- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Hindi Belt. Liz Read! Talk! 01:11, 16 November 2023 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Cow belt ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Procedural nomination; I am neutral. PRODded in 2020 by
LearnIndology (no-pinged; TBANned and inactive) for reason It is just a social media slang and not enough scholarly sources are available for this term.
Instead
BLAR'd to
Indo-Gangetic Plain by
Capankajsmilyo. Restored by
आज़ादी, BLAR'd again by LearnIndology because has nothing except a dictionary source; restore redirect
, and finally
brought to RfD, where I found consensus to restore and send to AfD. A number of RfD voters favored redirecting to
BIMARU states, which this AfD should consider. --
Tamzin[
cetacean needed (they|xe|she)
00:39, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Geography and India. -- Tamzin[ cetacean needed (they|xe|she) 00:39, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
- It's non-trivial to consider, but fairly obvious.
Reddy 2015, p. 109 documents this as a genuine journalistic shorthand. But it is long past the time that we should have formally adopted rules against slang article titles, given how inevitably bad they have always turned out to be over the years.
Reddy 2015, p. 109 indicates that "cow belt" is pejorative slang, and talks of a
Hindi belt. That latter turns up in things like
Harrison 2015, p. 305, which documents
K. Kelappan's view of the Hindi belt. Given that sources such as
West 2010, p. 281 (the author being an anthropology professor) and many others use the names synonymously, and given that
Reddy 2015, p. 109 (the author being a journalist) points out that "cow belt" is pejorative for
Hindi belt, the fact that this should be a redirect, and the redirect target, seem plainly indicated by how subject experts have documented this.
Uncle G (
talk)
01:20, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
- Reddy, Kovuuri G. (2015). Handbook of Journalism and Media: India, Bharat, Hindustan. Vikas Publishing House. ISBN 9789325982383.
- Harrison, Selig S. (2015). India: The Most Dangerous Decades. Princeton Legacy Library. Vol. 2233. Princeton University Press. ISBN 9781400877805.
- West, Barbara A. (2010). "Hindi". Encyclopedia of the Peoples of Asia and Oceania. Infobase Publishing.
ISBN
9781438119137.
so-called Hindi belt or cow belt
- Keep this is notable enough. बिनोद थारू ( talk) 00:53, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to BIMARU states per the rationales shared at the RfD. The subject does not appear to independently pass GNG, with only passing mentions in sources and no focused discussion. — TechnoSquirrel69 ( sigh) 02:18, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting, User:Uncle G you say it's fairly obvious but it's not despite your admirable investigation. I gather you want to turn this page into a Redirect but to what redirect target? The one proposed in the nominator's statement or to the previous redirect target? Or another one entirely?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 00:24, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- Question: Is this not just an alternative name for the
Hindi Belt? Is there something I'm missing here? —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
01:26, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- The term seems to be used interchangeably in some contexts, but is typically used to refer to a particular region that is a subset of the Hindi belt. — TechnoSquirrel69 ( sigh) 02:03, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- Just to be clear, although I thought that the quotation and the fact that I said that they were synonyms made it obvious, per Reddy 2015, p. 109 and West 2010, p. 281 the "cow belt" is the Hindi belt, just a pejorative name for it. Wikipedia:Redirect#Neutrality of redirects. Reddy 2015, p. 109 draws a distinction between the Hindi belt a.k.a. Hindi heartland, including Delhi and Chhattisgarh, and the BIMARU states, not including those. But that's another discussion, about two other pages. Uncle G ( talk) 09:17, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to
Hindi Belt and/or selectively merge there. If this is simply a slang term for a region referred to by a more common name, it might be better to mention it
within the article with broader scope that provides more context rather than forking it out into its own article. Sources are describing the two as alternative names for one another, and I'm not really seeing the nominated article as being about the (oft-)pejorative title, so I think we've essentially got duplicate article subjects at the moment. —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
13:33, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
- In response to
Liz's relisting comment below, I'm OK with
BIMARU states, though I do think
Hindi Belt is more precise. I'd be fine hashing out this nuance at RfD. —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
01:44, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- Let's please not send this back to RfD, this AfD was only opened because of an RfD. — TechnoSquirrel69 ( sigh) 01:47, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- In response to
Liz's relisting comment below, I'm OK with
BIMARU states, though I do think
Hindi Belt is more precise. I'd be fine hashing out this nuance at RfD. —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
01:44, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting as there are three different redirect target articles mentioned in this discussion. If this closes as Redirect, we need to coalesce opinion on one article.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 01:09, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to Hindi belt: Since this is simply a (junior and pejorative) synonym for the existing article Hindi belt, we should simply redirect to avoid a content fork. I agree with the opinion above that we should be extremely circumspect about adopting a pejorative title as an article name. Chiswick Chap ( talk) 13:11, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was redirect to Hindi Belt. Liz Read! Talk! 01:11, 16 November 2023 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Cow belt ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Procedural nomination; I am neutral. PRODded in 2020 by
LearnIndology (no-pinged; TBANned and inactive) for reason It is just a social media slang and not enough scholarly sources are available for this term.
Instead
BLAR'd to
Indo-Gangetic Plain by
Capankajsmilyo. Restored by
आज़ादी, BLAR'd again by LearnIndology because has nothing except a dictionary source; restore redirect
, and finally
brought to RfD, where I found consensus to restore and send to AfD. A number of RfD voters favored redirecting to
BIMARU states, which this AfD should consider. --
Tamzin[
cetacean needed (they|xe|she)
00:39, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Geography and India. -- Tamzin[ cetacean needed (they|xe|she) 00:39, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
- It's non-trivial to consider, but fairly obvious.
Reddy 2015, p. 109 documents this as a genuine journalistic shorthand. But it is long past the time that we should have formally adopted rules against slang article titles, given how inevitably bad they have always turned out to be over the years.
Reddy 2015, p. 109 indicates that "cow belt" is pejorative slang, and talks of a
Hindi belt. That latter turns up in things like
Harrison 2015, p. 305, which documents
K. Kelappan's view of the Hindi belt. Given that sources such as
West 2010, p. 281 (the author being an anthropology professor) and many others use the names synonymously, and given that
Reddy 2015, p. 109 (the author being a journalist) points out that "cow belt" is pejorative for
Hindi belt, the fact that this should be a redirect, and the redirect target, seem plainly indicated by how subject experts have documented this.
Uncle G (
talk)
01:20, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
- Reddy, Kovuuri G. (2015). Handbook of Journalism and Media: India, Bharat, Hindustan. Vikas Publishing House. ISBN 9789325982383.
- Harrison, Selig S. (2015). India: The Most Dangerous Decades. Princeton Legacy Library. Vol. 2233. Princeton University Press. ISBN 9781400877805.
- West, Barbara A. (2010). "Hindi". Encyclopedia of the Peoples of Asia and Oceania. Infobase Publishing.
ISBN
9781438119137.
so-called Hindi belt or cow belt
- Keep this is notable enough. बिनोद थारू ( talk) 00:53, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to BIMARU states per the rationales shared at the RfD. The subject does not appear to independently pass GNG, with only passing mentions in sources and no focused discussion. — TechnoSquirrel69 ( sigh) 02:18, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting, User:Uncle G you say it's fairly obvious but it's not despite your admirable investigation. I gather you want to turn this page into a Redirect but to what redirect target? The one proposed in the nominator's statement or to the previous redirect target? Or another one entirely?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 00:24, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- Question: Is this not just an alternative name for the
Hindi Belt? Is there something I'm missing here? —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
01:26, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- The term seems to be used interchangeably in some contexts, but is typically used to refer to a particular region that is a subset of the Hindi belt. — TechnoSquirrel69 ( sigh) 02:03, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- Just to be clear, although I thought that the quotation and the fact that I said that they were synonyms made it obvious, per Reddy 2015, p. 109 and West 2010, p. 281 the "cow belt" is the Hindi belt, just a pejorative name for it. Wikipedia:Redirect#Neutrality of redirects. Reddy 2015, p. 109 draws a distinction between the Hindi belt a.k.a. Hindi heartland, including Delhi and Chhattisgarh, and the BIMARU states, not including those. But that's another discussion, about two other pages. Uncle G ( talk) 09:17, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to
Hindi Belt and/or selectively merge there. If this is simply a slang term for a region referred to by a more common name, it might be better to mention it
within the article with broader scope that provides more context rather than forking it out into its own article. Sources are describing the two as alternative names for one another, and I'm not really seeing the nominated article as being about the (oft-)pejorative title, so I think we've essentially got duplicate article subjects at the moment. —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
13:33, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
- In response to
Liz's relisting comment below, I'm OK with
BIMARU states, though I do think
Hindi Belt is more precise. I'd be fine hashing out this nuance at RfD. —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
01:44, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- Let's please not send this back to RfD, this AfD was only opened because of an RfD. — TechnoSquirrel69 ( sigh) 01:47, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- In response to
Liz's relisting comment below, I'm OK with
BIMARU states, though I do think
Hindi Belt is more precise. I'd be fine hashing out this nuance at RfD. —
Red-tailed hawk
(nest)
01:44, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting as there are three different redirect target articles mentioned in this discussion. If this closes as Redirect, we need to coalesce opinion on one article.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 01:09, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- Redirect to Hindi belt: Since this is simply a (junior and pejorative) synonym for the existing article Hindi belt, we should simply redirect to avoid a content fork. I agree with the opinion above that we should be extremely circumspect about adopting a pejorative title as an article name. Chiswick Chap ( talk) 13:11, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.