- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. ( non-admin closure) Yash! 05:08, 28 October 2015 (UTC)
Jamie Lawson (album)
- Jamie Lawson (album) ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
WP:CRYSTAL. Album release date hasn't happened yet, and charting that was indicated was for singles, not for the album itself. Content has absolutely nothing to do with the album itself, but it regurgitated content from the articles on the singles. MSJapan ( talk) 21:53, 12 October 2015 (UTC)
This album meets Wikipedia's criteria for a notable album:
An album requires its own notability, and that notability is not inherited and requires independent evidence. That an album is an officially released recording by a notable musician or ensemble is not by itself reason for a standalone article. Conversely, an album does not need to be by a notable artist or ensemble to merit a standalone article if it meets the general notability guideline. Album articles with little more than a track listing may be more appropriately merged into the artist's main article or discography article, space permitting.
It is indisputable that Jamie Lawson is to be considered a 'notable musician'. This article does meet Wikipedia's General Notability Guideline, as all 5 entries on the list can be checked. Only one of the singles mentioned in the article has its own page, so the album page provides for information for the first time on other singles. This article currently includes release information and charting information for album ( MSJapan's claim that charting information was for singles is incorrect, as sources show that chart statistics are for the album). The track list will be updated to include writers and times for all track after formal album release on October 16 2015. HeyJude70 ( talk) 14:27, 13 October 2015
- Reply Except that notable musicians do not release notable albums by default; that is what
WP:NOTINHERITED is all about. Your charting information cannot be for the album, as the album hasn't been released yet; the article clearly states it was pushed back, and nothing can chart before its release, so I'm sorry, but there's no way that chart information is for the album. As for your sources, you have two reliable sources. ITunes, Google Play, and Twitter just don't cut it.
MSJapan (
talk)
07:08, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
- ReplyAlbums can chart on the iTunes Charts prior to release. The iTunes Charts are detirmined by sales of an album, so in this case the sales for this album which was available for pre-order proved to be high enough for the album to chart. The sources used for the charts determines this, and a quick scan of the Australian or UK iTunes store chart will also prove this point. Please educate yourself on how different charting systems work before removing them from a page.
HeyJude70 (
talk)
08:30, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
- Reply: iTunes charts are not Billboard. It's got nothing to do with "different charting systems" - iTunes charts are not what we use for charting purposes. See
WP:CHART.
MSJapan (
talk)
19:10, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
- Reply:This album page has been greatly improved since this article for deletion was opened. The page now includes writing credits and times for every track, personnel for the entire album and a brief history behind that album. As of next week, charting information will be added as the album has already been shown at #1 for the UK Official Charts Half-Week. This page also has several new, reliable sources. HeyJude70 ( talk) 06:41, 20 October 2015 (UTC)
- Reply: iTunes charts are not Billboard. It's got nothing to do with "different charting systems" - iTunes charts are not what we use for charting purposes. See
WP:CHART.
MSJapan (
talk)
19:10, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
- ReplyAlbums can chart on the iTunes Charts prior to release. The iTunes Charts are detirmined by sales of an album, so in this case the sales for this album which was available for pre-order proved to be high enough for the album to chart. The sources used for the charts determines this, and a quick scan of the Australian or UK iTunes store chart will also prove this point. Please educate yourself on how different charting systems work before removing them from a page.
HeyJude70 (
talk)
08:30, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MBisanz talk 16:16, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
- Strong Keep: The album has now peaked to number 1 in the UK, number 5 in Ireland, number 4 in Australia and number 3 in New Zealand. There are now lots of reliable sources and content provided in the article now. Greenock125 ( talk) 10:20, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
- Speedy keep Sufficient sources, charting album. — Justin (koavf)❤ T☮ C☺ M☯ 03:03, 26 October 2015 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. ( non-admin closure) Yash! 05:08, 28 October 2015 (UTC)
Jamie Lawson (album)
- Jamie Lawson (album) ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
WP:CRYSTAL. Album release date hasn't happened yet, and charting that was indicated was for singles, not for the album itself. Content has absolutely nothing to do with the album itself, but it regurgitated content from the articles on the singles. MSJapan ( talk) 21:53, 12 October 2015 (UTC)
This album meets Wikipedia's criteria for a notable album:
An album requires its own notability, and that notability is not inherited and requires independent evidence. That an album is an officially released recording by a notable musician or ensemble is not by itself reason for a standalone article. Conversely, an album does not need to be by a notable artist or ensemble to merit a standalone article if it meets the general notability guideline. Album articles with little more than a track listing may be more appropriately merged into the artist's main article or discography article, space permitting.
It is indisputable that Jamie Lawson is to be considered a 'notable musician'. This article does meet Wikipedia's General Notability Guideline, as all 5 entries on the list can be checked. Only one of the singles mentioned in the article has its own page, so the album page provides for information for the first time on other singles. This article currently includes release information and charting information for album ( MSJapan's claim that charting information was for singles is incorrect, as sources show that chart statistics are for the album). The track list will be updated to include writers and times for all track after formal album release on October 16 2015. HeyJude70 ( talk) 14:27, 13 October 2015
- Reply Except that notable musicians do not release notable albums by default; that is what
WP:NOTINHERITED is all about. Your charting information cannot be for the album, as the album hasn't been released yet; the article clearly states it was pushed back, and nothing can chart before its release, so I'm sorry, but there's no way that chart information is for the album. As for your sources, you have two reliable sources. ITunes, Google Play, and Twitter just don't cut it.
MSJapan (
talk)
07:08, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
- ReplyAlbums can chart on the iTunes Charts prior to release. The iTunes Charts are detirmined by sales of an album, so in this case the sales for this album which was available for pre-order proved to be high enough for the album to chart. The sources used for the charts determines this, and a quick scan of the Australian or UK iTunes store chart will also prove this point. Please educate yourself on how different charting systems work before removing them from a page.
HeyJude70 (
talk)
08:30, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
- Reply: iTunes charts are not Billboard. It's got nothing to do with "different charting systems" - iTunes charts are not what we use for charting purposes. See
WP:CHART.
MSJapan (
talk)
19:10, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
- Reply:This album page has been greatly improved since this article for deletion was opened. The page now includes writing credits and times for every track, personnel for the entire album and a brief history behind that album. As of next week, charting information will be added as the album has already been shown at #1 for the UK Official Charts Half-Week. This page also has several new, reliable sources. HeyJude70 ( talk) 06:41, 20 October 2015 (UTC)
- Reply: iTunes charts are not Billboard. It's got nothing to do with "different charting systems" - iTunes charts are not what we use for charting purposes. See
WP:CHART.
MSJapan (
talk)
19:10, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
- ReplyAlbums can chart on the iTunes Charts prior to release. The iTunes Charts are detirmined by sales of an album, so in this case the sales for this album which was available for pre-order proved to be high enough for the album to chart. The sources used for the charts determines this, and a quick scan of the Australian or UK iTunes store chart will also prove this point. Please educate yourself on how different charting systems work before removing them from a page.
HeyJude70 (
talk)
08:30, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MBisanz talk 16:16, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
- Strong Keep: The album has now peaked to number 1 in the UK, number 5 in Ireland, number 4 in Australia and number 3 in New Zealand. There are now lots of reliable sources and content provided in the article now. Greenock125 ( talk) 10:20, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
- Speedy keep Sufficient sources, charting album. — Justin (koavf)❤ T☮ C☺ M☯ 03:03, 26 October 2015 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.