- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Sandstein 16:42, 29 September 2016 (UTC)
Oded Yinon
- Oded Yinon ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
This is a clear WP:BIO1E/ WP:BLP1E case. This individual is only known in connection to the Yinon Plan, and what little information is available about him personally is already covered in that article. Nsk92 ( talk) 14:55, 21 September 2016 (UTC) Nsk92 ( talk) 14:55, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
BIO1E states If the event is highly significant, and the individual's role within it is a large one, a separate article is generally appropriate. This individual is the sole author of a very significant plan which is a regionally and globally sigificant strategic plan to set out how Israel could destabilize the region through a process of balkanization to achieve its goal of securing its status as a regional superpower. In my view this is of sufficient significance to warrant a separate article. Martyn.Preller ( talk) 15:46, 21 September 2016 (UTC)[Martyn.Preller]
- That provision of WP:BIO1E refers to the situation where the individual in question, because of of his/her significant role in the event, has himself/herself been the subject of significant coverage. A good example of that would be Abdelhamid Abaaoud, because of his role in the November 2015 Paris attacks. But that's not the case here. Almost nothing at all is known about Oded Yinon personally, and he himself has not been the subject of significant coverage (in fact of hardly any coverage). The article you created says as much: ``Little is known about him and his background". In this situation there is no point in having a separate WP article about him. Apart from him having authored the Yinon Plan, the absolute grand total of information about him personally that seems to be available is that he is (or perhaps was) an Israeli journalist and a former Foreign Ministry official. There appears to be literally nothing else. Everything of substance that is known about him is already adequately covered in the Yinon Plan article, and that's exactly the kind of a situation that WP:BIO1E is designed to deal with. Nsk92 ( talk) 16:15, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Although there is little available about Yinon in English, there is much more in Hebrew. I have located sources which identify him as the son of the well-known diplomat, journalist and orientalist Dov Yinon, about whom he wrote two books. He has also published articles in newspapers, journals and books, and is a former Foreign Ministry official, later working in "another government department". Some of this could be added to the article, with links to reliable sources. RolandR ( talk) 23:38, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Middle East-related deletion discussions. Nsk92 ( talk) 16:01, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Journalism-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 16:47, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Israel-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 16:47, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete - I do not believe the event is notable enough to warrant its own article. The main Yinon Plan article is severely lacking in WP:RS. Without enough RS to support the main article there certainly isn't enough to prove him notable on his own. - Galatz Talk 17:08, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Redirect to Yinon Plan and include anything useful from this article in that one. John Pack Lambert ( talk) 23:38, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete as failing WP:GNG and WP:BIO1E. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 21:53, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
- Comment Actually it's worse than I thought at the beginning. There is no any evidence that Oded Yinon ever existed. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 22:00, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete - no indication that this individual even exists, let alone be notable. All the sources used in the article are completely unreliable, and the article's creator and main contributor is not allowed to edit any Israeli-Arab conflict article, per WP:ARBPIA3.. Epson Salts ( talk) 18:50, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per my comments above. And, despite Arthistorian1977's comment above, Yinon certainly does exist and is known and published in Israel. RolandR ( talk) 23:38, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
- Comment Please. provide sources for this. I didn't find anything reliable maintaining his existence either in English or Hebrew. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 04:31, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- For instance, this page for one of his books on the Steimatzky site; this letter by him in Haaretz; this article about him in Matzpen. These may not establish his notability, but they are certainly sufficient to confirm his existence. RolandR ( talk) 11:29, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Steimatzky is publishing house that will print anything they are paid for under any name. Second link is letter - anyone can sign by any name and the third one is not reliable source. I searched and didn't find any reliable records - reviews of his alleged book, articles about him in reliable sources. Nothing.
Arthistorian1977 (
talk) 12:17, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Don't be ridiculous. The book is available at all Israeli bookshops, not just Steimatzky's:
Booksefer,
Sefer Lecol,
Sifrut Zola and many more. It was
reviewed in Haaretz, and is
on the shelves of the Hebrew University library. Of course it is a genuine book. Haaretz is a reputable newspaper, and not in the business of publishing letters by non-existent people. And Matzpen is not going to waste its time polemicising against someone who doesn't exist.
RolandR (
talk) 13:14, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Allow me to continue being ridiculous. Is there any information available that connects Oded Yinon of this article to Oded Yinon, author of mentioned book. As Nsk92 mentioned below, there is almost any information available about him. And Harretz didn't publish review about his books, but just mentioned it in the list of the new books with exactly the same wording as on Steimatzki site, which I suppose is a PR message. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 19:54, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Don't be ridiculous. The book is available at all Israeli bookshops, not just Steimatzky's:
Booksefer,
Sefer Lecol,
Sifrut Zola and many more. It was
reviewed in Haaretz, and is
on the shelves of the Hebrew University library. Of course it is a genuine book. Haaretz is a reputable newspaper, and not in the business of publishing letters by non-existent people. And Matzpen is not going to waste its time polemicising against someone who doesn't exist.
RolandR (
talk) 13:14, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Even taking his existence for granted, the situation is still a long way off from overcoming the WP:BIO1E bar. There are still only snippets of extra information about Oden Yinon personally in the links you provided, the main extra bit of information being that he is the son of Dov Yinon. To overcome the WP:BIO1E bar one would need to find significant specific coverage of Oded Yinon personally, apart from the Yinon Plan, by solid WP:RS, that would justify a separate biographical article about him. Right now we don't have even the basic biographical details such as when and where he was born, where he was raised and when to school, where he got his college degree and possible a graduate degree, something more precise about his job history, whether he is/was married and has children, where he works/lives/retired now, or etc. In fact, we don't even know if he is still alive. With this dearth of specific information about him WP:BIO1E still applies and a separate biographical article is not justified, even if one takes his existence for granted. Nsk92 ( talk) 13:26, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete: Nothing points to the notability of the subject of this article. There's not a single reliable source used. Fails GNG spectacularly. Also 1E. No More Mr Nice Guy ( talk) 01:25, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete does not pass the general notability guideline. Firkin Flying Fox ( talk) 19:15, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete' as non-notable individual. E.M.Gregory ( talk) 22:04, 28 September 2016 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Sandstein 16:42, 29 September 2016 (UTC)
Oded Yinon
- Oded Yinon ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
This is a clear WP:BIO1E/ WP:BLP1E case. This individual is only known in connection to the Yinon Plan, and what little information is available about him personally is already covered in that article. Nsk92 ( talk) 14:55, 21 September 2016 (UTC) Nsk92 ( talk) 14:55, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
BIO1E states If the event is highly significant, and the individual's role within it is a large one, a separate article is generally appropriate. This individual is the sole author of a very significant plan which is a regionally and globally sigificant strategic plan to set out how Israel could destabilize the region through a process of balkanization to achieve its goal of securing its status as a regional superpower. In my view this is of sufficient significance to warrant a separate article. Martyn.Preller ( talk) 15:46, 21 September 2016 (UTC)[Martyn.Preller]
- That provision of WP:BIO1E refers to the situation where the individual in question, because of of his/her significant role in the event, has himself/herself been the subject of significant coverage. A good example of that would be Abdelhamid Abaaoud, because of his role in the November 2015 Paris attacks. But that's not the case here. Almost nothing at all is known about Oded Yinon personally, and he himself has not been the subject of significant coverage (in fact of hardly any coverage). The article you created says as much: ``Little is known about him and his background". In this situation there is no point in having a separate WP article about him. Apart from him having authored the Yinon Plan, the absolute grand total of information about him personally that seems to be available is that he is (or perhaps was) an Israeli journalist and a former Foreign Ministry official. There appears to be literally nothing else. Everything of substance that is known about him is already adequately covered in the Yinon Plan article, and that's exactly the kind of a situation that WP:BIO1E is designed to deal with. Nsk92 ( talk) 16:15, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Although there is little available about Yinon in English, there is much more in Hebrew. I have located sources which identify him as the son of the well-known diplomat, journalist and orientalist Dov Yinon, about whom he wrote two books. He has also published articles in newspapers, journals and books, and is a former Foreign Ministry official, later working in "another government department". Some of this could be added to the article, with links to reliable sources. RolandR ( talk) 23:38, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Middle East-related deletion discussions. Nsk92 ( talk) 16:01, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Journalism-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 16:47, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Israel-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 16:47, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete - I do not believe the event is notable enough to warrant its own article. The main Yinon Plan article is severely lacking in WP:RS. Without enough RS to support the main article there certainly isn't enough to prove him notable on his own. - Galatz Talk 17:08, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Redirect to Yinon Plan and include anything useful from this article in that one. John Pack Lambert ( talk) 23:38, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete as failing WP:GNG and WP:BIO1E. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 21:53, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
- Comment Actually it's worse than I thought at the beginning. There is no any evidence that Oded Yinon ever existed. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 22:00, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete - no indication that this individual even exists, let alone be notable. All the sources used in the article are completely unreliable, and the article's creator and main contributor is not allowed to edit any Israeli-Arab conflict article, per WP:ARBPIA3.. Epson Salts ( talk) 18:50, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per my comments above. And, despite Arthistorian1977's comment above, Yinon certainly does exist and is known and published in Israel. RolandR ( talk) 23:38, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
- Comment Please. provide sources for this. I didn't find anything reliable maintaining his existence either in English or Hebrew. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 04:31, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- For instance, this page for one of his books on the Steimatzky site; this letter by him in Haaretz; this article about him in Matzpen. These may not establish his notability, but they are certainly sufficient to confirm his existence. RolandR ( talk) 11:29, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Steimatzky is publishing house that will print anything they are paid for under any name. Second link is letter - anyone can sign by any name and the third one is not reliable source. I searched and didn't find any reliable records - reviews of his alleged book, articles about him in reliable sources. Nothing.
Arthistorian1977 (
talk) 12:17, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Don't be ridiculous. The book is available at all Israeli bookshops, not just Steimatzky's:
Booksefer,
Sefer Lecol,
Sifrut Zola and many more. It was
reviewed in Haaretz, and is
on the shelves of the Hebrew University library. Of course it is a genuine book. Haaretz is a reputable newspaper, and not in the business of publishing letters by non-existent people. And Matzpen is not going to waste its time polemicising against someone who doesn't exist.
RolandR (
talk) 13:14, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Allow me to continue being ridiculous. Is there any information available that connects Oded Yinon of this article to Oded Yinon, author of mentioned book. As Nsk92 mentioned below, there is almost any information available about him. And Harretz didn't publish review about his books, but just mentioned it in the list of the new books with exactly the same wording as on Steimatzki site, which I suppose is a PR message. Arthistorian1977 ( talk) 19:54, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Don't be ridiculous. The book is available at all Israeli bookshops, not just Steimatzky's:
Booksefer,
Sefer Lecol,
Sifrut Zola and many more. It was
reviewed in Haaretz, and is
on the shelves of the Hebrew University library. Of course it is a genuine book. Haaretz is a reputable newspaper, and not in the business of publishing letters by non-existent people. And Matzpen is not going to waste its time polemicising against someone who doesn't exist.
RolandR (
talk) 13:14, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Even taking his existence for granted, the situation is still a long way off from overcoming the WP:BIO1E bar. There are still only snippets of extra information about Oden Yinon personally in the links you provided, the main extra bit of information being that he is the son of Dov Yinon. To overcome the WP:BIO1E bar one would need to find significant specific coverage of Oded Yinon personally, apart from the Yinon Plan, by solid WP:RS, that would justify a separate biographical article about him. Right now we don't have even the basic biographical details such as when and where he was born, where he was raised and when to school, where he got his college degree and possible a graduate degree, something more precise about his job history, whether he is/was married and has children, where he works/lives/retired now, or etc. In fact, we don't even know if he is still alive. With this dearth of specific information about him WP:BIO1E still applies and a separate biographical article is not justified, even if one takes his existence for granted. Nsk92 ( talk) 13:26, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete: Nothing points to the notability of the subject of this article. There's not a single reliable source used. Fails GNG spectacularly. Also 1E. No More Mr Nice Guy ( talk) 01:25, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete does not pass the general notability guideline. Firkin Flying Fox ( talk) 19:15, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
- Delete' as non-notable individual. E.M.Gregory ( talk) 22:04, 28 September 2016 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.