The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. MuZemike 17:20, 19 December 2009 (UTC) reply

Persian-speakers of Iran

Persian-speakers of Iran (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log • AfD statistics)

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The article is a content fork of the article 'Persian people'created to surpass POV guidelines Danz23 ( talk) 03:59, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Iran-related deletion discussions. — Ladyof Shalott 05:32, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Language-related deletion discussions. — Ladyof Shalott 05:34, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Redirect To Persian language. Warrah ( talk) 14:01, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Delete content fork with oddball title. Abductive ( reasoning) 15:16, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply

If this version of Persian people seems too similar to the content of Persian-speakers of Iran, it's just because Danz23 (nominator of this AfD), and SorenShadow, have tried to make it that way. Alefbe ( talk) 16:23, 13 December 2009 (UTC) reply

Alefbe why are you making false claims? I have never edited this article, I just pointed out to the most obvious fact, that this article has the same content at Persian people and is thus a fork which violates the standards of wikipedia. Danz23 ( talk) 22:10, 15 December 2009 (UTC) reply

• Keep Persian-speakers of Iran are an important sub-group of Persian people (with their own sub-culture). Tajiks, Hazaras and Farsiwans are examples of other sub-groups of Persian people and all of them have their own page (and they should have). The main reason that Danz23 wants to delete this page is because he is not happy with the content of Persian people and he doesn't like defining Persian people as an ethnolinguistic group (he wants to turn that page to a copy of what is now in the page Persian-speakers of Iran and then talk about their distinctive ethnic features and exclude other sub-groups whose mother tongue is also Persian, claiming that they are not pure Persians). Read the related discussion in talk:Persian people and look at the history of that page to see the nationalistic motivation of this proposal. Alefbe ( talk) 15:33, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Comment The reason that the title of that page is somehow odd is because the term Persians is very ambiguous and is used in different meanings, including all citizen of Iran (independent of their ethnicy), and all people whose mother tongue is Persian (independent of their country). Alefbe ( talk) 15:43, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Keep Persian-speakers of Iran are a sub-group of Persian people, so this page is needed. -- Kurdo777 ( talk) 21:15, 12 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Keep linguistically analyzing Iran's population is an appropriate topic in itself, so it isn't an improper content fork. I don't see any POV writing so it isn't a POV fork either. Them From Space 05:38, 13 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Delete Persian people or persians of iran are an ethnic group native to iran who speak farsi, persian speakers of iran may apply to all iranians since persian language is the only official/State language in iran. This article is created for political reasons.

I'm not surprised to see Alefbe and Kurdo777 here:) they are the ones who have hijacked persian people article. -- Owen3050 ( talk) 13:23, 13 December 2009 (UTC) reply

• Keep The distinction between Persian as a primary language and Persian ethnicity has not yet been made clear with supporting references either here or in Persian people. If it can be shown beyond reasonable doubt that the overwhelming consensus in peer-reviewed academic literature agrees with the unreferenced assertion in Persian people: "The Persian people are defined by the use of the Persian language as their mother tongue", then this article one or other of the articles is a POV fork. Until then, this separate article is worthwhile for covering one of several distinct linguistic groups in Iran, regardless of official recognition (or otherwise) by the present Iranian state. MuffledThud ( talk) 14:32, 13 December 2009 (UTC) reply

The important thing is that Persian-speakers comprise different sub-groups (with their own sub-culture) such as Tajiks, Hazaras, Farsiwans, Persian-speakers of Iran, ... . Whether Persian-speakers of Iran is the best title or not is a secondary issue and should be dealt in its own talk page. Alefbe ( talk) 15:59, 13 December 2009 (UTC) reply

• Second comment Danz23, SorenShadow and 4 other IDs (which are banned because of sock-puppetry) have been trying to change Persian people to a redundant copy of Persian-speakers of Iran, and now, Danz23 tries to delete Persian-speakers of Iran, claiming that it is a copy of Persian people. This shows the real motivation behind this AfD. Alefbe ( talk) 15:52, 13 December 2009 (UTC) reply
• Keep Danz is claiming these articles are incorrect because they are promoting "secesion from Iran". His editing violates Wikipedia's rules. Kalifo ( talk) 20:40, 13 December 2009 (UTC) reply

• Delete* It is obvious for all casual observers that this article is a is a content fork for the article Persian people, the content is identical but shorter. There is absolutly no content differenct as this articles content is not about Persian speakers in Iran (who by definition would include almost all peoples of Iran and would be best covered by the article farsi). This article just like the much longer article Persian people tries to define an ethnic group as a'n eclectic collection of groups with the Persian language being the main shared legacy”

The case is clear, it is an POV fork with an odd name, no reason not to delete this.

Also I see this article as a part of a larger political scheme in maintaining the myth that Persian ethnicity does not exist or is an indefinable groups of peoples. I have therefore opened this discussion to neutral thirld party observers with no political stake.

Danz23 ( talk) 23:39, 15 December 2009 (UTC) reply

• Delete Persian People(persians) are refered to a group of people in modern day Iran according to online Dictionaries and all relaible Sites. This is what i got online from http://dictionary.babylon.com/persian adj. of or pertaining to Persia; from Persia (former name of modern-day Iran. According to Chambers online Dictionary : Persian adj relating to ancient Persia(southern Iran) or modern Iran, or to their people Culture or language(Farsi). Persians of Iran are never called Persian speakers!! I think this article should either be deleted or the title changed to Persian Speakers to accommodate other Dari-persian speakers in Afghanistan & central asia whom are never defined as Persian People.-- Edinhu ( talk) 14:18, 16 December 2009 (UTC) — Edinhu ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. reply

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.