biography to remove material that didn't belong such as a list of books he's read, people who have taught him and student he has taught.
The sources do not seem reliable and talk about him in a promotional manner.
My before search was difficult, but I didn't find anything that stood out as the kind of coverage that would meet
WP:GNG or
WP:NPROF. I can't tell whether his writings might make him notable.
I had considered that, but like any country's honours, there are different levels, with the lower levels being awarded to hundreds of people a year and many thousands over the years, so not sufficient in itself for every awardee to warrant an article about them on Wikipedia. In any event, WP:ANYBIO does not automatically confer notability.
Curb Safe Charmer (
talk)
21:48, 7 January 2024 (UTC)reply
Can you provide sources that talk about the individual? The award is likely notable, but we need things about the person, not reports of what he's said about things.
Oaktree b (
talk)
15:47, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
@
Shoerack: At the point of nomination, I had been unable to verify that he had received the award, as what appeared to be the definitive list didn't include him. See my edit summary when I tagged it as citation needed. I have reviewed plenty bios where the recipient had for example received an
MBE in the UK, but as there are over 100,000 such award holders, it isn't sufficiently selective to be a guaranteed route to notablity, even if it is an indicator. More secondary coverage was required, per Oaktree, though I note the article's author Gwanki added some directly after my nomination, which I've not yet looked at in depth.
Curb Safe Charmer (
talk)
16:32, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
Thanks, I understand the importance of a before search, and did one, as noted in my nomination rationale.
Your assertion that "Orders awarded by a sovereign state are considered notable enough to meet WP:ANYBIO" are not supported by experience - see the following random examples:
1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8.
Thank you. This is helpful. I believe the award combined with the BBC source and other sources in Hausa are sufficient to establish notability. I have changed my
WP:SPEEDYKEEP to "keep." It would have been "strong keep," but your argument is plausible.
Shoerack (
talk)
18:36, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
Delete: The award implies notability, but without coverage, there is no article... This is typical
[1], he speaks to the press about xyz subject as an expert. I'm not seeing much ABOUT him as a person.
Oaktree b (
talk)
15:45, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
I tried in French language African press sources, they also don't mention him. There is more French in Africa then English, and still nothing about this person.
Oaktree b (
talk)
21:25, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
I haven't looked for sources, so the subject may or may not pass the
general notability guideline. I would however point out that he has the grade of officer in the Order of the Niger which, if our article on the order is to be believed, is equivalent to an OBE in the United Kingdom. That has never been held to be enough for
WP:ANYBIO. A subject must be at least a CBE (commander) to qualify.
Phil Bridger (
talk)
22:02, 14 January 2024 (UTC)reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. The delete views are solidly based on policy, which is particularly important for a BLP. The keep views, meanwhile, show little basis in P&G.
Owen×☎23:55, 31 January 2024 (UTC)reply
I have TNTed the biography to remove material that didn't belong such as a list of books he's read, people who have taught him and student he has taught.
The sources do not seem reliable and talk about him in a promotional manner.
My before search was difficult, but I didn't find anything that stood out as the kind of coverage that would meet
WP:GNG or
WP:NPROF. I can't tell whether his writings might make him notable.
I had considered that, but like any country's honours, there are different levels, with the lower levels being awarded to hundreds of people a year and many thousands over the years, so not sufficient in itself for every awardee to warrant an article about them on Wikipedia. In any event, WP:ANYBIO does not automatically confer notability.
Curb Safe Charmer (
talk)
21:48, 7 January 2024 (UTC)reply
Can you provide sources that talk about the individual? The award is likely notable, but we need things about the person, not reports of what he's said about things.
Oaktree b (
talk)
15:47, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
@
Shoerack: At the point of nomination, I had been unable to verify that he had received the award, as what appeared to be the definitive list didn't include him. See my edit summary when I tagged it as citation needed. I have reviewed plenty bios where the recipient had for example received an
MBE in the UK, but as there are over 100,000 such award holders, it isn't sufficiently selective to be a guaranteed route to notablity, even if it is an indicator. More secondary coverage was required, per Oaktree, though I note the article's author Gwanki added some directly after my nomination, which I've not yet looked at in depth.
Curb Safe Charmer (
talk)
16:32, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
Thanks, I understand the importance of a before search, and did one, as noted in my nomination rationale.
Your assertion that "Orders awarded by a sovereign state are considered notable enough to meet WP:ANYBIO" are not supported by experience - see the following random examples:
1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8.
Thank you. This is helpful. I believe the award combined with the BBC source and other sources in Hausa are sufficient to establish notability. I have changed my
WP:SPEEDYKEEP to "keep." It would have been "strong keep," but your argument is plausible.
Shoerack (
talk)
18:36, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
Delete: The award implies notability, but without coverage, there is no article... This is typical
[1], he speaks to the press about xyz subject as an expert. I'm not seeing much ABOUT him as a person.
Oaktree b (
talk)
15:45, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
I tried in French language African press sources, they also don't mention him. There is more French in Africa then English, and still nothing about this person.
Oaktree b (
talk)
21:25, 10 January 2024 (UTC)reply
I haven't looked for sources, so the subject may or may not pass the
general notability guideline. I would however point out that he has the grade of officer in the Order of the Niger which, if our article on the order is to be believed, is equivalent to an OBE in the United Kingdom. That has never been held to be enough for
WP:ANYBIO. A subject must be at least a CBE (commander) to qualify.
Phil Bridger (
talk)
22:02, 14 January 2024 (UTC)reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.