- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. The article's subject is found to be notable, per the sources provided below. — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 01:18, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
Rust Belt Derby
- Rust Belt Derby ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Contested PROD with no reason given, initial concern still exists. Per WP:NRIVALRY - yes these teams have played each other a few times, but there is nothing to indicate that, even if a genuine rivalry exists, that there is sufficient significant, reliable coverage of a non-routine nature (i.e. not match reports, stat sites, team listings, etc) to satisfy WP:GNG. Fenix down ( talk) 15:32, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Fenix down ( talk) 15:33, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:44, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:45, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ohio-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:45, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:45, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Delete - no evidence that this is a notable rivalry. Giant Snowman 13:32, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
- Strong Keep – want evidence? Here you go 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 Quidster4040 ( talk) 03:59, 5 March 2015 (UTC)
- Comment - there are major issues with all the sources you have presented as follows:
- 1 - this is just a match report, this does not discuss the notion of the derby. In fact it is only mentioned in passing twice in the whole article.
- 2 - This does kind of discuss the "rivalry" in the wider context of rivalries in the US, but doesn't really indicate notability as it is talkng about the rivalry before any games actually took place(!) essentially an opinion piece about what the rivalry might come to be once the teams actually play each other. The fact that this article explicitly states that this is an artificially created supporters' cup that only came into existence in 2012 significantly lessens its importance.
- 3 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. Of course one of the clibs involved is going to promote this artificial rivalry too generate more interest / income for themselves.
- 4 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. This is also just a routine match report. It doesn't even discuss the rivalry. The only mention of the Rust Belt Derby is as a tag at the bottom of the article.
- 5 - This is exactly the same link as 4.
- 6 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. One sentence mentions the Derby, there is no significant coverage of it as a notion.
- 7 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. This is also just a routine match report. It doesn't even discuss the rivalry. The only mention of the Rust Belt Derby is as a tag at the bottom of the article.
- 8 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. This is also just a routine season summary, the Rust Belt Derby is mentioned once in passing, there is no significant coverage of the rivalry.
- 9 - This is just the rivalry's logo. This only confirms that it exists and in no way indicates notability of any form.
- 10 - This is an article about one of Detroit City's supporters groups, not the Derby. In fact the Derby is mentioned only in one sentence to explain what it is (and the fact this is necessary is kind of indicative that this is not a seperately notable rivalry).
- So yes, there has been an attempt to artificially create a rivalry, yes the teams have played a few times since it was created three years ago and yes it might some day receive the level of coverage of similar derbies such as the Cascadia Cup, but at the moment, outside of references to the name and articles on the involved clubs' own websites, there is no significant reliable coverage of the Derby as a specific rivalry outside of match reporting that would exist whether this rivalry did or not. Fenix down ( talk) 09:01, 5 March 2015 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, JodyB talk 22:40, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, JodyB talk 22:40, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
- Keep I don't know much about soccer, but there do seem to be enough sources to establish the Rust Belt Derby as notable. Adding to the sources above are this and this.-- I am One of Many ( talk) 00:03, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 02:02, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 02:02, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. The article's subject is found to be notable, per the sources provided below. — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 01:18, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
Rust Belt Derby
- Rust Belt Derby ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Contested PROD with no reason given, initial concern still exists. Per WP:NRIVALRY - yes these teams have played each other a few times, but there is nothing to indicate that, even if a genuine rivalry exists, that there is sufficient significant, reliable coverage of a non-routine nature (i.e. not match reports, stat sites, team listings, etc) to satisfy WP:GNG. Fenix down ( talk) 15:32, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Fenix down ( talk) 15:33, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:44, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:45, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ohio-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:45, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. NORTH AMERICA 1000 19:45, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
- Delete - no evidence that this is a notable rivalry. Giant Snowman 13:32, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
- Strong Keep – want evidence? Here you go 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 Quidster4040 ( talk) 03:59, 5 March 2015 (UTC)
- Comment - there are major issues with all the sources you have presented as follows:
- 1 - this is just a match report, this does not discuss the notion of the derby. In fact it is only mentioned in passing twice in the whole article.
- 2 - This does kind of discuss the "rivalry" in the wider context of rivalries in the US, but doesn't really indicate notability as it is talkng about the rivalry before any games actually took place(!) essentially an opinion piece about what the rivalry might come to be once the teams actually play each other. The fact that this article explicitly states that this is an artificially created supporters' cup that only came into existence in 2012 significantly lessens its importance.
- 3 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. Of course one of the clibs involved is going to promote this artificial rivalry too generate more interest / income for themselves.
- 4 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. This is also just a routine match report. It doesn't even discuss the rivalry. The only mention of the Rust Belt Derby is as a tag at the bottom of the article.
- 5 - This is exactly the same link as 4.
- 6 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. One sentence mentions the Derby, there is no significant coverage of it as a notion.
- 7 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. This is also just a routine match report. It doesn't even discuss the rivalry. The only mention of the Rust Belt Derby is as a tag at the bottom of the article.
- 8 - This is a primary source and so doesn't count. This is also just a routine season summary, the Rust Belt Derby is mentioned once in passing, there is no significant coverage of the rivalry.
- 9 - This is just the rivalry's logo. This only confirms that it exists and in no way indicates notability of any form.
- 10 - This is an article about one of Detroit City's supporters groups, not the Derby. In fact the Derby is mentioned only in one sentence to explain what it is (and the fact this is necessary is kind of indicative that this is not a seperately notable rivalry).
- So yes, there has been an attempt to artificially create a rivalry, yes the teams have played a few times since it was created three years ago and yes it might some day receive the level of coverage of similar derbies such as the Cascadia Cup, but at the moment, outside of references to the name and articles on the involved clubs' own websites, there is no significant reliable coverage of the Derby as a specific rivalry outside of match reporting that would exist whether this rivalry did or not. Fenix down ( talk) 09:01, 5 March 2015 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, JodyB talk 22:40, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, JodyB talk 22:40, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
- Keep I don't know much about soccer, but there do seem to be enough sources to establish the Rust Belt Derby as notable. Adding to the sources above are this and this.-- I am One of Many ( talk) 00:03, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 02:02, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Coffee // have a cup // beans // 02:02, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.