- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Gridiron Australia. ( non-admin closure) – Davey2010 Talk 23:52, 9 December 2015 (UTC)
Gridiron West
- Gridiron West ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Fails WP:GNG, has not been the subject of significant coverage in reliable sources. Hack ( talk) 05:46, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. Musa Talk 06:34, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. Musa Talk 06:35, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 12:03, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Delete fails WP:GNG and any other measure I can find. No independent sources. Would change my position of they are found.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 02:32, 30 November 2015 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 00:42, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 00:42, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. North America 1000 01:18, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- Delete as this seems acceptable deletion material until a better article is available, no solid independent notability currently. SwisterTwister talk 07:18, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- Comment: Gridiron West is part of a set of articles on state-level governing bodies for "gridiron" (American football) in Australia. Unless this one was picked as a "test case", I can't see why this is any different from ACT Gridiron, Gridiron NSW, Gridiron Queensland, South Australian Gridiron Association, and Gridiron Victoria. An alternative to deletion would be to redirect these to Gridiron Australia. -- Tavix ( talk) 20:55, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- @ Tavix: Thank you for posting that explanation. Have you taken a look at the sources for this article? Any suggestions how we should wrap our heads around the notability analysis for this? All of the articles for the member teams of Gridiron West have already been redirected to this article, so a number of related team articles have already been deleted. I keep starting to research this, and then getting interrupted . . . I suspect the best potential newspaper references for this subject may only be available through Aussie newspaper archives . . . do we have any Australian sports editors with an interest in researching this? Jenks24, perhaps? Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 08:38, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- Not sure how it works in other countries, but Australia generally has state-level governing bodies for sports that are then overseen by a national governing body. Using examples from my state, Baseball Victoria, Cricket Victoria, Hockey Victoria, AFL Victoria, etc. I'd say these are usually notable but Wikipedia's coverage of them is often poor – the national governing body will draw most of the attention and, let's face it, sports fans are more interested in writing about their teams and leagues. On the question of whether this particular article is notable, I'm not sure. Looking at Newsbank, the coverage appears to be in local sources (e.g. Joondalup-Wanneroo Times, North Coast Times, Canning Times, Fremantle-Cockburn Gazette, Weekend Courier) rather than statewide newspapers. I think if someone went to the effort, a case could be made for passing the GNG but in the interim I wouldn't be opposed to just redirecting to Gridiron Australia. I also wouldn't necessarily use this as a precedent for all state gridiron bodies in Australia. I think a case could easily be made that Gridiron Victoria, for example, passes GNG – it has a fair bit of coverage in the Herald Sun. Jenks24 ( talk) 11:33, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- Redirect to
Gridiron Australia (note "redirect" entails that article history be preserved) - I'm going to follow
Jenks24's recommendation immediately above. This is a Western Australian state-level governing body for what is a relatively minor, but growing sport in Australia. Current coverage of the subject in independent reliable sources is marginal at best, but this subject may very well have significant expansion potential in the not-distant future, so an outright "delete" may not be the best outcome here. I also note that all of the articles for the member teams have already been redirected to this article. @
Tavix,
SwisterTwister,
Paulmcdonald, and
Hack: Pinging previous !voters to reconsider their !votes and rationales in light of Jenks24's comments. I think a redirect may be the best outcome for now.
Dirtlawyer1 (
talk) 15:21, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- No objection I have no objection to redirect. It makes sense.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 14:46, 6 December 2015 (UTC)
- Redirect to Gridiron Australia, seconding Dirtlawyer and our conversation above. Since we're already here, it might be a worthwhile task to figure out which other state-level governing bodies should also be redirected there. I assumed it would be an all or none situation, but perhaps a few of them would pass GNG as Jenks24 mentioned. If the result is "redirect", I'm also considering an RFD for the team redirects since we'd be pushing them up a level, but feedback regarding that issue would be nice as well (my apologies if this is outside the purview of this AFD, it seems convenient raising them here). -- Tavix ( talk) 15:32, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Gridiron Australia. ( non-admin closure) – Davey2010 Talk 23:52, 9 December 2015 (UTC)
Gridiron West
- Gridiron West ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Fails WP:GNG, has not been the subject of significant coverage in reliable sources. Hack ( talk) 05:46, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. Musa Talk 06:34, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. Musa Talk 06:35, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 12:03, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
- Delete fails WP:GNG and any other measure I can find. No independent sources. Would change my position of they are found.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 02:32, 30 November 2015 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 00:42, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 00:42, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. North America 1000 01:18, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- Delete as this seems acceptable deletion material until a better article is available, no solid independent notability currently. SwisterTwister talk 07:18, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- Comment: Gridiron West is part of a set of articles on state-level governing bodies for "gridiron" (American football) in Australia. Unless this one was picked as a "test case", I can't see why this is any different from ACT Gridiron, Gridiron NSW, Gridiron Queensland, South Australian Gridiron Association, and Gridiron Victoria. An alternative to deletion would be to redirect these to Gridiron Australia. -- Tavix ( talk) 20:55, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
- @ Tavix: Thank you for posting that explanation. Have you taken a look at the sources for this article? Any suggestions how we should wrap our heads around the notability analysis for this? All of the articles for the member teams of Gridiron West have already been redirected to this article, so a number of related team articles have already been deleted. I keep starting to research this, and then getting interrupted . . . I suspect the best potential newspaper references for this subject may only be available through Aussie newspaper archives . . . do we have any Australian sports editors with an interest in researching this? Jenks24, perhaps? Dirtlawyer1 ( talk) 08:38, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- Not sure how it works in other countries, but Australia generally has state-level governing bodies for sports that are then overseen by a national governing body. Using examples from my state, Baseball Victoria, Cricket Victoria, Hockey Victoria, AFL Victoria, etc. I'd say these are usually notable but Wikipedia's coverage of them is often poor – the national governing body will draw most of the attention and, let's face it, sports fans are more interested in writing about their teams and leagues. On the question of whether this particular article is notable, I'm not sure. Looking at Newsbank, the coverage appears to be in local sources (e.g. Joondalup-Wanneroo Times, North Coast Times, Canning Times, Fremantle-Cockburn Gazette, Weekend Courier) rather than statewide newspapers. I think if someone went to the effort, a case could be made for passing the GNG but in the interim I wouldn't be opposed to just redirecting to Gridiron Australia. I also wouldn't necessarily use this as a precedent for all state gridiron bodies in Australia. I think a case could easily be made that Gridiron Victoria, for example, passes GNG – it has a fair bit of coverage in the Herald Sun. Jenks24 ( talk) 11:33, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- Redirect to
Gridiron Australia (note "redirect" entails that article history be preserved) - I'm going to follow
Jenks24's recommendation immediately above. This is a Western Australian state-level governing body for what is a relatively minor, but growing sport in Australia. Current coverage of the subject in independent reliable sources is marginal at best, but this subject may very well have significant expansion potential in the not-distant future, so an outright "delete" may not be the best outcome here. I also note that all of the articles for the member teams have already been redirected to this article. @
Tavix,
SwisterTwister,
Paulmcdonald, and
Hack: Pinging previous !voters to reconsider their !votes and rationales in light of Jenks24's comments. I think a redirect may be the best outcome for now.
Dirtlawyer1 (
talk) 15:21, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- No objection I have no objection to redirect. It makes sense.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 14:46, 6 December 2015 (UTC)
- Redirect to Gridiron Australia, seconding Dirtlawyer and our conversation above. Since we're already here, it might be a worthwhile task to figure out which other state-level governing bodies should also be redirected there. I assumed it would be an all or none situation, but perhaps a few of them would pass GNG as Jenks24 mentioned. If the result is "redirect", I'm also considering an RFD for the team redirects since we'd be pushing them up a level, but feedback regarding that issue would be nice as well (my apologies if this is outside the purview of this AFD, it seems convenient raising them here). -- Tavix ( talk) 15:32, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.