- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. No objection to subsequent creation of a dab page. Randykitty ( talk) 12:12, 26 December 2014 (UTC)
- Kensei ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Contested PROD. Original reason was Unsourced since 2009 - the only source is a dictionary entry. I checked several Japanese dictionaries (daijisen, daijirin, Nihon Kokugo Daijiten) and none of them makes any mention of it being an honorary title - daijs only says "剣術にすぐれ、奥義を極めた人。" (person who is extremely skilled at fencing). It's telling that there's no entry for this in the Japanese wikipedia.
Jackmcbarn (
talk)
18:31, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Japan-related deletion discussions. Everymorning talk 18:43, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- This might work better as a list, if we don't have one already; the Japanese Wikipedia does have a dab page at ja:剣豪 that leads to ja:剣豪人物一覧 ("List of [Japanese] master swordsmen"). Dekimasu よ! 20:34, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- The Japanese Wikipedia also has ja:昭和の剣聖 ("Kensei of the Showa period") which is more specific to kendo. Dekimasu よ! 20:37, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- Delete. Looks like a collection of original research regarding both the claimed definition of kensei and the list of names who are supposedly kensei. -- DAJF ( talk) 14:56, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 15:38, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 15:38, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Delete Certainly needs more references than just a single dictionary reference - I think the original PROD was correct. The Japanese articles mentioned above are not the same thing and a lot of what was written in the article is different from my understanding - it really isn't a title as such just that occasionally it was a term used in association with a particular swordsman. Sort of like calling the occasional King 'the Great'. Without supporting references I would call original research. A wiktionary entry at best. Peter Rehse ( talk) 16:00, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Delete The phrase gets very few hits on Google or the Japanese wikipedia. The Japanese article for Miyamoto Musashi does not use the phrase to describe him, but the article for the Musashi Museum does. Regardless, I do not think this is a very notable term. Regarding the reference to the Kenkyusha dictionary, I understood the reference being to the term that is being compared to, Kenshi. I think I have access to that dictionary (but perhaps not the same edition), so I will check which term is actually printed. AtHomeIn神戸 ( talk) 05:53, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
- Convert into a dab page. We've got
Kensei (horse),
Kensei: Sacred Fist, and several BLPs, such as
Kensei Mizote and
Kensei Hasegawa. If it gets deleted, I might just create the dab myself. If I can remember, that is.
NinjaRobotPirate (
talk)
02:32, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
- That's not a bad idea, but I think it should happen after what's there now is deleted. Jackmcbarn ( talk) 19:04, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
- Concur - I was watching for this if NinjaRobotPirate couldn't remember. Peter Rehse ( talk) 19:06, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. No objection to subsequent creation of a dab page. Randykitty ( talk) 12:12, 26 December 2014 (UTC)
- Kensei ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Contested PROD. Original reason was Unsourced since 2009 - the only source is a dictionary entry. I checked several Japanese dictionaries (daijisen, daijirin, Nihon Kokugo Daijiten) and none of them makes any mention of it being an honorary title - daijs only says "剣術にすぐれ、奥義を極めた人。" (person who is extremely skilled at fencing). It's telling that there's no entry for this in the Japanese wikipedia.
Jackmcbarn (
talk)
18:31, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Japan-related deletion discussions. Everymorning talk 18:43, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- This might work better as a list, if we don't have one already; the Japanese Wikipedia does have a dab page at ja:剣豪 that leads to ja:剣豪人物一覧 ("List of [Japanese] master swordsmen"). Dekimasu よ! 20:34, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- The Japanese Wikipedia also has ja:昭和の剣聖 ("Kensei of the Showa period") which is more specific to kendo. Dekimasu よ! 20:37, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
- Delete. Looks like a collection of original research regarding both the claimed definition of kensei and the list of names who are supposedly kensei. -- DAJF ( talk) 14:56, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 15:38, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 15:38, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Delete Certainly needs more references than just a single dictionary reference - I think the original PROD was correct. The Japanese articles mentioned above are not the same thing and a lot of what was written in the article is different from my understanding - it really isn't a title as such just that occasionally it was a term used in association with a particular swordsman. Sort of like calling the occasional King 'the Great'. Without supporting references I would call original research. A wiktionary entry at best. Peter Rehse ( talk) 16:00, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
- Delete The phrase gets very few hits on Google or the Japanese wikipedia. The Japanese article for Miyamoto Musashi does not use the phrase to describe him, but the article for the Musashi Museum does. Regardless, I do not think this is a very notable term. Regarding the reference to the Kenkyusha dictionary, I understood the reference being to the term that is being compared to, Kenshi. I think I have access to that dictionary (but perhaps not the same edition), so I will check which term is actually printed. AtHomeIn神戸 ( talk) 05:53, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
- Convert into a dab page. We've got
Kensei (horse),
Kensei: Sacred Fist, and several BLPs, such as
Kensei Mizote and
Kensei Hasegawa. If it gets deleted, I might just create the dab myself. If I can remember, that is.
NinjaRobotPirate (
talk)
02:32, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
- That's not a bad idea, but I think it should happen after what's there now is deleted. Jackmcbarn ( talk) 19:04, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
- Concur - I was watching for this if NinjaRobotPirate couldn't remember. Peter Rehse ( talk) 19:06, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.