- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Consensus is that this doesn't meet WP:GEOLAND. There's a suggestion to redirect to Santa, Idaho, but no consensus (or even discussion) on that. If somebody wants to add this to Santa, Idaho and redirect there, they can do that on their own. -- RoySmith (talk) 16:09, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
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- Renfrew, Idaho ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
We haven't had as many problem rail points in Idaho, but there are a few, and Renfrew appears to be one of them. It's just a short ways down the road from Santa, and there's a construction business at the site which perhaps was put there to take advantage of the siding, but there's no sign of any accompanying settlement except a cemetery (which is unnamed as far as I can tell, and which may have been built to serve Santa). It's a little heard to search due to a prominent academic, but I couldn't find any reference to it as a settlement. Mangoe ( talk) 23:03, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Idaho-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 23:12, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Geography-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 23:13, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
- Delete Not even on 58 topo, does not appear to be a separate community in 63 topo. Newspaper results are all names, nothing with Santa or railroad keywords. Reywas92 Talk 06:47, 19 March 2020 (UTC)
- Keep
- In 2015, the Idaho Legislature stated "several areas of Benewah County, though unincorporated, have rich histories and vibrant communities including Chatcolet, DeSmet, Emida, Fernwood, Parkline, Renfrew and Santa."
- Benewah County's
Wildland-Urban Interface Wildfire Mitigation Plan Update 2012 states:
Several other 'populated places' are scattered around the county with groups of home structures ranging from a dozen homes, to hundreds of homes in these unincorporated population clusters. These population clusters include Emida, Fernwood, Renfrew, Santa, Carpenter Creek, Desmet, Benewah, Chatcolet, St. Joe, Ferrell, Highland Springs, Hells Gulch, Mowry, Cherry Creek, Alder Creek, and Elkhorn.
- The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration lists Renfrew as a city here.
- This
original research shows the community of Renfrew exists and has a cemetery.
Magnolia677 (
talk)
16:03, 22 March 2020 (UTC)
- Do you read these sources at all? The NHTSA may supposedly list it as a city, but Pocatello Municipal Airport, Penitentiary Spur, Anderson Dam, and Nez Perce National Historical Park are apparently cities now too! I just don't get this concept that we need an article for every set of "a dozen homes" on the planet. The other items on the list of "clusters" are largely not notable places either needing their own articles either. Is this Maggie Rail a reliable source, or did she just write down the name on the map? For god's sake, if Renfrew had "a rich history", where is it?!? Reywas92 Talk 06:50, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
- Of these, only the last presents any substantial evidence. The first is a purely ceremonial resolution which cannot be taken as representing any sort of neutral reporting, while the second even puts "populated places" in quotes, implying simply reading of a list of such places from GNIS; the third is simply a list of values to enter on a form and doesn't imply that anyone checked to see that this list of names were "cities" or even anything other than a dot on a map. Now, the last one is more interesting, but again it really doesn't get us to any real evidence of a settlement. It says that the cemetery served Santa and Fernwood, but it only says it was located in Renfrew, that it calls it a "community" really begs the question, as the only thing there is the lumber yard mentioned in the directions. How did this person know that it was a "community"? Mangoe ( talk) 00:59, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
- Delete WP:EXISTS, but no evidence of notability. Cheers, 1292simon ( talk) 12:07, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
- The question is whether Renfrew satisfies WP:GEOLAND, not whether it exists. Magnolia677 ( talk) 12:27, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
- Redirect to Santa, Idaho. It shows up on Google maps, and the Idaho Legislature mention is something, perhaps a "Legally Recognized Place", and therefore outright deletion isn't helpful to a reader, whom it is not hard to conceive may look for information on this defined location. However, I've spent some time looking for this through newspapers.com and archive.org, and not a single instance shows up, indicating that it isn't notable by normal standards or by GEOLAND. I'd add a sentence into the Santa article describing Renfrew as a named place outside of/next to Santa. 78.26 ( spin me / revolutions) 15:46, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Consensus is that this doesn't meet WP:GEOLAND. There's a suggestion to redirect to Santa, Idaho, but no consensus (or even discussion) on that. If somebody wants to add this to Santa, Idaho and redirect there, they can do that on their own. -- RoySmith (talk) 16:09, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Renfrew, Idaho ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
We haven't had as many problem rail points in Idaho, but there are a few, and Renfrew appears to be one of them. It's just a short ways down the road from Santa, and there's a construction business at the site which perhaps was put there to take advantage of the siding, but there's no sign of any accompanying settlement except a cemetery (which is unnamed as far as I can tell, and which may have been built to serve Santa). It's a little heard to search due to a prominent academic, but I couldn't find any reference to it as a settlement. Mangoe ( talk) 23:03, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Idaho-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 23:12, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Geography-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 23:13, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
- Delete Not even on 58 topo, does not appear to be a separate community in 63 topo. Newspaper results are all names, nothing with Santa or railroad keywords. Reywas92 Talk 06:47, 19 March 2020 (UTC)
- Keep
- In 2015, the Idaho Legislature stated "several areas of Benewah County, though unincorporated, have rich histories and vibrant communities including Chatcolet, DeSmet, Emida, Fernwood, Parkline, Renfrew and Santa."
- Benewah County's
Wildland-Urban Interface Wildfire Mitigation Plan Update 2012 states:
Several other 'populated places' are scattered around the county with groups of home structures ranging from a dozen homes, to hundreds of homes in these unincorporated population clusters. These population clusters include Emida, Fernwood, Renfrew, Santa, Carpenter Creek, Desmet, Benewah, Chatcolet, St. Joe, Ferrell, Highland Springs, Hells Gulch, Mowry, Cherry Creek, Alder Creek, and Elkhorn.
- The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration lists Renfrew as a city here.
- This
original research shows the community of Renfrew exists and has a cemetery.
Magnolia677 (
talk)
16:03, 22 March 2020 (UTC)
- Do you read these sources at all? The NHTSA may supposedly list it as a city, but Pocatello Municipal Airport, Penitentiary Spur, Anderson Dam, and Nez Perce National Historical Park are apparently cities now too! I just don't get this concept that we need an article for every set of "a dozen homes" on the planet. The other items on the list of "clusters" are largely not notable places either needing their own articles either. Is this Maggie Rail a reliable source, or did she just write down the name on the map? For god's sake, if Renfrew had "a rich history", where is it?!? Reywas92 Talk 06:50, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
- Of these, only the last presents any substantial evidence. The first is a purely ceremonial resolution which cannot be taken as representing any sort of neutral reporting, while the second even puts "populated places" in quotes, implying simply reading of a list of such places from GNIS; the third is simply a list of values to enter on a form and doesn't imply that anyone checked to see that this list of names were "cities" or even anything other than a dot on a map. Now, the last one is more interesting, but again it really doesn't get us to any real evidence of a settlement. It says that the cemetery served Santa and Fernwood, but it only says it was located in Renfrew, that it calls it a "community" really begs the question, as the only thing there is the lumber yard mentioned in the directions. How did this person know that it was a "community"? Mangoe ( talk) 00:59, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
- Delete WP:EXISTS, but no evidence of notability. Cheers, 1292simon ( talk) 12:07, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
- The question is whether Renfrew satisfies WP:GEOLAND, not whether it exists. Magnolia677 ( talk) 12:27, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
- Redirect to Santa, Idaho. It shows up on Google maps, and the Idaho Legislature mention is something, perhaps a "Legally Recognized Place", and therefore outright deletion isn't helpful to a reader, whom it is not hard to conceive may look for information on this defined location. However, I've spent some time looking for this through newspapers.com and archive.org, and not a single instance shows up, indicating that it isn't notable by normal standards or by GEOLAND. I'd add a sentence into the Santa article describing Renfrew as a named place outside of/next to Santa. 78.26 ( spin me / revolutions) 15:46, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.