- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Tony Tan#Personal life. Consensus there is insufficient coverage for a standalone article. (non-admin closure) Alpha3031 ( t • c) 14:19, 16 September 2023 (UTC)
Mary Chee Bee Kiang
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- Mary Chee Bee Kiang ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Does not meet WP:GNG. All sources are incidental of the subject. Unable to find any prior significant mention of the subject online or in the news archive at NewspaperSG. – robertsky ( talk) 09:12, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Singapore-related deletion discussions. – robertsky ( talk) 09:12, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Shellwood ( talk) 11:12, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to
Spouse of the president of SingaporeTony Tan. The 2011 AsiaOne piece, "Women behind the men" reads: "The woman behind one of the presidential candidates, Dr Tony Tan, remains elusive. Not much has been written publicly about Dr Tan's wife, Madam Mary Chee Bee Kiang, 70 (right, with Dr Tan). And Dr Tan's office declined this paper's request to interview her, with a spokesman replying via e-mail: "We will not be participating in this project as we believe before Singaporeans is the election of a President...". The article in The Straits Times is mainly a quote of Dr Tan's Facebook post thanking his wife for her "support and encouragement" during their 53rd anniversary. Not much else turns up in searches of Google.sg and Wikipedia Library, except for mentions of her name during official visits with her husband. There isn't enough coverage in independent reliable secondary sources to expand the stub meaningfully (and it seems she prefers to keep it that way for now); does not meet WP:BASIC, let alone WP:GNG. Cielquiparle ( talk) 05:10, 26 August 2023 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗ plicit 14:09, 1 September 2023 (UTC)Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Eddie891 Talk Work 15:19, 8 September 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to Tony Tan as {{ R from spouse}}. I agree with Cielquiparle's assessment of the suitability of a standalone article, but Tan's article seems better as a target. - Presidentman talk · contribs ( Talkback) 17:01, 8 September 2023 (UTC)
- Keep - There's no positive contribution to either Wikipedia or general public knowledge by deleting her biography, and no negative drawback to keeping Mary Chee Bee Kiang. None. At the end of the day, she's a national public figure. You may argue that it's a minor role, but she and her position are still national and public, and Wikipedia has generally protected the wives/husbands of national leaders from deletion (aside from a small handful of editors targeting similar Asian biographies and consistently try to delete these biographies). And, for the record, I would have strongly advocated against the deletion/redirect of Mohammed Abdullah Alhabshee, the first man to hold the role, had I known he was up for mass deletion too.
Scanlan (
talk) 12:43, 9 September 2023 (UTC)
- On the contrary, there is no positive contribution to Wikipedia as well for keeping an article that carries no WP:GNG and the same information can be sought for in Tony Tan's article.
- Also, there is no 'mass deletion' here. Only two articles were nominated by me, a Singaporean editor no less. Both are nominated separately so that each article can be evaluated on its own standing. I am pretty much aware of the perception of Asian BLPs being targeted for deletion, but make no mistake, I do not take deletions of articles lightly in general and have had conducted my research with local resources in hopes of shoring up the article. I was unable to find a single mention about Mary Chee that's apart from Tony Tan, that's even with Newslink, a newspaper archive of every article written in Singapore's national papers since 2001. (Access for Newslink is made available through Singapore's national library membership, which is virtually available to all Singaporean citizens and current residents at no or little cost). What I can conclude with my research is that Mary Chee is an extremely private person and was only present to accompany her husband in his official duties when required. She had no authority to exercise or even made use of the inherent intangible influence that a spouse of the President may have. – robertsky ( talk) 07:02, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
- Keep, per above. Brachy08 (Talk) 04:34, 15 September 2023 (UTC)
Redirect to Spouse of the president of Singapore or redirect/merge to Tony Tan#Personal life. My argument from the Mohammed Abdullah Alhabshee AFD: "Not notable enough for a standalone article, but there will be people looking for info on this person. Keeping at least the search term will help satisfy these and also solve the WP:GNG issue." still stands on this article. S5A-0043 Talk 05:55, 12 September 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to Tony Tan: Failed GNG but still notable for people to search for her. If there is any new references available in the future, we can remove the redirect then. JASWE ( talk) 04:53, 15 September 2023 (UTC)
- Comment. Agree that Tony Tan is the best target for a redirect and have struck my earlier recommendation for the main redirect target above. Yes, if more coverage about Mary Chee is published in reliable independent secondary sources in the future, we could/should convert the redirect back to a standalone article about her then. But for now it seems we should respect her privacy per WP:BLP and also, notability is not "inherited" or automatically passed from one's spouse per WP:NOTINHERITED. Cielquiparle ( talk) 02:38, 16 September 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Tony Tan#Personal life. Consensus there is insufficient coverage for a standalone article. (non-admin closure) Alpha3031 ( t • c) 14:19, 16 September 2023 (UTC)
Mary Chee Bee Kiang
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Mary Chee Bee Kiang ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Does not meet WP:GNG. All sources are incidental of the subject. Unable to find any prior significant mention of the subject online or in the news archive at NewspaperSG. – robertsky ( talk) 09:12, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Singapore-related deletion discussions. – robertsky ( talk) 09:12, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Shellwood ( talk) 11:12, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to
Spouse of the president of SingaporeTony Tan. The 2011 AsiaOne piece, "Women behind the men" reads: "The woman behind one of the presidential candidates, Dr Tony Tan, remains elusive. Not much has been written publicly about Dr Tan's wife, Madam Mary Chee Bee Kiang, 70 (right, with Dr Tan). And Dr Tan's office declined this paper's request to interview her, with a spokesman replying via e-mail: "We will not be participating in this project as we believe before Singaporeans is the election of a President...". The article in The Straits Times is mainly a quote of Dr Tan's Facebook post thanking his wife for her "support and encouragement" during their 53rd anniversary. Not much else turns up in searches of Google.sg and Wikipedia Library, except for mentions of her name during official visits with her husband. There isn't enough coverage in independent reliable secondary sources to expand the stub meaningfully (and it seems she prefers to keep it that way for now); does not meet WP:BASIC, let alone WP:GNG. Cielquiparle ( talk) 05:10, 26 August 2023 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗ plicit 14:09, 1 September 2023 (UTC)Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Eddie891 Talk Work 15:19, 8 September 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to Tony Tan as {{ R from spouse}}. I agree with Cielquiparle's assessment of the suitability of a standalone article, but Tan's article seems better as a target. - Presidentman talk · contribs ( Talkback) 17:01, 8 September 2023 (UTC)
- Keep - There's no positive contribution to either Wikipedia or general public knowledge by deleting her biography, and no negative drawback to keeping Mary Chee Bee Kiang. None. At the end of the day, she's a national public figure. You may argue that it's a minor role, but she and her position are still national and public, and Wikipedia has generally protected the wives/husbands of national leaders from deletion (aside from a small handful of editors targeting similar Asian biographies and consistently try to delete these biographies). And, for the record, I would have strongly advocated against the deletion/redirect of Mohammed Abdullah Alhabshee, the first man to hold the role, had I known he was up for mass deletion too.
Scanlan (
talk) 12:43, 9 September 2023 (UTC)
- On the contrary, there is no positive contribution to Wikipedia as well for keeping an article that carries no WP:GNG and the same information can be sought for in Tony Tan's article.
- Also, there is no 'mass deletion' here. Only two articles were nominated by me, a Singaporean editor no less. Both are nominated separately so that each article can be evaluated on its own standing. I am pretty much aware of the perception of Asian BLPs being targeted for deletion, but make no mistake, I do not take deletions of articles lightly in general and have had conducted my research with local resources in hopes of shoring up the article. I was unable to find a single mention about Mary Chee that's apart from Tony Tan, that's even with Newslink, a newspaper archive of every article written in Singapore's national papers since 2001. (Access for Newslink is made available through Singapore's national library membership, which is virtually available to all Singaporean citizens and current residents at no or little cost). What I can conclude with my research is that Mary Chee is an extremely private person and was only present to accompany her husband in his official duties when required. She had no authority to exercise or even made use of the inherent intangible influence that a spouse of the President may have. – robertsky ( talk) 07:02, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
- Keep, per above. Brachy08 (Talk) 04:34, 15 September 2023 (UTC)
Redirect to Spouse of the president of Singapore or redirect/merge to Tony Tan#Personal life. My argument from the Mohammed Abdullah Alhabshee AFD: "Not notable enough for a standalone article, but there will be people looking for info on this person. Keeping at least the search term will help satisfy these and also solve the WP:GNG issue." still stands on this article. S5A-0043 Talk 05:55, 12 September 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to Tony Tan: Failed GNG but still notable for people to search for her. If there is any new references available in the future, we can remove the redirect then. JASWE ( talk) 04:53, 15 September 2023 (UTC)
- Comment. Agree that Tony Tan is the best target for a redirect and have struck my earlier recommendation for the main redirect target above. Yes, if more coverage about Mary Chee is published in reliable independent secondary sources in the future, we could/should convert the redirect back to a standalone article about her then. But for now it seems we should respect her privacy per WP:BLP and also, notability is not "inherited" or automatically passed from one's spouse per WP:NOTINHERITED. Cielquiparle ( talk) 02:38, 16 September 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.