- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. ( non-admin closure) GeoffreyT2000 ( talk) 00:37, 29 April 2017 (UTC)
List of metropolitan areas in Taiwan
- List of metropolitan areas in Taiwan ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Content not
notable. Metropolitan areas are not recognized by the government of Taiwan since 2010. There are no reliable sources on the topic.
Szqecs (
talk) 14:57, 13 April 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Geography-related deletion discussions. Antepenultimate ( talk) 02:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Antepenultimate ( talk) 02:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Taiwan-related deletion discussions. Antepenultimate ( talk) 02:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- Comment. Even if the government of Taiwan no longer uses the concept of "metropolitan area", there still presumably are geographical areas in Taiwan which would be thought of as metropolitan areas by geographers in other countries. If this article is to be deleted, it should be replaced with a redirect to an article which covers metropolitan areas in Taiwan as people would still want that information. -- Metropolitan90 (talk) 21:14, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- I'm leaning towards speedy keep here as the nomination is clearly erroneous. The nominator acknowledges that metropolitan areas were recognized by the government of Taiwan until 2010, and yet inexplicably and unsupportably claims that there are no reliable sources on the topic. The premise for the nomination then seems to be that we only list presently existing things, or that once it is no longer an official thing it can no longer be verified that it ever existed. In any event, the nomination is contradictory and incorrect, and unless another argument for deletion is presented there's nothing to discuss. postdlf ( talk) 14:36, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- How do I prove that there are no reliable sources? There are buttons up there for you to easily find sources and disprove this claim. The premise of this nomination is
WP:N, not existence.
Szqecs (
talk) 15:36, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- But if the government of Taiwan recognized metropolitan areas before 2010, there must be sources saying so from 2009 or earlier. And whether or not the government recognizes metropolitan areas, such areas still exist, because Taiwan still has large cities and those large cities have smaller cities and towns surrounding them. --
Metropolitan90
(talk) 16:12, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- I removed the 2010 sentence because both of you were mislead. It's not that since 2010 the subject doesn't exist, or that they are no sources because it is not recognized. This was never a notable topic, but since they are no longer recognized, it is unlikely to ever become notable.
Szqecs (
talk) 16:27, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- I restored your comment because it's already been replied to, removing it makes it look like you never said it unless someone digs into the history of this page and completely distorts the context for replies by others. If you want to retract something, you can do that by either 1) a subsequent comment in this discussion that explains why you were incorrect or no longer support a previous statement you made, or 2) by using
strikethrough(<s>...</s>) with an explanation. postdlf ( talk) 21:49, 15 April 2017 (UTC)- Anyway, back on the merits... You claimed that there are no reliable sources, which is obviously false, and not the same thing as claiming that something isn't notable (a claim you have not explained). Regardless, we don't even need to delve into notability because one of Wikipedia's core functions is as a gazetteer, which means we document populated places. We have independent articles on metropolitan areas in Taiwan and this list indexes them together based on that (prior) classification as a "metropolitan area". And as Metropolitan90 has pointed out, metropolitan area has a general meaning outside of any official classifications, so this list would be justified under either sense. postdlf ( talk) 21:57, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- I restored your comment because it's already been replied to, removing it makes it look like you never said it unless someone digs into the history of this page and completely distorts the context for replies by others. If you want to retract something, you can do that by either 1) a subsequent comment in this discussion that explains why you were incorrect or no longer support a previous statement you made, or 2) by using
- I removed the 2010 sentence because both of you were mislead. It's not that since 2010 the subject doesn't exist, or that they are no sources because it is not recognized. This was never a notable topic, but since they are no longer recognized, it is unlikely to ever become notable.
Szqecs (
talk) 16:27, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- But if the government of Taiwan recognized metropolitan areas before 2010, there must be sources saying so from 2009 or earlier. And whether or not the government recognizes metropolitan areas, such areas still exist, because Taiwan still has large cities and those large cities have smaller cities and towns surrounding them. --
Metropolitan90
(talk) 16:12, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- How do I prove that there are no reliable sources? There are buttons up there for you to easily find sources and disprove this claim. The premise of this nomination is
WP:N, not existence.
Szqecs (
talk) 15:36, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 04:18, 20 April 2017 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 04:18, 20 April 2017 (UTC)
- Keep We do not have a valid reason for deletion, as even a defunct metro region would still meet WP:GEOLAND and a list of such regions would meet WP:CLN, as we need to provide reasonable ways for people to find things, including lists. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 11:21, 25 April 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - it appears to pass WP:LISTN, and is focused so that it is not simply a random list. Onel5969 TT me 22:53, 28 April 2017 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. ( non-admin closure) GeoffreyT2000 ( talk) 00:37, 29 April 2017 (UTC)
List of metropolitan areas in Taiwan
- List of metropolitan areas in Taiwan ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Content not
notable. Metropolitan areas are not recognized by the government of Taiwan since 2010. There are no reliable sources on the topic.
Szqecs (
talk) 14:57, 13 April 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Geography-related deletion discussions. Antepenultimate ( talk) 02:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Antepenultimate ( talk) 02:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Taiwan-related deletion discussions. Antepenultimate ( talk) 02:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- Comment. Even if the government of Taiwan no longer uses the concept of "metropolitan area", there still presumably are geographical areas in Taiwan which would be thought of as metropolitan areas by geographers in other countries. If this article is to be deleted, it should be replaced with a redirect to an article which covers metropolitan areas in Taiwan as people would still want that information. -- Metropolitan90 (talk) 21:14, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
- I'm leaning towards speedy keep here as the nomination is clearly erroneous. The nominator acknowledges that metropolitan areas were recognized by the government of Taiwan until 2010, and yet inexplicably and unsupportably claims that there are no reliable sources on the topic. The premise for the nomination then seems to be that we only list presently existing things, or that once it is no longer an official thing it can no longer be verified that it ever existed. In any event, the nomination is contradictory and incorrect, and unless another argument for deletion is presented there's nothing to discuss. postdlf ( talk) 14:36, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- How do I prove that there are no reliable sources? There are buttons up there for you to easily find sources and disprove this claim. The premise of this nomination is
WP:N, not existence.
Szqecs (
talk) 15:36, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- But if the government of Taiwan recognized metropolitan areas before 2010, there must be sources saying so from 2009 or earlier. And whether or not the government recognizes metropolitan areas, such areas still exist, because Taiwan still has large cities and those large cities have smaller cities and towns surrounding them. --
Metropolitan90
(talk) 16:12, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- I removed the 2010 sentence because both of you were mislead. It's not that since 2010 the subject doesn't exist, or that they are no sources because it is not recognized. This was never a notable topic, but since they are no longer recognized, it is unlikely to ever become notable.
Szqecs (
talk) 16:27, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- I restored your comment because it's already been replied to, removing it makes it look like you never said it unless someone digs into the history of this page and completely distorts the context for replies by others. If you want to retract something, you can do that by either 1) a subsequent comment in this discussion that explains why you were incorrect or no longer support a previous statement you made, or 2) by using
strikethrough(<s>...</s>) with an explanation. postdlf ( talk) 21:49, 15 April 2017 (UTC)- Anyway, back on the merits... You claimed that there are no reliable sources, which is obviously false, and not the same thing as claiming that something isn't notable (a claim you have not explained). Regardless, we don't even need to delve into notability because one of Wikipedia's core functions is as a gazetteer, which means we document populated places. We have independent articles on metropolitan areas in Taiwan and this list indexes them together based on that (prior) classification as a "metropolitan area". And as Metropolitan90 has pointed out, metropolitan area has a general meaning outside of any official classifications, so this list would be justified under either sense. postdlf ( talk) 21:57, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- I restored your comment because it's already been replied to, removing it makes it look like you never said it unless someone digs into the history of this page and completely distorts the context for replies by others. If you want to retract something, you can do that by either 1) a subsequent comment in this discussion that explains why you were incorrect or no longer support a previous statement you made, or 2) by using
- I removed the 2010 sentence because both of you were mislead. It's not that since 2010 the subject doesn't exist, or that they are no sources because it is not recognized. This was never a notable topic, but since they are no longer recognized, it is unlikely to ever become notable.
Szqecs (
talk) 16:27, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- But if the government of Taiwan recognized metropolitan areas before 2010, there must be sources saying so from 2009 or earlier. And whether or not the government recognizes metropolitan areas, such areas still exist, because Taiwan still has large cities and those large cities have smaller cities and towns surrounding them. --
Metropolitan90
(talk) 16:12, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
- How do I prove that there are no reliable sources? There are buttons up there for you to easily find sources and disprove this claim. The premise of this nomination is
WP:N, not existence.
Szqecs (
talk) 15:36, 15 April 2017 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 04:18, 20 April 2017 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 04:18, 20 April 2017 (UTC)
- Keep We do not have a valid reason for deletion, as even a defunct metro region would still meet WP:GEOLAND and a list of such regions would meet WP:CLN, as we need to provide reasonable ways for people to find things, including lists. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 11:21, 25 April 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - it appears to pass WP:LISTN, and is focused so that it is not simply a random list. Onel5969 TT me 22:53, 28 April 2017 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.